Powering off as a trouble shooting procedure

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by Dugie, Jan 25, 2005.

  1. Dugie

    Dugie Guest

    Hi All,

    I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software
    or hardware problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning the power supply is off. Either restarting
    immediately, or waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.

    He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was not true.

    Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off" technique?

    Thanks, Dugie
     
    Dugie, Jan 25, 2005
    #1
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  2. Dugie

    °Mike° Guest

    A complete power of is usually only necessary when
    adding or removing hardware, or when cleaning out
    memory resident programs and/or viruses. Otherwise
    a warm reboot is sufficient.

    Oh, and please fix the line wrap to 72 characters in
    your news client. Tools / Options / Send ... News
    Sending Format. Automatically wrap text at [72] chars....


    On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, in
    <qLxJd.218163$>
    Dugie scrawled:

    >Hi All,
    >
    >I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software
    >or hardware problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    >Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning the power supply is off. Either restarting
    >immediately, or waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    >
    >He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was not true.
    >
    >Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off" technique?
    >
    >Thanks, Dugie
    >


    --
    Basic computer maintenance
    http://uk.geocities.com/personel44/maintenance.html
     
    °Mike°, Jan 25, 2005
    #2
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  3. Dugie

    Guest

    On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, "Dugie" <>
    wrote:

    |> Hi All,
    |>
    |> I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software
    |> or hardware problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    |> Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning the power supply is off. Either restarting
    |> immediately, or waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    |>
    |> He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was not true.
    |>
    |> Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off" technique?
    |>

    This is important when static ram (sram) is involved, Turning off the
    power allows all memory to be flushed.

    --
     
    , Jan 25, 2005
    #3
  4. On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, "Dugie" <>
    wrote:

    >Hi All,
    >
    >I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software
    >or hardware problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    >Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning the power supply is off. Either restarting
    >immediately, or waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    >
    >He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was not true.
    >
    >Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off" technique?
    >
    >Thanks, Dugie
    >


    And never restart immediately. Always wait at least a few seconds
    when turning back on any electrical or electronic device. Power
    spikes can do some nasty damage to your hardware. Half a minute
    wouldn't hurt.

    TD
     
    Toothless Dan, Jan 25, 2005
    #4
  5. wrote:
    > On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, "Dugie" <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>> Hi All,
    >>>
    >>> I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down>
    >>> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software or hardware
    >>> problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    >>> Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning
    >>> the power supply is off. Either restarting immediately, or waiting
    >>> for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    >>>
    >>> He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was
    >>> not true.
    >>>
    >>> Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off"
    >>> technique?
    >>>

    >
    > This is important when static ram (sram) is involved, Turning off the
    > power allows all memory to be flushed.


    I'm very curious about what would and can be left behind in memory,
    perhaps you can tell me. Would it be limited to only remnants of
    applications that have been opened or can other things also be stored there?
    Such as the path the computer has used to access a certain folder?
    I ask this because I had once been told that doing a shutdown after
    defragging and waiting a few minutes before turning the computer back on,
    would result in the computer having to find 'new' paths to applications
    because the old ones would have been erased... forgotten. And that if you
    didn't allow the computer to forget the old paths, it would follow the old
    path and when it got to where the folder had been, would be forced,
    essentially, to go on to form a longer path because of folder rearranging
    during defrag.
    I have since been told that this is nothing but nonsense, but, I am not
    fully convinced either way and I continue to shutdown my computer after
    defragging for a minimum of 3 minutes.
    Your thoughts, if any? Thanks.
    PJ
     
    The Black Laced One, Jan 26, 2005
    #5
  6. Dugie

    Guest

    On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 17:55:27 -0800, "The Black Laced One"
    <> wrote:

    |> wrote:
    |> > On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, "Dugie" <>
    |> > wrote:
    |> >
    |> >>> Hi All,
    |> >>>
    |> >>> I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down>
    |> >>> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software or hardware
    |> >>> problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    |> >>> Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning
    |> >>> the power supply is off. Either restarting immediately, or waiting
    |> >>> for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    |> >>>
    |> >>> He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was
    |> >>> not true.
    |> >>>
    |> >>> Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off"
    |> >>> technique?
    |> >>>
    |> >
    |> > This is important when static ram (sram) is involved, Turning off the
    |> > power allows all memory to be flushed.
    |>



    |> I'm very curious about what would and can be left behind in memory,
    |> perhaps you can tell me. Would it be limited to only remnants of
    |> applications that have been opened or can other things also be stored there?

    Static ram, everything.

    It was an old trick on the Amiga to load a program (copy protected
    game), soft reboot, then grab the programs pix, music, and code that was
    still in the memory.

    Static ram can be anywhere on board, cpu, sound card, video card...
    I find it best to power off for awhile to get a clean start.

    |> Such as the path the computer has used to access a certain folder?
    |> I ask this because I had once been told that doing a shutdown after
    |> defragging and waiting a few minutes before turning the computer back on,
    |> would result in the computer having to find 'new' paths to applications
    |> because the old ones would have been erased... forgotten. And that if you
    |> didn't allow the computer to forget the old paths, it would follow the old
    |> path and when it got to where the folder had been, would be forced,
    |> essentially, to go on to form a longer path because of folder rearranging
    |> during defrag.

    I don't know where to start, that's just all wrong.

    |> I have since been told that this is nothing but nonsense,

    and the person you should of listen'd to.

    |>but, I am not
    |> fully convinced either way and I continue to shutdown my computer after
    |> defragging for a minimum of 3 minutes.

    As you should to clear out all memory.

    --
     
    , Jan 26, 2005
    #6
  7. Dugie

    Toolman Tim Guest

    "Dugie" <> wrote in message
    news:qLxJd.218163$...
    | Hi All,
    |
    | I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down> Restart) is
    not always a good way to solve a software
    | or hardware problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    | Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning the
    power supply is off. Either restarting
    | immediately, or waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    |
    | He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was not
    true.
    |
    | Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off" technique?
    |
    Here's an 'unrelated' issue, but it goes to the point of power off - and you
    are correct.

    Scenario: my office computer is networked into two Novell servers - one is
    the portal to the Internet/email, the other is file/print services.
    Recently, more than twice this month, when I reboot and log on, it selects
    the wrong server as 'primary'. What happens is I can't get to the mapped
    drives, including my working files. If I reboot, I still cannot connect
    correctly. ONLY when I power down does the system clear out whatever
    bug-a-boos are routing my login incorrectly. And a couple other computers at
    the office have exhibited the same problem. So, as seldom as I would
    disagree with °Mike°, I must in this case say that a warm-start (reboot)
    isn't always going to be as effective as a cold-start.
     
    Toolman Tim, Jan 26, 2005
    #7
  8. wrote:
    > On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 17:55:27 -0800, "The Black Laced One"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>> wrote:
    >>>> On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 20:13:10 GMT, "Dugie"
    >>>> <> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>> Hi All,
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> I mentioned to my brother that a warm reboot (eg. Shut Down>
    >>>>>> Restart) is not always a good way to solve a software or hardware
    >>>>>> problem, referring to a Win 2000 OS.
    >>>>>> Often it is useful to shut down the computer completely, meaning
    >>>>>> the power supply is off. Either restarting immediately, or
    >>>>>> waiting for 30 seconds or more may also help.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> He asked why do this, where did I hear this, and said that it was
    >>>>>> not true.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Any comments on the usefulness of this "complete power off"
    >>>>>> technique?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>> This is important when static ram (sram) is involved, Turning off
    >>>> the power allows all memory to be flushed.
    >>>

    >
    >
    >
    >>> I'm very curious about what would and can be left behind in
    >>> memory, perhaps you can tell me. Would it be limited to only
    >>> remnants of applications that have been opened or can other things
    >>> also be stored there?

    >
    > Static ram, everything.
    >
    > It was an old trick on the Amiga to load a program (copy protected
    > game), soft reboot, then grab the programs pix, music, and code that
    > was still in the memory.
    >
    > Static ram can be anywhere on board, cpu, sound card, video card...
    > I find it best to power off for awhile to get a clean start.
    >
    >>> Such as the path the computer has used to access a certain folder?
    >>> I ask this because I had once been told that doing a shutdown
    >>> after defragging and waiting a few minutes before turning the
    >>> computer back on, would result in the computer having to find 'new'
    >>> paths to applications because the old ones would have been
    >>> erased... forgotten. And that if you didn't allow the computer to
    >>> forget the old paths, it would follow the old path and when it got
    >>> to where the folder had been, would be forced, essentially, to go
    >>> on to form a longer path because of folder rearranging during
    >>> defrag.

    >
    > I don't know where to start, that's just all wrong.


    Okay, I shall accept the fact that it is wrong... I think for the most
    part, I already had, but after reading your answer to the original poster's
    question... it got me thinking about it... so I asked, mostly I guess for
    confirmation. So, thank you. I will think about it no more.

    >
    >>> I have since been told that this is nothing but nonsense,

    >
    > and the person you should of listen'd to.
    >
    >>> but, I am not
    >>> fully convinced either way and I continue to shutdown my computer
    >>> after defragging for a minimum of 3 minutes.

    >
    > As you should to clear out all memory.


    So even though the reasoning of my doing a 3 minute shutdown was wrong,
    the shutdown itself is a good thing and should be continued.
    Thanks for responding, I really do appreciate it.
    PJ
     
    The Black Laced One, Jan 26, 2005
    #8
  9. On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 21:50:19 -0800, "The Black Laced One"
    <> wrote:

    > So even though the reasoning of my doing a 3 minute shutdown was wrong,
    >the shutdown itself is a good thing and should be continued.
    > Thanks for responding, I really do appreciate it.


    Look at it like this; a restart reloads Windows.
    A shutdown then reboot reloads all hardware as well.

    Swill

    --
    If you find a message from myself offensive, inappropriate or
    disruptive, please ignore it. If you don't know how to ignore
    a posting, complain to me and I will demonstrate. -- Wicked Nickname
     
    Governor Swill, Jan 26, 2005
    #9
  10. Dugie

    °Mike° Guest

    On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:10:18 -0800, in
    <hVDJd.1725$>
    Toolman Tim scrawled:

    <snip>

    > So, as seldom as I would disagree with °Mike°, I must in
    >this case say that a warm-start (reboot) isn't always going
    >to be as effective as a cold-start.


    To quote: "complete power off is *usually* only necessary".

    There are always exceptions and caveats.

    --
    Basic computer maintenance
    http://uk.geocities.com/personel44/maintenance.html
     
    °Mike°, Jan 26, 2005
    #10
  11. Dugie

    Toolman Tim Guest

    "°Mike°" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    | On Tue, 25 Jan 2005 19:10:18 -0800, in
    | <hVDJd.1725$>
    | Toolman Tim scrawled:
    |
    | <snip>
    |
    | > So, as seldom as I would disagree with °Mike°, I must in
    | >this case say that a warm-start (reboot) isn't always going
    | >to be as effective as a cold-start.
    |
    | To quote: "complete power off is *usually* only necessary".
    |
    | There are always exceptions and caveats.
    |
    Correct - I missed that in the first reading.
     
    Toolman Tim, Jan 27, 2005
    #11
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