Question on being on the right track for MCSA

Discussion in 'MCSA' started by GlennS, Feb 19, 2008.

  1. GlennS

    GlennS Guest

    I want to achive my MCSA. I have my MCDST now, and im about to take my 70-620
    exam. From there I was told the only other 2 exams I would need to achive my
    MCSA are 70-290, 70-291. Is this true?
    Also, should I take 70-621 instead of 70-620?

    Glenn
    GlennS, Feb 19, 2008
    #1
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  2. GlennS

    PAJ Guest

    On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:15:01 -0800, GlennS
    <> wrote:

    >I want to achive my MCSA. I have my MCDST now, and im about to take my 70-620
    >exam. From there I was told the only other 2 exams I would need to achive my
    >MCSA are 70-290, 70-291. Is this true?


    Yes.

    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcsa/windows2003/default.mspx

    >Also, should I take 70-621 instead of 70-620?


    Could do either. 70-621 would have the advantage of taking your mcdst up
    to mcitp enterprise support.

    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx

    Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.
    PAJ, Feb 19, 2008
    #2
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  3. GlennS

    John R Guest

    "PAJ" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:15:01 -0800, GlennS
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>I want to achive my MCSA. I have my MCDST now, and im about to take my
    >>70-620
    >>exam. From there I was told the only other 2 exams I would need to achive
    >>my
    >>MCSA are 70-290, 70-291. Is this true?

    >
    > Yes.
    >
    > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcsa/windows2003/default.mspx
    >
    >>Also, should I take 70-621 instead of 70-620?

    >
    > Could do either. 70-621 would have the advantage of taking your mcdst up
    > to mcitp enterprise support.
    >
    > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx
    >
    > Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    > (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.


    I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    lot easier for you since most of it is crossover material from 70-271. That
    was the path I initially took. Still, you should review the test objectives
    and see what you are more comfortable with.

    John R
    John R, Feb 19, 2008
    #3
  4. GlennS

    GlennS Guest

    Well, I just took both courses in Vista, so i think i would probably rather
    take a vista test. Whats the real difference with between the 620 and 621
    tests anyways?

    "John R" wrote:

    >
    > "PAJ" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:15:01 -0800, GlennS
    > > <> wrote:
    > >
    > >>I want to achive my MCSA. I have my MCDST now, and im about to take my
    > >>70-620
    > >>exam. From there I was told the only other 2 exams I would need to achive
    > >>my
    > >>MCSA are 70-290, 70-291. Is this true?

    > >
    > > Yes.
    > >
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcsa/windows2003/default.mspx
    > >
    > >>Also, should I take 70-621 instead of 70-620?

    > >
    > > Could do either. 70-621 would have the advantage of taking your mcdst up
    > > to mcitp enterprise support.
    > >
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx
    > >
    > > Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    > > (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.

    >
    > I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    > lot easier for you since most of it is crossover material from 70-271. That
    > was the path I initially took. Still, you should review the test objectives
    > and see what you are more comfortable with.
    >
    > John R
    >
    >
    >
    GlennS, Feb 19, 2008
    #4
  5. GlennS

    John R Guest

    "GlennS" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Well, I just took both courses in Vista, so i think i would probably
    > rather
    > take a vista test. Whats the real difference with between the 620 and 621
    > tests anyways?
    >


    620 = MCTS - Vista Config
    620 + 622 = MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician

    621 + MCDST = 620 + 622

    621 is an upgrade test that, in combination with your MCDST, will give you
    both MCTS - Vista Config, and MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician. 621 is
    a combination test of elements from both 620 and 622. Should you decide to
    take 621, be sure you understand all of the objectives for 620 and 622. If
    you take 620 and 622 seperately, you accomplish the same thing as taking 621
    (with MCDST in hand).

    621 without MCDST is of no value. However, I believe you did say you have
    MCDST.

    And yes, if you feel more comfortable with the Vista route, then by all
    means proceed in that direction.

    John R
    John R, Feb 19, 2008
    #5
  6. GlennS

    GlennS Guest

    I guess my thinking is why not just take 620 if my main goal is the MCSA and
    not upgrading my mcsdt. do you know what im saying? Plus.. it sounds like 620
    would be easier than 621.. :)-

    "John R" wrote:

    >
    > "GlennS" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > Well, I just took both courses in Vista, so i think i would probably
    > > rather
    > > take a vista test. Whats the real difference with between the 620 and 621
    > > tests anyways?
    > >

    >
    > 620 = MCTS - Vista Config
    > 620 + 622 = MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician
    >
    > 621 + MCDST = 620 + 622
    >
    > 621 is an upgrade test that, in combination with your MCDST, will give you
    > both MCTS - Vista Config, and MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician. 621 is
    > a combination test of elements from both 620 and 622. Should you decide to
    > take 621, be sure you understand all of the objectives for 620 and 622. If
    > you take 620 and 622 seperately, you accomplish the same thing as taking 621
    > (with MCDST in hand).
    >
    > 621 without MCDST is of no value. However, I believe you did say you have
    > MCDST.
    >
    > And yes, if you feel more comfortable with the Vista route, then by all
    > means proceed in that direction.
    >
    > John R
    >
    >
    >
    GlennS, Feb 19, 2008
    #6
  7. "John R" <jsr^^^813@zoom^^^internet.net> wrote in message
    news::

    > "PAJ" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 11:15:01 -0800, GlennS
    > > <> wrote:
    > >
    > >>I want to achive my MCSA. I have my MCDST now, and im about to take my
    > >>70-620
    > >>exam. From there I was told the only other 2 exams I would need to achive
    > >>my
    > >>MCSA are 70-290, 70-291. Is this true?

    > >
    > > Yes.
    > >
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcsa/windows2003/default.mspx
    > >
    > >>Also, should I take 70-621 instead of 70-620?

    > >
    > > Could do either. 70-621 would have the advantage of taking your mcdst up
    > > to mcitp enterprise support.
    > >
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx
    > >
    > > Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    > > (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.

    >
    > I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    > lot easier for you since most of it is crossover material from 70-271. That
    > was the path I initially took. Still, you should review the test objectives
    > and see what you are more comfortable with.
    >
    > John R


    On that note, MCDSTs will be thoroughly surprised if they think that
    sitting the 70-270 will be easy. Remember your boy scout motto: Be
    Prepared. Just sayin'.
    --
    Michael D. Alligood, MCITP, MCTS, MCSA, MCDST
    The I.T. Classroom - http://www.theitclassroom.com/
    CertGuard, Inc. - http://www.certguard.com/
    Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.], Feb 19, 2008
    #7
  8. "GlennS" <> wrote in message
    news::

    > I guess my thinking is why not just take 620 if my main goal is the MCSA and
    > not upgrading my mcsdt. do you know what im saying? Plus.. it sounds like 620
    > would be easier than 621.. :)-
    >
    > "John R" wrote:
    >
    > >
    > > "GlennS" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > Well, I just took both courses in Vista, so i think i would probably
    > > > rather
    > > > take a vista test. Whats the real difference with between the 620 and 621
    > > > tests anyways?
    > > >

    > >
    > > 620 = MCTS - Vista Config
    > > 620 + 622 = MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician
    > >
    > > 621 + MCDST = 620 + 622
    > >
    > > 621 is an upgrade test that, in combination with your MCDST, will give you
    > > both MCTS - Vista Config, and MCITP - Enterprise Support Technician. 621 is
    > > a combination test of elements from both 620 and 622. Should you decide to
    > > take 621, be sure you understand all of the objectives for 620 and 622. If
    > > you take 620 and 622 seperately, you accomplish the same thing as taking 621
    > > (with MCDST in hand).
    > >
    > > 621 without MCDST is of no value. However, I believe you did say you have
    > > MCDST.
    > >
    > > And yes, if you feel more comfortable with the Vista route, then by all
    > > means proceed in that direction.
    > >
    > > John R
    > >
    > >
    > >


    Let's just put things into perspective here.
    1.) You are going to run across a lot more Server 2003 networks still
    running Windows XP clients than Vista.
    2.) Do you have experience in configuring Vista? Minus the courses you
    just attended.
    3.) Concentrate on the technology and not the certifications. You will
    earn them in time. There is no need to rush this.
    4.) If you are concerned solely on being certified no matter what,
    please make sure for the rest of us that you deserve the designation.
    And I don't mean by just passing an exam.

    --
    Michael D. Alligood, MCITP, MCTS, MCSA, MCDST
    The I.T. Classroom - http://www.theitclassroom.com/
    CertGuard, Inc. - http://www.certguard.com/
    Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.], Feb 19, 2008
    #8
  9. GlennS

    PAJ Guest

    On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 15:07:42 -0500, "John R" wrote:
    >"PAJ" wrote:
    >> Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    >> (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.

    >
    >I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    >lot easier for you


    Nothing to do with it being easier. Vista sucks and has a small install
    base compared to XP, in my experience (which is what counts).
    PAJ, Feb 19, 2008
    #9
  10. GlennS

    John R Guest

    "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.]" <> wrote in
    message news:...
    > "John R" <jsr^^^813@zoom^^^internet.net> wrote in message
    > news::
    >>
    >> I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would
    >> be a
    >> lot easier for you since most of it is crossover material from 70-271.
    >> That
    >> was the path I initially took. Still, you should review the test
    >> objectives
    >> and see what you are more comfortable with.
    >>
    >> John R

    >
    > On that note, MCDSTs will be thoroughly surprised if they think that
    > sitting the 70-270 will be easy. Remember your boy scout motto: Be
    > Prepared. Just sayin'.
    > --


    Absolutely. Nobody should take any test lightly, 270 included. However, I
    did find that 270 and 271 were somewhat similar, although 271 looked at XP
    from a user/tech support side and 270 looked at it more from an
    administrator point of view.

    My point was that if the OP had MCDST, then he is probably already "up" on
    XP, but if he wants to go after 620 instead of 270, there is nothing wrong
    with that. He mentioned that he took some classes, but he didn't mention
    his experience level. If he reviews the test objectives and feels he could
    pass 620, or at least gear up for it quicker, go for it. You know that I
    preach experience.

    Even though XP currently has a much larger installed base than Vista does,
    some day the opposite will be true. If his company or the companies he
    plans to work for are early adopters, 620 (and the MCTS it brings) may be
    more important to him, especially given that he has already demonstrated a
    skill level with XP in his MCDST. My company is finding it difficult to
    purchase replacment hardware now with XP, and we have been given marching
    orders to come up to speed on Vista, quickly. Given that we do a good bit
    of ASP hosting, we are even now getting pressure to provide user level
    support for our customer's Vista machines as it relates to our hosting
    environment.

    So, eventually, it all comes back to what the OP wants, which is why my
    prior post ended with "you should review the test objectives and see what
    you are more comfortable with." The definition of "comfort", I'll leave up
    to the OP.

    John R
    John R, Feb 20, 2008
    #10
  11. GlennS

    GlennS Guest

    I think ill just go with 621 since it adds value to my mcsdt and also counts
    toward my final goal of the mcsa.
    and for the person that asked if i had experience configuring Vista, the
    answer is yes, I have about a years worth of that.
    "PAJ" wrote:

    > On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 15:07:42 -0500, "John R" wrote:
    > >"PAJ" wrote:
    > >> Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    > >> (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.

    > >
    > >I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    > >lot easier for you

    >
    > Nothing to do with it being easier. Vista sucks and has a small install
    > base compared to XP, in my experience (which is what counts).
    >
    GlennS, Feb 20, 2008
    #11
  12. "GlennS" <> wrote in message
    news::

    > I think ill just go with 621 since it adds value to my mcsdt and also counts
    > toward my final goal of the mcsa.
    > and for the person that asked if i had experience configuring Vista, the
    > answer is yes, I have about a years worth of that.
    > "PAJ" wrote:
    >
    > > On Tue, 19 Feb 2008 15:07:42 -0500, "John R" wrote:
    > > >"PAJ" wrote:
    > > >> Personally I am skipping all Vista exams and sticking with the XP track
    > > >> (until Vista is replaced). I took 70-270 as my client exam.
    > > >
    > > >I have to agree that if you hold MCDST, it would seem that 70-270 would be a
    > > >lot easier for you

    > >
    > > Nothing to do with it being easier. Vista sucks and has a small install
    > > base compared to XP, in my experience (which is what counts).
    > >


    The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    make that determination.

    --
    Michael D. Alligood, MCITP, MCTS, MCSA, MCDST
    The I.T. Classroom - http://www.theitclassroom.com/
    CertGuard, Inc. - http://www.certguard.com/
    Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.], Feb 20, 2008
    #12
  13. GlennS

    PAJ Guest

    On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 18:28:16 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    Inc.]" <> wrote:

    >The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    >upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    >is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    >http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    >be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    >make that determination.


    What is your problem?
    You seem to like putting people down.
    People here are not in your 'classroom'!

    People will study and take exams for whatever reason they see fit.

    The official MS line may be to show proficiency in a subject they
    already work with on a day-to-day basis. This is not always how it works
    in the real world. I am willing to bet the vast majority of people who
    study for and take MS exams do so to learn new subjects or to improve
    their knowledge.

    The fact is to get real-world experience they may need the certs. Yes an
    employer *may* employ someone with experience over someone who has a
    cert, they may not. If two equal people have little experience but one
    has certs then the one with the certs stands a better chance of getting
    the job. I know... not if you were the employer blah blah blah.

    People may study for an MS exam to learn new subjects. To improve their
    career prospects. To prove they can pass the exam. Because their
    employer has asked them to.....
    If you think this devalues the certifications in any way, well that is
    just tough.

    Telling people the only way the can add value is to gain experience is
    just male bovine excrement.

    Like your comments, this is all my opinion.
    PAJ, Feb 20, 2008
    #13
  14. "PAJ" <> wrote in message
    news::

    > On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 18:28:16 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    > Inc.]" <> wrote:
    >
    > >The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    > >upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    > >is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    > >http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    > >be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    > >make that determination.

    >
    > What is your problem?
    > You seem to like putting people down.
    > People here are not in your 'classroom'!
    >
    > People will study and take exams for whatever reason they see fit.
    >
    > The official MS line may be to show proficiency in a subject they
    > already work with on a day-to-day basis. This is not always how it works
    > in the real world. I am willing to bet the vast majority of people who
    > study for and take MS exams do so to learn new subjects or to improve
    > their knowledge.
    >
    > The fact is to get real-world experience they may need the certs. Yes an
    > employer *may* employ someone with experience over someone who has a
    > cert, they may not. If two equal people have little experience but one
    > has certs then the one with the certs stands a better chance of getting
    > the job. I know... not if you were the employer blah blah blah.
    >
    > People may study for an MS exam to learn new subjects. To improve their
    > career prospects. To prove they can pass the exam. Because their
    > employer has asked them to.....
    > If you think this devalues the certifications in any way, well that is
    > just tough.
    >
    > Telling people the only way the can add value is to gain experience is
    > just male bovine excrement.
    >
    > Like your comments, this is all my opinion.


    And thank you for sharing your opinion.

    --
    Michael D. Alligood, MCITP, MCTS, MCSA, MCDST
    The I.T. Classroom - http://www.theitclassroom.com/
    CertGuard, Inc. - http://www.certguard.com/
    Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.], Feb 20, 2008
    #14
  15. GlennS

    PAJ Guest

    On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 22:39:27 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    Inc.]" <> wrote:

    >"PAJ" <> wrote in message
    >news::
    >
    >> On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 18:28:16 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    >> Inc.]" <> wrote:
    >>
    >> >The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    >> >upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    >> >is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    >> >http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    >> >be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    >> >make that determination.

    >>
    >> What is your problem?
    >> You seem to like putting people down.
    >> People here are not in your 'classroom'!
    >>
    >> People will study and take exams for whatever reason they see fit.
    >>
    >> The official MS line may be to show proficiency in a subject they
    >> already work with on a day-to-day basis. This is not always how it works
    >> in the real world. I am willing to bet the vast majority of people who
    >> study for and take MS exams do so to learn new subjects or to improve
    >> their knowledge.
    >>
    >> The fact is to get real-world experience they may need the certs. Yes an
    >> employer *may* employ someone with experience over someone who has a
    >> cert, they may not. If two equal people have little experience but one
    >> has certs then the one with the certs stands a better chance of getting
    >> the job. I know... not if you were the employer blah blah blah.
    >>
    >> People may study for an MS exam to learn new subjects. To improve their
    >> career prospects. To prove they can pass the exam. Because their
    >> employer has asked them to.....
    >> If you think this devalues the certifications in any way, well that is
    >> just tough.
    >>
    >> Telling people the only way the can add value is to gain experience is
    >> just male bovine excrement.
    >>
    >> Like your comments, this is all my opinion.

    >
    >And thank you for sharing your opinion.


    Well someone had to!
    PAJ, Feb 21, 2008
    #15
  16. GlennS

    new2IT Guest

    Just wanted to say thank you PAJ for your comments. I am completely new to
    this discussion group and like my name implies new to the field (or should I
    say getting into the field). I agree with Michael in the since that
    experience is number one but in todays job market getting a job in the field
    in order to get the experience is almost impossible unless you have certs.
    After reading many comments concerning certs dont mean anything experience
    does it almost made me wonder if making my career change was the right thing
    since I dont have a lot of experience yet.

    "PAJ" wrote:

    > On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 22:39:27 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    > Inc.]" <> wrote:
    >
    > >"PAJ" <> wrote in message
    > >news::
    > >
    > >> On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 18:28:16 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    > >> Inc.]" <> wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    > >> >upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    > >> >is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    > >> >http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    > >> >be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    > >> >make that determination.
    > >>
    > >> What is your problem?
    > >> You seem to like putting people down.
    > >> People here are not in your 'classroom'!
    > >>
    > >> People will study and take exams for whatever reason they see fit.
    > >>
    > >> The official MS line may be to show proficiency in a subject they
    > >> already work with on a day-to-day basis. This is not always how it works
    > >> in the real world. I am willing to bet the vast majority of people who
    > >> study for and take MS exams do so to learn new subjects or to improve
    > >> their knowledge.
    > >>
    > >> The fact is to get real-world experience they may need the certs. Yes an
    > >> employer *may* employ someone with experience over someone who has a
    > >> cert, they may not. If two equal people have little experience but one
    > >> has certs then the one with the certs stands a better chance of getting
    > >> the job. I know... not if you were the employer blah blah blah.
    > >>
    > >> People may study for an MS exam to learn new subjects. To improve their
    > >> career prospects. To prove they can pass the exam. Because their
    > >> employer has asked them to.....
    > >> If you think this devalues the certifications in any way, well that is
    > >> just tough.
    > >>
    > >> Telling people the only way the can add value is to gain experience is
    > >> just male bovine excrement.
    > >>
    > >> Like your comments, this is all my opinion.

    > >
    > >And thank you for sharing your opinion.

    >
    > Well someone had to!
    >
    new2IT, Feb 22, 2008
    #16
  17. "new2IT" <> wrote in message
    news::

    > Just wanted to say thank you PAJ for your comments. I am completely new to
    > this discussion group and like my name implies new to the field (or should I
    > say getting into the field). I agree with Michael in the since that
    > experience is number one but in todays job market getting a job in the field
    > in order to get the experience is almost impossible unless you have certs.
    > After reading many comments concerning certs dont mean anything experience
    > does it almost made me wonder if making my career change was the right thing
    > since I dont have a lot of experience yet.
    >
    > "PAJ" wrote:
    >
    > > On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 22:39:27 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    > > Inc.]" <> wrote:
    > >
    > > >"PAJ" <> wrote in message
    > > >news::
    > > >
    > > >> On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 18:28:16 +0000, "Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard,
    > > >> Inc.]" <> wrote:
    > > >>
    > > >> >The 621 has no, and will not add value to your MCDST. It's just an
    > > >> >upgrade exam. The only thing that can add value to your certifications
    > > >> >is experience. Here are the skills measured for the 70-621 exam
    > > >> >http://www.microsoft.com/learning/exams/70-621.mspx#EKF. Review them and
    > > >> >be honest with yourself if you are prepared. No one but yourself can
    > > >> >make that determination.
    > > >>
    > > >> What is your problem?
    > > >> You seem to like putting people down.
    > > >> People here are not in your 'classroom'!
    > > >>
    > > >> People will study and take exams for whatever reason they see fit.
    > > >>
    > > >> The official MS line may be to show proficiency in a subject they
    > > >> already work with on a day-to-day basis. This is not always how it works
    > > >> in the real world. I am willing to bet the vast majority of people who
    > > >> study for and take MS exams do so to learn new subjects or to improve
    > > >> their knowledge.
    > > >>
    > > >> The fact is to get real-world experience they may need the certs. Yes an
    > > >> employer *may* employ someone with experience over someone who has a
    > > >> cert, they may not. If two equal people have little experience but one
    > > >> has certs then the one with the certs stands a better chance of getting
    > > >> the job. I know... not if you were the employer blah blah blah.
    > > >>
    > > >> People may study for an MS exam to learn new subjects. To improve their
    > > >> career prospects. To prove they can pass the exam. Because their
    > > >> employer has asked them to.....
    > > >> If you think this devalues the certifications in any way, well that is
    > > >> just tough.
    > > >>
    > > >> Telling people the only way the can add value is to gain experience is
    > > >> just male bovine excrement.
    > > >>
    > > >> Like your comments, this is all my opinion.
    > > >
    > > >And thank you for sharing your opinion.

    > >
    > > Well someone had to!
    > >


    I.T. is no different from any other field that someone decides to
    pursue. Let's take a chef for example. Do you think that one day a
    person gets out of bed and decides, "Hey, I want to be a chef of a 4
    star restaurant." So this person goes to a high end eatery and applies
    for the executive chef position. What are the odds of him getting that
    position -- even if he is a graduate of a top end culinary school? None.
    Why? Experience. Yes, he has his credentials from the culinary school,
    but proprietors' are not going to risk the reputation of their
    restaurant on a newly graduated chef. Like anything you want, there is
    always some sort of sacrifice. Whether it's an initial low salary, low
    position, number of hours worked, etc.. We have forgotten what it means
    to earn something nowadays. Determination to see your goals, dreams and
    desires through no matter what.

    How many posts have littered this and many other newsgroups like this
    one that states, "Hey, I just got certified in XYZ, now what do I do?"
    What does this say? This person a month ago was just complaining about
    the lack of jobs that s/he have been denied because the employer was
    looking for certifications. Now they have one or two and still cannot
    find employment. Why??? EXPERIENCE. Employers have secretly smarten up
    over the years after the onslaught of paper certified individuals
    milking their payrolls with extraordinary salaries who could not tell
    you the difference between DHCP and DNS -- much less how to implement
    and/or administrate either. Long gone are the days an employer looks at
    your resume and says, "Oh you have your MCSE? Your hired!"

    My advice; if you want it bad enough, you will have it. It's called
    determination. It's being willing to sacrifice anything. No experience,
    no problem. I'll beg to work for X amount of dollars (X being a lower
    starting pay). Volunteer. Come in early. Stay later. Sleep less. Stay
    current with technology. Ask questions. Demand answers. And research
    everything.

    --
    Michael D. Alligood, MCITP, MCTS, MCSA, MCDST
    The I.T. Classroom - http://www.theitclassroom.com/
    CertGuard, Inc. - http://www.certguard.com/
    Michael D. Alligood [CertGuard, Inc.], Feb 22, 2008
    #17
  18. GlennS

    PAJ Guest

    On Thu, 21 Feb 2008 19:12:01 -0800, new2IT
    <> wrote:

    >Just wanted to say thank you PAJ for your comments. I am completely new to
    >this discussion group and like my name implies new to the field (or should I
    >say getting into the field). I agree with Michael in the since that
    >experience is number one but in todays job market getting a job in the field
    >in order to get the experience is almost impossible unless you have certs.
    >After reading many comments concerning certs dont mean anything experience
    >does it almost made me wonder if making my career change was the right thing
    >since I dont have a lot of experience yet.
    >


    That's great. Also read Michael's later post. It does make sense.
    My main reason for posting was to make it clear I do not agree with
    putting people down if they want to try and better themselves. I also do
    not believe that someone with no experience gaining cert's is a bad
    thing. I also do not believe it devalues the cert's in any way. So long
    as the correct path is taken and they are earned legitimately.

    If they only people taking MCSA cert's were sysadmins then this would
    devalue them. I disagree with people posting that experience is all that
    counts. These same people have the experience and then go and take the
    cert's themselves. Why? They have shown they can do their jobs! Maybe
    they do not like it that the cert's can be earned by someone with no
    experience. Never mint the fact the people with no experience have to
    work a lot harder to earn them. In my eyes this makes them more valuable
    (the people and the cert's they earn).

    I myself went for a career change over 10 years ago (from manual work).
    I followed the exact same path you did, training and then an
    'internship/work experience'. Then a low paid job. Continuing to take
    more exams along the way (not just MS). Now I have a good, well paid job
    I am happy with that I am happy with.

    Go for it. You have nothing to lose.
    PAJ, Feb 22, 2008
    #18
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