Nikon D80 or Canon 30D?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by pistorin@gmail.com, Oct 25, 2006.

  1. Guest

    We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or is
    a coin toss?

    Cheers.

    Victor
    , Oct 25, 2006
    #1
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  2. Paul Rubin Guest

    writes:
    > We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    > either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or is
    > a coin toss?


    Neither, it's a matter of preference. Try handling both. They're not
    that similar to each other and you're likely to find you prefer one
    over the other. Get the one that you like better.
    Paul Rubin, Oct 25, 2006
    #2
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  3. tbm Guest

    why not go for the 400d?
    tbm, Oct 25, 2006
    #3
  4. THO Guest

    In article <5VP%g.27981$>,
    "tbm" <> wrote:

    > why not go for the 400d?


    Because the construction is terrible?
    THO, Oct 25, 2006
    #4
  5. <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    > either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or is
    > a coin toss?


    My partner recently got a D80 and I like everything about it apart from the
    fact that the body is slightly too small so it's not as easy to hold as my
    D70s. I've only used it for a short time, but it's nice to have a much
    larger LCD screen, and the viewfinder is very bright & large (ie proper
    glass prism!) and there are even nice touches like being able to dial in the
    WB in kelvin rather than having to use "sunny" "cloudy" etc

    Cheers Adrian www.boliston.co.uk
    Adrian Boliston, Oct 26, 2006
    #5
  6. bmoag Guest

    If one shoots only raw then it is really which camera feels better in terms
    of heft and control layout and which lens line-up you prefer.
    If you shoot jpeg only or even mostly one should rethink why one would even
    want a dSLR (these are heavy beasts to lug around and use like a P&S).
    Both are far more technically capable than 99% of amateur and professionals
    are capable of utilizing, regardless of their opinions.
    Both have limited capability for manual focusing, but this is a universal
    problem with nearly all autofocus SLRs.
    The D80 is a significant improvement over the D70 viewing system and the
    extra 4mps seem to translate into better appearing noise at high ISOs. If
    one had a D30 there would be no rational reason to convert to the D80 or the
    Nikon lens system and vice versa.
    However rational decision making often has little do with such things.
    bmoag, Oct 26, 2006
    #6
  7. PeteD Guest

    Hi,

    I agree with all of your post except....

    > If you shoot jpeg only or even mostly one should rethink why one would even
    > want a dSLR (these are heavy beasts to lug around and use like a P&S).


    Just because you only use jpeg does not mean you are just using a DSLR
    as a P&S.

    1. An SLR gives you access to the lens range and flash systems of Nikon
    or Canon.
    2. Compare a small DOF portrait from an SLR with anything out of a P&S.
    3. Great viewfinder (I waited for D80 for this, never liked the D70).
    4. Negligible shutter delay and 3fps or above, superb for action or
    sport.
    5. Much easier selection of a lot of the camera settings by buttons and
    dials rather than menus.
    6. Use of filters (polarizer, Neutral grads).

    However, if you don't care about the above the tiny P&S is a far better
    option.

    I stopped taking film a couple of years ago when we bought a tiny P&S.
    I loved the digital medium but missed the abilities of an SLR. I am
    absolutely loving my D80 and have not taken a shot with the P&S since
    buying it. I will probably still use it in hazardous (to camera)
    environments or where size really does matter.

    Cheers
    Pete



    bmoag wrote:
    > If one shoots only raw then it is really which camera feels better in terms
    > of heft and control layout and which lens line-up you prefer.
    > If you shoot jpeg only or even mostly one should rethink why one would even
    > want a dSLR (these are heavy beasts to lug around and use like a P&S).
    > Both are far more technically capable than 99% of amateur and professionals
    > are capable of utilizing, regardless of their opinions.
    > Both have limited capability for manual focusing, but this is a universal
    > problem with nearly all autofocus SLRs.
    > The D80 is a significant improvement over the D70 viewing system and the
    > extra 4mps seem to translate into better appearing noise at high ISOs. If
    > one had a D30 there would be no rational reason to convert to the D80 or the
    > Nikon lens system and vice versa.
    > However rational decision making often has little do with such things.
    PeteD, Oct 26, 2006
    #7
  8. Annika1980 Guest

    wrote:
    > We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    > either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or is
    > a coin toss?


    Be aware that there are lots of Nikon shills who lurk here.
    Don't listen to them. Get the 30D. You'll love it!
    Annika1980, Oct 26, 2006
    #8
  9. Bill Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    > either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or
    > is
    > a coin toss?



    Do you own any lenses now that you could use with the camera?

    If not, then both bodies are very good and functional, and either will
    get the job done. But there are a few things to consider before
    deciding, like handling and lense choices.

    First, handle both camera bodies, take a few shots, and see if you
    prefer the way one feels over the other. Check the controls, shutter
    button position, menu buttons, etc. Some prefer the way the Nikon
    feels, others prefer the Canon - it's a very subjective choice since
    everyone has different hands.

    Then look at the lenses and accessories, and see if there is a
    specific lense you may want that is better or not offered in one
    system, or if there is a specific feature you want.

    This past weekend I was playing with both cameras in the store and
    preferred the Nikon, mostly due to the shutter position feels more
    natural to me, and the viewfinder is better than the Canon. Earlier
    today I sold my XT and bought the D80 and couldn't be happier. But you
    may prefer the Canon ergonomics and design, so you have to go to a
    store and decide for yourself.
    Bill, Oct 26, 2006
    #9
  10. ASAAR Guest

    On 25 Oct 2006 20:41:22 -0700, Annika1980 wrote:

    > Be aware that there are lots of Nikon shills who lurk here.
    > Don't listen to them. Get the 30D. You'll love it!


    Shills? You really think that this newsgroup has shills? If
    they're lurkers how would we know - there'd be nothing to listen to!

    But there are a few shills that post messages and I can think of
    five. The products shilled are Canon, Fuji, Panasonic, Chrysler and
    Li-Ion batteries. Guess who? <g> Oops, make it six. I forgot
    about Cadillac. It could have been seven, but it's been too long
    since GP shilled his beloved Sigmas for him to be included. There
    are several Nikon fans in this newsgroup, but I don't see that any
    of them have made the leap to shilldom, just as most Canon fans are
    only fans. Even most of the pugnacious Canonistas aren't really
    shills, though some come close.
    ASAAR, Oct 26, 2006
    #10
  11. In article <mZT%g.23825$>,
    bmoag <> wrote:
    >Both have limited capability for manual focusing, but this is a universal
    >problem with nearly all autofocus SLRs.


    This myth is commonly repeated, but is unlikely to be true for the D80.
    Assuming that the viewfinder in the D80 is similar to the one in the
    D200, then, with some practice, manual focus should not be a problem.

    I have only manual focus lenses, and I never use screens with manual
    focus assists.


    --
    That was it. Done. The faulty Monk was turned out into the desert where it
    could believe what it liked, including the idea that it had been hard done
    by. It was allowed to keep its horse, since horses were so cheap to make.
    -- Douglas Adams in Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency
    Philip Homburg, Oct 26, 2006
    #11
  12. acl Guest

    Philip Homburg wrote:
    > In article <mZT%g.23825$>,
    > bmoag <> wrote:
    >>Both have limited capability for manual focusing, but this is a universal
    >>problem with nearly all autofocus SLRs.

    >
    > This myth is commonly repeated, but is unlikely to be true for the D80.
    > Assuming that the viewfinder in the D80 is similar to the one in the
    > D200, then, with some practice, manual focus should not be a problem.
    >
    > I have only manual focus lenses, and I never use screens with manual
    > focus assists.
    >
    >


    Whether it is a myth or not is relative. I have never managed to focus
    accurately without focus aids (split screen or something like that). Not
    even my Minolta XD-7. For instance now, I get closest to correct focus
    with my D200 and a 90mm f/2.8 lens; however, it's still hit and miss if
    I don't use the electronic rangefinder. So it is clearly not a myth for
    me: I simply can't judge focus accurately enough. Maybe my eyesight is
    the problem, or maybe my eyes get tired trying to judge focus or
    something. I don't know.
    acl, Oct 26, 2006
    #12
  13. In article <>,
    acl <> wrote:
    >I get closest to correct focus
    >with my D200 and a 90mm f/2.8 lens; however, it's still hit and miss if
    >I don't use the electronic rangefinder.


    And how much is the difference? If you take a number of pictures of a
    brick wall under an angle of 45 degrees, what is the spread?



    --
    That was it. Done. The faulty Monk was turned out into the desert where it
    could believe what it liked, including the idea that it had been hard done
    by. It was allowed to keep its horse, since horses were so cheap to make.
    -- Douglas Adams in Dirk Gently's Holistic Detective Agency
    Philip Homburg, Oct 26, 2006
    #13
  14. DHB Guest

    On Thu, 26 Oct 2006 01:13:54 GMT, "bmoag" <> wrote:

    <CUT>
    >If you shoot jpeg only or even mostly one should rethink why one would even
    >want a dSLR (these are heavy beasts to lug around and use like a P&S).

    <CUT>

    Everybody is entitled to their opinion but 1 would hope that
    reason might long ago have filtered into this RAW = Great , JPEG = Bad
    mentality.

    Each has it's pro's & cons.

    <1> The RAW processing workflow is getting easier as more companies
    are producing RAW conversion plug-ins for the most commonly used
    editing programs. RAW does allow for greater post processing options
    & abilities.

    <2> JPEG has some advantages over RAW for *certain* applications.
    High frame rate action photography is just 1, more fit into any give
    size buffer, so you can take more continuous pictures when timing is
    critical to the shot.

    <3> Now with flash memory prices continuing downward in price & their
    capacities continuing upwards, (RAW+JPEG) is often the best of both
    worlds. Often that's what I do with my Canon 30D.

    When I shot in JPEG with my DSLR, I certainly don't feel that
    I am using it like a P&S!

    In more ways than 1, there should be *room* for *both*. Just
    as there are pros & cons for DSLR & P&S cameras & different
    manufactures. Just as some events are far better suited/enjoyed with
    just a small P&S, others require the abilities of a DSLR.

    Given the choice of *either or* in anything, I select what
    works best for a given need but as needs change so should the choice.
    When I attend a Wedding or similar special event, I often take my DSLR
    *&* 2 small P&S cameras for 2 main reasons:

    <1> Some of the best candid/semi-candid pictures are best taken by
    relatively young children. It's a win-win when I give 1 of them a P&S
    camera to use & ask them to go around to each table & take a few
    pictures. Most people will gladly tolerate & even cooperate with a
    young child with a camera in ways that are not easy for an adult to
    duplicate. Also children have a very different perspective & that's
    not just because they are generally shorter. Usually children love
    taking the pictures & I make sure to burn them a CD of *all* of the
    pictures that they took.

    <2> A quality small pocket size P&S allows 1 to carry it with them far
    more often than would usually be possible/practical with a DSLR.

    In short, I would rather have a *good* picture taken with a
    P&S in JPEG than a *great* picture that did *not* get taken with my
    DSLR set to RAW because I did not have my DSLR with me when the photo
    opportunity presented itself!

    Just my opinion & no I am not nor ever will be a professional
    photographer but photography has been a hobby of mine for over 30
    years & digital has only added to the enjoyment. It helps not having
    the recurrent film & film processing costs too, that can now be
    diverted to other things.

    Respectfully, DHB


    "To announce that there must be no criticism of the President,
    or that we are to stand by the President, right or wrong,
    is not only unpatriotic and servile, but is morally treasonable
    to the American public."--Theodore Roosevelt, May 7, 1918
    DHB, Oct 26, 2006
    #14
  15. acl Guest

    Philip Homburg wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > acl <> wrote:
    > >I get closest to correct focus
    > >with my D200 and a 90mm f/2.8 lens; however, it's still hit and miss if
    > >I don't use the electronic rangefinder.

    >
    > And how much is the difference? If you take a number of pictures of a
    > brick wall under an angle of 45 degrees, what is the spread?
    >
    >
    >


    With the D200? I've never checked. It's not some kind of systematic
    error, though: The few times I did try to focus without the rangefinder
    and then checked, it was randomly on each side (ie too far or too
    near). Luckily, the electronic rangefinder does a good job (it doesn't
    tell you if you're in front or behind, but since some of my lenses
    focus in the opposite way from others, I guess it would have been
    confusing anyway).

    I think it depends on the person: I simply could never judge accurately
    enough on any camera I've used. Of course, rocking focus back and forth
    etc lets me get close, but I often found that my slides were slightly
    blurry a long time ago, and since then, I stopped trying.
    acl, Oct 26, 2006
    #15
  16. frederick Guest

    acl wrote:
    > Philip Homburg wrote:
    >> In article <mZT%g.23825$>,
    >> bmoag <> wrote:
    >>> Both have limited capability for manual focusing, but this is a
    >>> universal problem with nearly all autofocus SLRs.

    >>
    >> This myth is commonly repeated, but is unlikely to be true for the D80.
    >> Assuming that the viewfinder in the D80 is similar to the one in the
    >> D200, then, with some practice, manual focus should not be a problem.
    >>
    >> I have only manual focus lenses, and I never use screens with manual
    >> focus assists.
    >>

    >
    > Whether it is a myth or not is relative. I have never managed to focus
    > accurately without focus aids (split screen or something like that). Not
    > even my Minolta XD-7. For instance now, I get closest to correct focus
    > with my D200 and a 90mm f/2.8 lens; however, it's still hit and miss if
    > I don't use the electronic rangefinder. So it is clearly not a myth for
    > me: I simply can't judge focus accurately enough. Maybe my eyesight is
    > the problem, or maybe my eyes get tired trying to judge focus or
    > something. I don't know.


    I agree with you.
    The screens aren't good for manual focus on AF slrs. Your eyes seem to
    compensate for slight out of focus and bring it in to focus. Anyway,
    the camera is calibrated for the AF sensors to work accurately - not
    the screen.
    The larger (than 30d D70 etc) screen on the D80/D200 is nice, but makes
    much less difference than I expected.
    frederick, Oct 26, 2006
    #16
  17. acl Guest

    frederick wrote:
    >
    > I agree with you.
    > The screens aren't good for manual focus on AF slrs. Your eyes seem to
    > compensate for slight out of focus and bring it in to focus. Anyway,
    > the camera is calibrated for the AF sensors to work accurately - not
    > the screen.
    > The larger (than 30d D70 etc) screen on the D80/D200 is nice, but makes
    > much less difference than I expected.


    Well, I did not manage to focus without split screens with manual focus
    SLRs either, so maybe I am not a good data point in this context.
    acl, Oct 26, 2006
    #17
  18. frederick Guest

    acl wrote:
    > frederick wrote:
    >> I agree with you.
    >> The screens aren't good for manual focus on AF slrs. Your eyes seem to
    >> compensate for slight out of focus and bring it in to focus. Anyway,
    >> the camera is calibrated for the AF sensors to work accurately - not
    >> the screen.
    >> The larger (than 30d D70 etc) screen on the D80/D200 is nice, but makes
    >> much less difference than I expected.

    >
    > Well, I did not manage to focus without split screens with manual focus
    > SLRs either, so maybe I am not a good data point in this context.
    >

    Of course it was many times worse with MF slrs - there was a big delay
    in finding out how bad your MF skills were, and each mistake cost money :)
    frederick, Oct 26, 2006
    #18
  19. John Turco Guest

    Annika1980 wrote:
    >
    > wrote:
    > > We're in the market for a new camera and have narrowed it down to
    > > either the D80 or the 30D. Any big opinions one way or the other? Or is
    > > a coin toss?

    >
    > Be aware that there are lots of Nikon shills who lurk here.


    Hello, Bret:

    If ever a sentence dripped with sarcasm, it's >that< one, directly
    above. <g>

    > Don't listen to them. Get the 30D. You'll love it!


    Lurkers are silent, no? Hence, how could anybody "listen" to them,
    in the first place?

    Duh!! :)


    Cordially,
    John Turco <>
    John Turco, Oct 31, 2006
    #19
  20. John Turco Guest

    ASAAR wrote:
    >
    > On 25 Oct 2006 20:41:22 -0700, Annika1980 wrote:
    >
    > > Be aware that there are lots of Nikon shills who lurk here.
    > > Don't listen to them. Get the 30D. You'll love it!

    >
    > Shills? You really think that this newsgroup has shills? If
    > they're lurkers how would we know - there'd be nothing to listen to!
    >
    > But there are a few shills that post messages and I can think of
    > five. The products shilled are Canon, Fuji, Panasonic, Chrysler and
    > Li-Ion batteries. Guess who? <g> Oops, make it six. I forgot
    > about Cadillac. It could have been seven, but it's been too long
    > since GP shilled his beloved Sigmas for him to be included. There
    > are several Nikon fans in this newsgroup, but I don't see that any
    > of them have made the leap to shilldom, just as most Canon fans are
    > only fans. Even most of the pugnacious Canonistas aren't really
    > shills, though some come close.



    Hello, ASAAR:

    Am I misreading between the lines, and you're >not< implying that I'm a
    Duesenberg pusher? In any case, don't worry about it, as "Duesy" is long
    gone! :p


    Cordially,
    John Turco <>
    John Turco, Oct 31, 2006
    #20
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