Nikon D200 + 80-200mm f/2.8 + 2x Tele-Converter = ?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Bill Crocker, Oct 22, 2006.

  1. Bill Crocker

    Bill Crocker Guest

    I have a Nikon D200, and a Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 zoom. I'm considering
    purchasing a 2X Tele-Converter. Will this combination work, and if so, what
    tele-converter do you recommend? It appears that Nikon's do not support AF,
    but some third party ones do.

    Also, would this effectively be equivalent to a 160-400mm f/6?

    Thanks,
    Bill Crocker
    Bill Crocker, Oct 22, 2006
    #1
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  2. On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 14:00:41 -0400, in rec.photo.digital "Bill Crocker"
    <> wrote:

    >I have a Nikon D200, and a Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 zoom. I'm considering
    >purchasing a 2X Tele-Converter. Will this combination work, and if so, what
    >tele-converter do you recommend? It appears that Nikon's do not support AF,
    >but some third party ones do.


    ?? TC-20E-II. I use it all the time in combo with the 70-200 f/2.8 VR on a
    D70 and D200. You will notice the AF gets noticeably sluggish.

    >Also, would this effectively be equivalent to a 160-400mm f/6?


    The combo is f/5.6. FWIW, I've found my D200 will AF with the TC-20 mounted
    with the 200-400 f/4, or f/8 in total even though Nikon says you need f/5.6
    or better.
    --
    Ed Ruf ()
    http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html
    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!), Oct 22, 2006
    #2
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  3. Bill Crocker

    Bill Crocker Guest

    "Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 14:00:41 -0400, in rec.photo.digital "Bill Crocker"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>I have a Nikon D200, and a Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 zoom. I'm considering
    >>purchasing a 2X Tele-Converter. Will this combination work, and if so,
    >>what
    >>tele-converter do you recommend? It appears that Nikon's do not support
    >>AF,
    >>but some third party ones do.

    >
    > ?? TC-20E-II. I use it all the time in combo with the 70-200 f/2.8 VR on a
    > D70 and D200. You will notice the AF gets noticeably sluggish.
    >
    >>Also, would this effectively be equivalent to a 160-400mm f/6?

    >
    > The combo is f/5.6. FWIW, I've found my D200 will AF with the TC-20
    > mounted
    > with the 200-400 f/4, or f/8 in total even though Nikon says you need
    > f/5.6
    > or better.
    > --
    > Ed Ruf ()
    > http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html


    Thanks for your help Ed, it is appreciated! I'll look into the TC-20E-II.

    Bill Crocker
    Bill Crocker, Oct 23, 2006
    #3
  4. Bill Crocker

    Bill Crocker Guest

    "Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!)" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 14:00:41 -0400, in rec.photo.digital "Bill Crocker"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>I have a Nikon D200, and a Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 zoom. I'm considering
    >>purchasing a 2X Tele-Converter. Will this combination work, and if so,
    >>what
    >>tele-converter do you recommend? It appears that Nikon's do not support
    >>AF,
    >>but some third party ones do.

    >
    > ?? TC-20E-II. I use it all the time in combo with the 70-200 f/2.8 VR on a
    > D70 and D200. You will notice the AF gets noticeably sluggish.
    >
    >>Also, would this effectively be equivalent to a 160-400mm f/6?

    >
    > The combo is f/5.6. FWIW, I've found my D200 will AF with the TC-20
    > mounted
    > with the 200-400 f/4, or f/8 in total even though Nikon says you need
    > f/5.6
    > or better.
    > --
    > Ed Ruf ()
    > http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html


    It doesn't appear it will auto-focus with my AF lens, only AF-S lenses (that
    have the motor built-in the lens). The AF lens requires a mechanical
    drive-shaft connection to the camera. Some of the third party converters
    extend the operation of that shaft.

    Bill Crocker
    Bill Crocker, Oct 23, 2006
    #4
  5. Bill Crocker

    cjcampbell Guest

    Bill Crocker wrote:
    > I have a Nikon D200, and a Nikkor 80-200mm f/2.8 zoom. I'm considering
    > purchasing a 2X Tele-Converter. Will this combination work, and if so, what
    > tele-converter do you recommend? It appears that Nikon's do not support AF,
    > but some third party ones do.
    >


    You are better off with Nikon's 1.7x AF teleconverter. Nevertheless,
    TC-20E II 2x teleconverter does support AF on Nikon's digital cameras
    and newer SLRs. Nikon specifically recommends this converter for use on
    your lens. Many third party teleconverters do not really support AF.
    The TC-17E II teleconverter is a much better lens, though. The 2x
    converter costs you two stops. The 1.7x converter costs you less than
    half a stop. The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    almost nothing in sharpness.

    Nikon makes a line of manual focus teleconverters, too. You may have
    them confused with the series II AF teleconverters.

    > Also, would this effectively be equivalent to a 160-400mm f/6?
    >
    > Thanks,
    > Bill Crocker
    cjcampbell, Oct 23, 2006
    #5
  6. Bill Crocker

    cjcampbell Guest

    Bill Crocker wrote:
    >
    > It doesn't appear it will auto-focus with my AF lens, only AF-S lenses (that
    > have the motor built-in the lens). The AF lens requires a mechanical
    > drive-shaft connection to the camera. Some of the third party converters
    > extend the operation of that shaft.


    It works only with AF-S and AF-I lenses.
    cjcampbell, Oct 23, 2006
    #6
  7. On 22 Oct 2006 17:07:48 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    <> wrote:

    >You are better off with Nikon's 1.7x AF teleconverter. Nevertheless,
    >TC-20E II 2x teleconverter does support AF on Nikon's digital cameras
    >and newer SLRs. Nikon specifically recommends this converter for use on
    >your lens. Many third party teleconverters do not really support AF.
    >The TC-17E II teleconverter is a much better lens, though. The 2x
    >converter costs you two stops. The 1.7x converter costs you less than
    >half a stop.


    Half a stop? Not quite, from
    http://www.nikonusa.com/template.php?cat=1&grp=5&productNr=2151
    "Minimal effect on f-number of 1.5 stops"

    >The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    >comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    >almost nothing in sharpness.


    So does the TC-20E-II. This isn't an either or situation. The difference is
    an additional half a stop for the additional magnification. Some might
    complain on the loss of sharpness, but on the 70-200 f/2.8 images are still
    quite sharp in my experience.
    --
    Ed Ruf ()
    http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html
    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!), Oct 23, 2006
    #7
  8. Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:

    >> The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    >> comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    >> almost nothing in sharpness.

    >
    > So does the TC-20E-II. This isn't an either or situation. The
    > difference is an additional half a stop for the additional
    > magnification. Some might complain on the loss of sharpness, but on
    > the 70-200 f/2.8 images are still quite sharp in my experience.


    I agree that the extra magnification is well worth getting the TC-20 II. A
    while back, I did some experiments with the 70-200 and TC-20E II using
    tripod mount and mirror lock-up. My findings are that the TC only added a
    slight bit of softness, which is more than acceptable for the price point
    and convenience of adding a 2x TC in the mix. Most "softness" issues people
    have when using TCs is they neglect to use proper and good technique. Your
    shooting at an effective focal length of 600mm with this combo, use proper
    technique and you will be very pleased with the results.







    Rita
    =?iso-8859-1?Q?Rita_=C4_Berkowitz?=, Oct 23, 2006
    #8
  9. Bill Crocker

    Ed Ruf Guest

    On Sun, 22 Oct 2006 20:02:20 -0400, in rec.photo.digital "Bill
    Crocker" <> wrote:

    >It doesn't appear it will auto-focus with my AF lens, only AF-S lenses (that
    >have the motor built-in the lens). The AF lens requires a mechanical
    >drive-shaft connection to the camera. Some of the third party converters
    >extend the operation of that shaft.


    At that point yes, you need to look elsewhere. I believe the Kenko Pro
    ones might be appropriate, but don't quote me on that.
    -
    Ed Ruf Lifetime AMA# 344007 ()
    http://EdwardGRuf.com
    Ed Ruf, Oct 23, 2006
    #9
  10. Bill Crocker

    Bill Crocker Guest

    "Rita Ä Berkowitz" <ritaberk2O04 @aol.com> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
    >
    >>> The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    >>> comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    >>> almost nothing in sharpness.

    >>
    >> So does the TC-20E-II. This isn't an either or situation. The
    >> difference is an additional half a stop for the additional
    >> magnification. Some might complain on the loss of sharpness, but on
    >> the 70-200 f/2.8 images are still quite sharp in my experience.

    >
    > I agree that the extra magnification is well worth getting the TC-20 II.
    > A while back, I did some experiments with the 70-200 and TC-20E II using
    > tripod mount and mirror lock-up. My findings are that the TC only added a
    > slight bit of softness, which is more than acceptable for the price point
    > and convenience of adding a 2x TC in the mix. Most "softness" issues
    > people have when using TCs is they neglect to use proper and good
    > technique. Your shooting at an effective focal length of 600mm with this
    > combo, use proper technique and you will be very pleased with the results.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Rita
    >


    Thanks everyone!

    I may have solved my needs by another method. Last night I snagged a Nikon
    300mm AF-S f/4 off eBay, in excellent condition, from a reputable seller.

    Bill Crocker
    Bill Crocker, Oct 23, 2006
    #10
  11. Bill Crocker

    cjcampbell Guest

    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
    > On 22 Oct 2006 17:07:48 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    > <> wrote:
    >


    >
    > >The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    > >comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    > >almost nothing in sharpness.

    >
    > So does the TC-20E-II.


    Do you have some documentation for that?
    cjcampbell, Oct 24, 2006
    #11
  12. On 23 Oct 2006 19:11:52 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
    >> On 22 Oct 2006 17:07:48 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>

    >
    >>
    >> >The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    >> >comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    >> >almost nothing in sharpness.

    >>
    >> So does the TC-20E-II.

    >
    >Do you have some documentation for that?


    For what claim? VR works fine through the TC-20E-II in the following combos
    in my experience:
    D70 + 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII
    D200 + 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII
    D200 + 200-400mm f/4 VR + TC-20EII
    I haven't gotten around to trying the TC-20 with the 200-4400 on the D70.

    Now as far as the sharpness question I believe that will be a bit
    subjective. It is especially difficult to evaluate fairly in light of the
    fact that you lose two stops with the TC-20. Technique can be extremely
    important. Much of what I shoot is handheld, so that holds even more so.
    I'm still struggling with technique sometimes in using the 200-400mm f/4 VR
    by itself as compared to the 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII given it's
    greater bulk and heft, such as trying to shoot F-22s flying around at work.

    Overall for the 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII I've been extremely happy with
    the results in general.

    --
    Ed Ruf ()
    http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html
    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!), Oct 26, 2006
    #12
  13. Bill Crocker

    cjcampbell Guest

    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
    > On 23 Oct 2006 19:11:52 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    > >
    > >Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!) wrote:
    > >> On 22 Oct 2006 17:07:48 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    > >> <> wrote:
    > >>

    > >
    > >>
    > >> >The 1.7x converter also supports VR. It is also a lot more
    > >> >comfortable to use. Reviewers also say the 1.7x converter costs you
    > >> >almost nothing in sharpness.
    > >>
    > >> So does the TC-20E-II.

    > >
    > >Do you have some documentation for that?

    >
    > For what claim? VR works fine through the TC-20E-II in the following combos
    > in my experience:
    > D70 + 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII
    > D200 + 70-200mm f/2.8 VR + TC-20EII
    > D200 + 200-400mm f/4 VR + TC-20EII
    > I haven't gotten around to trying the TC-20 with the 200-4400 on the D70.


    Yeah, it was the VR that I wanted documentation for. Interesting. the
    1.7x teleconverter is the only one that Nikon says will support VR. How
    do you know it is working on the 2x teleconverter?
    cjcampbell, Oct 26, 2006
    #13
  14. On 25 Oct 2006 18:40:38 -0700, in rec.photo.digital "cjcampbell"
    <> wrote:

    >>Yeah, it was the VR that I wanted documentation for. Interesting. the

    >1.7x teleconverter is the only one that Nikon says will support VR. How
    >do you know it is working on the 2x teleconverter?


    Well, the 70-200mm f/2.8 VR is a lens specifically recommended for use with
    it. You can also hear and see VR working in the viewfinder and in the
    resulting images, just as you can without the TC-20. The TC-17E was the
    last TC to come to the market, so it's product info might be a bit more up
    to date. Also, sometimes it appears their published info isn't always
    correct. In the instruction booklet I got with the TC-20E, which also
    covers the TC-14E, it explicitly states you would lose AF using the TC-20E
    + 200-400mm f/4 VR because of a resulting f/8 for the combo. As I've
    stated, at least on my case on my D200 that is not the case. AF still
    works, albeit a bit more sluggish, but not as sluggish as the TC-20E +
    70-200mm f/2.8 VR combo does at f/5.6 on my D70.
    --
    Ed Ruf ()
    http://edwardgruf.com/Digital_Photography/General/index.html
    Ed Ruf (REPLY to E-MAIL IN SIG!), Oct 26, 2006
    #14
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