Multi-site, global deployment of VoIP - Qs

Discussion in 'VOIP' started by Papi, Aug 6, 2004.

  1. Papi

    Papi Guest

    Like any other good "netizen" - once I got my new assignment, I have
    started "poking around" various information resources:voip-info.org,
    reading this group, etc. The time came - though - when - despite all the
    information I have stumbled upon, so far, I need to bug you with some
    questions/thoughts:

    First teh setup - I am responsible for a global network, with LANs in
    various countries in the world, with the majority of connections happening
    over site-to-site VPNs, managed by my group (i.e. no QoS, but "fat" pipes
    .... I know, I know - latency is here important - but I can tell you that
    none of my existing links has had higher latency than the previously used
    WAN/dedicated connetions (FRs, T1s, etc.))

    Second - the LANs are - in the majority of cases - old technology - so I
    will be reaping those apart, probably. Inside those I have good telephony
    infrastructure, with - mostly - Nortel gear (thus hard to justify taking
    those out, for the IP Telephony - in fact this may be a question on its
    own ...)

    And now the Qs:

    - has anybody deployed successfully VoIP over site-to-site VPNs? If so -
    what type of devices/solutions?
    - in regards to IPTelephony - I am being pushed to go with the Cisco
    "suite" - Call Manager annd such. I have recently had a horrible
    experience with the Express version (calls stumbling on each other,
    voice messages showing up days later, etc.), but I was told that it was
    because of the (im)maturity level of Express, vs. the very robust CM 4.0
    that I should be using. Is this correct?
    - what solutions (links) would you recommend for a global/multi-site
    architecture(s)?
    - for the infrastructure - I am thinking 3750s, in conjunction with 2950s
    for small sites, and 65xx and 4xxx for bigger ones (multi-layered). Any
    advise in this regard?
    - though in charge with a group of geeks, and having deployed many other
    things on our own, before, I am afraid I may have to go with consulting
    from experienced people this time ... it's just that my Cisco acct rep's
    statement gives me shivers about "plug-and-play" Cisco VoIP solutions ;)
    Would this be a correct approach (though more costly, of course), or would
    you think we'll "figure it out"?

    I would definitely appreciate first hand experience sharing, and I will
    try to summarize - in the end - your replies.

    TIA,
    Papi
    Papi, Aug 6, 2004
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Papi

    Jay Wagener Guest

    Probably the best thing you can do is go to some of the major dealers'
    websites and see what they have to offer. Some like NEC, Cisco, Nortel all
    have excellent solutions. To answer some of your questions/concerns: QoS
    is almost as important as latency if not more, so you may want to implement
    some sort of QoS. Doing a Point to Multipoint VoIP solution is possible
    with VPN's in fact is it encouraged. If you limit the traffic on the
    network such as the Internet Cloud traffic it will improve your quality,
    thus VPN's are great for that. I have personally installed NEC VoIP
    solutions over VPN's that were poorly setup and have not had any problems.
    Your switches and router selection is good (Layer 2/3). IP Telephony is a
    field that has drastically improved over the last year or so. There are
    programs that run in the "background and pop up when you receive a message
    or phone call and then allows you to route the call in whatever way you
    need. There are also those that integrate with Outlook and notify you when
    a new message arrives. Cisco is not the only solution, it is a good one,
    but there are others that are more economical and just as efficient if not
    more. Hope this helps.
    "Papi" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > Like any other good "netizen" - once I got my new assignment, I have
    > started "poking around" various information resources:voip-info.org,
    > reading this group, etc. The time came - though - when - despite all the
    > information I have stumbled upon, so far, I need to bug you with some
    > questions/thoughts:
    >
    > First teh setup - I am responsible for a global network, with LANs in
    > various countries in the world, with the majority of connections happening
    > over site-to-site VPNs, managed by my group (i.e. no QoS, but "fat" pipes
    > ... I know, I know - latency is here important - but I can tell you that
    > none of my existing links has had higher latency than the previously used
    > WAN/dedicated connetions (FRs, T1s, etc.))
    >
    > Second - the LANs are - in the majority of cases - old technology - so I
    > will be reaping those apart, probably. Inside those I have good telephony
    > infrastructure, with - mostly - Nortel gear (thus hard to justify taking
    > those out, for the IP Telephony - in fact this may be a question on its
    > own ...)
    >
    > And now the Qs:
    >
    > - has anybody deployed successfully VoIP over site-to-site VPNs? If so -
    > what type of devices/solutions?
    > - in regards to IPTelephony - I am being pushed to go with the Cisco
    > "suite" - Call Manager annd such. I have recently had a horrible
    > experience with the Express version (calls stumbling on each other,
    > voice messages showing up days later, etc.), but I was told that it was
    > because of the (im)maturity level of Express, vs. the very robust CM 4.0
    > that I should be using. Is this correct?
    > - what solutions (links) would you recommend for a global/multi-site
    > architecture(s)?
    > - for the infrastructure - I am thinking 3750s, in conjunction with 2950s
    > for small sites, and 65xx and 4xxx for bigger ones (multi-layered). Any
    > advise in this regard?
    > - though in charge with a group of geeks, and having deployed many other
    > things on our own, before, I am afraid I may have to go with consulting
    > from experienced people this time ... it's just that my Cisco acct rep's
    > statement gives me shivers about "plug-and-play" Cisco VoIP solutions ;)
    > Would this be a correct approach (though more costly, of course), or would
    > you think we'll "figure it out"?
    >
    > I would definitely appreciate first hand experience sharing, and I will
    > try to summarize - in the end - your replies.
    >
    > TIA,
    > Papi
    Jay Wagener, Aug 10, 2004
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Papi

    Adie Guest

    Papi wrote:

    > - has anybody deployed successfully VoIP over site-to-site VPNs? If so -
    > what type of devices/solutions?


    Ive set VOIP up over the public Internet using VPN, it works extremely well
    between the UK, USA and United Arab Emirates, India will be online in a few
    months.

    Ive managed to cut phone bills by 50% using the Avaya IP Office, a few VPN
    concentrators and IP phones. We also now have the ability to "break out" at
    each site, allowing for local call rates into the countries with the
    systems.

    Mind you our setup wouldn't cope with anymore than 10 concurrent users --
    doesnt need to -- but that's more down to the VPN routers being used rather
    than the Avaya IPO.

    The boss loves it.
    Adie, Aug 10, 2004
    #3
  4. Rather than ripping out all of your old telcom gear, have you thought about
    just plugging in some VOIP gateways between the PSTN and your PBX. As a
    small business user, I've been looking at Multitech and the Sipura SPA-3000
    boxes, which look like they might do a great job (the SPA-3000 is only
    $120).

    I don't know what's available for larger users, but something similar could
    save you a huge amount of money for replacing your existing phone systems.

    Mike Schumann

    "Papi" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > Like any other good "netizen" - once I got my new assignment, I have
    > started "poking around" various information resources:voip-info.org,
    > reading this group, etc. The time came - though - when - despite all the
    > information I have stumbled upon, so far, I need to bug you with some
    > questions/thoughts:
    >
    > First teh setup - I am responsible for a global network, with LANs in
    > various countries in the world, with the majority of connections happening
    > over site-to-site VPNs, managed by my group (i.e. no QoS, but "fat" pipes
    > ... I know, I know - latency is here important - but I can tell you that
    > none of my existing links has had higher latency than the previously used
    > WAN/dedicated connetions (FRs, T1s, etc.))
    >
    > Second - the LANs are - in the majority of cases - old technology - so I
    > will be reaping those apart, probably. Inside those I have good telephony
    > infrastructure, with - mostly - Nortel gear (thus hard to justify taking
    > those out, for the IP Telephony - in fact this may be a question on its
    > own ...)
    >
    > And now the Qs:
    >
    > - has anybody deployed successfully VoIP over site-to-site VPNs? If so -
    > what type of devices/solutions?
    > - in regards to IPTelephony - I am being pushed to go with the Cisco
    > "suite" - Call Manager annd such. I have recently had a horrible
    > experience with the Express version (calls stumbling on each other,
    > voice messages showing up days later, etc.), but I was told that it was
    > because of the (im)maturity level of Express, vs. the very robust CM 4.0
    > that I should be using. Is this correct?
    > - what solutions (links) would you recommend for a global/multi-site
    > architecture(s)?
    > - for the infrastructure - I am thinking 3750s, in conjunction with 2950s
    > for small sites, and 65xx and 4xxx for bigger ones (multi-layered). Any
    > advise in this regard?
    > - though in charge with a group of geeks, and having deployed many other
    > things on our own, before, I am afraid I may have to go with consulting
    > from experienced people this time ... it's just that my Cisco acct rep's
    > statement gives me shivers about "plug-and-play" Cisco VoIP solutions ;)
    > Would this be a correct approach (though more costly, of course), or would
    > you think we'll "figure it out"?
    >
    > I would definitely appreciate first hand experience sharing, and I will
    > try to summarize - in the end - your replies.
    >
    > TIA,
    > Papi
    Mike Schumann, Sep 19, 2004
    #4
  5. Papi

    RC Guest

    Cisco router/gateways work great with Nortel PBX, do it all the time. I
    don't know what you're using for VPN but at the very least make sure you
    have QoS up to the VPN device. After that it's all internet so their isn't
    much more you can do.

    Do some basic round trip latency tests (simple ping) through the VPN
    tunnels. If it varies greatly you will have quality problems known as
    Jitter, this can be dealt with to a point. If the latency is over 100ms you
    might have quality issue but it's very subjective. What kind of calling will
    it be? Office to office, or customer to sales rep? Internal company
    communication don't have to be as good as outside calls. If the latency gets
    over 250ms you're in trouble.

    "Mike Schumann" <> wrote in message
    news:414dbefb$0$432$...
    > Rather than ripping out all of your old telcom gear, have you thought

    about
    > just plugging in some VOIP gateways between the PSTN and your PBX. As a
    > small business user, I've been looking at Multitech and the Sipura

    SPA-3000
    > boxes, which look like they might do a great job (the SPA-3000 is only
    > $120).
    >
    > I don't know what's available for larger users, but something similar

    could
    > save you a huge amount of money for replacing your existing phone systems.
    >
    > Mike Schumann
    >
    > "Papi" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    > > Like any other good "netizen" - once I got my new assignment, I have
    > > started "poking around" various information resources:voip-info.org,
    > > reading this group, etc. The time came - though - when - despite all the
    > > information I have stumbled upon, so far, I need to bug you with some
    > > questions/thoughts:
    > >
    > > First teh setup - I am responsible for a global network, with LANs in
    > > various countries in the world, with the majority of connections

    happening
    > > over site-to-site VPNs, managed by my group (i.e. no QoS, but "fat"

    pipes
    > > ... I know, I know - latency is here important - but I can tell you that
    > > none of my existing links has had higher latency than the previously

    used
    > > WAN/dedicated connetions (FRs, T1s, etc.))
    > >
    > > Second - the LANs are - in the majority of cases - old technology - so I
    > > will be reaping those apart, probably. Inside those I have good

    telephony
    > > infrastructure, with - mostly - Nortel gear (thus hard to justify taking
    > > those out, for the IP Telephony - in fact this may be a question on its
    > > own ...)
    > >
    > > And now the Qs:
    > >
    > > - has anybody deployed successfully VoIP over site-to-site VPNs? If so -
    > > what type of devices/solutions?
    > > - in regards to IPTelephony - I am being pushed to go with the Cisco
    > > "suite" - Call Manager annd such. I have recently had a horrible
    > > experience with the Express version (calls stumbling on each other,
    > > voice messages showing up days later, etc.), but I was told that it was
    > > because of the (im)maturity level of Express, vs. the very robust CM 4.0
    > > that I should be using. Is this correct?
    > > - what solutions (links) would you recommend for a global/multi-site
    > > architecture(s)?
    > > - for the infrastructure - I am thinking 3750s, in conjunction with

    2950s
    > > for small sites, and 65xx and 4xxx for bigger ones (multi-layered). Any
    > > advise in this regard?
    > > - though in charge with a group of geeks, and having deployed many other
    > > things on our own, before, I am afraid I may have to go with consulting
    > > from experienced people this time ... it's just that my Cisco acct rep's
    > > statement gives me shivers about "plug-and-play" Cisco VoIP solutions ;)
    > > Would this be a correct approach (though more costly, of course), or

    would
    > > you think we'll "figure it out"?
    > >
    > > I would definitely appreciate first hand experience sharing, and I will
    > > try to summarize - in the end - your replies.
    > >
    > > TIA,
    > > Papi

    >
    >
    RC, Sep 30, 2004
    #5
  6. Papi

    Hank Karl Guest

    On Wed, 29 Sep 2004 19:06:15 -0400, "RC" <> wrote:
    >
    >Do some basic round trip latency tests (simple ping) through the VPN
    >tunnels. If it varies greatly you will have quality problems known as
    >Jitter, this can be dealt with to a point. If the latency is over 100ms you
    >might have quality issue but it's very subjective. What kind of calling will
    >it be? Office to office, or customer to sales rep? Internal company
    >communication don't have to be as good as outside calls. If the latency gets
    >over 250ms you're in trouble.
    >

    Pings are better than nothing, but there's a lot more to voice quality
    than simple jitter and latency. See www.voiptroubleshooter.com for
    more info.

    Rather than doing a ping, you can use www.testyourvoip.com to get an
    idea of what the line quality is on each link. However, quality can
    change because of network loading. Note that time of day and day of
    week can affect network loading, especially in a global situation.

    If you've got the budget, get a VoIP analyzer or two and some probes.
    The VoIP Troubleshooter website has a listing of these devices under
    "Tools and Resources"
    Hank Karl, Sep 30, 2004
    #6
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. thrill5
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    846
    stephen
    Mar 26, 2005
  2. Replies:
    0
    Views:
    754
  3. Replies:
    2
    Views:
    701
    Ivor Jones
    Mar 22, 2006
  4. Hoffa
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    673
    Hoffa
    Oct 25, 2006
  5. Hoffa
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    1,425
    Walter Roberson
    Oct 25, 2006
Loading...

Share This Page