No photographs allowed

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by tony cooper, Sep 11, 2011.

  1. tony cooper

    tony cooper Guest

    Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.

    Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.

    http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg

    Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.

    The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    behind this shooter is timing him.

    http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg

    In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".

    My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    disturbing anything.

    The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    walked away.

    The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.

    The little would-be tyrant:

    http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-7jgdT9S/0/X3/i-7jgdT9S-X3.jpg

    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
    tony cooper, Sep 11, 2011
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    > small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    > instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >
    > My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    > a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    > disturbing anything.
    >
    > The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    > take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    > laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    > feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    > walked away.
    >
    > The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    > of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    > There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    > money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    > abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    > deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.
    >
    > The little would-be tyrant:
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-7jgdT9S/0/X3/i-7jgdT9S-X3.jpg


    I'm very cagey about shooting or publishing photos that don't show people in
    a respectful way. Porn (in all its forms) is just damage. If someone doesn't
    want their photo taken you'd better take a damn good photo, or make sure
    there's an overriding public interest (and making money isn't one of them).

    Irony, the fifth fundamental force, strikes again (maybe for both of us)
    because that was the best photo you took. It's very flattering to this Jason
    Stratham wannabe with his "pro" kit and small paunch fondling a handgun like
    he's seen actors playing special forces handle them on TV.

    --
    Charles E. Hardwidge
    Charles E. Hardwidge, Sep 11, 2011
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. tony cooper

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 17:25:04 -0400, tony cooper <>
    wrote:
    : Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    : shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    : We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    : rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    :
    : Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    : on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    : weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    :
    : http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    :
    : Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    : just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    : good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    :
    : The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    : behind this shooter is timing him.
    :
    : http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg

    I'd be inclined to crop off about two thirds of the distance from the top of
    the frame to the tops of the subjects' hats. The fact that the picture is
    already cramped laterally, with one of the subjects badly truncated, makes the
    extra margin at the top more conspicuous.

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Sep 11, 2011
    #3
  4. tony cooper

    Irwell Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 22:49:47 +0100, Charles E. Hardwidge wrote:

    > "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >> In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    >> small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    >> instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >>
    >> My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    >> a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    >> disturbing anything.
    >>
    >> The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    >> take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    >> laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    >> feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    >> walked away.
    >>
    >> The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    >> of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    >> There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    >> money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    >> abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    >> deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.
    >>
    >> The little would-be tyrant:
    >>
    >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-7jgdT9S/0/X3/i-7jgdT9S-X3.jpg

    >
    > I'm very cagey about shooting or publishing photos that don't show people in
    > a respectful way. Porn (in all its forms) is just damage. If someone doesn't
    > want their photo taken you'd better take a damn good photo, or make sure
    > there's an overriding public interest (and making money isn't one of them).
    >
    > Irony, the fifth fundamental force, strikes again (maybe for both of us)
    > because that was the best photo you took. It's very flattering to this Jason
    > Stratham wannabe with his "pro" kit and small paunch fondling a handgun like
    > he's seen actors playing special forces handle them on TV.


    That thick throbbing vein on his forehead is a warning sign.
    Irwell, Sep 11, 2011
    #4
  5. tony cooper

    Mike Guest

    On 11/09/2011 5:25 PM, tony cooper wrote:
    > Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    > shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    > We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    > rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >
    > Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    > on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    > weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >
    > Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    > just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    > good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >
    > The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    > behind this shooter is timing him.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >
    > In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    > small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    > instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >
    > My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    > a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    > disturbing anything.
    >
    > The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    > take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    > laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    > feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    > walked away.
    >

    The shooting range I would presume is "Private Property" I would say the
    same thing if you came into my living room...

    Mike
    Mike, Sep 12, 2011
    #5
  6. tony cooper

    tony cooper Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 19:03:35 -0400, Mike <> wrote:

    >On 11/09/2011 5:25 PM, tony cooper wrote:
    >> Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    >> shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    >> We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    >> rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >>
    >> Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    >> on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    >> weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >>
    >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >>
    >> Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    >> just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    >> good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >>
    >> The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    >> behind this shooter is timing him.
    >>
    >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >>
    >> In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    >> small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    >> instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >>
    >> My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    >> a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    >> disturbing anything.
    >>
    >> The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    >> take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    >> laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    >> feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    >> walked away.
    >>

    >The shooting range I would presume is "Private Property" I would say the
    >same thing if you came into my living room...


    He is not the owner of the property. It's a county-owned range
    primarily used as a weapons training range by the various county
    police departments.

    If someone says "Please don't take my picture", I go along with it.
    When someone says "No photographs allowed" and "You can't take my
    photo without my permission", I keep snapping if I think it could be
    an interesting photo.

    It was especially aggravating to have a NRA member try to constrain my
    rights.



    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
    tony cooper, Sep 12, 2011
    #6
  7. tony cooper

    tony cooper Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 18:39:16 -0400, Robert Coe <> wrote:

    >On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 17:25:04 -0400, tony cooper <>
    >wrote:
    >: Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    >: shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    >: We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    >: rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >:
    >: Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    >: on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    >: weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >:
    >: http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >:
    >: Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    >: just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    >: good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >:
    >: The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    >: behind this shooter is timing him.
    >:
    >: http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >
    >I'd be inclined to crop off about two thirds of the distance from the top of
    >the frame to the tops of the subjects' hats. The fact that the picture is
    >already cramped laterally, with one of the subjects badly truncated, makes the
    >extra margin at the top more conspicuous.


    It's cropped to 4" x 6" as I crop all family snapshots. It'll be in
    the family Lightroom Catalog as a scene-setting photo for the photos
    of the grandchildren that day.

    I'll creatively crop if the use is for some other purpose.


    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
    tony cooper, Sep 12, 2011
    #7
  8. tony cooper

    PeterN Guest

    On 9/11/2011 5:25 PM, tony cooper wrote:
    > Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    > shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    > We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    > rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >
    > Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    > on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    > weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >
    > Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    > just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    > good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >
    > The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    > behind this shooter is timing him.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >
    > In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    > small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    > instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >
    > My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    > a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    > disturbing anything.
    >
    > The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    > take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    > laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    > feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    > walked away.
    >
    > The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    > of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    > There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    > money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    > abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    > deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.
    >
    > The little would-be tyrant:
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-7jgdT9S/0/X3/i-7jgdT9S-X3.jpg
    >


    Appropriate double standard.

    --
    Peter
    PeterN, Sep 12, 2011
    #8
  9. "Irwell" <> wrote in message
    news:93do2uwpxta8.78c2oxi1uyl$...
    > On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 22:49:47 +0100, Charles E. Hardwidge wrote:
    >> "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...


    >>> The little would-be tyrant:
    >>>
    >>> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-7jgdT9S/0/X3/i-7jgdT9S-X3.jpg


    >> Irony, the fifth fundamental force, strikes again (maybe for both of us)
    >> because that was the best photo you took. It's very flattering to this
    >> Jason Stratham wannabe with his "pro" kit and small paunch fondling a
    >> handgun like he's seen actors playing special forces handle them on TV.

    >
    > That thick throbbing vein on his forehead is a warning sign.


    LOL. Just noticed now you say that - he shaves his legs.

    --
    Charles E. Hardwidge
    Charles E. Hardwidge, Sep 12, 2011
    #9
  10. tony cooper

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 19:19:49 -0400, tony cooper <>
    wrote:
    : On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 18:39:16 -0400, Robert Coe <> wrote:
    : >I'd be inclined to crop off about two thirds of the distance from the top
    : >of the frame to the tops of the subjects' hats. The fact that the picture
    : >is already cramped laterally, with one of the subjects badly truncated,
    : >makes the extra margin at the top more conspicuous.
    :
    : It's cropped to 4" x 6" as I crop all family snapshots. It'll be in
    : the family Lightroom Catalog as a scene-setting photo for the photos
    : of the grandchildren that day.
    :
    : I'll creatively crop if the use is for some other purpose.

    Jeez, you're as bad as my daughter. She gripes if I give her any of my
    pictures at anything but a 3x2 aspect ratio, because she's got her albums,
    etc., set up for that. But she won't take my RAW originals, since she shoots
    only JPEGs, and processing RAW is outside her workflow. Fortunately, she's a
    good photographer (better than I am in some ways) and doesn't really need my
    stuff very often. I'm entirely too lazy to crop a picture differently, just to
    give it to her.

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Sep 12, 2011
    #10
  11. tony cooper

    Robert Coe Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 19:15:26 -0400, tony cooper <>
    wrote:
    : On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 19:03:35 -0400, Mike <> wrote:
    :
    : >On 11/09/2011 5:25 PM, tony cooper wrote:
    : >> Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    : >> shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    : >> We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    : >> rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    : >>
    : >> Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    : >> on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    : >> weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    : >>
    : >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    : >>
    : >> Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    : >> just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    : >> good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    : >>
    : >> The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    : >> behind this shooter is timing him.
    : >>
    : >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    : >>
    : >> In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    : >> small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    : >> instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    : >>
    : >> My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    : >> a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    : >> disturbing anything.
    : >>
    : >> The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    : >> take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    : >> laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    : >> feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    : >> walked away.
    : >>
    : >The shooting range I would presume is "Private Property" I would say the
    : >same thing if you came into my living room...
    :
    : He is not the owner of the property. It's a county-owned range
    : primarily used as a weapons training range by the various county
    : police departments.
    :
    : If someone says "Please don't take my picture", I go along with it.
    : When someone says "No photographs allowed" and "You can't take my
    : photo without my permission", I keep snapping if I think it could be
    : an interesting photo.
    :
    : It was especially aggravating to have a NRA member try to constrain my
    : rights.

    I don't think he'd see it as a "your rights"/"my rights" situation. It's just
    that the NRA is used to getting its way. You don't have any rights that
    interfere with that objective.

    Bob
    Robert Coe, Sep 12, 2011
    #11
  12. tony cooper

    tony cooper Guest

    On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 21:40:08 -0400, Robert Coe <> wrote:

    >On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 19:19:49 -0400, tony cooper <>
    >wrote:
    >: On Sun, 11 Sep 2011 18:39:16 -0400, Robert Coe <> wrote:
    >: >I'd be inclined to crop off about two thirds of the distance from the top
    >: >of the frame to the tops of the subjects' hats. The fact that the picture
    >: >is already cramped laterally, with one of the subjects badly truncated,
    >: >makes the extra margin at the top more conspicuous.
    >:
    >: It's cropped to 4" x 6" as I crop all family snapshots. It'll be in
    >: the family Lightroom Catalog as a scene-setting photo for the photos
    >: of the grandchildren that day.
    >:
    >: I'll creatively crop if the use is for some other purpose.
    >
    >Jeez, you're as bad as my daughter. She gripes if I give her any of my
    >pictures at anything but a 3x2 aspect ratio, because she's got her albums,
    >etc., set up for that. But she won't take my RAW originals, since she shoots
    >only JPEGs, and processing RAW is outside her workflow. Fortunately, she's a
    >good photographer (better than I am in some ways) and doesn't really need my
    >stuff very often. I'm entirely too lazy to crop a picture differently, just to
    >give it to her.


    I put everything in that Lightroom Catalog at the 3x2 because I'm the
    only one who understands that images have to be cropped before they're
    printed. My wife, son, and daughter-in-law don't. So, if anyone
    wants to have a print made from the family files, the images are set
    up for them. And, there are only .jpgs in that Catalog. The RAW
    originals are on DVDs.

    My daughter edits and crops, but she's in another town.


    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
    tony cooper, Sep 12, 2011
    #12
  13. tony cooper

    dadiOH Guest

    tony cooper wrote:
    > Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    > shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    > We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    > rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >
    > Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    > on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    > weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >
    > Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    > just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    > good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >
    > The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    > behind this shooter is timing him.
    >
    > http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >
    > In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    > small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    > instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >
    > My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    > a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    > disturbing anything.
    >
    > The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    > take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    > laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    > feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    > walked away.
    >
    > The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    > of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    > There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    > money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    > abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    > deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.
    >
    > The little would-be tyrant:


    Regardless, if someone doesn't want there picture taken I think their wishes
    should be respected. YMMV

    --

    dadiOH
    ____________________________

    dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
    ....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
    LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
    Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico
    dadiOH, Sep 12, 2011
    #13
  14. "dadiOH" <> wrote in message
    news:j4krmc$dbj$...
    > tony cooper wrote:
    >> Someone pulled that on me today. I took my grandchildren to a
    >> shooting range where a group of "Cowboy Shooters" meet once a month.
    >> We spent a couple of hours watching these hobbyists fire six-shooters,
    >> rifles, and shotguns with genuine or replica frontier-era weapons.
    >>
    >> Nice group of people. Several took the time to explain what was going
    >> on to my six and seven year-old grandchildren, showed them their
    >> weapons, and one even allowed the boys to dry fire his six-shooter.
    >>
    >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fGQnLTS/0/X3/i-fGQnLTS-X3.jpg
    >>
    >> Some good shots of the grandchildren today, but nothing that isn't
    >> just a snapshot. Mostly, the view is the back of people. Not too
    >> good standing in front of them since they are using live ammo.
    >>
    >> The shooting is scored on time minus misses, so the person standing
    >> behind this shooter is timing him.
    >>
    >> http://tonycooper.smugmug.com/photos/i-fLmj27p/0/X3/i-fLmj27p-X3.jpg
    >>
    >> In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    >> small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    >> instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >>
    >> My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    >> a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    >> disturbing anything.
    >>
    >> The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    >> take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    >> laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    >> feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    >> walked away.
    >>
    >> The subject matter wasn't interesting, so I left after just a couple
    >> of snaps. What gets me the most is the hypocrisy of the instructor.
    >> There is no group in this country that spends more time, energy, and
    >> money to ensure that their right to pursue their own hobby is not
    >> abridged than gun owners who are in the NRA. Yet, this guy wanted to
    >> deny me my right to pursue my own hobby.
    >>
    >> The little would-be tyrant:

    >
    > Regardless, if someone doesn't want there picture taken I think their wishes
    > should be respected. YMMV


    Ture, but either lying or claiming something due to one's ignorance doesn't help
    one's case.
    Pete Stavrakoglou, Sep 12, 2011
    #14
  15. "Pete Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    news:j4ksmq$jh1$...
    > "dadiOH" <> wrote in message
    > news:j4krmc$dbj$...


    >> Regardless, if someone doesn't want there picture taken I think their
    >> wishes should be respected. YMMV

    >
    > Ture, but either lying or claiming something due to one's ignorance
    > doesn't help one's case.


    Excuse the Buddhist in me stepping in: this is irrelevant. Mere words and
    laws whether true or not at just "stuff" without a causal link. They are
    just words and laws - fresh air.

    --
    Charles E. Hardwidge
    Charles E. Hardwidge, Sep 12, 2011
    #15
  16. tony cooper <> writes:

    > In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    > small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    > instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >
    > My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    > a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    > disturbing anything.


    Private property, right? Which you were on? They can make that rule.

    > The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    > take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    > laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    > feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    > walked away.


    On the other hand, if that was his justification, then it's bullshit of
    course.

    Many gun people feel that it's a security issue to avoid being publicly
    known as gun people; they feel it makes them more likely to be burgled
    if people know they have guns in the house, guns being highly desirable
    in the black market. This may factor in to the reaction you were
    getting.

    (I haven't had that reaction from anybody at ranges I've been shooting
    at, myself, though. Sometimes with lots of people who didn't know me.)
    David Dyer-Bennet, Sep 12, 2011
    #16
  17. tony cooper

    tony cooper Guest

    On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 09:32:08 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet <>
    wrote:

    >tony cooper <> writes:
    >
    >> In another area was a group of people taking instruction on modern
    >> small weapons from an instructor. I took a couple of snaps and the
    >> instructor came over and said "No photographs allowed".
    >>
    >> My answer was the short form: "Bullshit". I was far behind them with
    >> a 200mm lens and out of ear range of the shutter click, so I wasn't
    >> disturbing anything.

    >
    >Private property, right? Which you were on? They can make that rule.


    As pointed out in another post, the property is owned by the county.
    The gun instructor pays a fee to the county to use the facilities. He
    can make the rule, but whether or not I have to follow the rule is up
    to me.


    >> The instructor got shirty with me and said it was against the law to
    >> take a photograph of someone without their permission. This made me
    >> laugh. He had an NRA patch on his shirt, so I asked him how he would
    >> feel if I started making up laws about guns. He just turned and
    >> walked away.

    >
    >On the other hand, if that was his justification, then it's bullshit of
    >course.
    >
    >Many gun people feel that it's a security issue to avoid being publicly
    >known as gun people; they feel it makes them more likely to be burgled
    >if people know they have guns in the house, guns being highly desirable
    >in the black market. This may factor in to the reaction you were
    >getting.


    With open-carry permissable about everywhere in Florida, it's hard to
    believe that some gun owners are shy. The NRA recently bought off the
    Florida legislature in order to permit open-carry in public parks and
    to stop individual cities from passing gun laws. The only gun laws
    allowed in Florida must be state laws.

    >(I haven't had that reaction from anybody at ranges I've been shooting
    >at, myself, though. Sometimes with lots of people who didn't know me.)


    The "Cowboy Shooters" group, who are gun owners, welcomed being
    photographed. Not only are they gun owners, but they each have at
    least three guns (pistol, rifle, shotgun) to compete, most had more
    than three with them, and one assumes some modern guns at home.

    I did make the point, though, that if someone asks me not to
    photograph them I usually comply. Not always. If they ask with
    attitude as this guy did, then it's another story.




    --
    Tony Cooper - Orlando, Florida
    tony cooper, Sep 12, 2011
    #17
  18. "tony cooper" <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > I did make the point, though, that if someone asks me not to
    > photograph them I usually comply. Not always. If they ask with
    > attitude as this guy did, then it's another story.


    Usually? Oh, a fucking wiseguy. You're just bellyaching like Sisker did
    because your nose is out of joint.

    You don't know someone's history or interests, or what risk you are running
    of getting that camera shoved up your ass.

    --
    Charles E. Hardwidge
    Charles E. Hardwidge, Sep 12, 2011
    #18
  19. tony cooper <> writes:

    > On Mon, 12 Sep 2011 09:32:08 -0500, David Dyer-Bennet <>
    > wrote:


    >>Many gun people feel that it's a security issue to avoid being publicly
    >>known as gun people; they feel it makes them more likely to be burgled
    >>if people know they have guns in the house, guns being highly desirable
    >>in the black market. This may factor in to the reaction you were
    >>getting.

    >
    > With open-carry permissable about everywhere in Florida, it's hard to
    > believe that some gun owners are shy. The NRA recently bought off the
    > Florida legislature in order to permit open-carry in public parks and
    > to stop individual cities from passing gun laws. The only gun laws
    > allowed in Florida must be state laws.


    Is it? I remember reading about Florida being one of the states where
    if your shirt-tail blew up exposing your gun, it made you a felon.
    Maybe they've changed it since then, though; that would be smart. I was
    very happy that Minnesota allows both open and concealed carry on a
    carry permit, precisely because it avoids criminalizing minor flaws in
    concealment. But that's unusual.

    I'm VERY sympathetic to state-wide preemption. Anything less leads to a
    patchwork of rules that's impossible to actually carry in. Which is the
    goal of a lot of people, of course; but it's not my goal. I hate all
    the back-door ways to block things that they can't muster the votes to
    simply reject. But then, the two basic positions on this are "the
    presence of guns makes things less safe" and "allowing law-abiding sane
    people to carry guns makes things safer", and I'm solidly in the second
    group.

    >>(I haven't had that reaction from anybody at ranges I've been shooting
    >>at, myself, though. Sometimes with lots of people who didn't know me.)

    >
    > The "Cowboy Shooters" group, who are gun owners, welcomed being
    > photographed. Not only are they gun owners, but they each have at
    > least three guns (pistol, rifle, shotgun) to compete, most had more
    > than three with them, and one assumes some modern guns at home.


    Yes, I know of the CAS, and that competitions are three-gun.

    > I did make the point, though, that if someone asks me not to
    > photograph them I usually comply. Not always. If they ask with
    > attitude as this guy did, then it's another story.


    That's about where I am on that part. On principle I should not
    photograph people who don't want to (at least in recreational
    circumstances; if it's a real news story it's something else); but if
    they piss me off enough I may not be nice about it.
    David Dyer-Bennet, Sep 12, 2011
    #19
  20. Savageduck <savageduck1@{REMOVESPAM}me.com> writes:

    > In April of this year Florida implemented an Amendment which still
    > bans "open carry" in Florida, but protects legal gun owners with valid
    > concealed carry weapon (CCW) permits if they inadvertently expose
    > their concealed weapon, and those engaged in, or going directly to and
    > from legitimate shooting events. You cannot drive in your car with a
    > gun on your belt.
    > It has been referred to as "open carry lite".
    > < http://opencarry.org/fl.html >


    Ah, thanks. I remembered older articles on the problem of minor
    concealment mishaps ("wardrobe malfunctions" :) ) being criminalized.
    I'm glad they at least sort-of fixed it.

    But what's this about not being able to carry in my own car? That's
    absurd.
    David Dyer-Bennet, Sep 12, 2011
    #20
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