Need SPI support in router?

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by Steve, Feb 24, 2008.

  1. Steve

    Steve Guest

    How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?

    I've managed using a router without it until now - is it just a way of
    selling me something that I don't need?

    Hence what's the threat/risk, if any, to:

    - my router h/w?
    - my BB service

    I'm a VoIP user and there's a trade-off in choice of ATA/router if SPI
    is something I should consider.

    TIA
    Steve, Feb 24, 2008
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. In article <>,
    Steve <> wrote:
    >How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?


    Not at all.

    >I've managed using a router without it until now - is it just a way of
    >selling me something that I don't need?


    Probably.

    >Hence what's the threat/risk, if any, to:
    >
    > - my router h/w?


    Do you really think that someone could do something from the outside to cause
    physical damage?

    > - my BB service


    SPI or not, if someone decides they don't like you, they can cause huge
    quantities of data to flow your way and no amount of filtering or
    firewalling at your end of the bit of string will make any difference.
    You can stop it going through the router (NAT alone ought to do that),
    but not stop it getting to the router, and by the time it's reached your
    router, it's too late to do anything about it other than throw it away -
    it's already clocked up "wire time".

    >I'm a VoIP user and there's a trade-off in choice of ATA/router if SPI
    >is something I should consider.


    You want (a) a good ISP - none of your 9.99 a month rubbish, and (b) a
    router/firewall that can do outbound QoS.

    Gordon
    Gordon Henderson, Feb 24, 2008
    #2
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  3. Steve <> writes:

    > How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?


    Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the Serial
    Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to other
    chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a decision
    for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    be of no interest to the user.
    Graham Murray, Feb 24, 2008
    #3
  4. Steve

    Gaz Guest

    Graham Murray wrote:
    > Steve <> writes:
    >
    >> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?

    >
    > Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    > numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the
    > Serial Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are
    > wired to other chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used
    > should be a decision for the hardware designer and be of no interest
    > to the user, unless
    > the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    > then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    > be of no interest to the user.


    SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???

    Gaz
    Gaz, Feb 24, 2008
    #4
  5. Steve

    Graham. Guest

    "Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Steve <> writes:
    >
    >> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?

    >
    > Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    > numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the Serial
    > Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to other
    > chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a decision
    > for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    > the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    > then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    > be of no interest to the user.


    I think we are talking about Stateful Packet Inspection here,
    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateful_firewall

    --
    Graham

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Feb 24, 2008
    #5
  6. Steve

    Mark Guest

    On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:56:46 -0000, "Graham." <> wrote:

    >
    >"Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Steve <> writes:
    >>
    >>> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?

    >>
    >> Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    >> numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the Serial
    >> Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to other
    >> chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a decision
    >> for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    >> the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    >> then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    >> be of no interest to the user.

    >
    >I think we are talking about Stateful Packet Inspection here,
    >http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateful_firewall


    We are indeed.
    Mark, Feb 24, 2008
    #6
  7. Steve

    Mark Guest

    On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:25:00 +0000 (UTC), Gordon Henderson
    <> wrote:

    >In article <>,
    >Steve <> wrote:
    >>How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?

    >
    >Not at all.
    >
    >>I've managed using a router without it until now - is it just a way of
    >>selling me something that I don't need?

    >
    >Probably.
    >
    >>Hence what's the threat/risk, if any, to:
    >>
    >> - my router h/w?

    >
    >Do you really think that someone could do something from the outside to cause
    >physical damage?
    >
    >> - my BB service

    >
    >SPI or not, if someone decides they don't like you, they can cause huge
    >quantities of data to flow your way and no amount of filtering or
    >firewalling at your end of the bit of string will make any difference.
    >You can stop it going through the router (NAT alone ought to do that),
    >but not stop it getting to the router, and by the time it's reached your
    >router, it's too late to do anything about it other than throw it away -
    >it's already clocked up "wire time".
    >
    >>I'm a VoIP user and there's a trade-off in choice of ATA/router if SPI
    >>is something I should consider.

    >
    >You want (a) a good ISP - none of your 9.99 a month rubbish, and (b) a
    >router/firewall that can do outbound QoS.
    >
    >Gordon


    Ta.

    Decision made: SPA-3102 replaces an older (and trusty) 2100
    Mark, Feb 24, 2008
    #7
  8. Steve

    Nick Guest

    Gordon Henderson wrote:

    >
    >> I'm a VoIP user and there's a trade-off in choice of ATA/router if SPI
    >> is something I should consider.

    >
    > You want (a) a good ISP - none of your 9.99 a month rubbish, and (b) a
    > router/firewall that can do outbound QoS.
    >
    > Gordon


    Which ISPs support outbound qos. I thought QoS at the moment was only
    really handled in your LAN.
    Nick, Feb 24, 2008
    #8
  9. "Gaz" <> writes:

    > SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???


    Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'
    (an inter-chip bus), which is also what SPI means to me. None of the
    hits returned on the first 5 pages use SPI in the context of packet
    inspection - which implies that that is a minority usage.
    Graham Murray, Feb 24, 2008
    #9
  10. Steve

    Nick Guest

    Graham Murray wrote:
    > "Gaz" <> writes:
    >
    >> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???

    >
    > Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    > 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'
    > (an inter-chip bus), which is also what SPI means to me. None of the
    > hits returned on the first 5 pages use SPI in the context of packet
    > inspection - which implies that that is a minority usage.
    >
    >

    Yebbut, in the context or routers.

    If I was talking about a verruca problem on my foot, I wouldn't expect
    you to think I was discussing the imperial length measurement a foot.
    Nick, Feb 24, 2008
    #10
  11. Steve

    Brian A Guest

    On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:08:22 +0000, Mark <>
    wrote:

    >On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:56:46 -0000, "Graham." <> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>"Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> Steve <> writes:
    >>>
    >>>> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?
    >>>
    >>> Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    >>> numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the Serial
    >>> Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to other
    >>> chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a decision
    >>> for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    >>> the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    >>> then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    >>> be of no interest to the user.

    >>
    >>I think we are talking about Stateful Packet Inspection here,
    >>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateful_firewall

    >
    >We are indeed.

    I always use
    http:\\www.acronymfinder.com
    84 definitions of SPI there.
    Stateful Packet Inspection (firewall based protocol) links to:-
    http://encyclopedia.thefreedictionary.com/Stateful Packet Inspection

    ---
    Remove 'no_spam_' from email address.
    ---
    Brian A, Feb 24, 2008
    #11
  12. Steve

    Graham. Guest

    "Brian A" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:08:22 +0000, Mark <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:56:46 -0000, "Graham." <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>
    >>>"Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:...
    >>>> Steve <> writes:
    >>>>
    >>>>> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?
    >>>>
    >>>> Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    >>>> numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the Serial
    >>>> Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to
    >>>> other
    >>>> chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a
    >>>> decision
    >>>> for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    >>>> the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    >>>> then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    >>>> be of no interest to the user.
    >>>
    >>>I think we are talking about Stateful Packet Inspection here,
    >>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateful_firewall

    >>
    >>We are indeed.

    > I always use
    > http:\\www.acronymfinder.com


    You slashed the wrong way :)
    --
    Graham

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Feb 24, 2008
    #12
  13. Steve

    Graham. Guest

    "Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > "Gaz" <> writes:
    >
    >> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???

    >
    > Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    > 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'
    > (an inter-chip bus), which is also what SPI means to me. None of the
    > hits returned on the first 5 pages use SPI in the context of packet
    > inspection - which implies that that is a minority usage.



    One can't help but sympathise, it so much depends on your background.
    I always see 'upper side-band' when I see USB
    and when I see DRM I have to check if its 'Digital Radio Mondial'
    or 'Digital Rights Management' that is being discussed.
    --
    Graham

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Feb 24, 2008
    #13
  14. Steve

    Al Guest

    "Graham." <> wrote in message
    news:fps06a$taq$...
    >
    >
    > "Brian A" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 14:08:22 +0000, Mark <>
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>>On Sun, 24 Feb 2008 13:56:46 -0000, "Graham." <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>
    >>>>"Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    >>>>news:...
    >>>>> Steve <> writes:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> How necessary is SPI in reality, for a home router?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Would you even know is a router has SPI unless you look at the part
    >>>>> numbers of the chips on the board and see if a) They support the
    >>>>> Serial
    >>>>> Peripheral Interface and b) that the appropriate pins are wired to
    >>>>> other
    >>>>> chip(s) which also support SPI. Whether SPI is used should be a
    >>>>> decision
    >>>>> for the hardware designer and be of no interest to the user, unless
    >>>>> the SPI bus is brought to a connector for an add-on board - but even
    >>>>> then unless the user is going to design his own add-on board this will
    >>>>> be of no interest to the user.
    >>>>
    >>>>I think we are talking about Stateful Packet Inspection here,
    >>>>http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Stateful_firewall
    >>>
    >>>We are indeed.

    >> I always use
    >> http:\\www.acronymfinder.com

    >
    > You slashed the wrong way :)
    > --
    > Graham
    >
    > %Profound_observation%


    Terrible eh, he has had to go home and change his trousers now!
    Al, Feb 24, 2008
    #14
  15. In article <>,
    Nick <> wrote:
    >Gordon Henderson wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>> I'm a VoIP user and there's a trade-off in choice of ATA/router if SPI
    >>> is something I should consider.

    >>
    >> You want (a) a good ISP - none of your 9.99 a month rubbish, and (b) a
    >> router/firewall that can do outbound QoS.
    >>
    >> Gordon

    >
    >Which ISPs support outbound qos. I thought QoS at the moment was only
    >really handled in your LAN.


    It is. But what you can do is limit the 'damage' caused by outgoing
    traffic leaving your LAN to the world wide wait. E.g. uploading large
    email, p2p traffic and so on. As incoming is usually much faster than
    outgoing, it's less of an issue (most of the time)

    Gordon
    Gordon Henderson, Feb 24, 2008
    #15
  16. Steve

    Graham. Guest

    >>> I always use
    >>> http:\\www.acronymfinder.com

    >>
    >> You slashed the wrong way :)
    >> --
    >> Graham
    >>
    >> %Profound_observation%

    >
    > Terrible eh, he has had to go home and change his trousers now!


    No doubt he will blame his Taylor for not asking the relevant question.

    --
    Graham

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Feb 24, 2008
    #16
  17. Graham Murray wrote:
    > "Gaz" <> writes:
    >
    >> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???

    >
    > Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    > 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'


    Good example of why not to rely on websearches alone. SPI with respect
    to firewalls is Stateful Packet Inspection.
    Mark McIntyre, Feb 24, 2008
    #17
  18. Mark McIntyre <> writes:

    > Graham Murray wrote:
    >> "Gaz" <> writes:
    >>
    >>> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???

    >>
    >> Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    >> 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'

    >
    > Good example of why not to rely on websearches alone. SPI with respect
    > to firewalls is Stateful Packet Inspection.


    Yet the original post did not mention firewalls, it mentioned
    routers. It is perfectly conceivable that a router might use an SPI bus
    as a data highway between 2 or more of its chips.
    Graham Murray, Feb 24, 2008
    #18
  19. Steve

    Graham. Guest

    "Graham Murray" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Mark McIntyre <> writes:
    >
    >> Graham Murray wrote:
    >>> "Gaz" <> writes:
    >>>
    >>>> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???
    >>>
    >>> Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    >>> 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'

    >>
    >> Good example of why not to rely on websearches alone. SPI with respect
    >> to firewalls is Stateful Packet Inspection.

    >
    > Yet the original post did not mention firewalls, it mentioned
    > routers. It is perfectly conceivable that a router might use an SPI bus
    > as a data highway between 2 or more of its chips.


    A detail only likely to be of interest to its designer. Stateful Packet
    Inspection,
    being a feature, is much more likely to be of interest to the end-user
    --
    Graham

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Feb 25, 2008
    #19
  20. Steve

    Nick Guest

    Graham Murray wrote:
    > Mark McIntyre <> writes:
    >
    >> Graham Murray wrote:
    >>> "Gaz" <> writes:
    >>>
    >>>> SPI is to do with internet packet inspection, is it not???
    >>> Google would seem to indicate otherwise. The first hit on the query
    >>> 'SPI' returns the Wikipedia article for 'Serial Peripheral Interface'

    >> Good example of why not to rely on websearches alone. SPI with respect
    >> to firewalls is Stateful Packet Inspection.

    >
    > Yet the original post did not mention firewalls, it mentioned
    > routers. It is perfectly conceivable that a router might use an SPI bus
    > as a data highway between 2 or more of its chips.


    Who was it who said Google would seem to indicate otherwise. Type in SPI
    router and the references all appear to be to Stateful Packet Inspection.

    In future maybe it would be better to just admit you made a mistake?
    Nick, Feb 25, 2008
    #20
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