Mother Boards maker, what a Con..

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Big Cat@parxxx.net.nz, Sep 22, 2003.

  1. Big

    Big Guest

    Why can't Mobo makers list what comes in the Box..

    So far the Ausus P4P800 does not have support for the 8 USB connectors Only
    4 are supported, no socket plate for the other 4, and this is a very dear
    board for what you get.


    The Gigabyte GA-8IK1100 has IEEE 1394 Firewire Interface, but it can't be
    used, as no sockets are provided..


    Abit IS7-E can't dnload a manual for it, links are dead..

    Asus P4P800, Morningstar pic of this board is a P4C800..



    The Only way to find out some of these things are by reviews, but they are
    hard to come by, and then they only review the Full board and not the budget
    version, plus Rev level or board and bios version is not always listed..

    Magazine reviews are just a big waste of time, they never go into overclocking
    do not tell you what is in the box and mostly just quote what is on the web
    site..


    So I am still looking for a reasonable priced budget i865PE/i875P mobo, and
    must have 6 USB ports (supported) and a Lan..

    And Why to they waste money in fitting Crap sound stuff, their are No decent
    Intel mobos with a good sound system that does not load the CPU..
     
    Big , Sep 22, 2003
    #1
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  2. Big

    Dogg Guest

    On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:34:52 GMT, (Steve Robertson)
    wrote:

    <snip>
    >Why do we need to keep the box??


    So they can sell it to some sucker?
     
    Dogg, Sep 22, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Big

    Dave Guest

    On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 08:29:58 +1200, Dogg wrote:

    > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:34:52 GMT, (Steve Robertson)
    > wrote:
    >
    > <snip>
    >>Why do we need to keep the box??

    >
    > So they can sell it to some sucker?



    Yes, quite possibly, last year, my MSI motherboard died (faulty capacitors
    :-( ). Any way I ordered a Soltek 75KAV as a replacment, what I ended up
    receiving was an ex serviced motherboard, with such an old revision that
    it couldn't take an Athlon XP CPU, it took me another three weeks to end
    up getting the board I should of got, unfortuantley I were stuck with
    getting a SDRAM board, as I couldn't afford new DDR RAM at the time. But
    this case would make me avoid MSI, Soltek, and the retailer I purchased my
    board from.
     
    Dave, Sep 23, 2003
    #3
  4. Big

    T-Boy Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > On Tue, 23 Sep 2003 08:29:58 +1200, Dogg wrote:
    >
    > > On Mon, 22 Sep 2003 07:34:52 GMT, (Steve Robertson)
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > > <snip>
    > >>Why do we need to keep the box??

    > >
    > > So they can sell it to some sucker?

    >
    >
    > Yes, quite possibly, last year, my MSI motherboard died (faulty capacitors
    > :-( ). Any way I ordered a Soltek 75KAV as a replacment, what I ended up
    > receiving was an ex serviced motherboard, with such an old revision that
    > it couldn't take an Athlon XP CPU, it took me another three weeks to end
    > up getting the board I should of got, unfortuantley I were stuck with
    > getting a SDRAM board, as I couldn't afford new DDR RAM at the time. But
    > this case would make me avoid MSI, Soltek, and the retailer I purchased my
    > board from.


    Well at least the retailer Dave - Soltek and Asus are the best
    mobos out there, IMO - (I like some of the Gigabyte boards
    too).

    You run similarly spec'd mobos from Soltek or Asus against say
    MSI - and I dunno - they just go a lot faster.

    --
    Duncan
     
    T-Boy, Sep 23, 2003
    #4
  5. If you are looking at P4 boards I can recommend the Gigabyte GA-8KNXP. I was
    quite surprised that it came with all the connectors that are listed as
    optional in the manual and that I didn't expect to be included.

    I was originally going to get the Asus (P4P800 I think), but the suppliers
    didn't have the particular revision of the board I insisted on that used CSA
    (The morons originally claimed they did... I definitely did not want the
    version without it).

    The Other Guy

    <Big > wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    >
    >
    > Why can't Mobo makers list what comes in the Box..
    >
    > So far the Ausus P4P800 does not have support for the 8 USB connectors

    Only
    > 4 are supported, no socket plate for the other 4, and this is a very dear
    > board for what you get.
    >
    >
    > The Gigabyte GA-8IK1100 has IEEE 1394 Firewire Interface, but it can't

    be
    > used, as no sockets are provided..
    >
    >
    > Abit IS7-E can't dnload a manual for it, links are dead..
    >
    > Asus P4P800, Morningstar pic of this board is a P4C800..
    >
    >
    >
    > The Only way to find out some of these things are by reviews, but they are
    > hard to come by, and then they only review the Full board and not the

    budget
    > version, plus Rev level or board and bios version is not always listed..
    >
    > Magazine reviews are just a big waste of time, they never go into

    overclocking
    > do not tell you what is in the box and mostly just quote what is on the

    web
    > site..
    >
    >
    > So I am still looking for a reasonable priced budget i865PE/i875P mobo,

    and
    > must have 6 USB ports (supported) and a Lan..
    >
    > And Why to they waste money in fitting Crap sound stuff, their are No

    decent
    > Intel mobos with a good sound system that does not load the CPU..
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
     
    The Other Guy, Sep 23, 2003
    #5
  6. Big

    Paul Guest

    Well ASUS, does list what's in the
    box. Its in the manual for the P4P800.

    I use a P4P800 mobo here (non-deluxe).

    I got this for $219+GST, which isnt too bad.

    The deluxe is 300 and something I think.

    But have chucked a PCI firewire card into
    it. So, it has eveything the deluxe has
    except raid 1. (BUT I have no need for
    RAID 0 or 1) at the mo.

    As u said there's 4 on the back (USB)
    and 4 inside. Its easy enough
    to buy the USB bracket, and chuck it
    on the outside.

    I think most mobo makers assume u
    know it all and are making a PC up
    when u buy a mobo. And they also
    assume you have a case with
    front USB ports on it. Which will make
    it easier for you to hook one of the internal
    USB connections, to the front USB on the
    case.

    Well, most mobo makers, try and
    limit what they put in the box. Otherwise,
    it would cost too much to buy the mobo
    you're after.Most of them also come with
    the main items you need, in order to make
    the thing to work!

    With the P4P800, you get

    The CD, 2 sata cables, ide cables the floppy
    cable, jumpers, user guide, ref card, and instant
    music keyboard label. (You can play
    CD's w/o Windows).

    I'm quite happy with this mobo. ATM, it's
    running a 2.4 800 mhz cpu, with HT, a 80 gb
    ide, a 120 sata, the 6 channel sound, built in
    gigabyte LAN. A 52x burner and a 16x DVD.
    ,
    I like the EZ flash option on this.

    Saves me formatting a disk, when
    or if I want to update the BIOS. You
    just chuck the disk with the updated BIOS in,
    press ALT-F2 I think it is, and it flashes/reboots!



    <Big > wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    >
    >
    > Why can't Mobo makers list what comes in the Box..
    >
    > So far the Ausus P4P800 does not have support for the 8 USB connectors

    Only
    > 4 are supported, no socket plate for the other 4, and this is a very dear
    > board for what you get.
    >
    >
    > The Gigabyte GA-8IK1100 has IEEE 1394 Firewire Interface, but it can't

    be
    > used, as no sockets are provided..
    >
    >
    > Abit IS7-E can't dnload a manual for it, links are dead..
    >
    > Asus P4P800, Morningstar pic of this board is a P4C800..
    >
    >
    >
    > The Only way to find out some of these things are by reviews, but they are
    > hard to come by, and then they only review the Full board and not the

    budget
    > version, plus Rev level or board and bios version is not always listed..
    >
    > Magazine reviews are just a big waste of time, they never go into

    overclocking
    > do not tell you what is in the box and mostly just quote what is on the

    web
    > site..
    >
    >
    > So I am still looking for a reasonable priced budget i865PE/i875P mobo,

    and
    > must have 6 USB ports (supported) and a Lan..
    >
    > And Why to they waste money in fitting Crap sound stuff, their are No

    decent
    > Intel mobos with a good sound system that does not load the CPU..
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >
     
    Paul, Sep 28, 2003
    #6
  7. > As u said there's 4 on the back (USB)
    > and 4 inside. Its easy enough
    > to buy the USB bracket, and chuck it
    > on the outside.


    Also intenal USB things connect to those headers like compact flash card readers
    and some other drive bay niceitys like LCDs.

    > Well, most mobo makers, try and
    > limit what they put in the box. Otherwise,
    > it would cost too much to buy the mobo
    > you're after.Most of them also come with
    > the main items you need, in order to make
    > the thing to work!


    I hate it when they give you a PCI bracket for usefull things like firewire, and
    still waste space on the ATX panel with things like the serial and parallel
    ports. Would be much better the other way since most cases have a thing you can
    punch out to hold the 9 and 25 pin D connectors so as to not waste a slot. One
    board I got came with 3 additional brackets - 1 was USB so I didnt use it, but
    the firewire and 2 extra audio plugs, and the spdif were on attitional brakets.
    leads not long enough to reach the lower slots.

    > Saves me formatting a disk, when
    > or if I want to update the BIOS. You
    > just chuck the disk with the updated BIOS in,
    > press ALT-F2 I think it is, and it flashes/reboots!


    Still needs a floppy drive.

    I see seagate have finally made a bootable cd image for seatools on there site,
    wonder if we will see mo-bo vendors do the same for bioses anytime soon.
     
    Richard Malcolm-Smith, Sep 28, 2003
    #7
  8. Big

    Paul Guest

    Well true, BUT EZ flash would also work with
    a USB flashdrive if it /your BIOS
    supports booting from it.

    I think this mobo supports USB boot.

    So, if it does work, u can biff the disk drive.
    And just plug in the flashdrive/prodrive
    when needed. That would be the only
    reason I would use a floppy. For BIOS
    updates. Other than that, I move files
    between the PC's here thru a network
    or just copy them to CDR.

    Altho the P4P800 doesnt come with
    a gameport or comport 2 on the
    outside, that's pretty easy to fix up too.

    I just screwed it to the back of the case
    since the case has a cutoff for it. I dont
    really need com 2. I dont even use com 1!

    I would like to get of these LCD things
    BUT they're not that common in NZ.

    There is one @ Dick Smith, which u
    can use, which has the LCD/Temp, and u can
    connect your fans to it, so it can keep
    track of the speeds etc. BUT not really
    anything else that has USB/Firewire/sockets,
    so u can connect it to a spare bay in the front
    of the case. To save u using brackets




    "Richard Malcolm-Smith" <> wrote in message
    news:bl5c8s$2a0$...
    > > As u said there's 4 on the back (USB)
    > > and 4 inside. Its easy enough
    > > to buy the USB bracket, and chuck it
    > > on the outside.

    >
    > Also intenal USB things connect to those headers like compact flash card

    readers
    > and some other drive bay niceitys like LCDs.
    >
    > > Well, most mobo makers, try and
    > > limit what they put in the box. Otherwise,
    > > it would cost too much to buy the mobo
    > > you're after.Most of them also come with
    > > the main items you need, in order to make
    > > the thing to work!

    >
    > I hate it when they give you a PCI bracket for usefull things like

    firewire, and
    > still waste space on the ATX panel with things like the serial and

    parallel
    > ports. Would be much better the other way since most cases have a thing

    you can
    > punch out to hold the 9 and 25 pin D connectors so as to not waste a slot.

    One
    > board I got came with 3 additional brackets - 1 was USB so I didnt use it,

    but
    > the firewire and 2 extra audio plugs, and the spdif were on attitional

    brakets.
    > leads not long enough to reach the lower slots.
    >
    > > Saves me formatting a disk, when
    > > or if I want to update the BIOS. You
    > > just chuck the disk with the updated BIOS in,
    > > press ALT-F2 I think it is, and it flashes/reboots!

    >
    > Still needs a floppy drive.




    >
    > I see seagate have finally made a bootable cd image for seatools on there

    site,
    > wonder if we will see mo-bo vendors do the same for bioses anytime soon.
    >
     
    Paul, Sep 28, 2003
    #8
  9. Paul wrote:
    > Well true, BUT EZ flash would also work with
    > a USB flashdrive if it /your BIOS
    > supports booting from it.


    Then you have to have an operating system to put on it that the bios flasher
    will run from. I dont know if freedos will work or not.

    > I think this mobo supports USB boot.
    >
    > So, if it does work, u can biff the disk drive.
    > And just plug in the flashdrive/prodrive
    > when needed. That would be the only
    > reason I would use a floppy. For BIOS
    > updates. Other than that, I move files
    > between the PC's here thru a network
    > or just copy them to CDR.


    Exactly why I have no FDD, Cases with the moulded part for a floppy piss me off.
    I have one in that computer because otherwise its an empty hole.

    > Altho the P4P800 doesnt come with
    > a gameport or comport 2 on the
    >> outside, that's pretty easy to fix up too.


    > I just screwed it to the back of the case
    > since the case has a cutoff for it. I dont
    > really need com 2. I dont even use com 1!


    Those ones are because cases have the cutouts for them, but USB and firewire and
    audio ports are a different matter. They can only go on the PCI backplate they
    supply, and with only 7 slots its wasting them when they can be used for cards.

    > I would like to get of these LCD things
    > BUT they're not that common in NZ.


    > There is one @ Dick Smith, which u
    > can use, which has the LCD/Temp, and u can
    > connect your fans to it, so it can keep
    > track of the speeds etc.


    Get them online. The dse one is a cut down digidoc, only supporting 4 channels.
    It doesnt interface to the PC at all. I want something like that which
    motherboard monitor can read from as well. Maybe adjust too.

    > BUT not really
    > anything else that has USB/Firewire/sockets,
    > so u can connect it to a spare bay in the front
    > of the case. To save u using brackets


    I have seen USB passthru on some HDD bay coolers too, but I already have more
    USBs on the front then I know what to do with. If anything else has some I will
    need a hub inside to run them all.
     
    Richard Malcolm-Smith, Sep 28, 2003
    #9
  10. Big

    Big Guest

    On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:40:35 +1200, "Paul" <> wrote:

    >Well ASUS, does list what's in the
    >box. Its in the manual for the P4P800.
    >
    >I use a P4P800 mobo here (non-deluxe).
    >
    >I got this for $219+GST, which isnt too bad.




    Who Sells them at that price, Also was it a Rev 2 MoBo..?
     
    Big , Sep 28, 2003
    #10
  11. Big

    Paul Guest

    Well not necessarily Rich. Come to
    think of it, it wouldnt need DOS
    either. Since the BIOS (as part of EZ
    flash) already has AFUDOS or something
    built in. Just as long as the BIOS/EZ flash
    detects the USB prodrive, it'll load whats on it
    (EZ flash searches for a particular file
    ( P4P800.rom on a floppy), so just
    as long as u name the rom this on the
    USB device, (which is what u haveta name
    it anyway), it will find P4P800.rom,
    flash the BIOS and reboot).

    Well, yer I would get something like a LCD
    display online if I had a credit card! Which I haven't
    got. I did have an Ipanel, BUT that'll only
    work on this PC, (the other 2 PC's dont
    have the conections onboard), and ummm
    the only good thing bout it was the front
    USB/Comport, and display. And sound/mic
    inputs. Other than that, it sucked lol.

    And an Ipanel tends to bring up temp errors
    on startup. And also made songs etc skip
    if u enabled it so it updated the temps
    every 30 or so seconds. I spose I could
    make my own cutouts lol on a front
    5 1/4, or spare 3 1/2 panel, get the right
    plugs etc and wire them up. It shouldnt
    be that hard!











    "Richard Malcolm-Smith" <> wrote in message
    news:bl5e8r$3qj$...
    > Paul wrote:
    > > Well true, BUT EZ flash would also work with
    > > a USB flashdrive if it /your BIOS
    > > supports booting from it.

    >
    > Then you have to have an operating system to put on it that the bios

    flasher
    > will run from. I dont know if freedos will work or not.
    >
    > > I think this mobo supports USB boot.
    > >
    > > So, if it does work, u can biff the disk drive.
    > > And just plug in the flashdrive/prodrive
    > > when needed. That would be the only
    > > reason I would use a floppy. For BIOS
    > > updates. Other than that, I move files
    > > between the PC's here thru a network
    > > or just copy them to CDR.

    >
    > Exactly why I have no FDD, Cases with the moulded part for a floppy piss

    me off.
    > I have one in that computer because otherwise its an empty hole.
    >
    > > Altho the P4P800 doesnt come with
    > > a gameport or comport 2 on the
    > >> outside, that's pretty easy to fix up too.

    >
    > > I just screwed it to the back of the case
    > > since the case has a cutoff for it. I dont
    > > really need com 2. I dont even use com 1!

    >
    > Those ones are because cases have the cutouts for them, but USB and

    firewire and
    > audio ports are a different matter. They can only go on the PCI backplate

    they
    > supply, and with only 7 slots its wasting them when they can be used for

    cards.
    >
    > > I would like to get of these LCD things
    > > BUT they're not that common in NZ.

    >
    > > There is one @ Dick Smith, which u
    > > can use, which has the LCD/Temp, and u can
    > > connect your fans to it, so it can keep
    > > track of the speeds etc.

    >
    > Get them online. The dse one is a cut down digidoc, only supporting 4

    channels.
    > It doesnt interface to the PC at all. I want something like that which
    > motherboard monitor can read from as well. Maybe adjust too.
    >
    > > BUT not really
    > > anything else that has USB/Firewire/sockets,
    > > so u can connect it to a spare bay in the front
    > > of the case. To save u using brackets

    >
    > I have seen USB passthru on some HDD bay coolers too, but I already have

    more
    > USBs on the front then I know what to do with. If anything else has some I

    will
    > need a hub inside to run them all.
    >
     
    Paul, Sep 28, 2003
    #11
  12. Big

    Paul Guest

    Nah it isn't rev 2. I dont think there are
    any in NZ. The Rev is only a number.

    I dont think it'll make any difference.

    I think the rev I have is 1.02. Umm
    there's a shop up here in Auckland on
    Symonds St called Ezone. Run by a chinese
    guy. Looks like its gone up to 229+ GST
    (257 inc GST).


    http://www.e-zone.co.nz is the addy.






    <Big > wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:40:35 +1200, "Paul" <> wrote:
    >
    > >Well ASUS, does list what's in the
    > >box. Its in the manual for the P4P800.
    > >
    > >I use a P4P800 mobo here (non-deluxe).
    > >
    > >I got this for $219+GST, which isnt too bad.

    >
    >
    >
    > Who Sells them at that price, Also was it a Rev 2 MoBo..?
    >
    >
     
    Paul, Sep 28, 2003
    #12
  13. On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 12:40:35 +1200, Paul wrote:

    > Well ASUS, does list what's in the
    > box. Its in the manual for the P4P800.


    The problem with ASUS boards in NZ is that the main importer only brings
    in a very limited range - almost exclusively what they use themselves for
    assembling whiteboxes - and invariably bring in the bottom line board
    _only_ of any conbination setup .

    I went through this a couple of years ago trying to order an all-in-one
    board. Ordered it based on the ASUS website spec, only to find that the
    version supplied had NO sound, NO onboard video, NO onboard LAN and only 2
    USB ports instead of the 6 specified.

    They wouldn't take it back either.
     
    Uncle StoatWarbler, Sep 28, 2003
    #13
  14. On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:09:37 +1200, Richard Malcolm-Smith wrote:

    > I see seagate have finally made a bootable cd image for seatools on there site,
    > wonder if we will see mo-bo vendors do the same for bioses anytime soon.


    As a workaround, burn yourself a FreeDOS CD.

    These work fine for bios updates. I use it for that quite a bit.
     
    Uncle StoatWarbler, Sep 28, 2003
    #14
  15. On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:43:54 +1200, Richard Malcolm-Smith wrote:

    > Exactly why I have no FDD, Cases with the moulded part for a floppy piss
    > me off. I have one in that computer because otherwise its an empty hole.


    There are several multibay setups which will go in the floppy hole.

    ie: CF + PCMCIA + SDmedia + infrared, etc.

    Quite handy if you have any devices which used these methods for file
    storage...
     
    Uncle StoatWarbler, Sep 28, 2003
    #15
  16. On Sun, 28 Sep 2003 13:43:54 +1200, Richard Malcolm-Smith wrote:

    > Get them online. The dse one is a cut down digidoc, only supporting 4
    > channels. It doesnt interface to the PC at all. I want something like
    > that which motherboard monitor can read from as well. Maybe adjust too.


    Have you seen the ASUS iPanel?

    It's nice, but rather expensive.
     
    Uncle StoatWarbler, Sep 28, 2003
    #16
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