.NET training and certification what do I need and how do I get it

Discussion in 'MCAD' started by learnerplates, Jul 11, 2006.

  1. I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    intricasies.
    What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    training, books, self training, courses?
    I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    for the future.
    learnerplates, Jul 11, 2006
    #1
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  2. learnerplates

    Cerebrus Guest

    learnerplates wrote:
    > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    > intricasies.
    > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > training, books, self training, courses?
    > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    > for the future.


    See <http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/newgen/> for info. about the
    certifications available for .NET 2.0

    Personally, I always recommend that you learn the framework first, and
    then think about certifications. Also, I don't believe that getting a
    certification improves your productivity at work (unless you're
    starting from scratch), however it does definitely enhance your resume.
    Cerebrus, Jul 11, 2006
    #2
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  3. Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    "Cerebrus" wrote:

    >
    > learnerplates wrote:
    > > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    > > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    > > intricasies.
    > > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > > training, books, self training, courses?
    > > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    > > for the future.

    >
    > See <http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/newgen/> for info. about the
    > certifications available for .NET 2.0
    >
    > Personally, I always recommend that you learn the framework first, and
    > then think about certifications. Also, I don't believe that getting a
    > certification improves your productivity at work (unless you're
    > starting from scratch), however it does definitely enhance your resume.
    >
    >


    Thanks Cerebrus,
    I am starting from scratch as far as .NET is concerned. Any recommendations
    on .NET books or other resourses? what about classes are there some msoft
    specific classes that can be taken.
    learnerplates, Jul 11, 2006
    #3
  4. learnerplates

    Cerebrus Guest

    Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    learnerplates wrote:
    > Thanks Cerebrus,
    > I am starting from scratch as far as .NET is concerned. Any recommendations
    > on .NET books or other resourses? what about classes are there some msoft
    > specific classes that can be taken.


    As for books, I don't know of many. I didn't start learning .NET from
    books. I did a course instead. So, most of the books I have, are not
    introductory in nature, and are specifically related to a particular
    portion of .NET. (Such as ADO.NET, Distributed programming, Graphics
    programming etc.) But I usually find books by APress to be very good.
    You might try Wrox or O'Reilly also. Maybe someone else can suggest a
    good book to start learning from.

    There are a lot of websites as well, which have very nice tutorials on
    ..NET. One of my favourites is FunctionX (www.functionx.com)

    I don't know about your local classes since the odds are that I'm not
    even in the same country as you are. :p
    Cerebrus, Jul 11, 2006
    #4
  5. July 11, 2006

    The Step By Step books from MS Press are excellent!! I found the courses
    were wwaaayyy too expensive, and you only got a "smell" of the topic and
    weren't useful at all. The books were the only way to really dive in at high
    speed :) (plus, what happens if you forget something? You can't just look up
    the instructor and ask him after the class is over... but with a book you
    can come back again and again.)

    Here's the beginning of the list of books I started with: (look for Visual
    Studio 2005 editions though! - All MSPress)

    Visual Basic .Net Step By Step (or C# depending on what you want)

    Ado .Net Step By Step

    XML Step By Step

    70-306 training kit - look for training kit for Windows Development for the
    new certifications... this is the old exam number - these are great because
    they come with 300 free practice questions (so you don't need to buy your
    own practice exam - saves $$) and they also have a detailed exam objective
    list in the front and where you can find it in the book...

    Asp.Net Programming with Visual Basic .Net Step by Step

    ..Net XML Web Services Step By Step

    ..... and so on and so on... for more topics, just look up
    microsoft.com/mspress... and click the All Books link (or the up & coming
    link for some of the new books which haven't come out yet)... and scroll
    through them looking for your topic.

    BTW, security is going to be a big piece of the new exams (not optional)...
    here's the books I found vveeerrryyyy exact and perfectly fitting for the
    security portions:

    Security for VB .Net
    Improving Web Application Security (free online at msdn.com)
    Threat Modeling
    70-330 - Training Kit.... Implementing Security for applications.... old
    exam number

    Hope this helps!!! :)
    --
    Joseph Bittman
    Microsoft Certified Solution Developer
    Microsoft Most Valuable Professional -- DPM

    Web Site/Blog: http://CactiDevelopers.ResDev.Net/

    "learnerplates" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some
    > Microsoft
    > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET
    > language
    > intricasies.
    > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > training, books, self training, courses?
    > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more
    > appealing
    > for the future.
    >
    >
    Joseph Bittman MVP MCSD, Jul 11, 2006
    #5
  6. Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    thanks guys, this is useful information.
    I checked out some of the mspress books on amazon and they haven't gotten a
    very good write up. I'll ask around some more before purchasing.
    The functionx website has a lot of content, and looks useful I'll try that
    too,
    BTW I'm in Ireland, if anyone has information on local resourses on .NET
    learning or certification please let me know.
    Cheers.



    "Joseph Bittman MVP MCSD" wrote:

    > July 11, 2006
    >
    > The Step By Step books from MS Press are excellent!! I found the courses
    > were wwaaayyy too expensive, and you only got a "smell" of the topic and
    > weren't useful at all. The books were the only way to really dive in at high
    > speed :) (plus, what happens if you forget something? You can't just look up
    > the instructor and ask him after the class is over... but with a book you
    > can come back again and again.)
    >
    > Here's the beginning of the list of books I started with: (look for Visual
    > Studio 2005 editions though! - All MSPress)
    >
    > Visual Basic .Net Step By Step (or C# depending on what you want)
    >
    > Ado .Net Step By Step
    >
    > XML Step By Step
    >
    > 70-306 training kit - look for training kit for Windows Development for the
    > new certifications... this is the old exam number - these are great because
    > they come with 300 free practice questions (so you don't need to buy your
    > own practice exam - saves $$) and they also have a detailed exam objective
    > list in the front and where you can find it in the book...
    >
    > Asp.Net Programming with Visual Basic .Net Step by Step
    >
    > ..Net XML Web Services Step By Step
    >
    > ..... and so on and so on... for more topics, just look up
    > microsoft.com/mspress... and click the All Books link (or the up & coming
    > link for some of the new books which haven't come out yet)... and scroll
    > through them looking for your topic.
    >
    > BTW, security is going to be a big piece of the new exams (not optional)...
    > here's the books I found vveeerrryyyy exact and perfectly fitting for the
    > security portions:
    >
    > Security for VB .Net
    > Improving Web Application Security (free online at msdn.com)
    > Threat Modeling
    > 70-330 - Training Kit.... Implementing Security for applications.... old
    > exam number
    >
    > Hope this helps!!! :)
    > --
    > Joseph Bittman
    > Microsoft Certified Solution Developer
    > Microsoft Most Valuable Professional -- DPM
    >
    > Web Site/Blog: http://CactiDevelopers.ResDev.Net/
    >
    > "learnerplates" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some
    > > Microsoft
    > > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET
    > > language
    > > intricasies.
    > > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > > training, books, self training, courses?
    > > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more
    > > appealing
    > > for the future.
    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    >
    learnerplates, Jul 12, 2006
    #6
  7. learnerplates

    B.Anil.Kumar Guest

    Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    Hi,
    Your info. is really worth. I am planning to take 70-315 exam this month
    end , so can u please suggest how to prepare and If u have any e-books which
    supports the certification(i.e Amit Kalani's e-books)
    Pls. send to my email id :

    Thanks in advance.

    "Cerebrus" wrote:

    >
    > learnerplates wrote:
    > > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    > > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    > > intricasies.
    > > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > > training, books, self training, courses?
    > > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    > > for the future.

    >
    > See <http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/newgen/> for info. about the
    > certifications available for .NET 2.0
    >
    > Personally, I always recommend that you learn the framework first, and
    > then think about certifications. Also, I don't believe that getting a
    > certification improves your productivity at work (unless you're
    > starting from scratch), however it does definitely enhance your resume.
    >
    >
    B.Anil.Kumar, Jul 13, 2006
    #7
  8. learnerplates

    akki Guest

    You can go for anyone of two streams MCAD/MCSD that will be batter. You can
    even chaecks the details at Microsoft.com learning section for details of
    exam.
    Regards

    "learnerplates" wrote:

    > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    > intricasies.
    > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > training, books, self training, courses?
    > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    > for the future.
    >
    >
    akki, Jul 17, 2006
    #8
  9. learnerplates

    Javaman59 Guest

    > I'm starting out with the .NET framework 2.0 as a developer, for the most
    > part developing in C# and ASP.NET, Winforms. I'd like to get some Microsoft
    > Certification under my belt while learning .NET and some of the .NET language
    > intricasies.


    Good for you! If you are doing it at work, then you will find the exam
    preparation much easier. I had to do 70-320 with my only workplace experience
    being C++ and COM. It was very hard!

    > I have a C++ backgroud but am still an intermediate grade developer. My
    > first preference would be to identify the courses I need to improve my
    > productivity in my present workplace and also make my resume more appealing
    > for the future.
    >


    I disagree with Cerberus who wrote that the courses won't improve your
    workplace productivity. Doing the study introduces us to parts of the
    framework, and especially the Visual Studio IDE (eg. deployment), that we
    might otherwise not stumble across in the pressures of getting the job done.
    (My C# training did exactly this for my VS C++ skills at work)

    > What Certificates should I aim for and what is the best way to get the
    > training, books, self training, courses?


    I did 70-316 (C# Windows Apps) and 70-320 (XML Web Services) with the Amit
    Kalani ExamCram guides, and Visual Studio 2003 Unleashed, by SAMS. I would
    highly recommend both these books. Don't be fooled by the ExamCram title -
    only a genius, with a photographic memory, would be able to pass the exam by
    "cramming" the contents of this book. It's takes a lot of work, and you have
    to really understand the material (particularly for 70-320). Fortunately, I
    thoroughly enjoyed learning the .Net platform, and programming in it. If I
    didn't, I don't think I would have been able to stick with it.

    Do 70-316 first!

    oh, btw.. it took me a year, while working full time in C++, to pass these
    exams. ;-)

    Good luck, and have fun with it!

    Javaman
    Javaman59, Aug 1, 2006
    #9
  10. learnerplates

    Cerebrus Guest

    Javaman59 wrote:

    > I disagree with Cerberus who wrote that the courses won't improve your
    > workplace productivity. Doing the study introduces us to parts of the
    > framework, and especially the Visual Studio IDE (eg. deployment), that we
    > might otherwise not stumble across in the pressures of getting the job done.
    > (My C# training did exactly this for my VS C++ skills at work)


    You're most welcome to disagree, but my point, when taken in context is
    that certifications *alone* do not improve productivity in the
    workplace. Too many people these days decide to get a certification,
    and then start learning the framework. I feel that that is not how it's
    supposed to be. Certifications attest to a person's above average skill
    on a particular platform / subject, not that he has "learnt" the
    concepts.

    Studying for certifications allows you to delve deeper into the whys
    and the wherefores of each topic. Therefore, it greatly enhances your
    understanding. But if you're starting from scratch, you would probably
    be trying to hard just to grasp the basic concepts, to be able to
    notice the finer details.

    Just my 2p.
    Cerebrus, Aug 1, 2006
    #10
  11. learnerplates

    Javaman59 Guest

    Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    > Studying for certifications allows you to delve deeper into the whys
    > and the wherefores of each topic. Therefore, it greatly enhances your
    > understanding. But if you're starting from scratch, you would probably
    > be trying to hard just to grasp the basic concepts, to be able to
    > notice the finer details.


    Thanks Cerebrus. I guess that our point of "disagreement" comes down to how
    much skills and knowledge are needed to actually *use* the subject matter of
    the exams. As you say, someone with not much experience will not be be able
    to use their studies, even if they have passed the exam (if I understand you
    correctly), whereas my point is that for someone with experience (like
    myself) can use the studies to improve their workplace productivity. I think
    we are both saying that it is going to be almost impossible to pass the
    harder exams (such as 70-320) just from books.

    > You're most welcome to disagree, but my point, when taken in context is
    > that certifications *alone* do not improve productivity in the
    > workplace. Too many people these days decide to get a certification,
    > and then start learning the framework. I feel that that is not how it's
    > supposed to be. Certifications attest to a person's above average skill
    > on a particular platform / subject, not that he has "learnt" the
    > concepts.


    That's great if you can augment your studies with related work experience,
    however some of us don't have the opportunity, and so we decide to get the
    certification in order to get entry to the related job market. The old
    chicken and egg problem.

    Regards,

    Javaman
    Javaman59, Aug 1, 2006
    #11
  12. learnerplates

    Cerebrus Guest

    Re: .NET training and certification what do I need and how do I ge

    Well, put even more simply, my point would be :

    - Beginner User + Certification = Intermediate User. (Not as productive
    in workplace)

    - Intermediate user + Certification = Advanced User. (Very productive
    in workplace)

    (By Certification, I mean the process of preparing for certifications)

    So, I think we're basically saying the same thing. BTW, you rightly put
    it as the chicken and egg problem.
    Cerebrus, Aug 1, 2006
    #12
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