New House construction: network architecture

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Jedmeister, May 11, 2005.

  1. Jedmeister

    Jedmeister Guest

    We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.

    I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    plug-in.

    Any good sites?
     
    Jedmeister, May 11, 2005
    #1
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  2. Jedmeister

    Rob J Guest

    In article <28hge.195$> in nz.comp on Wed, 11 May
    2005 17:56:00 +1200, Jedmeister <> says...
    > We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    > good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    > I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    > switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    > ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    > plug-in.
    >
    > Any good sites?


    Essentially, any cable you lay can be used for phone as well as data. In
    fact, you lay the same kind of cable for both. I'd suggest your layout
    is, in part, dictated by the most convenient point to bring the phone
    line into a wall jack or terminal block.
     
    Rob J, May 11, 2005
    #2
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  3. Jedmeister wrote:
    > We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    > good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    > I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    > switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    > ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    > plug-in.
    >
    > Any good sites?


    hehehe, sorry, I just found it quite funny.
    If you make sure you get a sparky who knows data too(Aotea
    Security/electric/data systems in Dunedin do it well) they should be
    able to help you out.

    I'm just considering doing cat6 through the house or doing wireless...
    there is an ideal room in the basement for rack/switch/server, just got
    to cost up the wiring.
     
    Dave - Dave.net.nz, May 11, 2005
    #3
  4. Rob J wrote:
    > In article <28hge.195$> in nz.comp on Wed, 11 May
    > 2005 17:56:00 +1200, Jedmeister <> says...
    >
    >>We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    >>good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >>
    >>I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    >>switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    >>ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    >>plug-in.
    >>
    >>Any good sites?

    >
    >
    > Essentially, any cable you lay can be used for phone as well as data. In
    > fact, you lay the same kind of cable for both. I'd suggest your layout
    > is, in part, dictated by the most convenient point to bring the phone
    > line into a wall jack or terminal block.


    There are a couple of home automation newsgroup that covers this subject
    regularly comp.home.automation and uk.tech-automation.home). The first
    is bit US based but the advice seems pretty solid. Have a chat with an
    electrician as to what is available in NZ.

    One suggestion would be to run conduit thus allowing you to replace/add
    cables as technology changes. Maybe start with some Cat5e/6 and coax
    depending on what you need. Either connect all to basement or roof
    cavity to make it very easy to run cables.

    cheers

    W
     
    William Hamilton, May 11, 2005
    #4
  5. Jedmeister

    Greg Guest

    you can buy a purpose made cabinet that is set up for phone/data/sat/tv,
    try your local electrical supplier


    Jedmeister wrote:
    > We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    > good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    > I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    > switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    > ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    > plug-in.
    >
    > Any good sites?
    >
    >
     
    Greg, May 11, 2005
    #5
  6. Jedmeister

    geoffm Guest

    On Wed, 11 May 2005 17:56:00 +1200, "Jedmeister"
    <> wrote:

    >We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    >good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    >I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    >switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    >ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    >plug-in.
    >
    >Any good sites?
    >

    That is pretty much what I did - ran cable to a patch panel in the
    broom cupboard, with jacks in each room
    Don't forget:
    lots of power points
    phone jack
    light in th ecupbard so you can see what you are doing
     
    geoffm, May 11, 2005
    #6
  7. Jedmeister

    Richard Guest

    Jedmeister wrote:
    > We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    > good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    > I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    > switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    > ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    > plug-in.
    >
    > Any good sites?



    2x cat5e to every location that you may want a computer or phone to a central
    patch panel in a hall closet or attached garage or something. At leaste 1 cat5e
    run to the location of the alarm panel for phoen connection if you choose to go
    the landline monitored alarm route. Perhaps 2 if you think you will want to hook
    a computer to the alarm at a later stage to track home/away status etc.

    You can either use the cat5e for analog phone or else use it for IP phones if
    you choose to move out of the 19th centuary at a later stage.

    Dont think you can use a bedroom closet as anything you put in there will have
    fans that makes noise.

    2 coaxs from every TV location back to the same place, as well as 2 runs to
    where you will have the sky dish mounted. You may want to run 3 coaxs to the
    main tv if you will be locating the sky reciever there and running the RF back
    to a splitter if you are not interested in picture quality on the other TVs

    You may choose to run coax+power to any locations you want to put exterior CCTV
    cameras. You can then use modulators to put it on the TV antenna to every TV in
    the house. DSE do a totally rubbish analog tuned modulator for about $70 that
    will do the job, or else look on tardme.

    I am evaluating the idea of pulling some 2.5mm twin and earth from the server
    closet here to select locations for when I put in a big grunter UPS under the
    stairs, still awaiting my mate to find the way to do that legally. I am
    investigating the idea of a generator cut over switch for when I get a genny,
    but luckilly the last 6 months or so have being relativly powercut free.

    You may also want to lookinto putting wire in for an irrigation controller at
    some stage, and cables to any aircons you may put in, so you can turn them
    on/off under computer control.

    Perhaps also run speaker cables for rears in the lounge room, to some cieling
    speakers in the kitchen and put some into the bathroom too. You will need cat5
    in the walls if you want remote extenders from those rooms. I have run them back
    to the server closet and just put a shitty $400 stereo receiver in there to
    drive them either radio or off one of the machines in there for audiofile
    playback. No remote on the PC yet however.

    There is loads of info out there on diy home automation. The trouble is in a new
    house you are reluctant to smash into the walls to run any new cables since the
    house has a new factor to it, even tho a crappy timber framed drywall house is
    so damn easy to patch up. Get the cables in now and save yourself the hastle.

    You can put cat6 in if you want, but there is no benifit over cat5e on todays
    hardware, and I dont think cat6 will handle 10gig ethernet so you would need to
    repull cables anyway later.
     
    Richard, May 11, 2005
    #7
  8. Jedmeister

    Jedmeister Guest

    "William Hamilton" <> wrote in
    message news:d5s8e2$12b$...
    > Rob J wrote:
    >> In article <28hge.195$> in nz.comp on Wed, 11 May
    >> 2005 17:56:00 +1200, Jedmeister <> says...
    >>
    >>>We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of
    >>>any good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >>>
    >>>I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    >>>switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space
    >>>with ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might
    >>>want to plug-in.
    >>>
    >>>Any good sites?

    >>
    >>
    >> Essentially, any cable you lay can be used for phone as well as data. In
    >> fact, you lay the same kind of cable for both. I'd suggest your layout
    >> is, in part, dictated by the most convenient point to bring the phone
    >> line into a wall jack or terminal block.

    >
    > There are a couple of home automation newsgroup that covers this subject
    > regularly comp.home.automation and uk.tech-automation.home). The first is
    > bit US based but the advice seems pretty solid. Have a chat with an
    > electrician as to what is available in NZ.
    >
    > One suggestion would be to run conduit thus allowing you to replace/add
    > cables as technology changes. Maybe start with some Cat5e/6 and coax
    > depending on what you need. Either connect all to basement or roof cavity
    > to make it very easy to run cables.
    >
    > cheers
    >
    > W



    Great, thanks for this. Probably will end up getting some qualified help,
    but am interested.
     
    Jedmeister, May 11, 2005
    #8
  9. Jedmeister

    David Preece Guest

    Jedmeister wrote:
    > We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    > good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.


    This may be a foregone conclusion, but think really carefully about just
    getting an AP and a good (separate) antenna and doing it with 802.11G.
    Could save you an arm and a leg, not to mention the time.

    Dave
     
    David Preece, May 11, 2005
    #9
  10. Jedmeister

    Jedmeister Guest

    "Richard" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Jedmeister wrote:
    >> We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of
    >> any good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >>
    >> I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    >> switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space
    >> with ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might
    >> want to plug-in.
    >>
    >> Any good sites?

    >
    >
    > 2x cat5e to every location that you may want a computer or phone to a
    > central patch panel in a hall closet or attached garage or something. At
    > leaste 1 cat5e run to the location of the alarm panel for phoen connection
    > if you choose to go the landline monitored alarm route. Perhaps 2 if you
    > think you will want to hook a computer to the alarm at a later stage to
    > track home/away status etc.
    >
    > You can either use the cat5e for analog phone or else use it for IP phones
    > if you choose to move out of the 19th centuary at a later stage.
    >
    > Dont think you can use a bedroom closet as anything you put in there will
    > have fans that makes noise.
    >
    > 2 coaxs from every TV location back to the same place, as well as 2 runs
    > to where you will have the sky dish mounted. You may want to run 3 coaxs
    > to the main tv if you will be locating the sky reciever there and running
    > the RF back to a splitter if you are not interested in picture quality on
    > the other TVs
    >
    > You may choose to run coax+power to any locations you want to put exterior
    > CCTV cameras. You can then use modulators to put it on the TV antenna to
    > every TV in the house. DSE do a totally rubbish analog tuned modulator for
    > about $70 that will do the job, or else look on tardme.
    >
    > I am evaluating the idea of pulling some 2.5mm twin and earth from the
    > server closet here to select locations for when I put in a big grunter UPS
    > under the stairs, still awaiting my mate to find the way to do that
    > legally. I am investigating the idea of a generator cut over switch for
    > when I get a genny, but luckilly the last 6 months or so have being
    > relativly powercut free.
    >
    > You may also want to lookinto putting wire in for an irrigation controller
    > at some stage, and cables to any aircons you may put in, so you can turn
    > them on/off under computer control.
    >
    > Perhaps also run speaker cables for rears in the lounge room, to some
    > cieling speakers in the kitchen and put some into the bathroom too. You
    > will need cat5 in the walls if you want remote extenders from those rooms.
    > I have run them back to the server closet and just put a shitty $400
    > stereo receiver in there to drive them either radio or off one of the
    > machines in there for audiofile playback. No remote on the PC yet however.
    >
    > There is loads of info out there on diy home automation. The trouble is in
    > a new house you are reluctant to smash into the walls to run any new
    > cables since the house has a new factor to it, even tho a crappy timber
    > framed drywall house is so damn easy to patch up. Get the cables in now
    > and save yourself the hastle.
    >
    > You can put cat6 in if you want, but there is no benifit over cat5e on
    > todays hardware, and I dont think cat6 will handle 10gig ethernet so you
    > would need to repull cables anyway later.


    Thanks for the info. We have not built yet , so figure it is best to get
    the design right to avoid any future wall smashing.
     
    Jedmeister, May 11, 2005
    #10
  11. Jedmeister

    Craig Shore Guest

    On Wed, 11 May 2005 17:56:00 +1200, "Jedmeister" <> wrote:

    >We may be building a house soon - was just wondering if anyone knew of any
    >good spots on the net describing a good layout of the cabling.
    >
    >I was thinking, of perhaps a central 'space' to hold the adsl modem,
    >switchand possibly a server. Then, a patch panel in the central space with
    >ethernet running terminating in each room in the house where I might want to
    >plug-in.
    >
    >Any good sites?


    One thing I don't see many people mentioning, that I did here, was to put
    network sockets behind wherever there will be a TV. In the future you're most
    likely going to have a networked device playing media from a central server (in
    your central space).
     
    Craig Shore, May 11, 2005
    #11
  12. Jedmeister

    Richard Guest

    Jedmeister wrote:

    >>You can put cat6 in if you want, but there is no benifit over cat5e on
    >>todays hardware, and I dont think cat6 will handle 10gig ethernet so you
    >>would need to repull cables anyway later.

    >
    >
    > Thanks for the info. We have not built yet , so figure it is best to get
    > the design right to avoid any future wall smashing.



    If you are not specing the house yourself, chances are it will be finished very
    cheaply, with a single colour paint ontop of standard gib with no skim coat, so
    smashing into the wall isnt a huge mission if you are able to stop it yourself
    (its not hard, just time consumign waiting for everything to dry so you can move
    onto the next step) - oh and messy.

    If you have more then 4-5 holes in a single sheet of gib its normally easier to
    rip the whole sheet off and replace it, gib is cheap - $14 a sheet or so for a
    2.4m standard gib.

    Worst case, put a flushbox, and good sized wholes thru the studs and just a
    piece of 2.5mm conduit wire as a decent drawwire for later to any location you
    may want an outlet, cheap insurance.

    Thats assuming you can have site access before completion, if you are buying a
    house in a subdivsion off a developer, they may have a no access till final
    completion policy so you are stuck with there exhorbitant charges for any cable
    runs.
     
    Richard, May 11, 2005
    #12
  13. In article <d0lge.317$>, "Jedmeister" <> wrote:
    >
    >"Richard" <> wrote in message
    >news:...

    *SNIP*
    >> You can put cat6 in if you want, but there is no benifit over cat5e on
    >> todays hardware, and I dont think cat6 will handle 10gig ethernet so you
    >> would need to repull cables anyway later.

    >

    The 10gig-E standard won't work over copper. Well, it will, but they
    decided that a 10cm maximum cable length wasn't much use to anyone so
    it's not certified and thus there will never be adaptors in RJ45
    terminations.

    >Thanks for the info. We have not built yet , so figure it is best to get
    >the design right to avoid any future wall smashing.
    >

    Every time this question comes up on Slashdot, which is fairly often,
    the most common piece of advice given is to conduit before the wall
    panels go on, and to put two lengths of fishing line or conduit wire
    into every one. Even if you don't cut holes for the wall boxes in the
    initial stages, the conduits are there and you can just tie a cable onto
    the wire and draw it through if you decide to put in a new wall box.
    Run conduits on every other stud if you can afford it, because it's a
    fairly safe bet that network infrastructure in the future will be like
    power points are now - you want outlets on every wall.
    The logic behind two wires is that even if you run one through with a
    cable on it in the future, you still have another one if you decide to
    re-cable.

    Also, check what the standards are for wall- and ceiling-space conduits
    with regards to what it's made of. A lot of places overseas require
    special materials to be used, stuff that doesn't produce toxic smoke and
    won't readily burn. I'm not sure if NZ has anything similar.

    --
    Matthew Poole
    "Veni, vidi, velcro...
    I came, I saw, I stuck around"

    My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
     
    Matthew Poole, May 11, 2005
    #13
  14. Jedmeister

    Rob J Guest

    In article <d5tqiu$4ot$> in nz.comp on Wed, 11 May 2005
    19:40:00 GMT, Matthew Poole <> says...
    > In article <d0lge.317$>, "Jedmeister" <> wrote:
    > >
    > >"Richard" <> wrote in message
    > >news:...

    > *SNIP*
    > >> You can put cat6 in if you want, but there is no benifit over cat5e on
    > >> todays hardware, and I dont think cat6 will handle 10gig ethernet so you
    > >> would need to repull cables anyway later.

    > >

    > The 10gig-E standard won't work over copper. Well, it will, but they
    > decided that a 10cm maximum cable length wasn't much use to anyone so
    > it's not certified and thus there will never be adaptors in RJ45
    > terminations.
    >
    > >Thanks for the info. We have not built yet , so figure it is best to get
    > >the design right to avoid any future wall smashing.
    > >

    > Every time this question comes up on Slashdot, which is fairly often,
    > the most common piece of advice given is to conduit before the wall
    > panels go on, and to put two lengths of fishing line or conduit wire
    > into every one. Even if you don't cut holes for the wall boxes in the
    > initial stages, the conduits are there and you can just tie a cable onto
    > the wire and draw it through if you decide to put in a new wall box.
    > Run conduits on every other stud if you can afford it, because it's a
    > fairly safe bet that network infrastructure in the future will be like
    > power points are now - you want outlets on every wall.
    > The logic behind two wires is that even if you run one through with a
    > cable on it in the future, you still have another one if you decide to
    > re-cable.


    But of course you could draw through with the old cable as well.
     
    Rob J, May 13, 2005
    #14
  15. Jedmeister

    NewsDroid Guest

    In article blah blah a bunch of guys wrote & wrote & wrote:

    > > One suggestion would be to run conduit thus allowing you to replace/add
    > > cables as technology changes. Maybe start with some Cat5e/6 and coax
    > > depending on what you need. Either connect all to basement or roof cavity
    > > to make it very easy to run cables.
    > > crap crap crap crap balone crap crap bilge crap crap etc etc
    >>

    > Great, thanks for this. Probably will end up getting some qualified help,
    > but am interested.


    Forget all that, no matter how carefully you lay cable or conduit, the
    Domestic Chief Executive Officer will decide that the computer room will
    be at the OTHER end of the house, the Entertainment Center will go on
    that concrete wall backing onto the garage, the one with none of the
    above and the 20c/4c/-20c storage unit will be free-standing between the
    food preparation and consumption areas.

    It's better to make sure that the house is on long piles rather than a
    concrete slab so you can crawl about easily and that the roof pitch is
    high enough to allow badminton games in the ceiling cavity and overhangs
    the walls enough to allow ready access to them without lifting roofing.
    That way any future cabling/fibre/whatever can be readily fed anywhere
    at any time with only a long bit set.

    Believe me, I've been there and done all that.

    --
    .....NewsDroid
     
    NewsDroid, May 13, 2005
    #15
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