OT: Small server room cooling

Discussion in 'MCSE' started by Matt Burks, Jul 11, 2005.

  1. Matt Burks

    Matt Burks Guest

    I realize this is not related to MCSE topics but I couldn't find a better
    newsgroup and I knew I would find people in here that would know the answer.

    My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server room.
    The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high end
    residential window AC. This used to work fine but it wasn't built for
    24/7/365 use. Because of this it is no longer cooling like it should. It
    also uses 220v power so I don't have a UPS to hook it up to for that 2 sec.
    fail over while the generator is kicking in during power outages. These
    outages seem to always happen over the weekend when there isn't anyone here
    to turn it back on. Today was the fourth Monday in a row that I came in and
    the server cabinet was 90+ degrees. My question is, what do you guys suggest
    I get for this small room that I can run 24/7/365 that will either come back
    on by itself when the generator kicks in or that I can hook up to a small
    UPS for the fail over time.

    I've looked at the APC network air PA1000, does anyone know anything about
    this? Is it made to run all the time?

    I've also looked at a few comparable systems from Wal-Mart for about half
    the price of the APC.

    Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
    Thanks,
    Matt
    Matt Burks, Jul 11, 2005
    #1
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  2. Matt Burks

    kpg Guest

    "Matt Burks" <> wrote in
    news::

    It also uses 220v power so I don't have a UPS to hook it up to
    > for that 2 sec. fail over while the generator is kicking in during
    > power outages.


    Excuse my ignorance but will a UPS power an AC for even 2 seconds?

    Why would it 'reset' upon a power outage?

    See about replacing the one you have with one that comes
    back on by itself - that seems like the norm anyway...

    --
    kpg A+ MCP MCNGP 0x22
    why do I even try
    kpg, Jul 11, 2005
    #2
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  3. Matt Burks

    Matt Burks Guest

    Actually, after speaking with the plant ops guys I found out that the fail
    over time before the generator kicks in is less than a second, but for some
    reason this is enough to power off the current AC.

    -Matt

    "kpg" <ipost@thereforeiam> wrote in message
    news:Xns969063DA9AA95ipostthereforeiam@207.46.248.16...
    > "Matt Burks" <> wrote in
    > news::
    >
    > It also uses 220v power so I don't have a UPS to hook it up to
    >> for that 2 sec. fail over while the generator is kicking in during
    >> power outages.

    >
    > Excuse my ignorance but will a UPS power an AC for even 2 seconds?
    >
    > Why would it 'reset' upon a power outage?
    >
    > See about replacing the one you have with one that comes
    > back on by itself - that seems like the norm anyway...
    >
    > --
    > kpg A+ MCP MCNGP 0x22
    > why do I even try
    Matt Burks, Jul 11, 2005
    #3
  4. Matt Burks

    T-Bone Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    "Matt Burks" <> wrote
    > My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server room.
    > The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high end
    > residential window AC.


    We are using a Samsung two-piece unit that vents out to the factory floor.
    Just make sure whatever you buy has a high enough BTU rating to cover the
    heat generated by the servers. Though I don't think you'll find a "small"
    UPS that can drive an air conditioner. Going forward I would recommend
    either get a 120V AC unit or talk to the building managment people about
    getting the 220 line put on the generator circuit.
    --
    T-Bone
    MCNGP XL
    T-Bone, Jul 11, 2005
    #4
  5. Matt Burks

    kpg Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    "T-Bone" <reply2me@thenewsgroup> wrote in
    news::

    > "Matt Burks" <> wrote
    >> My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server
    >> room. The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high
    >> end residential window AC.

    >
    > We are using a Samsung two-piece unit that vents out to the factory
    > floor. Just make sure whatever you buy has a high enough BTU rating to
    > cover the heat generated by the servers. Though I don't think you'll
    > find a "small" UPS that can drive an air conditioner. Going forward I
    > would recommend either get a 120V AC unit or talk to the building
    > managment people about getting the 220 line put on the generator
    > circuit.


    We use a fan - it goes nicly with the bricks.


    but it's a nice fan - it oscillates

    --
    kpg A+ MCP MCNGP 0x22
    why do I even try
    kpg, Jul 11, 2005
    #5
  6. Matt Burks

    zenner Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    90 deg. is not, normally enough to cause a server to crash. As far as the
    server not resetting, that generally is a configurable value in the BIOS
    and/or the server OS.

    When was the last time you reviewed your server and OS settings? Not
    certain, as you didn't give any information that was not directly related to
    what you diagnose as the problem. I think you need to look at more of your
    environment before settling on a quick, obvious conclusion. Things are not
    always as they appear.

    By looking at your logs you could also check other equipment...is it
    possible that the A/C and the server are popping a circuit
    breaker...especially with an A/C in the same room, it is possible that the
    current draw as the A/C cycles on/off is enough of a spike to produce the
    symptom. Your facilities people should be able to determine just how
    widespread the outage.
    "Matt Burks" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >I realize this is not related to MCSE topics but I couldn't find a better
    >newsgroup and I knew I would find people in here that would know the
    >answer.
    >
    > My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server room.
    > The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high end
    > residential window AC. This used to work fine but it wasn't built for
    > 24/7/365 use. Because of this it is no longer cooling like it should. It
    > also uses 220v power so I don't have a UPS to hook it up to for that 2
    > sec. fail over while the generator is kicking in during power outages.
    > These outages seem to always happen over the weekend when there isn't
    > anyone here to turn it back on. Today was the fourth Monday in a row that
    > I came in and the server cabinet was 90+ degrees. My question is, what do
    > you guys suggest I get for this small room that I can run 24/7/365 that
    > will either come back on by itself when the generator kicks in or that I
    > can hook up to a small UPS for the fail over time.
    >
    > I've looked at the APC network air PA1000, does anyone know anything about
    > this? Is it made to run all the time?
    >
    > I've also looked at a few comparable systems from Wal-Mart for about half
    > the price of the APC.
    >
    > Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
    > Thanks,
    > Matt
    >
    zenner, Jul 11, 2005
    #6
  7. Matt Burks

    Matt Burks Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    ....I never said the server reset. The power flickers and the AC goes off,
    when the power comes back on the AC does not. I have a digital thermostat
    inside the server cabinet that tells me how hot it is in there.

    -Matt


    "zenner" <> wrote in message
    news:TPxAe.957$...
    > 90 deg. is not, normally enough to cause a server to crash. As far as the
    > server not resetting, that generally is a configurable value in the BIOS
    > and/or the server OS.
    >
    > When was the last time you reviewed your server and OS settings? Not
    > certain, as you didn't give any information that was not directly related
    > to what you diagnose as the problem. I think you need to look at more of
    > your environment before settling on a quick, obvious conclusion. Things
    > are not always as they appear.
    >
    > By looking at your logs you could also check other equipment...is it
    > possible that the A/C and the server are popping a circuit
    > breaker...especially with an A/C in the same room, it is possible that the
    > current draw as the A/C cycles on/off is enough of a spike to produce the
    > symptom. Your facilities people should be able to determine just how
    > widespread the outage.
    > "Matt Burks" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >>I realize this is not related to MCSE topics but I couldn't find a better
    >>newsgroup and I knew I would find people in here that would know the
    >>answer.
    >>
    >> My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server
    >> room. The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high end
    >> residential window AC. This used to work fine but it wasn't built for
    >> 24/7/365 use. Because of this it is no longer cooling like it should. It
    >> also uses 220v power so I don't have a UPS to hook it up to for that 2
    >> sec. fail over while the generator is kicking in during power outages.
    >> These outages seem to always happen over the weekend when there isn't
    >> anyone here to turn it back on. Today was the fourth Monday in a row that
    >> I came in and the server cabinet was 90+ degrees. My question is, what do
    >> you guys suggest I get for this small room that I can run 24/7/365 that
    >> will either come back on by itself when the generator kicks in or that I
    >> can hook up to a small UPS for the fail over time.
    >>
    >> I've looked at the APC network air PA1000, does anyone know anything
    >> about this? Is it made to run all the time?
    >>
    >> I've also looked at a few comparable systems from Wal-Mart for about half
    >> the price of the APC.
    >>
    >> Any suggestions would be greatly appreciated.
    >> Thanks,
    >> Matt
    >>

    >
    >
    Matt Burks, Jul 11, 2005
    #7
  8. Matt Burks

    catwalker63 Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    "Matt Burks" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    news:#:

    > ...I never said the server reset. The power flickers and the AC goes
    > off, when the power comes back on the AC does not. I have a digital
    > thermostat inside the server cabinet that tells me how hot it is in
    > there.
    >



    Have you considered calling in a heating and cooling specialist? They
    would be able to design a solution that would be more permanent and less
    shade tree. For something as important as your servers I don't think
    WallMart is going to have a good solution.

    --
    Catwalker
    aka Pu$$y Feet
    BS, MCP, MCSA
    MCNGP #43
    www.mcngp.com
    faq.mcngp.com
    "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    catwalker63, Jul 11, 2005
    #8
  9. Matt Burks

    Matt Burks Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    The only local heating/cooling specialist in town are the ones that sold us
    the window AC in the first place.

    This server cabinet only holds 4 servers, and the company I work for is less
    than flat broke, so If I want anything it's going to HAVE to cost less than
    $1000.

    -Matt


    "catwalker63" <> wrote in message
    news:Xns9690761638F9Ccatwalker63athotmail@216.196.97.136...
    > "Matt Burks" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    > news:#:
    >
    >> ...I never said the server reset. The power flickers and the AC goes
    >> off, when the power comes back on the AC does not. I have a digital
    >> thermostat inside the server cabinet that tells me how hot it is in
    >> there.
    >>

    >
    >
    > Have you considered calling in a heating and cooling specialist? They
    > would be able to design a solution that would be more permanent and less
    > shade tree. For something as important as your servers I don't think
    > WallMart is going to have a good solution.
    >
    > --
    > Catwalker
    > aka Pu$$y Feet
    > BS, MCP, MCSA
    > MCNGP #43
    > www.mcngp.com
    > faq.mcngp.com
    > "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    > deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain
    Matt Burks, Jul 11, 2005
    #9
  10. Matt Burks

    Kevin Harms Guest

    Re: Small server room cooling

    kpg wrote:
    > "T-Bone" <reply2me@thenewsgroup> wrote in
    > news::
    >
    >
    >>"Matt Burks" <> wrote
    >>
    >>>My problem is this, I have a small IS office that is also the server
    >>>room. The room is approx 370sqft and is currently cooled buy a high
    >>>end residential window AC.

    >>
    >>We are using a Samsung two-piece unit that vents out to the factory
    >>floor. Just make sure whatever you buy has a high enough BTU rating to
    >>cover the heat generated by the servers. Though I don't think you'll
    >>find a "small" UPS that can drive an air conditioner. Going forward I
    >>would recommend either get a 120V AC unit or talk to the building
    >>managment people about getting the 220 line put on the generator
    >>circuit.

    >
    >
    > We use a fan - it goes nicly with the bricks.
    >
    >
    > but it's a nice fan - it oscillates
    >

    I agree. We do something similar. We have two high end residental
    units that vent outside. We have 10 servers in there so they work hard
    to keep things cool.

    One that that we struggle with is ours have digital controls. When the
    power goes out, they go out and don't come back on. We currently have
    our UPS units text message our phones so we know the power has gone out
    and that we need to go in and turn the AC units back on. Otherwise its
    gets cooking pretty quick. Just remember that when you look at A/C units.
    Kevin Harms, Jul 12, 2005
    #10
  11. Re: Small server room cooling

    I had a Liebert cabinet that could be controlled via a web interface. It
    had cooling and power. It was, however, not very cheap (5 grand). So, that
    kills your requirement.
    Upside...manage the UPS and cabinet remotely.
    Downside...never fire your IT person on a Friday.

    You can also put in one of the portable air conditioners and vent it into
    the plenum (check fire codes before you go knocking holes in any walls
    within the plenum). The downside to the portables are that they have to
    have their water emptied frequently (every day or two) and they have to vent
    somewhere. ...and they are ~$500. ...and I don't know of any with web
    interfaces, but there are quite a few which can handle a power sag (they
    have manual controls) and reset their compressor...the fan runs and the
    compressor kicks back on after a few minutes.




    --
    Bob Christian II
    http://blogspot.bobchristian.com - Blog



    "Matt Burks" <> wrote in message
    news:%...
    > The only local heating/cooling specialist in town are the ones that sold
    > us the window AC in the first place.
    >
    > This server cabinet only holds 4 servers, and the company I work for is
    > less than flat broke, so If I want anything it's going to HAVE to cost
    > less than $1000.
    >
    > -Matt
    >
    >
    > "catwalker63" <> wrote in message
    > news:Xns9690761638F9Ccatwalker63athotmail@216.196.97.136...
    >> "Matt Burks" <> prattled ceaslessly in
    >> news:#:
    >>
    >>> ...I never said the server reset. The power flickers and the AC goes
    >>> off, when the power comes back on the AC does not. I have a digital
    >>> thermostat inside the server cabinet that tells me how hot it is in
    >>> there.
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >> Have you considered calling in a heating and cooling specialist? They
    >> would be able to design a solution that would be more permanent and less
    >> shade tree. For something as important as your servers I don't think
    >> WallMart is going to have a good solution.
    >>
    >> --
    >> Catwalker
    >> aka Pu$$y Feet
    >> BS, MCP, MCSA
    >> MCNGP #43
    >> www.mcngp.com
    >> faq.mcngp.com
    >> "If man could be crossed with the cat, it would improve man, but it would
    >> deteriorate the cat." Mark Twain

    >
    >
    Bob Christian, Jul 14, 2005
    #11
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