PS3 Linux

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Another Me, Apr 1, 2010.

  1. Another Me

    Another Me Guest

    I thought I would have seen messages by now praising Sony, or bitching
    at them for killing Linux on the PS3...
     
    Another Me, Apr 1, 2010
    #1
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  2. On 2 Apr, 10:41, Another Me <> wrote:
    > I thought I would have seen messages by now praising Sony, or bitching
    > at them for killing Linux on the PS3...


    It is fairly unpleasnt of them to do that. Take away existing
    functionality of a device you've paid for because said functionality
    can be exploited to circumvent their other attempts to take away
    further functionality of a device you've paid for. Not even Apple does
    that sort of thing.

    But I think its only the first generation consoles that are affected -
    later generations had the feature removed entirely.
     
    David Goodwin, Apr 2, 2010
    #2
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  3. Another Me

    Another Me Guest

    On Apr 2, 3:18 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:

    > It is fairly unpleasnt of them to do that. Take away existing
    > functionality of a device you've paid for because said functionality
    > can be exploited to circumvent their other attempts to take away
    > further functionality of a device you've paid for. Not even Apple does
    > that sort of thing.


    Yet no one complains at all the extra functionality that Sony has
    provided for free during the PS3 lifetime. Apple doesn't give you the
    features in the first place, and has historically made you purchase
    new hardware to get those extra features.

    > But I think its only the first generation consoles that are affected -
    > later generations had the feature removed entirely.


    The slim model has it removed from launch, there were several versions
    of the original model though.
     
    Another Me, Apr 2, 2010
    #3
  4. On 2 Apr, 16:15, Another Me <> wrote:
    > On Apr 2, 3:18 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:
    >
    > > It is fairly unpleasnt of them to do that. Take away existing
    > > functionality of a device you've paid for because said functionality
    > > can be exploited to circumvent their other attempts to take away
    > > further functionality of a device you've paid for. Not even Apple does
    > > that sort of thing.

    >
    > Yet no one complains at all the extra functionality that Sony has
    > provided for free during the PS3 lifetime.  Apple doesn't give you the
    > features in the first place, and has historically made you purchase
    > new hardware to get those extra features.


    The difference is those features are missing from Apples hardware when
    you buy it. Sony is removing features _after_ you buy it.

    I wouldn't buy an iPhone or an iPad because I know Apple won't let me
    install what ever software I like on it. The fact that the features
    are missing from the start allows them to be taken into consideration
    when purchasing the device. If the ability to install Linux on a PS3
    was one of the reasons why I purchased a one I would be extremely
    annoyed right now.

    Luckily I don't own a PS3. Sony and Apple can have their closed
    platforms - I just won't go anywhere near them. Its none of the
    hardware manufactures business what I do with it after I buy it.

    > > But I think its only the first generation consoles that are affected -
    > > later generations had the feature removed entirely.

    >
    > The slim model has it removed from launch, there were several versions
    > of the original model though.
     
    David Goodwin, Apr 2, 2010
    #4
  5. Another Me

    Another Me Guest

    On Apr 2, 5:48 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:

    > The difference is those features are missing from Apples hardware when
    > you buy it. Sony is removing features _after_ you buy it.


    I don't really think Linux on a PS3 is a "feature"

    > I wouldn't buy an iPhone or an iPad because I know Apple won't let me
    > install what ever software I like on it. The fact that the features
    > are missing from the start allows them to be taken into consideration
    > when purchasing the device. If the ability to install Linux on a PS3
    > was one of the reasons why I purchased a one I would be extremely
    > annoyed right now.


    If Linux was the reason you purchased a PS3, then don't install the
    update, it is that simple.

    > Luckily I don't own a PS3. Sony and Apple can have their closed
    > platforms - I just won't go anywhere near them. Its none of the
    > hardware manufactures business what I do with it after I buy it.


    So you don't purchase any hardware at all then?
     
    Another Me, Apr 2, 2010
    #5
  6. On 2 Apr, 17:55, Another Me <> wrote:
    > On Apr 2, 5:48 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:
    >
    > > The difference is those features are missing from Apples hardware when
    > > you buy it. Sony is removing features _after_ you buy it.

    >
    > I don't really think Linux on a PS3 is a "feature"
    >
    > > I wouldn't buy an iPhone or an iPad because I know Apple won't let me
    > > install what ever software I like on it. The fact that the features
    > > are missing from the start allows them to be taken into consideration
    > > when purchasing the device. If the ability to install Linux on a PS3
    > > was one of the reasons why I purchased a one I would be extremely
    > > annoyed right now.

    >
    > If Linux was the reason you purchased a PS3, then don't install the
    > update, it is that simple.


    I was just saying that linux support may have factored into some
    peoples decision to buy the console (not that it was the only reason -
    although I'm sure there are some of those people too). I've heard
    opting out of the update prevents you from playing newer BluRay discs
    or games.

    > > Luckily I don't own a PS3. Sony and Apple can have their closed
    > > platforms - I just won't go anywhere near them. Its none of the
    > > hardware manufactures business what I do with it after I buy it.

    >
    > So you don't purchase any hardware at all then?


    No. I just avoid hardware like game consoles, iPhones and iPads. HP
    doesn't care what operating system or software I install on my laptop.
    They certainly don't remove features from my laptop after sale or try
    to prevent me from writing my own software for it. Likewise with my
    desktop.
     
    David Goodwin, Apr 2, 2010
    #6
  7. Another Me

    Another Me Guest

    On Apr 2, 11:19 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:

    > I was just saying that linux support may have factored into some
    > peoples decision to buy the console (not that it was the only reason -
    > although I'm sure there are some of those people too). I've heard
    > opting out of the update prevents you from playing newer BluRay discs
    > or games.


    You've heard wrong, it only stops you from playing online games, and
    Blu-ray movies, maybe a couple if that.
     
    Another Me, Apr 2, 2010
    #7
  8. On 3 Apr, 00:40, Another Me <> wrote:
    > On Apr 2, 11:19 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:
    >
    > > I was just saying that linux support may have factored into some
    > > peoples decision to buy the console (not that it was the only reason -
    > > although I'm sure there are some of those people too). I've heard
    > > opting out of the update prevents you from playing newer BluRay discs
    > > or games.

    >
    > You've heard wrong, it only stops you from playing online games, and
    > Blu-ray movies, maybe a couple if that.


    Going by the way bluray works it wouldn't be a couple - it would be
    all movies released after the patch. If it stops you playing any I
    presume they must be changing the player key.

    Either way, taking functionality away from a device after you've
    purchased it for no good reason isn't a very nice thing to do.
     
    David Goodwin, Apr 3, 2010
    #8
  9. Another Me

    Another Me Guest

    On Apr 3, 12:00 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:

    > Going by the way bluray works it wouldn't be a couple - it would be
    > all movies released after the patch. If it stops you playing any I
    > presume they must be changing the player key.


    No it isn't, it would only be if they changed a key, which doesn't
    happen all that often as I don't patch my PS3 with every firmware
    update and new movies always play for me.

    > Either way, taking functionality away from a device after you've
    > purchased it for no good reason isn't a very nice thing to do.


    No it isn't, but at the end of the day it is another blow for Linux
     
    Another Me, Apr 3, 2010
    #9
  10. Another Me

    victor Guest

    Another Me wrote:
    > On Apr 3, 12:00 pm, David Goodwin <> wrote:
    >
    >> Going by the way bluray works it wouldn't be a couple - it would be
    >> all movies released after the patch. If it stops you playing any I
    >> presume they must be changing the player key.

    >
    > No it isn't, it would only be if they changed a key, which doesn't
    > happen all that often as I don't patch my PS3 with every firmware
    > update and new movies always play for me.
    >
    >> Either way, taking functionality away from a device after you've
    >> purchased it for no good reason isn't a very nice thing to do.

    >
    > No it isn't, but at the end of the day it is another blow for Linux


    Indeed
    The loss of the Playstation community will really hurt Linux.
    I don't know how it can recover from a blow like this.
     
    victor, Apr 3, 2010
    #10
  11. In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > Apple don't stop you from writing applications and installing what you
    > like on iPhones. With an iPhone *you* own the hardware, you can do with it
    > what you please.


    You mean by jailbreaking it? Doesn’t that violate Apple’s freedom to control
    what you can do with your iPhone?
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 6, 2010
    #11
  12. In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >> Doesn’t that violate Apple’s freedom to
    >> control what you can do with your iPhone?

    >
    > They don't have that freedom.


    But you’ve said previously they should have the freedom to impose whatever
    conditions they want.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 6, 2010
    #12
  13. In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >> In message <>, Allistar
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Doesn’t that violate Apple’s freedom to control what you can do with
    >>>> your iPhone?
    >>>
    >>> They don't have that freedom.

    >>
    >> But you’ve said previously they should have the freedom to impose
    >> whatever conditions they want.

    >
    > As long as they don't force you to agree to them, yes.


    So there are limits to their “freedoms�

    > Are you saying Apple have the condition that you cannot use your iPhone as
    > a door stop? Have they imposed the condition that you cannot jail break
    > it?


    A Google for “iphone eula†produced this
    <http://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf> as the top hit. Choice
    extract:

    2. (c) You may not and you agree not to, or to enable others to, copy
    (except as expressly permitted by this License), decompile, reverse
    engineer, disassemble, attempt to derive the source code of, decrypt,
    modify, or create derivative works of the iPhone Software or any
    services provided by the iPhone Software, or any part thereof (except as
    and only to the extent any foregoing restriction is prohibited by
    applicable law or to the extent as may be permitted by licensing terms
    governing use of open-sourced components included with the iPhone
    Software). Any attempt to do so is a violation of the rights of Apple
    and its licensors of the iPhone Software.

    So it would seem that, yes, jailbreaking is prohibited.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 6, 2010
    #13
  14. Another Me

    victor Guest

    On 06/04/10 16:15, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In message<>, Allistar wrote:
    >
    >> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>
    >>> In message<>, Allistar
    >>> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> Doesn’t that violate Apple’s freedom to control what you can do with
    >>>>> your iPhone?
    >>>>
    >>>> They don't have that freedom.
    >>>
    >>> But you’ve said previously they should have the freedom to impose
    >>> whatever conditions they want.

    >>
    >> As long as they don't force you to agree to them, yes.

    >
    > So there are limits to their “freedoms�
    >
    >> Are you saying Apple have the condition that you cannot use your iPhone as
    >> a door stop? Have they imposed the condition that you cannot jail break
    >> it?

    >
    > A Google for “iphone eula†produced this
    > <http://www.apple.com/legal/sla/docs/iphone.pdf> as the top hit. Choice
    > extract:
    >
    > 2. (c) You may not and you agree not to, or to enable others to, copy
    > (except as expressly permitted by this License), decompile, reverse
    > engineer, disassemble, attempt to derive the source code of, decrypt,
    > modify, or create derivative works of the iPhone Software or any
    > services provided by the iPhone Software, or any part thereof (except as
    > and only to the extent any foregoing restriction is prohibited by
    > applicable law or to the extent as may be permitted by licensing terms
    > governing use of open-sourced components included with the iPhone
    > Software). Any attempt to do so is a violation of the rights of Apple
    > and its licensors of the iPhone Software.
    >
    > So it would seem that, yes, jailbreaking is prohibited.


    The exceptions would allow for the provisions in the NZ copyright act to
    modify for the purpose of interoperability though.
     
    victor, Apr 6, 2010
    #14
  15. In message
    <>, David
    Goodwin wrote:

    > Sony is removing features _after_ you buy it.


    One customer has got a 20% refund off the cost of their PS3 over removal of
    this feature, by invoking European consumer-protection law
    <http://blogs.zdnet.com/hardware/?p=7971>.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Apr 10, 2010
    #15
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