Merge to HDR?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Nathan Gutman, Apr 24, 2007.

  1. Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.
    Thanks,
    --
    Nathan Gutman
    Nathan Gutman, Apr 24, 2007
    #1
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  2. Nathan Gutman

    Robin Guest

    Not something that I have ever used, however from memory doesn't the program
    need to support 32bit images to merge to HDR?


    "Nathan Gutman" <> wrote in message
    news:t7pXh.16170$...
    > Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    > Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    > Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.
    > Thanks,
    > --
    > Nathan Gutman
    Robin, Apr 24, 2007
    #2
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  3. Nathan Gutman

    =\(8\) Guest

    "Robin" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Not something that I have ever used, however from memory doesn't the
    > program need to support 32bit images to merge to HDR?
    >
    >
    > "Nathan Gutman" <> wrote in message
    > news:t7pXh.16170$...
    >> Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    >> Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    >> Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.
    >> Thanks,
    >> --
    >> Nathan Gutman

    >
    >


    Well one would think that if the program has an HDR feature that it DOES
    support 32-bit. I know Photoshop CS2 and 3 does. However, unlike Photomatix
    software it requires actual separate images shot with different exposures.
    You can not take a single RAW file and process it with different exposure
    amounts and have Photoshop accept it. The reason being is that Photoshop
    already sees all of the image data even if the human doesn't. So using a
    single image over and under exposed just won't cut it. Besides even if it
    did it isn't a true HDR image.

    I use exposure compensation with my camera. I start at the darkest under
    exposure I can, for mine that is -2 stops and then in 1/3 stop increments go
    to +2 stops. This gives me a nice set of images perfect for true HDR
    merging.

    =(8)
    =\(8\), Apr 24, 2007
    #3
  4. Nathan Gutman

    ray Guest

    On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 15:12:25 +0000, Nathan Gutman wrote:

    > Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    > Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    > Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.
    > Thanks,


    Could not find that in gimp - but cinepaint does.
    ray, Apr 24, 2007
    #4
  5. Nathan Gutman

    Rutger Guest

    "Nathan Gutman" <> schreef in bericht
    news:t7pXh.16170$...
    > Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    > Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    > Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.
    > Thanks,
    > --
    > Nathan Gutman



    No.

    Rutger
    Rutger, Apr 24, 2007
    #5
  6. =(8) wrote:
    > "Robin" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Not something that I have ever used, however from memory doesn't the
    >> program need to support 32bit images to merge to HDR?
    >>
    >>
    >> "Nathan Gutman" <> wrote in message
    >> news:t7pXh.16170$...
    >>> Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    >>> Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    >>> Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.


    > Well one would think that if the program has an HDR feature that it DOES
    > support 32-bit. I know Photoshop CS2 and 3 does. However, unlike
    > Photomatix software it requires actual separate images shot with
    > different exposures. You can not take a single RAW file and process it
    > with different exposure amounts and have Photoshop accept it. The reason
    > being is that Photoshop already sees all of the image data even if the
    > human doesn't. So using a single image over and under exposed just won't
    > cut it. Besides even if it did it isn't a true HDR image.


    Some facts wrong here -- the workflow for raw images in Photoshop has
    the conversion from RAW happen in the Adobe Camera Raw plugin, and what
    Photoshop itself sees is merely a single 8 or 16-bit version (as you
    selected in the plugin) of the image. Depending on your selections in
    ACR, that may or may not include all the information present in the raw
    file (for a 16-bit rendering it should be possible to get all the
    information into it).

    There's some utility to doing HDR merges from multiple raw conversions,
    or even from a single file -- see the synthetic HDR article at
    <http://www.findatlantis.com/wiki/index.php/Synthetic_HDR>. While it
    doesn't exactly give you extra information, it represents the
    information in a form that the HDR software can do very useful rendering
    tricks with, so you can get a better-looking picture that way than other
    ways, sometimes.

    > I use exposure compensation with my camera. I start at the darkest under
    > exposure I can, for mine that is -2 stops and then in 1/3 stop
    > increments go to +2 stops. This gives me a nice set of images perfect
    > for true HDR merging.


    That's much too small a step; I'd suggest 2 or 3 stop steps. And you're
    not going nearly far enough from the "correct" exposure; I'd suggest -7
    to +7 stops, or some such.
    David Dyer-Bennet, Apr 24, 2007
    #6
  7. Nathan Gutman

    Guest Guest

    In article <t7pXh.16170$>,
    says...
    > Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    > Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    > Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.


    qtpfsgui.exe is a free standalone program for merging multiple exposures
    into an HDR. Works well in my limited experience.

    --
    is Joshua Putnam
    <http://www.phred.org/~josh/>
    Updated Infrared Photography Gallery:
    <http://www.phred.org/~josh/photo/ir.html>
    Guest, Apr 25, 2007
    #7
  8. Nathan Gutman

    =\(8\) Guest

    "David Dyer-Bennet" <> wrote in message
    news:462e49ae$0$954$...
    > =(8) wrote:
    >> "Robin" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> Not something that I have ever used, however from memory doesn't the
    >>> program need to support 32bit images to merge to HDR?
    >>>
    >>>
    >>> "Nathan Gutman" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:t7pXh.16170$...
    >>>> Photoshop CS2 has a new function "Merge to HDR"
    >>>> Is anything like that available for any of these programs?
    >>>> Gimp, Photoshop 7, Paintshop Pro X or Photoshop Elements 5.

    >
    >> Well one would think that if the program has an HDR feature that it DOES
    >> support 32-bit. I know Photoshop CS2 and 3 does. However, unlike
    >> Photomatix software it requires actual separate images shot with
    >> different exposures. You can not take a single RAW file and process it
    >> with different exposure amounts and have Photoshop accept it. The reason
    >> being is that Photoshop already sees all of the image data even if the
    >> human doesn't. So using a single image over and under exposed just won't
    >> cut it. Besides even if it did it isn't a true HDR image.

    >
    > Some facts wrong here -- the workflow for raw images in Photoshop has the
    > conversion from RAW happen in the Adobe Camera Raw plugin, and what
    > Photoshop itself sees is merely a single 8 or 16-bit version (as you
    > selected in the plugin) of the image. Depending on your selections in
    > ACR, that may or may not include all the information present in the raw
    > file (for a 16-bit rendering it should be possible to get all the
    > information into it).
    >
    > There's some utility to doing HDR merges from multiple raw conversions, or
    > even from a single file -- see the synthetic HDR article at
    > <http://www.findatlantis.com/wiki/index.php/Synthetic_HDR>. While it
    > doesn't exactly give you extra information, it represents the information
    > in a form that the HDR software can do very useful rendering tricks with,
    > so you can get a better-looking picture that way than other ways,
    > sometimes.
    >
    >> I use exposure compensation with my camera. I start at the darkest under
    >> exposure I can, for mine that is -2 stops and then in 1/3 stop increments
    >> go to +2 stops. This gives me a nice set of images perfect for true HDR
    >> merging.

    >
    > That's much too small a step; I'd suggest 2 or 3 stop steps. And you're
    > not going nearly far enough from the "correct" exposure; I'd suggest -7 to
    > +7 stops, or some such.



    It really doesn't matter what you do or don't do in RAW. Photoshop WILL NOT
    allow you to merge to HDR using images derived from the same RAW file. That
    tells me that Photoshop is seeing something that we may or may not be
    seeing. There is a reason for this.

    Also, I would like to state for the record that I am not the one that said
    Photoshop can see all of the information in a image and that is why HDR
    won't work from multiple images derived from a single RAW image. That is
    what the program that created the merge to HDR feature said. I can only
    guess that he would know what he is talking about.

    While merging using images derived from the same file can give... useful
    results they are not true HDR images.

    =(8)
    =\(8\), Apr 25, 2007
    #8
  9. =(8) wrote:
    > "David Dyer-Bennet" <> wrote in message
    > news:462e49ae$0$954$...


    >> There's some utility to doing HDR merges from multiple raw
    >> conversions, or even from a single file -- see the synthetic HDR
    >> article at
    >> <http://www.findatlantis.com/wiki/index.php/Synthetic_HDR>. While it
    >> doesn't exactly give you extra information, it represents the
    >> information in a form that the HDR software can do very useful
    >> rendering tricks with, so you can get a better-looking picture that
    >> way than other ways, sometimes.

    >
    > It really doesn't matter what you do or don't do in RAW. Photoshop WILL
    > NOT allow you to merge to HDR using images derived from the same RAW
    > file. That tells me that Photoshop is seeing something that we may or
    > may not be seeing. There is a reason for this.


    Works fine, I've done it. You have to strip out the EXIF data, and then
    when it pops up a dialog box asking for the exposure info (which it
    doesn't do if the EXIF info has already supplied the exposure data),
    give it something plausible. If you *don't* strip out the EXIF, it uses
    it, and decides the photos don't present any variation at all, and
    refuses to use them; that's probably what you've encountered.

    > Also, I would like to state for the record that I am not the one that
    > said Photoshop can see all of the information in a image and that is why
    > HDR won't work from multiple images derived from a single RAW image.
    > That is what the program that created the merge to HDR feature said. I
    > can only guess that he would know what he is talking about.
    >
    > While merging using images derived from the same file can give... useful
    > results they are not true HDR images.


    I'd agree with that last; and that's why the person with the "synthetic
    HDR" work is calling it that -- she knows it's not real HDR too. But it
    may well still be useful. (Haven't played enough with the synthetic
    version to have an opinion yet. I've definitely found combining
    multiple renderings from a raw file to be useful.)
    David Dyer-Bennet, Apr 25, 2007
    #9
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