Need some advice and opinions...

Discussion in 'Microsoft Certification' started by MJBrown, Nov 5, 2003.

  1. MJBrown

    MJBrown Guest

    My situation currently (and this is long...):



    I have been in Helpdesk/Customer Support for about 6 years now and at a IT helpdesk (supported employees of AOL/Netscape) for the last 2 of those 6 years. I have a total of about 10 years experience in PC's and OS's. I have some experience in networking/system admin and alot of experience in PC Support for both hardware and software. I can build a system (very easy, I think), troubleshoot any PC (and Mac) issue and able to resolve said issue.



    I was thinking of going for MCSE certs but I have noticed that allot of those with MCSE certs are paid less (compared to programming) or just unemployed or is this the same on both sides of the fence? (Oh, also not counting the bad economy). There also seems to be allot of "paper" MCSE's that have really ruined the credibility of the MCSE cert and ruined its appeal to me. I also don't like helpdesk work anymore, I don't like talking to people on the phone and I would much rather deal with a computer and its issues then another person's issues with the computer.



    Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert to have something to show that I know what im doing. The issue is, I have no current experience in programming like I do in hardware/networking.



    I was wondering if I would be able to get the books, study for the tests and get the MCSD cert with no experience in the software programming side of things?



    Would I know enough to get at least an entry-level job doing something to get more experience?



    I was also wondering if there is an in between that would be good for my situation that delves into networking/system admin and programming?




    If I go for the change into programming, the MCSD.net splits the languages up into Visual Basic .net and Visual C# .net.



    I was wondering which of the two would be better for me to start out with taking into account that I would be learning from scratch?



    Would Java or J# be a good starting point and if so, which one or both?



    Would I or should I need to know the older programming languages (like C/C++, Java, ect) or can I just jump into C# .net or VB .net?



    Thanks for any advice



    Mike
    MJBrown, Nov 5, 2003
    #1
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  2. MJBrown

    Ray Higdon Guest

    Mike, I feel your pain. I think a lot of people are in your situation and unfortunately there is no clear cut magic answer. But, there are universal attributes that you can push yourself to learn/attain/demonstrate that will put you in the top percentage of the job market regardless of your profession. I'm a SQL Server/Database guy, not what people would classify as a "programmer" but what I can tell you is that studying for and passing the MCSD exams (which you can do) without having some programming under your belt, may not be your best choice if you plan on going into a programming job. I saw a quote somewhere and I'm sure most would find it corny but it said "Time is not money...Time is worth more". Putting the time in to learn a new area of computing is a valuable task, it all depends on how hungry you are. Certifications can make the difference between who gets the job and who doesn't so I don't recommend not taking the exams, quite the contrary, just don't allow those to be your sole keys to getting the next job. The ability to show a good attitude, teamwork ability and a strong work ethic will get you far. Not sure if this helps at all but good luck nonetheless!


    --
    Ray Higdon MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA
    ---
    "MJBrown" <> wrote in message news:...
    My situation currently (and this is long...):



    I have been in Helpdesk/Customer Support for about 6 years now and at a IT helpdesk (supported employees of AOL/Netscape) for the last 2 of those 6 years. I have a total of about 10 years experience in PC's and OS's. I have some experience in networking/system admin and alot of experience in PC Support for both hardware and software. I can build a system (very easy, I think), troubleshoot any PC (and Mac) issue and able to resolve said issue.



    I was thinking of going for MCSE certs but I have noticed that allot of those with MCSE certs are paid less (compared to programming) or just unemployed or is this the same on both sides of the fence? (Oh, also not counting the bad economy). There also seems to be allot of "paper" MCSE's that have really ruined the credibility of the MCSE cert and ruined its appeal to me. I also don't like helpdesk work anymore, I don't like talking to people on the phone and I would much rather deal with a computer and its issues then another person's issues with the computer.



    Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert to have something to show that I know what im doing. The issue is, I have no current experience in programming like I do in hardware/networking.



    I was wondering if I would be able to get the books, study for the tests and get the MCSD cert with no experience in the software programming side of things?



    Would I know enough to get at least an entry-level job doing something to get more experience?



    I was also wondering if there is an in between that would be good for my situation that delves into networking/system admin and programming?




    If I go for the change into programming, the MCSD.net splits the languages up into Visual Basic .net and Visual C# .net.



    I was wondering which of the two would be better for me to start out with taking into account that I would be learning from scratch?



    Would Java or J# be a good starting point and if so, which one or both?



    Would I or should I need to know the older programming languages (like C/C++, Java, ect) or can I just jump into C# .net or VB .net?



    Thanks for any advice



    Mike
    Ray Higdon, Nov 6, 2003
    #2
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  3. MJBrown

    MJBrown Guest

    Thanks, it did help. Basically what I have come to the conclusion is that I should stick to pursuing the current path I am in and another saying I am thinking of right now (the time and money one is good also by the way) is "don't bite off more then you can chew". I was becoming so focused on getting the highest of certs and also wanting to get my bachelors in CS in a year from now and I realized that I was just putting too much on myself to do it all at once all while holding down a full time job and of course the wife wants some attention too.

    Im gonna stick with the MCSA 2003 track and then see what that gets me. If that yields me a better job then Ill go for the rest to get MCSE. Also im learning that allot of certs are able to be applied to other certs like SQL for MCSE/MCSA counts towards MCDBA, MCAD and MCSD. Maybe ill study some programming languages on my own or in college and then see what happens from there.
    "Ray Higdon" <> wrote in message news:%...
    Mike, I feel your pain. I think a lot of people are in your situation and unfortunately there is no clear cut magic answer. But, there are universal attributes that you can push yourself to learn/attain/demonstrate that will put you in the top percentage of the job market regardless of your profession. I'm a SQL Server/Database guy, not what people would classify as a "programmer" but what I can tell you is that studying for and passing the MCSD exams (which you can do) without having some programming under your belt, may not be your best choice if you plan on going into a programming job. I saw a quote somewhere and I'm sure most would find it corny but it said "Time is not money...Time is worth more". Putting the time in to learn a new area of computing is a valuable task, it all depends on how hungry you are. Certifications can make the difference between who gets the job and who doesn't so I don't recommend not taking the exams, quite the contrary, just don't allow those to be your sole keys to getting the next job. The ability to show a good attitude, teamwork ability and a strong work ethic will get you far. Not sure if this helps at all but good luck nonetheless!


    --
    Ray Higdon MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA
    ---
    "MJBrown" <> wrote in message news:...
    My situation currently (and this is long...):



    I have been in Helpdesk/Customer Support for about 6 years now and at a IT helpdesk (supported employees of AOL/Netscape) for the last 2 of those 6 years. I have a total of about 10 years experience in PC's and OS's. I have some experience in networking/system admin and alot of experience in PC Support for both hardware and software. I can build a system (very easy, I think), troubleshoot any PC (and Mac) issue and able to resolve said issue.



    I was thinking of going for MCSE certs but I have noticed that allot of those with MCSE certs are paid less (compared to programming) or just unemployed or is this the same on both sides of the fence? (Oh, also not counting the bad economy). There also seems to be allot of "paper" MCSE's that have really ruined the credibility of the MCSE cert and ruined its appeal to me. I also don't like helpdesk work anymore, I don't like talking to people on the phone and I would much rather deal with a computer and its issues then another person's issues with the computer.



    Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert to have something to show that I know what im doing. The issue is, I have no current experience in programming like I do in hardware/networking.



    I was wondering if I would be able to get the books, study for the tests and get the MCSD cert with no experience in the software programming side of things?



    Would I know enough to get at least an entry-level job doing something to get more experience?



    I was also wondering if there is an in between that would be good for my situation that delves into networking/system admin and programming?




    If I go for the change into programming, the MCSD.net splits the languages up into Visual Basic .net and Visual C# .net.



    I was wondering which of the two would be better for me to start out with taking into account that I would be learning from scratch?



    Would Java or J# be a good starting point and if so, which one or both?



    Would I or should I need to know the older programming languages (like C/C++, Java, ect) or can I just jump into C# .net or VB .net?



    Thanks for any advice



    Mike
    MJBrown, Nov 6, 2003
    #3
  4. MJBrown

    Ray Higdon Guest

    That sounds like a good plan, especially the degree part, some IT folk concentrate very heavily on technical but fail to learn the business side of life, that is a tragic mistake. Knowing how businesses run, how you can improve efficiciencies, etc, complements a technical knowledge very well.

    GL

    --
    Ray Higdon MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA
    ---
    "MJBrown" <> wrote in message news:...
    Thanks, it did help. Basically what I have come to the conclusion is that I should stick to pursuing the current path I am in and another saying I am thinking of right now (the time and money one is good also by the way) is "don't bite off more then you can chew". I was becoming so focused on getting the highest of certs and also wanting to get my bachelors in CS in a year from now and I realized that I was just putting too much on myself to do it all at once all while holding down a full time job and of course the wife wants some attention too.

    Im gonna stick with the MCSA 2003 track and then see what that gets me. If that yields me a better job then Ill go for the rest to get MCSE. Also im learning that allot of certs are able to be applied to other certs like SQL for MCSE/MCSA counts towards MCDBA, MCAD and MCSD. Maybe ill study some programming languages on my own or in college and then see what happens from there.
    "Ray Higdon" <> wrote in message news:%...
    Mike, I feel your pain. I think a lot of people are in your situation and unfortunately there is no clear cut magic answer. But, there are universal attributes that you can push yourself to learn/attain/demonstrate that will put you in the top percentage of the job market regardless of your profession. I'm a SQL Server/Database guy, not what people would classify as a "programmer" but what I can tell you is that studying for and passing the MCSD exams (which you can do) without having some programming under your belt, may not be your best choice if you plan on going into a programming job. I saw a quote somewhere and I'm sure most would find it corny but it said "Time is not money...Time is worth more". Putting the time in to learn a new area of computing is a valuable task, it all depends on how hungry you are. Certifications can make the difference between who gets the job and who doesn't so I don't recommend not taking the exams, quite the contrary, just don't allow those to be your sole keys to getting the next job. The ability to show a good attitude, teamwork ability and a strong work ethic will get you far. Not sure if this helps at all but good luck nonetheless!


    --
    Ray Higdon MCSE, MCDBA, CCNA
    ---
    "MJBrown" <> wrote in message news:...
    My situation currently (and this is long...):



    I have been in Helpdesk/Customer Support for about 6 years now and at a IT helpdesk (supported employees of AOL/Netscape) for the last 2 of those 6 years. I have a total of about 10 years experience in PC's and OS's. I have some experience in networking/system admin and alot of experience in PC Support for both hardware and software. I can build a system (very easy, I think), troubleshoot any PC (and Mac) issue and able to resolve said issue.



    I was thinking of going for MCSE certs but I have noticed that allot of those with MCSE certs are paid less (compared to programming) or just unemployed or is this the same on both sides of the fence? (Oh, also not counting the bad economy). There also seems to be allot of "paper" MCSE's that have really ruined the credibility of the MCSE cert and ruined its appeal to me. I also don't like helpdesk work anymore, I don't like talking to people on the phone and I would much rather deal with a computer and its issues then another person's issues with the computer.



    Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert to have something to show that I know what im doing. The issue is, I have no current experience in programming like I do in hardware/networking.



    I was wondering if I would be able to get the books, study for the tests and get the MCSD cert with no experience in the software programming side of things?



    Would I know enough to get at least an entry-level job doing something to get more experience?



    I was also wondering if there is an in between that would be good for my situation that delves into networking/system admin and programming?




    If I go for the change into programming, the MCSD.net splits the languages up into Visual Basic .net and Visual C# .net.



    I was wondering which of the two would be better for me to start out with taking into account that I would be learning from scratch?



    Would Java or J# be a good starting point and if so, which one or both?



    Would I or should I need to know the older programming languages (like C/C++, Java, ect) or can I just jump into C# .net or VB .net?



    Thanks for any advice



    Mike
    Ray Higdon, Nov 6, 2003
    #4
  5. MJBrown

    chris Guest

    >Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of
    career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert
    to have something to show that I know what im doing. The
    issue is, I have no current experience in programming like
    I do in hardware/networking.


    Get a book and try some programming out first. I became
    an MCDBA a few years ago. I figured out quickly that
    programming just isnt for me. Ive been really bored lately
    because there isnt really enough DBA stuff for me to do.
    Im now starting to learn networking at home so I can
    increase my skills and values without having to program. I
    guess the point is to do what you enjoy. Ive found out
    lately that no amount of $$$ is worth my happiness. Im
    good programming for about 2 weeks before I start to go
    out of my mind. Its a different world then what you are
    used too so be sure you would like to make the switch.
    Good luck.



    >-----Original Message-----
    >My situation currently (and this is long...):
    >
    >
    >
    >I have been in Helpdesk/Customer Support for about 6

    years now and at a IT helpdesk (supported employees of
    AOL/Netscape) for the last 2 of those 6 years. I have a
    total of about 10 years experience in PC's and OS's. I
    have some experience in networking/system admin and alot
    of experience in PC Support for both hardware and
    software. I can build a system (very easy, I think),
    troubleshoot any PC (and Mac) issue and able to resolve
    said issue.
    >
    >
    >
    >I was thinking of going for MCSE certs but I have noticed

    that allot of those with MCSE certs are paid less
    (compared to programming) or just unemployed or is this
    the same on both sides of the fence? (Oh, also not
    counting the bad economy). There also seems to be allot
    of "paper" MCSE's that have really ruined the credibility
    of the MCSE cert and ruined its appeal to me. I also don't
    like helpdesk work anymore, I don't like talking to people
    on the phone and I would much rather deal with a computer
    and its issues then another person's issues with the
    computer.
    >
    >
    >
    >Because of this I was thinking of pursuing a change of

    career into programming and was looking at the MCSD cert
    to have something to show that I know what im doing. The
    issue is, I have no current experience in programming like
    I do in hardware/networking.
    >
    >
    >
    >I was wondering if I would be able to get the books,

    study for the tests and get the MCSD cert with no
    experience in the software programming side of things?
    >
    >
    >
    >Would I know enough to get at least an entry-level job

    doing something to get more experience?
    >
    >
    >
    >I was also wondering if there is an in between that would

    be good for my situation that delves into
    networking/system admin and programming?
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >If I go for the change into programming, the MCSD.net

    splits the languages up into Visual Basic .net and Visual
    C# .net.
    >
    >
    >
    >I was wondering which of the two would be better for me

    to start out with taking into account that I would be
    learning from scratch?
    >
    >
    >
    >Would Java or J# be a good starting point and if so,

    which one or both?
    >
    >
    >
    >Would I or should I need to know the older programming

    languages (like C/C++, Java, ect) or can I just jump into
    C# .net or VB .net?
    >
    >
    >
    >Thanks for any advice
    >
    >
    >
    >Mike
    >
    chris, Nov 6, 2003
    #5
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