Overlap between 290 and 270

Discussion in 'MCSA' started by Dan, Apr 8, 2005.

  1. Dan

    Dan Guest

    Hi Guys,

    Just wondering how much overlap there is between the 290
    and 270 exams?
    Looking at the curriculum on the MS site, there seems to
    be quite a bit.

    Without anyone violating the NDA, what info can people
    share with me on the similarities between these two exams?

    Cheers,
    Dan.
    Dan, Apr 8, 2005
    #1
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  2. Dan wrote:
    > Hi Guys,
    >
    > Just wondering how much overlap there is between the 290
    > and 270 exams?
    > Looking at the curriculum on the MS site, there seems to
    > be quite a bit.
    >
    > Without anyone violating the NDA, what info can people
    > share with me on the similarities between these two exams?
    >
    > Cheers,
    > Dan.


    For me, the only real overlap was in NTFS / share permissions
    scenarios. I would study those ad nauseum, set up a test server, create
    some user accounts and go to town assigning them different types of
    permissions and seeing what the users can do and what they cannot.

    And oh yeah, roaming / mandatory / local profiles may have appeared on
    both tests as well.

    But really that's about it.
    blastingfonda, Apr 8, 2005
    #2
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  3. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    > Dan wrote:
    >> Hi Guys,
    >>
    >> Just wondering how much overlap there is between the 290
    >> and 270 exams?
    >> Looking at the curriculum on the MS site, there seems to
    >> be quite a bit.
    >>
    >> Without anyone violating the NDA, what info can people
    >> share with me on the similarities between these two exams?
    >>
    >> Cheers,
    >> Dan.

    >
    > For me, the only real overlap was in NTFS / share permissions
    > scenarios. I would study those ad nauseum, set up a test server, create
    > some user accounts and go to town assigning them different types of
    > permissions and seeing what the users can do and what they cannot.
    >
    > And oh yeah, roaming / mandatory / local profiles may have appeared on
    > both tests as well.
    >
    > But really that's about it.
    >
    >


    Actually, disk management, TCP/IP configuration, installation methods,
    group policy, permissions, user rights, microsoft management console,
    domain vs. workgroup, all of these things and more can come up on both
    exams. Accepted wisdom says to study for both exams together and take
    professional first, then server. I did it the other way around and did
    fine though.

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 8, 2005
    #3
  4. catwalker63 wrote:

    > Actually, disk management,


    Completely different approach on both exams. 70-290 deals with mirrored
    drives and RAID-5 for example which you can't even install on XP.

    >TCP/IP configuration,


    Same on both, I guess.

    > installation methods,


    Night and day. RIPrep and RIS servers never appear on 70-290.

    > group policy, permissions, user rights,


    70-270 had very little on GPOs as I can recall.

    > microsoft management console,


    Hardly mentioned at all in the 70-270.

    > domain vs. workgroup,


    Wha? Never came up.

    > all of these things and more can come up on both
    > exams. Accepted wisdom says to study for both exams together and

    take
    > professional first, then server. I did it the other way around and

    did
    > fine though.
    >
    > --
    > Catwalker


    Prepping for both at the same time can't hurt, but I definitely
    wouldn't study for one and think it pretty enabled me to pass the
    other. The two exams are completely different for the most part and
    require studying as such.
    blastingfonda, Apr 8, 2005
    #4
  5. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    >
    > Prepping for both at the same time can't hurt, but I definitely
    > wouldn't study for one and think it pretty enabled me to pass the
    > other. The two exams are completely different for the most part and
    > require studying as such.
    >
    >


    You had one exam with one set of questions. Don't assume that's the mix
    everyone is going to get. The exam objectives show definite overlap.
    You have to know how each fits into a network with many platforms and
    structures. The questions combine concepts and expect you to know how
    things fit together, including how professional and server interact. I
    have found that each exam builds on another. It is better to treat them
    less as discrete exams and more as a puzzle the gets clearer the more
    pieces you add.

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 8, 2005
    #5
  6. catwalker63 wrote:
    >
    > You had one exam with one set of questions. Don't assume that's the

    mix
    > everyone is going to get. The exam objectives show definite overlap.


    > You have to know how each fits into a network with many platforms and


    > structures. The questions combine concepts and expect you to know

    how
    > things fit together, including how professional and server interact.

    I
    > have found that each exam builds on another. It is better to treat

    them
    > less as discrete exams and more as a puzzle the gets clearer the more


    > pieces you add.


    I see the exams as discrete exams. The .NET exams for example have
    nothing to do with supporting XP Pro, which has nothing to do with
    managing a SQL Server. On the MCSE track there is some overlap... more
    between 70-291 and 70-293 for example... but I think that's more to do
    with the fact that planning a network and maintaining a network are
    highly interrelated disciplines - in other words, to support a network
    properly, it helps to know how to set things up, and to set things up,
    it helps to have had real-life experience supporting and
    troubleshooting a network.

    I'm not sure the same is true though with client / server interaction.
    You can be an excellent client-side support tech without having touched
    a server, and you can be a server admin guru who would be at a loss
    when resolving client-side issues... though most admins can generally
    handle both disciplines...
    blastingfonda, Apr 9, 2005
    #6
  7. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    >
    > I see the exams as discrete exams. The .NET exams for example have
    > nothing to do with supporting XP Pro, which has nothing to do with
    > managing a SQL Server. On the MCSE track there is some overlap... more
    > between 70-291 and 70-293 for example... but I think that's more to do
    > with the fact that planning a network and maintaining a network are
    > highly interrelated disciplines - in other words, to support a network
    > properly, it helps to know how to set things up, and to set things up,
    > it helps to have had real-life experience supporting and
    > troubleshooting a network.
    >
    > I'm not sure the same is true though with client / server interaction.
    > You can be an excellent client-side support tech without having
    > touched a server, and you can be a server admin guru who would be at a
    > loss when resolving client-side issues... though most admins can
    > generally handle both disciplines...
    >


    I'm going to disagree with you again. While there may be some truth to
    what you say, learning the client OS will help you with server and
    learning the server OS will help you with the client, especially in this
    instance where they are both MS and have many of the core elements in
    common. That doesn't mean everything is the same, but they many
    similarities and many of the same tools. Maybe I'm just more of a big
    picture type person, but I prefer to see the network and the
    certification as a whole and the client, server, and each exam as pieces
    that belong to the whole. (We are talking about the MCSE/MCSA
    certification and I don't remember the OP mentioning anything about .NET
    exams and knowing server will have a huge impact on learning SQL server.)
    Like a puzzle, the exam topics interlock. The more you know about all
    the topics, the better you will do on each exam.

    I actually started my study with Active Directory since it was the major
    change in between NT4 and 2000 and I think it was a good decision. I
    didn't take the AD exam until much later, but I think it was critical to
    my understanding of server and the role it plays on the network. Every
    exam I've taken has built on knowledge and experience I have gained from
    studying for the previous exam. My experience managing a network also
    helped trememdously even though it is with NT4, Netware, and IBM
    AS400/Mainframe server systems. I'm not saying you can't pass the client
    exam without all the other stuff, I'm just saying the many of the skills
    overlap, which is what the OP was asking. I'm also suggesting that the
    goal for the certification shouldn't just be to get the cert but to
    really learn the material and be able to apply what was learned.

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it
    would deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 9, 2005
    #7
  8. catwalker63 wrote:
    > "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news::
    >
    > >
    > > I see the exams as discrete exams. The .NET exams for example have
    > > nothing to do with supporting XP Pro, which has nothing to do with
    > > managing a SQL Server. On the MCSE track there is some overlap...

    more
    > > between 70-291 and 70-293 for example... but I think that's more to

    do
    > > with the fact that planning a network and maintaining a network are
    > > highly interrelated disciplines - in other words, to support a

    network
    > > properly, it helps to know how to set things up, and to set things

    up,
    > > it helps to have had real-life experience supporting and
    > > troubleshooting a network.
    > >
    > > I'm not sure the same is true though with client / server

    interaction.
    > > You can be an excellent client-side support tech without having
    > > touched a server, and you can be a server admin guru who would be

    at a
    > > loss when resolving client-side issues... though most admins can
    > > generally handle both disciplines...
    > >

    >
    > I'm going to disagree with you again. While there may be some truth

    to
    > what you say, learning the client OS will help you with server and
    > learning the server OS will help you with the client, especially in

    this
    > instance where they are both MS and have many of the core elements in
    > common. That doesn't mean everything is the same, but they many
    > similarities and many of the same tools. Maybe I'm just more of a

    big
    > picture type person, but I prefer to see the network and the
    > certification as a whole and the client, server, and each exam as

    pieces
    > that belong to the whole. (We are talking about the MCSE/MCSA
    > certification and I don't remember the OP mentioning anything about

    ..NET
    > exams and knowing server will have a huge impact on learning SQL

    server.)
    > Like a puzzle, the exam topics interlock. The more you know about

    all
    > the topics, the better you will do on each exam.


    Well, I was actually talking about MCP exams in general not being one
    big puzzle, 'cause not knowing quite what you were going on about, I
    thought that was the point you were tyring to make. But if you want to
    specifically talk about the MCSE track as well, the comment also
    applies because SQL Server is an elective for the MCSE/MCSA. And you
    can manage a SQL Server quite well without having any knowledge of the
    vast majority of client or server issues (unless you're talking about
    SQL client issues...)

    I think you mentioned once you were going for your 2000 MCSE. Have you
    taken the 70-290 and the 70-270? 'Cause again, I'm not sure where
    you're coming from in stating the tests are similar. There is a small
    amount of overlap (that I covered earlier) and yes, having knowledge of
    both server and client is helpful to pass both exams and helpful in sys
    admining in general (duh), but there is ton of information exclusive to
    the 70-270 exam that isn't covered in 70-290, and a hell of a lot of
    stuff in the 70-290 which isn't covered in the 70-270. I'd say the
    overlap is at most 10% between the two tests, with 90% being entirely
    different. Again, without straying off topic, this is what we were
    originally discussing without going into long-winded discussions about
    how everything interlocks perfectly or whatever... (I think you're
    giving M$oft way too much credit...)
    blastingfonda, Apr 9, 2005
    #8
  9. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I
    told Bill that if they move my desk one more time, then, then I'm, I'm
    quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've
    moved my desk four times already this year, and I used to be over by the
    window, and I could see the squirrels, and they were merry, but then,
    they switched from the Swingline to the Bostich stapler, but I kept my
    Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much, and I kept the
    staples for the Swingline stapler and it's not okay because if they take
    my stapler then I'll set the building on fire...


    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 9, 2005
    #9
  10. catwalker63 wrote:
    > And I said, I don't care if they lay me off either, because I told, I


    > told Bill that if they move my desk one more time, then, then I'm,

    I'm
    > quitting, I'm going to quit. And, and I told Don too, because they've


    > moved my desk four times already this year, and I used to be over by

    the
    > window, and I could see the squirrels, and they were merry, but then,


    > they switched from the Swingline to the Bostich stapler, but I kept

    my
    > Swingline stapler because it didn't bind up as much, and I kept the
    > staples for the Swingline stapler and it's not okay because if they

    take
    > my stapler then I'll set the building on fire...


    ???

    So what you're trying to say is that the reason for your nonsensical
    rants about how all the MCSE tests are pieces to a puzzle is due to the
    fact that you're the female equivalent of the red stapler dude from
    'Office Space'?

    I'll go with that. ;-)
    blastingfonda, Apr 10, 2005
    #10
  11. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into storage B.
    We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we can get.
    So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and move it down there,
    that would be terrific, OK?


    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 10, 2005
    #11
  12. catwalker63 wrote:
    > BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into storage

    B.
    > We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we can

    get.
    > So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and move it down

    there,
    > that would be terrific, OK?


    I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you didn't take
    the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because your TPS
    Report had no cover sheet.
    blastingfonda, Apr 10, 2005
    #12
  13. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    > catwalker63 wrote:
    >> BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into storage
    >> B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we
    >> can get. So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and move it
    >> down there, that would be terrific, OK?
    >>

    >
    > I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you didn't
    > take the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because your
    > TPS Report had no cover sheet.
    >
    >


    It's possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It's conceivable, you
    miserable, vomitous mass, that I'm only lying here because I lack the
    strength to stand. But, then again... perhaps I have the strength after
    all.


    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it
    would deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 11, 2005
    #13
  14. catwalker63 wrote:
    > "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news::
    >
    > > catwalker63 wrote:
    > >> BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into

    storage
    > >> B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we
    > >> can get. So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and move

    it
    > >> down there, that would be terrific, OK?
    > >>

    > >
    > > I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you didn't
    > > take the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because

    your
    > > TPS Report had no cover sheet.

    >
    > It's possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It's conceivable, you
    > miserable, vomitous mass, that I'm only lying here because I lack the
    > strength to stand. But, then again... perhaps I have the strength

    after
    > all.


    Well I ain't sorry for you no more, ya crazy, psalm-singing, skinny old
    maid!
    blastingfonda, Apr 11, 2005
    #14
  15. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    >
    > catwalker63 wrote:
    >> "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    >> news::
    >>
    >> > catwalker63 wrote:
    >> >> BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into

    > storage
    >> >> B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space we
    >> >> can get. So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and move

    > it
    >> >> down there, that would be terrific, OK?
    >> >>
    >> >
    >> > I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you didn't
    >> > take the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because

    > your
    >> > TPS Report had no cover sheet.

    >>
    >> It's possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It's conceivable, you
    >> miserable, vomitous mass, that I'm only lying here because I lack the
    >> strength to stand. But, then again... perhaps I have the strength

    > after
    >> all.

    >
    > Well I ain't sorry for you no more, ya crazy, psalm-singing, skinny old
    > maid!
    >
    >


    I had this dream...
    I'm in this restaurant, and the waiter brings me my entree. It was a
    salad. It was BF's head on a plate of spinach with his penis sticking out
    of his ear. And I said, "I didn't order this." And the waiter said, "Oh
    you must try it, it's a delicacy. But don't eat the penis, it's just
    garnish."

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 11, 2005
    #15
  16. catwalker63 wrote:
    > "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news::
    >
    > >
    > > catwalker63 wrote:
    > >> "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > >> news::
    > >>
    > >> > catwalker63 wrote:
    > >> >> BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into

    > > storage
    > >> >> B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space

    we
    > >> >> can get. So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and

    move
    > > it
    > >> >> down there, that would be terrific, OK?
    > >> >>
    > >> >
    > >> > I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you

    didn't
    > >> > take the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because

    > > your
    > >> > TPS Report had no cover sheet.
    > >>
    > >> It's possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It's conceivable, you
    > >> miserable, vomitous mass, that I'm only lying here because I lack

    the
    > >> strength to stand. But, then again... perhaps I have the strength

    > > after
    > >> all.

    > >
    > > Well I ain't sorry for you no more, ya crazy, psalm-singing, skinny

    old
    > > maid!
    > >
    > >

    >
    > I had this dream...
    > I'm in this restaurant, and the waiter brings me my entree. It was a
    > salad. It was BF's head on a plate of spinach with his penis sticking

    out
    > of his ear. And I said, "I didn't order this." And the waiter said,

    "Oh
    > you must try it, it's a delicacy. But don't eat the penis, it's just
    > garnish."
    >
    > --
    > Catwalker
    > aka Pu$$y Feet
    > BS, MCP, MCSA
    > MCNGP #43
    > www.mcngp.com
    > faq.mcngp.com
    > "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it

    would
    > deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    blastingfonda, Apr 13, 2005
    #16
  17. catwalker63 wrote:
    > "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news::
    >
    > >
    > > catwalker63 wrote:
    > >> "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > >> news::
    > >>
    > >> > catwalker63 wrote:
    > >> >> BF, we're gonna need to go ahead and move you downstairs into

    > > storage
    > >> >> B. We have some new people coming in, and we need all the space

    we
    > >> >> can get. So if you could go ahead and pack up your stuff and

    move
    > > it
    > >> >> down there, that would be terrific, OK?
    > >> >>
    > >> >
    > >> > I guess the cheap subject change is your admission that you

    didn't
    > >> > take the 70-290. And you obviously didn't get the memo, because

    > > your
    > >> > TPS Report had no cover sheet.
    > >>
    > >> It's possible, Pig, I might be bluffing. It's conceivable, you
    > >> miserable, vomitous mass, that I'm only lying here because I lack

    the
    > >> strength to stand. But, then again... perhaps I have the strength

    > > after
    > >> all.

    > >
    > > Well I ain't sorry for you no more, ya crazy, psalm-singing, skinny

    old
    > > maid!
    > >
    > >

    >
    > I had this dream...
    > I'm in this restaurant, and the waiter brings me my entree. It was a
    > salad. It was BF's head on a plate of spinach with his penis sticking

    out
    > of his ear. And I said, "I didn't order this." And the waiter said,

    "Oh
    > you must try it, it's a delicacy. But don't eat the penis, it's just
    > garnish."
    >
    > --
    > Catwalker
    > aka Pu$$y Feet
    > BS, MCP, MCSA
    > MCNGP #43
    > www.mcngp.com
    > faq.mcngp.com
    > "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it

    would
    > deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain


    A woman is the most fiendish instrument of torture ever devised to
    bedevil the days of man.
    blastingfonda, Apr 13, 2005
    #17
  18. Dan

    catwalker63 Guest

    "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news::

    >
    > A woman is the most fiendish instrument of torture ever devised to
    > bedevil the days of man.
    >
    >


    .. . . you're just another good-looking, sweet-talking, charm-oozing fella
    with nothing to offer but some dialog. Why don't you run outside and
    jerk yourself a soda?

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Apr 13, 2005
    #18
  19. Dan

    JaR Guest

    In microsoft.public.cert.exam.mcsa, catwalker63 climbed on a soapbox &
    opined:

    > "blastingfonda" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news::
    >
    >>
    >> A woman is the most fiendish instrument of torture ever devised to
    >> bedevil the days of man.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > . . . you're just another good-looking, sweet-talking, charm-oozing
    > fella with nothing to offer but some dialog. Why don't you run
    > outside and jerk yourself a soda?
    >


    You two go get a room!

    Furrfu.

    --
    JaR
    Thug 10110
    Click on MCNGP.com and see CW & BF sitting in a tree...
    JaR, Apr 13, 2005
    #19
  20. Dan

    Jtyc Guest

    > . . . you're just another good-looking, sweet-talking, charm-oozing fella
    > with nothing to offer but some dialog. Why don't you run outside and
    > jerk yourself a soda?


    And she still took all his money.






    Womens...
    Jtyc, Apr 13, 2005
    #20
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    Views:
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    MCSA and MCSE overlap

    Bruce, Jul 12, 2004, in forum: MCSA
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