Pagefile

Discussion in 'Windows 64bit' started by Clayton, Jul 21, 2008.

  1. Clayton

    Clayton Guest

    Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    Clayton, Jul 21, 2008
    #1
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  2. Clayton

    Mark H Guest

    Yes, and no.
    Windows is instrinsically designed to use a pagefile and will "act strange"
    while producing errors if a pagefile is not available. On the other hand,
    with 8GB of memory, windows will find very little need to ever access this
    pagefile.

    So, instead of debating it, optimize it... set it to the right size based on
    how much windows uses it:
    (Yes, this works for Vista also.)
    http://support.microsoft.com/kb/889654


    "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    >
    Mark H, Jul 21, 2008
    #2
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  3. You may not see it being used very much, but the system really enjoys having
    one. And how big a chunk is 12GB out of a modern HD anyway?

    There are other benefits to having one as well - if your HD becomes
    fragmented, you can delete it and defragging will run faster. With that much
    RAM I would recommend to set the page file to a fixed size - Minsize same as
    Maxsize. You will not like it if the system thinks it will have to make a
    resize to the file.


    Tony. . .


    "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    >
    Tony Sperling, Jul 21, 2008
    #3
  4. "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    >


    There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The pagefile
    is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing it.
    Colin Barnhorst, Jul 21, 2008
    #4
  5. Clayton

    Clayton Guest

    So what should the min and max be?


    "Colin Barnhorst" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    >>

    >
    > There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The pagefile
    > is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing it.
    Clayton, Jul 22, 2008
    #5
  6. I suggest [Maxsize=Windows Recommended Initialsize], as it is listed in the
    Virtual Memory tab from Performance Options of System Properties, or
    whatever it is called in your Windows Version.

    Forget I mentioned minsize, the concept is confusing since it is used
    differently within the dialogs.

    Initial Size is your
    target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

    (System Properties keyboard short-cut [WinKey+Pause/Break] thanks to Colin,
    I believe?)


    Tony. . .



    "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > So what should the min and max be?
    >
    >
    > "Colin Barnhorst" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > >> Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    > >>

    > >
    > > There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The

    pagefile
    > > is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing it.

    >
    Tony Sperling, Jul 22, 2008
    #6
  7. Clayton

    Will Guest

    I am running Vista U.32 & Vista U.64 Bootcamped with Leopard in Mac Pro
    computer - 4 GB memory. Default page file is 2+GB, 4+GB respectively. I
    disable then delete pagefile after reboot, calling for small memory dump in
    system properties failure define.
    Assuming that the main reason for page file is to allow total memory dump,
    you could make that no dump on system failure because it is of no use to you
    or to Microsoft if one occurs. It is an absurd waste of space.
    You should see the difference between Leopard & Vista 64. Even the Apple
    discussion groups presentation leave this in the dust in terms of user
    friendly.
    Will, Jul 22, 2008
    #7
  8. Clayton

    Mark H Guest

    Okay, you don't follow links. So, here's the instructions from Microsoft on
    how to set Pagefile size manually to the best values. Yes, it can be
    convoluted. So, most people follow some silly rule of thumb like: 1.5x
    current RAM and then complain that 12GB of hard drive space is being wasted.
    For a computer with 8GB of memory: (Min-Max: Typical results will vary
    depending on software you use.)
    Method 1 will produce a pagefile of about 1-3GB.
    Method 2 will produce a pagefile of about 2-4GB.
    Method 3 will produce a pagefile of about 3-12GB.
    Method 4 is whatever you want it to be.

    Bottom line: Do you want room for a dump file that neither you or Microsoft
    is ever going to use to troubleshoot your machine in the event of an error?
    Method 1: Use performance logs to understand the paging activity on your
    computer
    (Most accurate)
    1. Click Start, point to Administrative Tools, and then click
    Performance.
    2. Expand Performance Logs and Alerts, click Counter Logs, right-click
    the blank space in the right-pane, and then click New Log Settings.
    3. In the Name box, type a name for the log, and then click OK.
    4. On the General tab, click Add Counters.
    5. Click Use local computer counters.
    6. In the Performance object list, click Paging File.
    7. Click Select counters from list, click % Usage, and then click Add.
    8. In the Performance object list, click Memory.
    9. In Select counters from list, click Available Bytes, and then click
    Add.
    10. In Select counters from list, click Pages Input/sec, click Add,
    and then click Close.
    11. Click OK.
    Use the log that you collect during typical computer use to understand the
    paging activity on your computer. Then, adjust the page file size
    accordingly.
    Method 2: Use the Page File Bytes Peak counter to calculate page file size
    (Good, easier to use)
    1. Click Start, point to Administrative Tools, and then click
    Performance.
    2. Click System Monitor.
    3. In the right pane, click + (the Add button).
    4. Click Use local computer counters.
    5. In the Performance object list, click Process.
    6. Click Select counters from list, click Page File Bytes Peak, click
    Add, and then click Close.
    7. Let the counter run during typical use of your computer.
    8. Note the maximum value for the Page File Bytes Peak counter, and
    then multiply the value by 0.70. The sum of the equation is the size to set
    for your page file.

    Method 3: Calculate the minimum and maximum page file size
    (Okay, easiest to use)
    To determine the approximate minimum page file that is required by your
    system, calculate the sum of peak private bytes that are used by each
    process on the system. Then, subtract the amount of memory on the system.

    To determine the approximate maximum page file space that is required for
    your system, calculate the sum of peak private bytes that are used by each
    process on the system. Then, add a margin of additional space. Do not
    subtract the amount of memory on the system. The size of the additional
    margin can be adjusted based on your confidence in the snapshot data that is
    used to estimate page file requirements.

    Method 4: Ignore it all and just set it to 1.5x current memory for Min and
    Max so it never changes.


    "Tony Sperling" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > I suggest [Maxsize=Windows Recommended Initialsize], as it is listed in

    the
    > Virtual Memory tab from Performance Options of System Properties, or
    > whatever it is called in your Windows Version.
    >
    > Forget I mentioned minsize, the concept is confusing since it is used
    > differently within the dialogs.
    >
    > Initial Size is your
    > target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    >
    > (System Properties keyboard short-cut [WinKey+Pause/Break] thanks to

    Colin,
    > I believe?)
    >
    >
    > Tony. . .
    >
    >
    >
    > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > news:%...
    > > So what should the min and max be?
    > >
    > >
    > > "Colin Barnhorst" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:...
    > > >> Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    > > >>
    > > >
    > > > There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The

    > pagefile
    > > > is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing

    it.
    > >

    >
    >
    Mark H, Jul 22, 2008
    #8
  9. Clayton

    Mark H Guest

    My apologies, Tony.
    Posted to wrong post. Was supposed to be on Clayton's last post.

    "Tony Sperling" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > I suggest [Maxsize=Windows Recommended Initialsize], as it is listed in

    the
    > Virtual Memory tab from Performance Options of System Properties, or
    > whatever it is called in your Windows Version.
    >
    > Forget I mentioned minsize, the concept is confusing since it is used
    > differently within the dialogs.
    >
    > Initial Size is your
    > target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    >
    > (System Properties keyboard short-cut [WinKey+Pause/Break] thanks to

    Colin,
    > I believe?)
    >
    >
    > Tony. . .
    >
    >
    >
    > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > news:%...
    > > So what should the min and max be?
    > >
    > >
    > > "Colin Barnhorst" <> wrote in message
    > > news:...
    > > > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:...
    > > >> Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    > > >>
    > > >
    > > > There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The

    > pagefile
    > > > is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing

    it.
    > >

    >
    >
    Mark H, Jul 22, 2008
    #9
  10. Quite all right, Mark - the Virtual Memory subsystem has changed a lot over
    the years anyhow. It used to be that the 1,5 algorithm was represented by
    actual code (actually, it was RAMsize+20%+something that I don't remember) -
    at least according to the 'Petzold' I have, so is not all that 'silly', I
    don't think.

    Since that time, it has all become much more complex and your actual size
    may vary depending on many different variations of hard/software plus the
    whole concept of Virtual Memory itself together with personal preferences.
    The fact remains, if you let the OS decide, it will (even today) probably
    decide on a figure that is close enough to the 1,5 figure, that I prefer to
    use that as an example. Someone who needs to ask - and we all needed that at
    some point, may not like to be served up choices for options that may be
    hard to grasp.

    Rather than firing up a big debate, I just want to pass on my own
    experience, which tells me to let the OS handle it, it helps maintain a
    solid and stable system because, right or wrong, the OS is seeing what it
    likes to see. But do override the default re-size option and use a fixed
    size if you have more than 512MB RAM, or give it a fixed size of 2xRAM or
    something totally other if you are adventurous. The 'wasted' space is well
    used as I see it, and may even sit there as a handy bonus one day.

    Other than that, I agree completely, and no irony there either!


    Tony. . .




    "Mark H" <> wrote in message
    news:O0VBxI$...
    > My apologies, Tony.
    > Posted to wrong post. Was supposed to be on Clayton's last post.
    >
    > "Tony Sperling" <> wrote in message
    > news:%...
    > > I suggest [Maxsize=Windows Recommended Initialsize], as it is listed in

    > the
    > > Virtual Memory tab from Performance Options of System Properties, or
    > > whatever it is called in your Windows Version.
    > >
    > > Forget I mentioned minsize, the concept is confusing since it is used
    > > differently within the dialogs.
    > >
    > > Initial Size is your
    > > target!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
    > >
    > > (System Properties keyboard short-cut [WinKey+Pause/Break] thanks to

    > Colin,
    > > I believe?)
    > >
    > >
    > > Tony. . .
    > >
    > >
    > >
    > > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > > news:%...
    > > > So what should the min and max be?
    > > >
    > > >
    > > > "Colin Barnhorst" <> wrote in message
    > > > news:...
    > > > > "Clayton" <> wrote in message
    > > > > news:...
    > > > >> Would a pagefile be required running 8GB memory?
    > > > >>
    > > > >
    > > > > There are some processes that require a pagefile regardless. The

    > > pagefile
    > > > > is not used very heavily with 8GB of ram but don't consider removing

    > it.
    > > >

    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Tony Sperling, Jul 22, 2008
    #10
  11. "Tony Sperling" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > Quite all right, Mark - the Virtual Memory subsystem has changed a lot
    > over
    > the years anyhow. It used to be that the 1,5 algorithm was represented by
    > actual code (actually, it was RAMsize+20%+something that I don't
    > remember) -
    > at least according to the 'Petzold' I have, so is not all that 'silly', I
    > don't think.
    >
    > Since that time, it has all become much more complex and your actual size
    > may vary depending on many different variations of hard/software plus the
    > whole concept of Virtual Memory itself together with personal preferences.
    > The fact remains, if you let the OS decide, it will (even today) probably
    > decide on a figure that is close enough to the 1,5 figure, that I prefer
    > to
    > use that as an example. Someone who needs to ask - and we all needed that
    > at
    > some point, may not like to be served up choices for options that may be
    > hard to grasp.
    >
    > Rather than firing up a big debate, I just want to pass on my own
    > experience, which tells me to let the OS handle it, it helps maintain a
    > solid and stable system because, right or wrong, the OS is seeing what it
    > likes to see. But do override the default re-size option and use a fixed
    > size if you have more than 512MB RAM, or give it a fixed size of 2xRAM or
    > something totally other if you are adventurous. The 'wasted' space is well
    > used as I see it, and may even sit there as a handy bonus one day.
    >
    > Other than that, I agree completely, and no irony there either!
    >
    >
    > Tony. . .
    >
    >


    I agree with Tony. Let the system handle it.
    Colin Barnhorst, Jul 22, 2008
    #11
  12. Clayton

    DevilsPGD Guest

    In message <#> "Clayton"
    <> wrote:

    >So what should the min and max be?


    Unless you have very specific needs, there is a handy "System Managed"
    option that will take care of it for you.
    DevilsPGD, Jul 23, 2008
    #12
  13. Clayton

    N Brown Guest

    I agree Leopard is a complete waste of space.

    "Will" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >I am running Vista U.32 & Vista U.64 Bootcamped with Leopard in Mac Pro
    > computer - 4 GB memory. Default page file is 2+GB, 4+GB respectively. I
    > disable then delete pagefile after reboot, calling for small memory dump
    > in
    > system properties failure define.
    > Assuming that the main reason for page file is to allow total memory dump,
    > you could make that no dump on system failure because it is of no use to
    > you
    > or to Microsoft if one occurs. It is an absurd waste of space.
    > You should see the difference between Leopard & Vista 64. Even the Apple
    > discussion groups presentation leave this in the dust in terms of user
    > friendly.
    >
    >
    N Brown, Aug 12, 2008
    #13
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