Microsoft: Following the money

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Roger_Nickel, Jun 30, 2005.

  1. Roger_Nickel

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-

    http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html

    "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of influence.
    We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple paths on which we can
    travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft has paved it with money...."
    Roger_Nickel, Jun 30, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Roger_Nickel

    Mark Remfrey Guest

    Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >
    > http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >
    > "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    > influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    > paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    > has paved it with money...."


    Yeah, so what you are saying is that companies should really be making
    stuff that nobody really has a need for?

    Come on, you have a business, you identify where you can develop a
    product that can fit a need, and you go for it.

    Regards,
    Mark Remfrey
    Mark Remfrey, Jun 30, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Hi there,

    Mark Remfrey wrote:
    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >
    >> For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >>
    >> http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >>
    >> "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >> influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >> paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take,
    >> Microsoft has paved it with money...."

    >
    >
    > Yeah, so what you are saying is that companies should really be making
    > stuff that nobody really has a need for?
    >
    > Come on, you have a business, you identify where you can develop a
    > product that can fit a need, and you go for it.


    Yes, but don't spend all your money trying to stifle your perceived
    opposition out of the market, because that will come back and bite
    you in the bum...

    Opposition has a right to be there, but MS aren't happy with that.
    They're trying to squash every little insect of a company that they
    cannot make some deal with, to the detriment of freedom of choice...

    --
    Kind regards,

    Chris Wilkinson, Brisbane, Australia.
    Anyone wishing to email me directly can remove the obvious
    spamblocker, and replace it with t p g <dot> c o m <dot> a u

    Software patents are killing YOUR freedom, STOP THEM NOW!
    http://swpat.ffii.org/ http://nosoftwarepatents.com/
    Chris Wilkinson, Jul 1, 2005
    #3
  4. Roger_Nickel

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    Mark Remfrey wrote:
    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >
    >> For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >>
    >> http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >>
    >> "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >> influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >> paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take,
    >> Microsoft has paved it with money...."

    >
    >
    > Yeah, so what you are saying is that companies should really be making
    > stuff that nobody really has a need for?
    >
    > Come on, you have a business, you identify where you can develop a
    > product that can fit a need, and you go for it.
    >
    > Regards,
    > Mark Remfrey

    More that products should sell on their own merits rather than as a result of
    market manipulations which would likely be found a breach of untitrust law if
    anyone were to prosecute. Prosecution is unlikely as the parties who would be
    involved in a prosecution are all in each others' pockets and have a vested
    interest in things remaining as they are. Having said that, MS is a latecomer to
    the political lobbying business and almost surely a good deal less corrupt than
    firms like the Carlyle Group or Kellog Brown and Root.
    Roger_Nickel, Jul 1, 2005
    #4
  5. Roger_Nickel

    Rob J Guest

    In article <42c4750d$> in nz.comp on Fri, 01 Jul
    2005 10:40:07 +1200, Roger_Nickel <> says...
    > For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-


    Slashdot doesn't post stories. They post opinions.
    Rob J, Jul 1, 2005
    #5
  6. Roger_Nickel

    Shane Guest

    On Fri, 01 Jul 2005 22:40:23 +1200, Rob J wrote:

    > In article <42c4750d$> in nz.comp on Fri, 01 Jul
    > 2005 10:40:07 +1200, Roger_Nickel <> says...
    >> For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-

    >
    > Slashdot doesn't post stories. They post opinions.


    Thats an opinion

    --
    Hardware, n.: The parts of a computer system that can be kicked

    The best way to get the right answer on usenet is to post the wrong one.
    Shane, Jul 1, 2005
    #6
  7. Roger_Nickel

    thing Guest

    Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >
    > http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >
    > "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    > influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    > paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    > has paved it with money...."



    MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...

    For that is what it is, corruption....

    Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    American business such as defence contracts.

    The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...

    So it is just bribary....

    It is beginning to look like a very sick society...

    more and more every day...

    regards

    Thing
    thing, Jul 1, 2005
    #7
  8. Roger_Nickel

    Rob J Guest

    In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    > Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > > For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    > >
    > > http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    > >
    > > "...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    > > influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    > > paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    > > has paved it with money...."

    >
    >
    > MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    > setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    > documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...
    >
    > For that is what it is, corruption....
    >
    > Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    > American business such as defence contracts.
    >
    > The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    > military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    >
    > So it is just bribary....
    >
    > It is beginning to look like a very sick society...


    But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political reality
    around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    Zealand.

    So what really is your point?
    Rob J, Jul 1, 2005
    #8
  9. Roger_Nickel

    shannon Guest

    Rob J wrote:
    > In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    > 09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    >
    >>Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >>
    >>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >>>
    >>>http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >>>
    >>>"...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >>>influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >>>paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    >>>has paved it with money...."

    >>
    >>
    >>MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    >> setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    >>documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...
    >>
    >>For that is what it is, corruption....
    >>
    >>Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    >>American business such as defence contracts.
    >>
    >>The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    >>military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    >>
    >>So it is just bribary....
    >>
    >>It is beginning to look like a very sick society...

    >
    >
    > But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political reality
    > around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    > Zealand.


    No its not.
    We don't have the same vote buying possibiities open to our politicians.
    shannon, Jul 1, 2005
    #9
  10. On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 10:50:20 +1200, shannon <> wrote:

    >Rob J wrote:
    >> In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    >> 09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    >>
    >>>Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >>>>
    >>>>http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >>>>
    >>>>"...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >>>>influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >>>>paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    >>>>has paved it with money...."
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    >>> setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    >>>documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...
    >>>
    >>>For that is what it is, corruption....
    >>>
    >>>Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    >>>American business such as defence contracts.
    >>>
    >>>The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    >>>military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    >>>
    >>>So it is just bribary....
    >>>
    >>>It is beginning to look like a very sick society...

    >>
    >>
    >> But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political reality
    >> around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    >> Zealand.

    >
    >No its not.
    >We don't have the same vote buying possibiities open to our politicians.


    hahaha
    What a joke
    The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    FreedomChooser, Jul 2, 2005
    #10
  11. Roger_Nickel

    shannon Guest

    FreedomChooser wrote:

    > hahaha
    > What a joke
    > The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    > Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    >


    No, there is no individual funding of New Zealand MPs campaigns by
    donations from business.
    Limited party donations are allowed.
    Campaign spending is strictly limited, and MPs are far more financially
    accountable.
    The bribery that is considered normal in the US would be exposed as
    scandalously unfair in any Westminster parliamentary democracy,
    including ours.
    shannon, Jul 2, 2005
    #11
  12. Roger_Nickel

    thing Guest

    Rob J wrote:
    > In article <42c4750d$> in nz.comp on Fri, 01 Jul
    > 2005 10:40:07 +1200, Roger_Nickel <> says...
    >
    >>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-

    >
    >
    > Slashdot doesn't post stories. They post opinions.


    No they dont.

    This is stuff from The Washington Post....

    Slashdot is a portal/blog, it merely collects info and lets you go read
    the actual article, its not journalism as such.

    regards

    Thing
    thing, Jul 2, 2005
    #12
  13. Roger_Nickel

    thing Guest

    Rob J wrote:
    > In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    > 09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    >
    >>Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >>
    >>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >>>
    >>>http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >>>
    >>>"...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >>>influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >>>paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    >>>has paved it with money...."

    >>
    >>
    >>MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    >> setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    >>documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...
    >>
    >>For that is what it is, corruption....
    >>
    >>Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    >>American business such as defence contracts.
    >>
    >>The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    >>military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    >>
    >>So it is just bribary....
    >>
    >>It is beginning to look like a very sick society...

    >
    >
    > But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political reality
    > around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    > Zealand.


    um.....no, I would class most if not all of our politicians far less
    corrupt when it comes to back handers, election helpers and wheeling and
    dealing. In this respact we follow the UK/Europe rather than the USA.

    > So what really is your point?


    I was following the thread, so what is yours? if you dont like my posts
    dont read them.

    Dont bother with negative comments, different points of view are fine
    but provide URLS justifying them.

    regards

    Thing
    thing, Jul 2, 2005
    #13
  14. Roger_Nickel

    thing Guest

    FreedomChooser wrote:

    8><--------

    >
    > hahaha
    > What a joke
    > The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    > Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    >


    I would storngly disagree, there is little if any evidence or underlying
    articles to justify we are any where near as bad as the USA.

    regards

    Thing
    thing, Jul 2, 2005
    #14
  15. Roger_Nickel

    Rob J Guest

    In article <42c5c8ac$> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    10:50:20 +1200, shannon <> says...
    > Rob J wrote:
    > > In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    > > 09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    > >
    > >>Roger_Nickel wrote:
    > >>
    > >>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    > >>>
    > >>>http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    > >>>
    > >>>"...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    > >>>influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    > >>>paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take, Microsoft
    > >>>has paved it with money...."
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best lobbying
    > >> setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    > >>documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have gone...
    > >>
    > >>For that is what it is, corruption....
    > >>
    > >>Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    > >>American business such as defence contracts.
    > >>
    > >>The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    > >>military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    > >>
    > >>So it is just bribary....
    > >>
    > >>It is beginning to look like a very sick society...

    > >
    > >
    > > But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political reality
    > > around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    > > Zealand.

    >
    > No its not.
    > We don't have the same vote buying possibiities open to our politicians.


    NZ doesn't have the same level of military. It doesn't have this industry
    or that industry. But it still has ample opportunities for politicians to
    buy votes.
    Rob J, Jul 2, 2005
    #15
  16. Roger_Nickel

    Rob J Guest

    In article <42c5e17a$> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    12:36:10 +1200, shannon <> says...
    > FreedomChooser wrote:
    >
    > > hahaha
    > > What a joke
    > > The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    > > Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    > >

    >
    > No, there is no individual funding of New Zealand MPs campaigns by
    > donations from business.
    > Limited party donations are allowed.
    > Campaign spending is strictly limited, and MPs are far more financially
    > accountable.
    > The bribery that is considered normal in the US would be exposed as
    > scandalously unfair in any Westminster parliamentary democracy,
    > including ours.


    MPs aren't that financially accountable. Don't kid yourself. Anytime MPs
    behaviour is put under scrutiny, they bloc vote against it. Remember the
    tax changes that MPs were supposed to be getting a year or two back, and
    changes to the Remuneration Authority? Never happened, did it. It was
    blocked across all the parties.

    As for campaign spending - the real agenda behind state campaign funding
    is that the socialists are so useless at fundraising that they have to
    get money from the government, and make sure no one else can get more
    money than them.
    Rob J, Jul 2, 2005
    #16
  17. Roger_Nickel

    Mercury Guest

    The OP made reference to Voters (MS as a conceptual Voter) BUYING
    politicians.
    Huge difference.

    No politician here can afford to buy votes. Instead you get the likes of
    Winston Peters doing his heads up campaigns only prior to each election so
    he singular can continue on in whatever it is he thinks he is doing. He is
    using the system as it is designed.

    Politicians here find it more cost effective to flap their jaws and spout
    forth drivel (Devine - a new job for you) than to spend their own hard
    earned cash on buying votes. The big stinks usually come in pre-election
    when Tax Drops, or promises of, may occur - to buy votes.

    In the US the sidling of Companies up to politicians is a manifestation of
    the huge ineffectiveness of their so called Democracy. Companies (and
    religions, industries, SIG's etc.) buy politicians to push their agenda and
    in return expect legislation / favours in the curry that comes out.

    The strongest indication of the degree of corruption has been the GWB /
    Haliburton / Pay Backs that George in his wisdom announced to all on TV he
    was going to Pay Back to those that Helped him get elected. Haliburton may
    not be Georges baby, but the rest of the mess sure is.

    The religions purchased George, George Backed the religions and gave them
    Anti Gay, Anti abortion and Pro War stance. Is that corrupt?

    As far as the MS issue is concerned I have no opinion. Considering the
    magnitude of Government, Business, and Greed that exists in the US,
    everything sited in the articles referred to are at the lower end of trivia.



    "Rob J" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <42c5c8ac$> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    > 10:50:20 +1200, shannon <> says...
    >> Rob J wrote:
    >> > In article <> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    >> > 09:32:57 +1200, thing <> says...
    >> >
    >> >>Roger_Nickel wrote:
    >> >>
    >> >>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-
    >> >>>
    >> >>>http://lxer.com/module/newswire/view/38971/index.html
    >> >>>
    >> >>>"...Let's begin to make some sense of Microsoft's puzzling maze of
    >> >>>influence. We'll only travel a short distance before seeing multiple
    >> >>>paths on which we can travel. Regardless of the path we take,
    >> >>>Microsoft
    >> >>>has paved it with money...."
    >> >>
    >> >>
    >> >>MS has long been regarded as having one of the biggest and best
    >> >>lobbying
    >> >> setups in DC. It is interesting when we start to see such public
    >> >>documents unfolding before us, just how far the corruption may have
    >> >>gone...
    >> >>
    >> >>For that is what it is, corruption....
    >> >>
    >> >>Of course we should als ask about "Hollywood" and other big areas of
    >> >>American business such as defence contracts.
    >> >>
    >> >>The fact that the pentegon wants to shut a huge amount of un-needed US
    >> >>military bases, but that would effect many comgressmen's voters...
    >> >>
    >> >>So it is just bribary....
    >> >>
    >> >>It is beginning to look like a very sick society...
    >> >
    >> >
    >> > But of course this kind of "sick society" happens to be political
    >> > reality
    >> > around the world. This kind of politics is seen right here in New
    >> > Zealand.

    >>
    >> No its not.
    >> We don't have the same vote buying possibiities open to our politicians.

    >
    > NZ doesn't have the same level of military. It doesn't have this industry
    > or that industry. But it still has ample opportunities for politicians to
    > buy votes.
    Mercury, Jul 2, 2005
    #17
  18. Roger_Nickel

    Ian H Guest

    Rob J wrote:
    > In article <42c5e17a$> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    > 12:36:10 +1200, shannon <> says...
    >
    >>FreedomChooser wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>hahaha
    >>>What a joke
    >>>The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    >>>Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    >>>

    >>
    >>No, there is no individual funding of New Zealand MPs campaigns by
    >>donations from business.
    >>Limited party donations are allowed.
    >>Campaign spending is strictly limited, and MPs are far more financially
    >>accountable.
    >>The bribery that is considered normal in the US would be exposed as
    >>scandalously unfair in any Westminster parliamentary democracy,
    >>including ours.

    >
    >
    > MPs aren't that financially accountable. Don't kid yourself. Anytime MPs
    > behaviour is put under scrutiny, they bloc vote against it. Remember the
    > tax changes that MPs were supposed to be getting a year or two back, and
    > changes to the Remuneration Authority? Never happened, did it. It was
    > blocked across all the parties.
    >
    > As for campaign spending - the real agenda behind state campaign funding
    > is that the socialists are so useless at fundraising that they have to
    > get money from the government, and make sure no one else can get more
    > money than them.


    The biggest difference between the US and here is that campaign spending
    by individual MPs makes bugger all difference to the outcome here. That
    is why our politicas is so much cleaner. And the reason is that our
    elections present the electorate with a meaningful choice whereas
    elections in the US are a fairly meaningless process. As democracies go,
    the US has the `lite' version while our democracy is full strength.

    In NZ elections are a process for choosing governments. In the US
    elections simply don't carry that greater meaning. Consequently each
    vote there is purely a choice between two individual candidates who are
    usually about as similar as Pepsi and Coke. That is why advertising
    plays such a big role in US politics. Advertising is most powerful as a
    tool for creating points of difference where none really exist.
    Ian H, Jul 3, 2005
    #18
  19. On Sat, 02 Jul 2005 14:05:35 +1200, thing <> wrote:

    >Rob J wrote:
    >> In article <42c4750d$> in nz.comp on Fri, 01 Jul
    >> 2005 10:40:07 +1200, Roger_Nickel <> says...
    >>
    >>>For those who may have missed the Slashdot story:-

    >>
    >>
    >> Slashdot doesn't post stories. They post opinions.

    >
    >No they dont.
    >
    >This is stuff from The Washington Post....
    >
    >Slashdot is a portal/blog, it merely collects info and lets you go read
    >the actual article, its not journalism as such.


    Helluva lot of what is on slashdot is readers posting in their
    opinions being turned into articles
    FreedomChooser, Jul 3, 2005
    #19
  20. On Sun, 03 Jul 2005 11:15:46 +1200, Ian H <> wrote:

    >Rob J wrote:
    >> In article <42c5e17a$> in nz.comp on Sat, 02 Jul 2005
    >> 12:36:10 +1200, shannon <> says...
    >>
    >>>FreedomChooser wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>hahaha
    >>>>What a joke
    >>>>The only thing we have less of is the size our economy
    >>>>Every opportunity for vote buying exists the same as other countries
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>No, there is no individual funding of New Zealand MPs campaigns by
    >>>donations from business.
    >>>Limited party donations are allowed.
    >>>Campaign spending is strictly limited, and MPs are far more financially
    >>>accountable.
    >>>The bribery that is considered normal in the US would be exposed as
    >>>scandalously unfair in any Westminster parliamentary democracy,
    >>>including ours.

    >>
    >>
    >> MPs aren't that financially accountable. Don't kid yourself. Anytime MPs
    >> behaviour is put under scrutiny, they bloc vote against it. Remember the
    >> tax changes that MPs were supposed to be getting a year or two back, and
    >> changes to the Remuneration Authority? Never happened, did it. It was
    >> blocked across all the parties.
    >>
    >> As for campaign spending - the real agenda behind state campaign funding
    >> is that the socialists are so useless at fundraising that they have to
    >> get money from the government, and make sure no one else can get more
    >> money than them.

    >
    >The biggest difference between the US and here is that campaign spending
    >by individual MPs makes bugger all difference to the outcome here. That
    >is why our politicas is so much cleaner. And the reason is that our
    >elections present the electorate with a meaningful choice whereas
    >elections in the US are a fairly meaningless process. As democracies go,
    >the US has the `lite' version while our democracy is full strength.


    Bullshit
    The US has a far more open system
    Dont give me that "Bush stole the election" crap
    The average citizen in the US has far more protection from the
    government than our Westminister style cabinet would ever be prepared
    to grudginly grant us

    >In NZ elections are a process for choosing governments. In the US
    >elections simply don't carry that greater meaning. Consequently each
    >vote there is purely a choice between two individual candidates who are
    >usually about as similar as Pepsi and Coke. That is why advertising
    >plays such a big role in US politics. Advertising is most powerful as a
    >tool for creating points of difference where none really exist.


    If you believe this you must be a socialist or some other kinda commie
    Just because the haed left isnt getting their tiny minority viewpoint
    accepted by the majority of people. lol

    Westminter style government is based on the idea that the people are
    the servants of the goverment

    US style government is based on the idea that the governments are the
    servants of the people

    The US government is at four levels compared to our one
    Helluva lot more democracy there than we have
    FreedomChooser, Jul 3, 2005
    #20
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  1. tbridge

    Re: Microsoft money

    tbridge, Apr 21, 2004, in forum: Microsoft Certification
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    479
    tbridge
    Apr 21, 2004
  2. Herbert Yu
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    516
    Herbert Yu
    Feb 17, 2005
  3. Barry Verona

    Unable to open data after Microsoft Money upgrade

    Barry Verona, Aug 11, 2003, in forum: Computer Support
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    399
    Barry Verona
    Aug 11, 2003
  4. why?
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    3,789
    dfederic
    Apr 28, 2006
  5. joevan

    Money? What money? It never existed.

    joevan, Oct 11, 2008, in forum: Computer Support
    Replies:
    7
    Views:
    511
    HEMI-Powered
    Oct 13, 2008
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