Outlook (and a few others) equivalents on Linux

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Adam Cameron, Dec 24, 2006.

  1. Adam Cameron

    Adam Cameron Guest

    G'day
    I'm increasingly intrigued by people's comments that Linux has caught up
    with Windows vis-a-vis desktop usability and availability of software to do
    anything one might currently be doing on Windows.

    I also had to go do some client support on a Solaris system the other week,
    and my memory of *nix CLI stuff is rapidly being forgotten, so I figure if
    I had it in front of me on a daily basis, I can buy a book (or download
    some stuff, whatever) and get myself back up to speed with it.

    So I've been looking @ what I run on my current laptop, and think I have
    most bases covered except Outlook (and the odd bit of gaming I do, but
    dual-booting can solve that one, a sI'mn not "hotswapping" between playing
    games and doing work ;-).

    After Eclipse, Outlook would be the primary application I use on a daily
    basis (I tend to be typing code and email, rather than docs). Openoffice
    seems to gloss over messaging/calendaring on its website, when stating it's
    a full replacement for MS Office.

    So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    provided by Outlook:
    - Email (duh)
    - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    available for appointments)
    - Contacts
    - Folder rules

    NB: replacing Exchange as the server is not an option, so don't suggest
    anything along those lines pls.

    Oh... over and above Outlook, I guess I also need to open / modify other
    people's Visio and Project files often enough for it to be a requirement to
    be able to do that too. Without a reboot into Windows, I mean.

    Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    Cheers for any (constructive) responses. I realise Windows vs Linux is a
    "hot" debate topic, but could I ask any respondents to stick with the
    question at hand, rather than bagging each other's choice of OS. I do
    actually work with both, as well Macs and NetWare and god knows what else
    over the last 15-odd years. I have no preference or interest in "which you
    might think is better", at OS level, they're all fine tools for the job,
    depending on what the job is. I'm after application advice, not OS advice
    :)

    Thanks.

    --
    Adam
     
    Adam Cameron, Dec 24, 2006
    #1
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  2. Adam Cameron

    Shane Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:


    > So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    > Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    > provided by Outlook:
    > - Email (duh)
    > - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    > available for appointments)
    > - Contacts
    > - Folder rules


    I use Kontact (KDE), Kontact incorporates other applications, making an
    outlook like client. It uses KMail for email, KNode for Usenet, KOrganiser
    for timetable reminders and KContact

    However, I have never tried it on an exchange server, so dont know if/how it
    handles. There are however exchange plugins


    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    Gaim, aMSN, Kopete. (Theres a few ;-)

    >
    > Thanks.
    >


    --
    Bender: I'm very generous. What about that time I gave blood?
    Fry: Whose blood?
    Bender: Some guy's.

    blog: http://shanes.dyndns.org
     
    Shane, Dec 24, 2006
    #2
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  3. Adam Cameron

    Rob Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:
    > G'day
    > I'm increasingly intrigued by people's comments that Linux has caught up
    > with Windows vis-a-vis desktop usability and availability of software to do
    > anything one might currently be doing on Windows.
    >
    > I also had to go do some client support on a Solaris system the other week,
    > and my memory of *nix CLI stuff is rapidly being forgotten, so I figure if
    > I had it in front of me on a daily basis, I can buy a book (or download
    > some stuff, whatever) and get myself back up to speed with it.
    >
    > So I've been looking @ what I run on my current laptop, and think I have
    > most bases covered except Outlook (and the odd bit of gaming I do, but
    > dual-booting can solve that one, a sI'mn not "hotswapping" between playing
    > games and doing work ;-).
    >
    > After Eclipse, Outlook would be the primary application I use on a daily
    > basis (I tend to be typing code and email, rather than docs). Openoffice
    > seems to gloss over messaging/calendaring on its website, when stating it's
    > a full replacement for MS Office.
    >
    > So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    > Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    > provided by Outlook:
    > - Email (duh)
    > - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    > available for appointments)
    > - Contacts
    > - Folder rules
    >
    > NB: replacing Exchange as the server is not an option, so don't suggest
    > anything along those lines pls.
    >
    > Oh... over and above Outlook, I guess I also need to open / modify other
    > people's Visio and Project files often enough for it to be a requirement to
    > be able to do that too. Without a reboot into Windows, I mean.
    >

    Evolution connects seamlessly with Exchange. Will do all your calendar,
    contacts, email etc. I can't think of any linux app that will open Visio
    files. If the Visio files are exported as svg, then Inkscape, or
    Openoffice with svg plugin will do fine. Dia and Kivio are good
    flow-charting apps. I'm at a loss on opening Project files in linux.

    The other way around it is to run crossover office.

    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?
    >

    Gaim, or Kopete on kdm
    --

    Rob
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
    http://aspir8or.googlepages.com/
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -


    Being married to a programmer is like having a cat. You talk to it but
    you're never really sure if it hears you, much less comprehends what you
    say.
    - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -
     
    Rob, Dec 24, 2006
    #3
  4. On Sun, 24 Dec 2006 18:12:13 +0000, Adam Cameron wrote:

    > So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    > Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    > provided by Outlook:
    > - Email (duh)
    > - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    > available for appointments)
    > - Contacts
    > - Folder rules



    Evolution with the Exchange Connector will do all that.


    > NB: replacing Exchange as the server is not an option, so don't suggest
    > anything along those lines pls.
    >
    > Oh... over and above Outlook, I guess I also need to open / modify other
    > people's Visio and Project files often enough for it to be a requirement to
    > be able to do that too. Without a reboot into Windows, I mean.


    MS Visio & MS Project are closed source proprietary applications with
    proprietary file formats. I don't know if there are applications that can
    handle their file formats - there are applications that do project
    management, but WRT Visio, simply get them to export the document as a PDF
    and then you will have enormous choice over what to view it in.

    BTW, other than the above two Windows Applications you will find
    everything else you need.


    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    Many clients. But why would you use that for business?


    Aquilegia Alyssum

    --
    MS Windows Vista - broken by design
    http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt
     
    Aquilegia Alyssum, Dec 24, 2006
    #4
  5. Adam Cameron

    Adam Cameron Guest

    G'day
    Cheers to Rob and Shane for their replies too. I'm replying to this one as
    I actually have something to add, rather than just thinking "OK, will look
    into your suggestions", for your posts.


    On Mon, 25 Dec 2006 09:32:31 +1300, Aquilegia Alyssum wrote:

    > Evolution with the Exchange Connector will do all that.


    "OK, will look into your suggestion".

    ;-)


    > MS Visio & MS Project are closed source proprietary applications with
    > proprietary file formats.


    Not that that has really stopped people in the past. So's the .doc format,
    isn't it? And .xls.


    > management, but WRT Visio, simply get them to export the document as a PDF
    > and then you will have enormous choice over what to view it in.


    Note my requirement to view and EDIT.

    But it's an occasional activity for me, so can probably get by without, or
    reboot into Windows if I need to. No worries there.


    >> Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?

    > Many clients. But why would you use that for business?


    I have team members on the other side of the city, country and world. It's
    more convenient than voice or email, sometimes. It's also an easy way to
    flick a file to the person on the other side of the room, or send them a
    URL, or any number of other things that aren't appropriate for voice, and
    it's quicker to message than email. I also have a number of tame clients
    and suppliers who like to be able to ask me quick instant questions as we
    both work (again, things too trivial for phone or immediate for email).

    Let's turn that around... why NOT use it for business?

    Thanks for the Evolution tip. Will definitely look into it.


    --
    Adam
     
    Adam Cameron, Dec 24, 2006
    #5
  6. Adam Cameron

    Shane Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:


    > But it's an occasional activity for me, so can probably get by without, or
    > reboot into Windows if I need to. No worries there.
    >
    >


    There is another option
    Virtual Machines

    If you install VMware (for example) on your Linux partition, you can install
    Windows, or OpenBSD, or Solaris, or another Linux, or w/ever as a guest OS
    (Licensing may be an issue for things like windows)

    It saves a reboot, you only need to 'boot' the guest up when the need
    arises, so its not chewing away any resources when not in use.

    Transferring files is like transferring from one box to another.. ftp, scp,
    http, w/ever you're accustomed to

    >>> Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these
    >>> days?

    >> Many clients. But why would you use that for business?

    >
    > I have team members on the other side of the city, country and world.
    > It's
    > more convenient than voice or email, sometimes. It's also an easy way to
    > flick a file to the person on the other side of the room, or send them a
    > URL, or any number of other things that aren't appropriate for voice, and
    > it's quicker to message than email. I also have a number of tame clients
    > and suppliers who like to be able to ask me quick instant questions as we
    > both work (again, things too trivial for phone or immediate for email).
    >
    > Let's turn that around... why NOT use it for business?



    We use a jabber server for work, makes life a *heck* of a lot easier
    Especially where there is potential for multiple people to [inadvertantly]
    work the same ticket at once



    --
    Bender: Behold, the internet.
    Fry: My God, it's full of ads!

    blog: http://shanes.dyndns.org
     
    Shane, Dec 24, 2006
    #6
  7. Adam Cameron

    Adam Cameron Guest

    > There is another option
    > Virtual Machines


    Yep: that's how I'll be evaluating linux in the first instance: set up a VM
    with all the various bits and pieces I think I need to run productively,
    and then try to spend as much of my working day within the VM... makes it
    easier to dive out to Windows if/when I find something I need Windows for.

    The idea is that ultimately I'll be able to demonstrate to myself I really
    don't need to be "diving back out into Windows", which is the point at
    which I'll rebuild the machine as a dual boot. Or not... if the testing
    doesn't convince me...

    --
    Adam
     
    Adam Cameron, Dec 24, 2006
    #7
  8. Adam Cameron

    Adam Cameron Guest

    >> Many clients. But why would you use that for business?
    >
    > I have [a bumdle of reasons already described]


    That, and - like now - I spend a lot of time @ home in front of the PC and
    use MSN Messenger to talk to family/friends back in NZ.

    This laptop I mentioned is my only machine: both work & A/H. The Linux
    solution needs to cater for both. I probably didn't make that clear
    before, sorry.

    --
    Adam
     
    Adam Cameron, Dec 24, 2006
    #8
  9. Adam Cameron

    Peter Guest

    Aquilegia Alyssum wrote:
    > MS Visio & MS Project are closed source proprietary applications with
    > proprietary file formats.
    > BTW, other than the above two Windows Applications you will find
    > everything else you need.


    The other one is Publisher, this has file formats that are designed to
    prevent compatibility and interoperability (even with other versions of
    Publisher).

    For your own good, you want to keep well clear of such secret file formats,
    especially for any data that has long term value.


    Peter
     
    Peter, Dec 24, 2006
    #9
  10. On Mon, 25 Dec 2006 12:15:01 +1300, Peter wrote:

    >> MS Visio & MS Project are closed source proprietary applications with
    >> proprietary file formats.
    >> BTW, other than the above two Windows Applications you will find
    >> everything else you need.

    >
    > The other one is Publisher, this has file formats that are designed to
    > prevent compatibility and interoperability (even with other versions of
    > Publisher).
    >
    > For your own good, you want to keep well clear of such secret file formats,
    > especially for any data that has long term value.


    Scribus is the current OSS equivalent to Adobe Pagemaker.

    It's not identical to PM, but is definitely heading in that direction -
    and they're actively developing it. :eek:)

    If you've got access to tools such as PageMaker, or equivalent, why bemoan
    the loss of the Micro$oft toy called Publisher?

    And you're right about not wanting to be locked into proprietary file
    formats that have been designed for incompatibility.


    Aquilegia Alyssum

    --
    MS Windows Vista - broken by design
    http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt
     
    Aquilegia Alyssum, Dec 24, 2006
    #10
  11. On Sun, 24 Dec 2006 21:56:49 +0000, Adam Cameron wrote:

    >>> Many clients. But why would you use that for business?

    >>
    >> I have [a bumdle of reasons already described]

    >
    > That, and - like now - I spend a lot of time @ home in front of the PC and
    > use MSN Messenger to talk to family/friends back in NZ.
    >
    > This laptop I mentioned is my only machine: both work & A/H. The Linux
    > solution needs to cater for both. I probably didn't make that clear
    > before, sorry.


    You may want to consider installing Wine - which is a program that enables
    the use of software designed to run on 32bit Windows systems.

    That may mean you would be able to install and use MS
    Office/Visio/Publisher.

    However, please consider only using MS Office if you must - so many
    viruses are targeted at MS Office and you really don't want to take that
    risk on an otherwise virus free platform.


    Aquilegia Alyssum

    --
    MS Windows Vista - broken by design
    http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~pgut001/pubs/vista_cost.txt
     
    Aquilegia Alyssum, Dec 24, 2006
    #11
  12. Adam Cameron

    jasen Guest

    On 2006-12-24, Adam Cameron <> wrote:

    > So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    > Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    > provided by Outlook:
    > - Email (duh)
    > - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    > available for appointments)
    > - Contacts
    > - Folder rules


    evolution aims to be a replacement for outlook but as the details of the
    exchange protocol have only recently been released it may not have all the
    features. (I haven't checked)

    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    gaim (there's a windows version too)

    Bye.
    Jasen
     
    jasen, Dec 25, 2006
    #12
  13. Adam Cameron

    jasen Guest

    On 2006-12-24, Shane <-a-geek.net> wrote:

    > If you install VMware (for example) on your Linux partition, you can install
    > Windows, or OpenBSD, or Solaris, or another Linux, or w/ever as a guest OS
    > (Licensing may be an issue for things like windows)
    >
    > It saves a reboot, you only need to 'boot' the guest up when the need
    > arises, so its not chewing away any resources when not in use.
    >
    > Transferring files is like transferring from one box to another.. ftp, scp,
    > http, w/ever you're accustomed to


    ??? ISTM samba would be the way to go there (installed under inetd to save
    resources)....

    Bye.
    Jasen
     
    jasen, Dec 25, 2006
    #13
  14. Adam Cameron

    steve Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:

    > G'day
    > I'm increasingly intrigued by people's comments that Linux has caught up
    > with Windows vis-a-vis desktop usability and availability of software to
    > do anything one might currently be doing on Windows.
    >
    > I also had to go do some client support on a Solaris system the other
    > week, and my memory of *nix CLI stuff is rapidly being forgotten, so I
    > figure if I had it in front of me on a daily basis, I can buy a book (or
    > download some stuff, whatever) and get myself back up to speed with it.
    >
    > So I've been looking @ what I run on my current laptop, and think I have
    > most bases covered except Outlook (and the odd bit of gaming I do, but
    > dual-booting can solve that one, a sI'mn not "hotswapping" between playing
    > games and doing work ;-).
    >
    > After Eclipse, Outlook would be the primary application I use on a daily
    > basis (I tend to be typing code and email, rather than docs). Openoffice
    > seems to gloss over messaging/calendaring on its website, when stating
    > it's a full replacement for MS Office.
    >
    > So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    > Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    > provided by Outlook:
    > - Email (duh)


    Evolution. If you buy Xandros Linux 4.1 Professional it also includes the
    software required to allow an Evolution client to talk to an Exchange
    server.

    > - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    > available for appointments)


    Evolution can do this as far as I know - with the software above.

    > - Contacts


    Same.

    > - Folder rules


    More detail, please.

    > NB: replacing Exchange as the server is not an option, so don't suggest
    > anything along those lines pls.
    >
    > Oh... over and above Outlook, I guess I also need to open / modify other
    > people's Visio and Project files often enough for it to be a requirement
    > to
    > be able to do that too. Without a reboot into Windows, I mean.


    I have had Visio running on Linux in the past. Not sure about the most
    recent releases.

    There are several different ways you could do this....including VNC into a
    Windows system that does have Visio.

    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    No worries here. Several to choose from.

    --
    Only boring people are bored.
     
    steve, Dec 25, 2006
    #14
  15. Adam Cameron

    Phil Guest

    Aquilegia Alyssum wrote, On 25/12/06 9.32 a:
    > MS Visio & MS Project are closed source proprietary applications with
    > proprietary file formats. I don't know if there are applications that can
    > handle their file formats - there are applications that do project
    > management, but WRT Visio, simply get them to export the document as a PDF
    > and then you will have enormous choice over what to view it in.


    Visio can export Visio XML files. I only know of one other application
    that can open them (OmniGraffle), but that's because when I want Visio,
    I use Visio.

    -Phil
     
    Phil, Dec 25, 2006
    #15
  16. Adam Cameron

    AD. Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:
    > I'm increasingly intrigued by people's comments that Linux has caught up
    > with Windows vis-a-vis desktop usability and availability of software to do
    > anything one might currently be doing on Windows.


    There is a difference between "Linux is an alternative to Windows" and
    "Linux is a drop in replacement for Windows in a Windows network using
    proprietary Windows file formats and protocols".

    While the first one would be a valid statement (and it still depends on
    the persons needs somewhat), the second is stretching it quite a bit.
    If you embark on a Linux evaluation with the second point of view in
    mind you will be disappointed.

    Sure there are projects that go to a great deal of trouble to reverse
    engineer and interoperate with proprietary protocols and formats etc,
    but there isn't (and probably never will be) complete coverage unless
    somehow MS opens up all those secrets.

    --
    Cheers
    Anton
     
    AD., Dec 25, 2006
    #16
  17. Adam Cameron

    Adam Cameron Guest

    Thanks for that.

    The chief issue for me is that I live in *reality*, not some world where
    everyone I deal with will suddenly change their way of doing things to
    interoperate with me, because, hey, "Linux is just better than Windows" (at
    which point everyone starts singing Cumbaya).

    Hence *needing* to connect to Exchange. Hence *needing* to be able to use
    MS-Project and MS-Visio documents.

    I don't think my position is really one way out in left field.

    If it was solely up to me, I'd simple convert to the nearest approximations
    that Linux offers, and we'd all be happy (and singing Cumbaya). But it's
    not. And it's a stupid song anyhow.

    FWIW, I use dozens (OK, maybe ONE dozen ;-) of apps on a daily basis, and
    they're either interoperable already, or I've found replacements. Except
    for those few that I mentioned.

    --
    Adam
     
    Adam Cameron, Dec 25, 2006
    #17
  18. In message <c05hotd4ygx6$>, Adam Cameron wrote:

    > Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?


    This page of Linux application equivalents
    <http://en.opensuse.org/Application_Equivalents> mentions something
    called "aMSN", which is supposed to be an "MSN Messenger clone".
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Dec 25, 2006
    #18
  19. Adam Cameron

    Enkidu Guest

    Is there anything *other than Evolution*?? (was Re: Outlook (anda few others) equivalents on Linux)

    Is there anything *other than Evolution* which will do messaging and
    calendaring and will connect to Exchange?

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    steve wrote:
    > Adam Cameron wrote:
    >
    >> G'day
    >> I'm increasingly intrigued by people's comments that Linux has caught up
    >> with Windows vis-a-vis desktop usability and availability of software to
    >> do anything one might currently be doing on Windows.
    >>
    >> I also had to go do some client support on a Solaris system the other
    >> week, and my memory of *nix CLI stuff is rapidly being forgotten, so I
    >> figure if I had it in front of me on a daily basis, I can buy a book (or
    >> download some stuff, whatever) and get myself back up to speed with it.
    >>
    >> So I've been looking @ what I run on my current laptop, and think I have
    >> most bases covered except Outlook (and the odd bit of gaming I do, but
    >> dual-booting can solve that one, a sI'mn not "hotswapping" between playing
    >> games and doing work ;-).
    >>
    >> After Eclipse, Outlook would be the primary application I use on a daily
    >> basis (I tend to be typing code and email, rather than docs). Openoffice
    >> seems to gloss over messaging/calendaring on its website, when stating
    >> it's a full replacement for MS Office.
    >>
    >> So if I was running a Linux desktop, what would I use to connect to an
    >> Exchange server, and preserve all the following capabilities currently
    >> provided by Outlook:
    >> - Email (duh)

    >
    > Evolution. If you buy Xandros Linux 4.1 Professional it also includes the
    > software required to allow an Evolution client to talk to an Exchange
    > server.
    >
    >> - Calendaring (including the ability to check when my team members are
    >> available for appointments)

    >
    > Evolution can do this as far as I know - with the software above.
    >
    >> - Contacts

    >
    > Same.
    >
    >> - Folder rules

    >
    > More detail, please.
    >
    >> NB: replacing Exchange as the server is not an option, so don't suggest
    >> anything along those lines pls.
    >>
    >> Oh... over and above Outlook, I guess I also need to open / modify other
    >> people's Visio and Project files often enough for it to be a requirement
    >> to
    >> be able to do that too. Without a reboot into Windows, I mean.

    >
    > I have had Visio running on Linux in the past. Not sure about the most
    > recent releases.
    >
    > There are several different ways you could do this....including VNC into a
    > Windows system that does have Visio.
    >
    >> Lastly: I presume there's a client for MSN Messenger on Linux these days?

    >
    > No worries here. Several to choose from.
    >




    --

    Have you ever noticed that if something is advertised as 'amusing' or
    'hilarious', it usually isn't?
     
    Enkidu, Dec 26, 2006
    #19
  20. Adam Cameron

    AD. Guest

    Adam Cameron wrote:
    > Thanks for that.
    >
    > The chief issue for me is that I live in *reality*, not some world where
    > everyone I deal with will suddenly change their way of doing things to
    > interoperate with me, because, hey, "Linux is just better than Windows" (at
    > which point everyone starts singing Cumbaya).
    >
    > Hence *needing* to connect to Exchange. Hence *needing* to be able to use
    > MS-Project and MS-Visio documents.
    >
    > I don't think my position is really one way out in left field.


    No it isn't, but I would ask what do you hope to gain from using Linux?
    Linux may be better than Windows at a bunch of stuff, but being a
    better Windows desktop than Windows isn't one of them.

    I reckon you'd need a clear idea of the benefits, to make sure that
    they'd outweigh any negatives. Otherwise you'd just be giving yourself
    interoperability headaches.

    I happily use Linux as a desktop at my work and prefer it over Windows,
    but I have a fair bit of control over the general IT environment there
    and can make it more cross platform friendly than the typical Windows
    workplace.

    As a general observation, people that are consciously switching away
    from something rather than consciously switching to something will
    quite often be disappointed. They will generally be wanting their old
    experience but without the few negative points that made them consider
    something else. Or in other words, liking what you are switching to
    will get better results than hating what you are switching from.

    Anyway, good luck with your evaluation / trial. There is a lot to like
    about Linux, hopefully you'll find enough to justify switching.

    --
    Cheers
    Anton
     
    AD., Dec 26, 2006
    #20
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