Paradise newsgroups updating has nearly ceased, nearly useless soon

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Ray Colvill, Nov 20, 2005.

  1. Ray Colvill

    Ray Colvill Guest

    I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.

    Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    been removed by the Newsmaster.

    Yet Teranews update had over 400 new groups.

    and news.isu.edu.tw had over 500 new groups.

    Paradise decline continues at a steady rate, i notice 3 off my
    relatives have moved to Orcon broadband while i was away.

    Protected by GIANT Company's Spam Inspector
    The most powerful anti-spam software available.
    http://mail.spaminspector.com
     
    Ray Colvill, Nov 20, 2005
    #1
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  2. Ray Colvill

    Kerry Guest

    In article <>,
    "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:

    > I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >
    > Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    > nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    > In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    > been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >


    How many crap newsgroups do you need?

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Laughter is the best medicine. Unless you're asthmatic, where Ventolin's
    your best bet.
     
    Kerry, Nov 20, 2005
    #2
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  3. Ray Colvill

    steve Guest

    Kerry wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    >
    >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >>
    >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >> been removed by the Newsmaster.

    >
    > How many crap newsgroups do you need?


    Grumpy!!!
     
    steve, Nov 20, 2005
    #3
  4. Ray Colvill

    Kerry Guest

    In article <>,
    steve <> wrote:

    > Kerry wrote:
    >
    > > In article <>,
    > > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    > >
    > >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    > >>
    > >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    > >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    > >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    > >> been removed by the Newsmaster.

    > >
    > > How many crap newsgroups do you need?

    >
    > Grumpy!!!


    Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    one need?

    Some people could need lives

    --
    ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
    Laughter is the best medicine. Unless you're asthmatic, where Ventolin's
    your best bet.
     
    Kerry, Nov 20, 2005
    #4
  5. Ray Colvill

    XP Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:06:58 +1300, "Ray Colvill" <>
    wrote:

    >I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >
    >Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >
    >Yet Teranews update had over 400 new groups.
    >
    >and news.isu.edu.tw had over 500 new groups.
    >
    >Paradise decline continues at a steady rate, i notice 3 off my
    >relatives have moved to Orcon broadband while i was away.
    >
    >Protected by GIANT Company's Spam Inspector
    >The most powerful anti-spam software available.
    >http://mail.spaminspector.com
    >
    >




    New Zealand does not have the resources to carry a decent NNTP News Service..

    The Storage for this would be Massive..
     
    XP, Nov 20, 2005
    #5
  6. Ray Colvill

    Sue Bilstein Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry <>
    wrote:
    >In article <>,
    > steve <> wrote:
    >> Kerry wrote:
    >>
    >> > How many crap newsgroups do you need?

    >>
    >> Grumpy!!!

    >
    >Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    >one need?
    >
    >Some people could need lives


    So would it be OK with you if xtra dropped nz.general? Maybe the OP
    lost a group he likes.

    NZ ISPs are crap with newsgroups.
     
    Sue Bilstein, Nov 20, 2005
    #6
  7. Ray Colvill

    Shane Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > steve <> wrote:
    >
    >> Kerry wrote:
    >>
    >> > In article <>,
    >> > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >> >>
    >> >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >> >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >> >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >> >> been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >> >
    >> > How many crap newsgroups do you need?

    >>
    >> Grumpy!!!

    >
    > Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    > one need?
    >


    Xtra has 50 -60,000 last time I looked

    > Some people could need lives


    Reality == the enemy!

    --
    Hardware, n.: The parts of a computer system that can be kicked

    The best way to get the right answer on usenet is to post the wrong one.
     
    Shane, Nov 20, 2005
    #7
  8. Ray Colvill

    XP Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry <> wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > steve <> wrote:
    >
    >> Kerry wrote:
    >>
    >> > In article <>,
    >> > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >> >>
    >> >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >> >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >> >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >> >> been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >> >
    >> > How many crap newsgroups do you need?

    >>
    >> Grumpy!!!

    >
    >Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    >one need?
    >
    >Some people could need lives




    SuperNews has some 77k plus.

    EasyNews 58k..
     
    XP, Nov 20, 2005
    #8
  9. Ray Colvill

    Jones Minor Guest

    "XP" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>In article <>,
    >> steve <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> Kerry wrote:
    >>>
    >>> > In article <>,
    >>> > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    >>> >
    >>> >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >>> >>
    >>> >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >>> >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >>> >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >>> >> been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >>> >
    >>> > How many crap newsgroups do you need?
    >>>
    >>> Grumpy!!!

    >>
    >>Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    >>one need?
    >>
    >>Some people could need lives

    >
    >
    >
    > SuperNews has some 77k plus.
    >
    > EasyNews 58k..


    Google groups has a massive usenet database that they took over from Deja
    News some time ago. You can also post to newsgroups using Google groups. I
    guess it would include the world's largest database of postings that have
    been made to usenet groups over the last 10 years. I use Google groups all
    the time.
     
    Jones Minor, Nov 20, 2005
    #9
  10. Ray Colvill

    Max Burke Guest

    > Shane scribbled:

    >> On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry wrote:
    >> Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many
    >> does one need?


    > Xtra has 50 -60,000 last time I looked


    Just reset Paradise newsgroup list in OE. 79882 newsgroups downloaded...

    --

    Replace the obvious with paradise.net to email me
    Found Images
    http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/~mlvburke
     
    Max Burke, Nov 20, 2005
    #10
  11. Re: Paradise newsgroups updating has nearly ceased, nearly uselesssoon

    XP wrote:
    > New Zealand does not have the resources to carry a decent NNTP News

    Service..
    >
    > The Storage for this would be Massive..


    The storage isn't really a problem. Many of us would have enough disk
    space at home to store a typical 180 days retention of text groups.
    Attempting to store binary groups for perhaps three days (typical, even
    for overseas servers, with the exception of those who are marketing news
    products specifically) would only be a few thousand dollars investment
    in equipment. Long term storage of binaries becomes expensive however.

    The biggest factor preventing NZ from having a decent news feed is
    bandwidth cost. Transfering 300+ gigabytes per day of international
    traffic is prohibitively expensive.

    The Other Guy
     
    The Other Guy, Nov 20, 2005
    #11
  12. Ray Colvill

    Brian Dooley Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:09:00 +1300, Kerry
    <> wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > "Ray Colvill" <> wrote:
    >
    >> I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >>
    >> Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    >> nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    >> In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    >> been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >>

    >
    >How many crap newsgroups do you need?


    I manage to get by on two - but then I can read.
    --

    Brian Dooley

    Wellington New Zealand
     
    Brian Dooley, Nov 20, 2005
    #12
  13. Ray Colvill

    Ralph Fox Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:06:58 +1300, in message
     <>, Ray Colvill wrote:

    > I have just got back from a 3 week overseas holiday.
    >
    > Updated my paradise.net newsgroup headers ok.
    > nothing about ANY NEW GROUP added to the system.
    > In fact about 20 groups had no content and must have
    > been removed by the Newsmaster.
    >
    > Yet Teranews update had over 400 new groups.
    >
    > and news.isu.edu.tw had over 500 new groups.


    1. I would be more impressed by these figures if you had told us
    how many of these were real groups with real discussions, and
    how many were not.

    Some jerks post "NEWGROUP" control messages to create groups
    with dorky names, that will not be used for real discussions.
    Some news servers honour these "NEWGROUP" control messages
    automatically.

    2. In my experience, Paradise will add a newsgroup if you ask
    them to.
     
    Ralph Fox, Nov 20, 2005
    #13
  14. Ray Colvill

    Ralph Fox Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:36:22 +1300, in message
     <>, Sue Bilstein wrote:

    > On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:25:55 +1300, Kerry <>
    > wrote:
    > >In article <>,
    > > steve <> wrote:
    > >> Kerry wrote:
    > >>
    > >> > How many crap newsgroups do you need?
    > >>
    > >> Grumpy!!!

    > >
    > >Me? Never. But Paradise likely carries 13,000 groups. How many does
    > >one need?


    Make that 79,882 newsgroups (as Max Burke has already stated).


    > >Some people could need lives

    >
    > So would it be OK with you if xtra dropped nz.general? Maybe the OP
    > lost a group he likes.


    Odd response. The OP said nothing about Paradise dropping or losing
    groups, like nz.general, that it previously carried.

    As I read it, the OP's complaint is that Paradise did not automatically
    add 400 or so unspecified groups that some other server had added.

    The OP did not say what these groups were, and AFAICT from the OP's
    message the OP may not even know what those 400 groups are. It might
    be that a good percentage of these 400 groups have names of this ilk

    alt.jimmy.spenks.from.my.junior.high.school.is.a.loser.and.a.jerk
    alt.genius.jerry.hoofnagle.i.am.the.greatest.at.my.junior.high.school


    > NZ ISPs are crap with newsgroups.


    For binary groups, true.
    For text groups, if you want your ISP to add a group then generally
    you only need to ask them to do so.


    --
    Cheers,
    Ralph

    The early bird gets the worm, but the second mouse gets the cheese.
     
    Ralph Fox, Nov 20, 2005
    #14
  15. Ray Colvill

    Sue Bilstein Guest

    On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 10:09:38 +0000, Ralph Fox
    <-echo.invalid> wrote:
    >On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 16:36:22 +1300, in message
    > <>, Sue Bilstein wrote:
    >
    >> NZ ISPs are crap with newsgroups.

    >
    >For binary groups, true.
    >For text groups, if you want your ISP to add a group then generally
    >you only need to ask them to do so.


    And then, after a time of wonder (usually 3 - 13 working days) you get
    through to someone who knows what a newsgroup is. I've had to do that
    with three ISPs, for the obscure NG that I moderate.

    But that's minor compared to the hassle in getting support for
    newsserver problems.

    Changing to a pay newsserver was well worth the money. Must be more
    than a year now, and never a worry.
     
    Sue Bilstein, Nov 21, 2005
    #15
  16. Ray Colvill

    Don Hills Guest

    In article <>,
    Ralph Fox <-echo.invalid> wrote:
    >
    >2. In my experience, Paradise will add a newsgroup if you ask
    > them to.


    Paradise used to. "Big 7" groups (comp.*, rec.* etc) usually got added
    automatically. But they dropped their news server and started using
    TelstraClear's. The TC admins are not interested in adding newsgroups.
    For example, I requested comp.os.os2.ecomstation but was told:

    ------------------------------
    We have requested this group to be added to our IS Ops team, however,
    unfortunately we cannot add this group, as we already have the maximum
    amount allocated from our upstream provider.

    We can only suggest in this case that you try an alternative news server
    for comp.os.os2.ecomstation

    Kind Regards,
    Helpdesk
    TelstraClear Customer Help
    -------------------------------

    --
    Don Hills (dmhills at attglobaldotnet) Wellington, New Zealand
    "New interface closely resembles Presentation Manager,
    preparing you for the wonders of OS/2!"
    -- Advertisement on the box for Microsoft Windows 2.11 for 286
     
    Don Hills, Nov 21, 2005
    #16
  17. Ray Colvill

    Dave Doe Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > In article <>,
    > Ralph Fox <-echo.invalid> wrote:
    > >
    > >2. In my experience, Paradise will add a newsgroup if you ask
    > > them to.

    >
    > Paradise used to. "Big 7" groups (comp.*, rec.* etc) usually got added
    > automatically. But they dropped their news server and started using
    > TelstraClear's. The TC admins are not interested in adding newsgroups.
    > For example, I requested comp.os.os2.ecomstation but was told:


    <snip>

    When are you gonna upgrade Don :) I remember the day we ran up NT 3.51
    and thought, hey how come OS/2 (Warp) doesn't multitask like this.

    Multitasks poorly, no app base - get rid of it.

    --
    Duncan
     
    Dave Doe, Nov 21, 2005
    #17
  18. Ray Colvill

    Don Hills Guest

    In article <>,
    Dave Doe <> wrote:
    >
    >When are you gonna upgrade Don :) I remember the day we ran up NT 3.51
    >and thought, hey how come OS/2 (Warp) doesn't multitask like this.
    >
    >Multitasks poorly, no app base - get rid of it.


    Put the trolling pole away, Dave. I ain't biting. But I will gloat a bit for
    the peanut gallery.

    I wouldn't recommend it to any newbie, but it works for me. Even Linux
    hasn't yet caught up - the kernel gurus are still trying to come up with
    workable fast threading. It makes an ideal internet appliance - there are no
    exploits for it. It requires no maintenance - it just runs. I installed this
    machine in 1999 and installed the latest fixpak at that time. I haven't had
    to touch it since then.

    Apps? Well, what do you need? Open Office runs. There's an older OS/2 native
    version, and the current Windows version runs in an emulation environment
    from Innotek. There are OS/2 ports of the more popular Linux apps, and you
    can recompile any others you need. The emx library handles API translation,
    console apps usually recompile without changing any code at all.

    I use:
    Firefox for browsing
    yarn/soup for mail/news (PMMail is also good)
    PMView for graphics (GIMP has been ported if you prefer it)
    CDRecord, RSJ and JCDRead for ripping and burning
    LAME for MP3 encoding
    Z! for MP3 playing
    Acrobat for PDFs
    Tame/Sane for scanning
    Pilot Link for syncing my PDA

    That's all this old laptop has room for. I have a more modern version of
    OS/2 (called eCS) on my main desktop system. OS/2 will no longer be
    available for purchase from IBM as of the end of this year, but eCS will
    continue to be actively maintained and updated because the vendor has an
    ongoing support agreement with IBM (as do the other large customers still
    using OS/2). It comes bundled with a useful selection of apps (see
    www.ecomstation.com).

    Hardware support is still not a big problem - IBM and others are still
    fixing problems that arise with new core chipsets. Scitech's video drivers
    are up to date, Uniaud handles sound chips, USB support has been there for
    years, Winmodems are supported, and there's even a new driver wrapper that
    allows using Windows NIC drivers in OS/2 for the more esoteric chipsets.

    So tell me again - why should I move? :)

    I know I'll have to move eventually, most likely to Linux, if only to gain
    some skills that have relevance in the modern world. As I pointed out, my
    knowledge of security, rootkits, trojans, patches, AV and spyware tools etc
    is all sadly lacking because I haven't needed any of it.

    --
    Don Hills (dmhills at attglobaldotnet) Wellington, New Zealand
    "New interface closely resembles Presentation Manager,
    preparing you for the wonders of OS/2!"
    -- Advertisement on the box for Microsoft Windows 2.11 for 286
     
    Don Hills, Nov 22, 2005
    #18
  19. Ray Colvill

    Ralph Fox Guest

    On Mon, 21 Nov 2005 18:53:32 +1200, in message
     <>, Don Hills wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > Ralph Fox <-echo.invalid> wrote:
    > >
    > >2. In my experience, Paradise will add a newsgroup if you ask
    > > them to.

    >
    > Paradise used to. "Big 7" groups (comp.*, rec.* etc) usually got added
    > automatically. But they dropped their news server and started using
    > TelstraClear's. The TC admins are not interested in adding newsgroups.


    You could be right. I haven't tried since Paradise started using
    TelstraClear's news server.

    > For example, I requested comp.os.os2.ecomstation but was told:
    >
    > ------------------------------
    > We have requested this group to be added to our IS Ops team, however,
    > unfortunately we cannot add this group, as we already have the maximum
    > amount allocated from our upstream provider.
    >
    > We can only suggest in this case that you try an alternative news server
    > for comp.os.os2.ecomstation
    >
    > Kind Regards,
    > Helpdesk
    > TelstraClear Customer Help
    > -------------------------------


    That sucks.

    If one is going to try an alternative news server, one
    might also "churn" (drop Paradise for another ISP).



    --
    Cheers,
    Ralph

    "There is only one boss, the customer. And he can fire everybody in
    the company from the chairman on down, simply by spending his money
    somewhere else." -- Sam Walton
     
    Ralph Fox, Nov 22, 2005
    #19
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