Looking for User Experience with XP Backup Software

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by Bob Bob, Jan 30, 2008.

  1. Bob Bob

    Bob Bob Guest

    Hi
    For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    all the backup data copied to removable media.
    We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    like having a moving gun and a moving target.

    I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    with them.

    So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    Exec.

    I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.

    Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    Bob

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    Bob Bob, Jan 30, 2008
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Bob Bob

    Jack Gillis Guest

    Hi Bob,

    I have used Acronis True Image on my three machines for years. It has never
    let me down.

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi
    > For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    > mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    > data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    > companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    > for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    > no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    > in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    > all the backup data copied to removable media.
    > We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    > like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >
    > I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    > with them.
    >
    > So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    > but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    > BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    > Exec.
    >
    > I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    > ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    > network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >
    > Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    > Bob
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >
    Jack Gillis, Jan 30, 2008
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Bob Bob

    PeeCee Guest

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi
    > For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    > mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    > data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    > companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    > for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    > no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    > in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    > all the backup data copied to removable media.
    > We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    > like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >
    > I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    > with them.
    >
    > So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    > but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    > BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    > Exec.
    >
    > I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    > ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    > network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >
    > Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    > Bob
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >




    Bob

    Have a look at Syncback http://www.2brightsparks.com/downloads.html#freeware
    (halfway down page)

    Works for myself and several of my clients.
    Typical setup would be to create a backup profile for each category e.g. My
    Documents, Emails (OE store folder or OL .pst) Address Book, Favourites, and
    their particular Book keeping software (MYOB etc)
    I usually leave it at defaults which means if a file with the same
    date/time/size is in the destination then ignore it, if it isn't copy it
    there.
    This means the first run takes a while as Syncback has to copy every file to
    the backup device, after than it only copies the new or altered files which
    means it can be very quick to do.
    Once I've run each of these profiles and copied the first run of files to
    the backup device be it an RW disk, external HD or flash stick, I'll create
    a 'Group' and include all the profiles in it and name the group 'all'
    Then I write 1 small batch file (sorry it does make it easier) that consists
    of one line "syncback.exe all" and save it in the Syncback folder in Program
    Files.

    A desktop short cut to this batch file means the user only has to put in
    their backup device, double click the this shortcut, wait for the black
    window to disappear and their backup is done.
    Syncback does have the ability to schedule backups using Windows Scheduler
    if need be.

    Downside
    The free version doesn't do shadow copy which means the user has to exit all
    programs that Syncback backs up otherwise you get a 'in use' error.

    Upside.
    Once set up it just plain works.
    Will compress (zip) files if wanted.
    Has lots of settings to 'refine' how the files are backed up.

    Best
    Paul.
    PeeCee, Jan 30, 2008
    #3
  4. Bob Bob

    Bob Bob Guest

    On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 12:46:16 -0500, "Jack Gillis"
    <> wrote:

    >Hi Bob,
    >
    >I have used Acronis True Image on my three machines for years. It has never
    >let me down.
    >
    >"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Hi
    >> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>
    >> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >> with them.
    >>
    >> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >> Exec.
    >>
    >> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>
    >> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >> Bob
    >>
    >> --
    >> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com



    Jack
    Have you been using to clone the entire drive or just certain files?
    Thanks for the reply.
    Bob

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    Bob Bob, Jan 31, 2008
    #4
  5. Bob Bob

    Bob Bob Guest

    On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:27:59 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:

    >"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Hi
    >> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>
    >> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >> with them.
    >>
    >> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >> Exec.
    >>
    >> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>
    >> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >> Bob
    >>
    >> --
    >> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>

    >
    >
    >
    >Bob
    >
    >Have a look at Syncback http://www.2brightsparks.com/downloads.html#freeware
    >(halfway down page)
    >
    >Works for myself and several of my clients.
    >Typical setup would be to create a backup profile for each category e.g. My
    >Documents, Emails (OE store folder or OL .pst) Address Book, Favourites, and
    >their particular Book keeping software (MYOB etc)
    >I usually leave it at defaults which means if a file with the same
    >date/time/size is in the destination then ignore it, if it isn't copy it
    >there.
    >This means the first run takes a while as Syncback has to copy every file to
    >the backup device, after than it only copies the new or altered files which
    >means it can be very quick to do.
    >Once I've run each of these profiles and copied the first run of files to
    >the backup device be it an RW disk, external HD or flash stick, I'll create
    >a 'Group' and include all the profiles in it and name the group 'all'
    >Then I write 1 small batch file (sorry it does make it easier) that consists
    >of one line "syncback.exe all" and save it in the Syncback folder in Program
    >Files.
    >
    >A desktop short cut to this batch file means the user only has to put in
    >their backup device, double click the this shortcut, wait for the black
    >window to disappear and their backup is done.
    >Syncback does have the ability to schedule backups using Windows Scheduler
    >if need be.
    >
    >Downside
    >The free version doesn't do shadow copy which means the user has to exit all
    >programs that Syncback backs up otherwise you get a 'in use' error.
    >
    >Upside.
    >Once set up it just plain works.
    >Will compress (zip) files if wanted.
    >Has lots of settings to 'refine' how the files are backed up.
    >
    >Best
    >Paul.

    Paul
    Thanks for the time.
    I am not too keen on the synching idea as it would be a leap of faith
    for me. However...

    Have you done any restores with it?

    That 'in use' error sounds like Second
    Copy(http://www.centered.com/products.html).

    In fact, your descriptions also sound like Second Copy.

    Batch files can be very helpful. Sometimes users(customers) get in the
    way as they turn a networked machine, fouling up the drive lettering
    and then the batch file has issues....

    I will give the site a look see.
    Again,
    Thanks
    Bob

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    Bob Bob, Jan 31, 2008
    #5
  6. Bob Bob

    PeeCee Guest

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:27:59 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:
    >
    >>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> Hi
    >>> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >>> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >>> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >>> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >>> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >>> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >>> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >>> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >>> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >>> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>>
    >>> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >>> with them.
    >>>
    >>> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >>> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >>> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >>> Exec.
    >>>
    >>> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >>> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >>> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>>
    >>> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >>> Bob
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>Bob
    >>
    >>Have a look at Syncback
    >>http://www.2brightsparks.com/downloads.html#freeware
    >>(halfway down page)
    >>
    >>Works for myself and several of my clients.
    >>Typical setup would be to create a backup profile for each category e.g.
    >>My
    >>Documents, Emails (OE store folder or OL .pst) Address Book, Favourites,
    >>and
    >>their particular Book keeping software (MYOB etc)
    >>I usually leave it at defaults which means if a file with the same
    >>date/time/size is in the destination then ignore it, if it isn't copy it
    >>there.
    >>This means the first run takes a while as Syncback has to copy every file
    >>to
    >>the backup device, after than it only copies the new or altered files
    >>which
    >>means it can be very quick to do.
    >>Once I've run each of these profiles and copied the first run of files to
    >>the backup device be it an RW disk, external HD or flash stick, I'll
    >>create
    >>a 'Group' and include all the profiles in it and name the group 'all'
    >>Then I write 1 small batch file (sorry it does make it easier) that
    >>consists
    >>of one line "syncback.exe all" and save it in the Syncback folder in
    >>Program
    >>Files.
    >>
    >>A desktop short cut to this batch file means the user only has to put in
    >>their backup device, double click the this shortcut, wait for the black
    >>window to disappear and their backup is done.
    >>Syncback does have the ability to schedule backups using Windows Scheduler
    >>if need be.
    >>
    >>Downside
    >>The free version doesn't do shadow copy which means the user has to exit
    >>all
    >>programs that Syncback backs up otherwise you get a 'in use' error.
    >>
    >>Upside.
    >>Once set up it just plain works.
    >>Will compress (zip) files if wanted.
    >>Has lots of settings to 'refine' how the files are backed up.
    >>
    >>Best
    >>Paul.

    > Paul
    > Thanks for the time.
    > I am not too keen on the synching idea as it would be a leap of faith
    > for me. However...
    >
    > Have you done any restores with it?
    >
    > That 'in use' error sounds like Second
    > Copy(http://www.centered.com/products.html).
    >
    > In fact, your descriptions also sound like Second Copy.
    >
    > Batch files can be very helpful. Sometimes users(customers) get in the
    > way as they turn a networked machine, fouling up the drive lettering
    > and then the batch file has issues....
    >
    > I will give the site a look see.
    > Again,
    > Thanks
    > Bob
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >



    Bob

    " have I done any restores"

    If you understand a Syncback backup is exactly the same layout as the parent
    (or source)
    Then all you have to do is drag & drop from the backup to where ever you
    want.

    Case in point.
    My personal backups using Syncback go to a Netgear NDAS box (network
    attached storage)
    One of the profiles I run is to backup my utilities drive which contains my
    (er cough!) password access tools.
    A PC I had on the bench had arrived (as usual) without any password
    information so I ran one of these tools directly from my utilites drive.
    Quick as a wink the PC's Security suite picked up the nature of the tool and
    blithley reported it had stopped the tool and 'deleted' it.
    Bugger, that particular tool is very useful.
    To get it back all I had to do was go to my NDAS drive find the missing file
    & copy and paste it back in place where it belonged.

    Second Copy, yep from what I can see on their website it is not disimilar to
    Syncback.

    (re reading your OP)
    I detect a certain desperation in your post, sort of I want to set it and
    forget it plea.
    'Fact of life' backup profiles are uniqe and backup systems allways require
    maintenance.
    Over the years I have build run and maintained many backup systems from
    floppy to tape to CD to Flash etc etc.
    All of them have required maintenance if for no other reason than to make
    sure the backup archive is valid,

    One of the scary parts of backing up is the restore phase, will it work,
    will xyz book keeping program accept the backup I've done.
    Well the best advice I can give is to make sure by building a clone of the
    client's system and trying it out.
    Very quickly you will find out what files you can drag & drop to restore and
    what files need a more formal 'import' routine.


    Other random observations.
    The best backups are done by those that know they will have to do the
    restore.
    Multiple systems are recommended if the data is at all critical. (took me
    two full nights to get one doctors system up that had a defective burner, a
    weeks worth of backups u/s, ouch)
    Full image backups (aka True Image) are simple in concept but not allways
    the right solution.
    Incremental backups are fine (aka Syncback) and quicker
    The quicker the backup the more likely it will be done.
    After hours (scheduled) backups fall over, someone must be responsible for
    reading the log file 'daily'
    If you must have low cost shadowed backups then MS Backup is allready in all
    Windows versions up to XP

    I allways suggest each site has it's own formal 'Backup' documentation, not
    all site take this on board.
    Backup procedures should include the who, what, when and where components
    Persons or positions responsible should be specifically spelled out in this
    backup procedure
    That way when the routine review of a backup picks up someone stuffed it up
    by (eg) tuning off the network drive it is easy to give someone a wakeup
    call 'before' a backup is needed in realtime.

    One thing is for sure Bob, backups are going to be a continued source of
    work for the forseeable future.

    Best
    Paul.
    PeeCee, Jan 31, 2008
    #6
  7. Bob Bob

    Bob Bob Guest

    On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 20:18:12 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:

    >"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:27:59 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:...
    >>>> Hi
    >>>> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >>>> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >>>> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >>>> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >>>> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >>>> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >>>> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >>>> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >>>> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >>>> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>>>
    >>>> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >>>> with them.
    >>>>
    >>>> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >>>> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >>>> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >>>> Exec.
    >>>>
    >>>> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >>>> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >>>> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>>>
    >>>> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >>>> Bob
    >>>>
    >>>> --
    >>>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>Bob
    >>>
    >>>Have a look at Syncback
    >>>http://www.2brightsparks.com/downloads.html#freeware
    >>>(halfway down page)
    >>>
    >>>Works for myself and several of my clients.
    >>>Typical setup would be to create a backup profile for each category e.g.
    >>>My
    >>>Documents, Emails (OE store folder or OL .pst) Address Book, Favourites,
    >>>and
    >>>their particular Book keeping software (MYOB etc)
    >>>I usually leave it at defaults which means if a file with the same
    >>>date/time/size is in the destination then ignore it, if it isn't copy it
    >>>there.
    >>>This means the first run takes a while as Syncback has to copy every file
    >>>to
    >>>the backup device, after than it only copies the new or altered files
    >>>which
    >>>means it can be very quick to do.
    >>>Once I've run each of these profiles and copied the first run of files to
    >>>the backup device be it an RW disk, external HD or flash stick, I'll
    >>>create
    >>>a 'Group' and include all the profiles in it and name the group 'all'
    >>>Then I write 1 small batch file (sorry it does make it easier) that
    >>>consists
    >>>of one line "syncback.exe all" and save it in the Syncback folder in
    >>>Program
    >>>Files.
    >>>
    >>>A desktop short cut to this batch file means the user only has to put in
    >>>their backup device, double click the this shortcut, wait for the black
    >>>window to disappear and their backup is done.
    >>>Syncback does have the ability to schedule backups using Windows Scheduler
    >>>if need be.
    >>>
    >>>Downside
    >>>The free version doesn't do shadow copy which means the user has to exit
    >>>all
    >>>programs that Syncback backs up otherwise you get a 'in use' error.
    >>>
    >>>Upside.
    >>>Once set up it just plain works.
    >>>Will compress (zip) files if wanted.
    >>>Has lots of settings to 'refine' how the files are backed up.
    >>>
    >>>Best
    >>>Paul.

    >> Paul
    >> Thanks for the time.
    >> I am not too keen on the synching idea as it would be a leap of faith
    >> for me. However...
    >>
    >> Have you done any restores with it?
    >>
    >> That 'in use' error sounds like Second
    >> Copy(http://www.centered.com/products.html).
    >>
    >> In fact, your descriptions also sound like Second Copy.
    >>
    >> Batch files can be very helpful. Sometimes users(customers) get in the
    >> way as they turn a networked machine, fouling up the drive lettering
    >> and then the batch file has issues....
    >>
    >> I will give the site a look see.
    >> Again,
    >> Thanks
    >> Bob
    >>
    >> --
    >> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>

    >
    >
    >Bob
    >
    >" have I done any restores"
    >
    >If you understand a Syncback backup is exactly the same layout as the parent
    >(or source)
    >Then all you have to do is drag & drop from the backup to where ever you
    >want.
    >
    >Case in point.
    >My personal backups using Syncback go to a Netgear NDAS box (network
    >attached storage)
    >One of the profiles I run is to backup my utilities drive which contains my
    >(er cough!) password access tools.
    >A PC I had on the bench had arrived (as usual) without any password
    >information so I ran one of these tools directly from my utilites drive.
    >Quick as a wink the PC's Security suite picked up the nature of the tool and
    >blithley reported it had stopped the tool and 'deleted' it.
    >Bugger, that particular tool is very useful.
    >To get it back all I had to do was go to my NDAS drive find the missing file
    >& copy and paste it back in place where it belonged.
    >
    >Second Copy, yep from what I can see on their website it is not disimilar to
    >Syncback.
    >
    >(re reading your OP)
    >I detect a certain desperation in your post, sort of I want to set it and
    >forget it plea.
    >'Fact of life' backup profiles are uniqe and backup systems allways require
    >maintenance.
    >Over the years I have build run and maintained many backup systems from
    >floppy to tape to CD to Flash etc etc.
    >All of them have required maintenance if for no other reason than to make
    >sure the backup archive is valid,
    >
    >One of the scary parts of backing up is the restore phase, will it work,
    >will xyz book keeping program accept the backup I've done.
    >Well the best advice I can give is to make sure by building a clone of the
    >client's system and trying it out.
    >Very quickly you will find out what files you can drag & drop to restore and
    >what files need a more formal 'import' routine.
    >
    >
    >Other random observations.
    >The best backups are done by those that know they will have to do the
    >restore.
    >Multiple systems are recommended if the data is at all critical. (took me
    >two full nights to get one doctors system up that had a defective burner, a
    >weeks worth of backups u/s, ouch)
    >Full image backups (aka True Image) are simple in concept but not allways
    >the right solution.
    >Incremental backups are fine (aka Syncback) and quicker
    >The quicker the backup the more likely it will be done.
    >After hours (scheduled) backups fall over, someone must be responsible for
    >reading the log file 'daily'
    >If you must have low cost shadowed backups then MS Backup is allready in all
    >Windows versions up to XP
    >
    >I allways suggest each site has it's own formal 'Backup' documentation, not
    >all site take this on board.
    >Backup procedures should include the who, what, when and where components
    >Persons or positions responsible should be specifically spelled out in this
    >backup procedure
    >That way when the routine review of a backup picks up someone stuffed it up
    >by (eg) tuning off the network drive it is easy to give someone a wakeup
    >call 'before' a backup is needed in realtime.
    >
    >One thing is for sure Bob, backups are going to be a continued source of
    >work for the forseeable future.
    >
    >Best
    >Paul.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >

    Paul
    We seem to have some common thoughts here...can we talk via email?
    Bob


    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    Bob Bob, Jan 31, 2008
    #7
  8. Bob Bob

    Jack Gillis Guest

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 12:46:16 -0500, "Jack Gillis"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>Hi Bob,
    >>
    >>I have used Acronis True Image on my three machines for years. It has
    >>never
    >>let me down.
    >>
    >>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> Hi
    >>> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >>> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >>> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >>> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >>> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >>> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >>> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >>> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >>> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >>> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>>
    >>> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >>> with them.
    >>>
    >>> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >>> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >>> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >>> Exec.
    >>>
    >>> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >>> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >>> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>>
    >>> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >>> Bob
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

    >
    >
    > Jack
    > Have you been using to clone the entire drive or just certain files?
    > Thanks for the reply.
    > Bob
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >


    The short answer is both.

    Typically, I use it to back up my complete system drive about every two
    weeks or just before I make major (whatever that means) changes to my system
    such as installing an SP. And much more often to back up all my data files
    which are on a separate partition, D:. All backups are kept on another HD
    in the machine as well as an USB external drive. I know that is probably
    overkill if there is such a thing in spite of what J. Buffett says. I also
    keep Acronis's bootable CD on hand to restore any of the backed up files in
    case of complete disaster. Further, I have a small batch file which uses
    Xcopy and some switches to back up a few files each time I make a change to
    them.
    Jack Gillis, Jan 31, 2008
    #8
  9. Bob Bob

    Bob Bob Guest

    On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 07:39:32 -0500, "Jack Gillis"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> On Wed, 30 Jan 2008 12:46:16 -0500, "Jack Gillis"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Hi Bob,
    >>>
    >>>I have used Acronis True Image on my three machines for years. It has
    >>>never
    >>>let me down.
    >>>
    >>>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:...
    >>>> Hi
    >>>> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >>>> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >>>> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >>>> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >>>> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >>>> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >>>> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >>>> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >>>> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >>>> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>>>
    >>>> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >>>> with them.
    >>>>
    >>>> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >>>> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >>>> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >>>> Exec.
    >>>>
    >>>> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >>>> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >>>> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>>>
    >>>> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >>>> Bob
    >>>>
    >>>> --
    >>>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com

    >>
    >>
    >> Jack
    >> Have you been using to clone the entire drive or just certain files?
    >> Thanks for the reply.
    >> Bob
    >>
    >> --
    >> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>

    >
    >The short answer is both.
    >
    >Typically, I use it to back up my complete system drive about every two
    >weeks or just before I make major (whatever that means) changes to my system
    >such as installing an SP. And much more often to back up all my data files
    >which are on a separate partition, D:. All backups are kept on another HD
    >in the machine as well as an USB external drive. I know that is probably
    >overkill if there is such a thing in spite of what J. Buffett says. I also
    >keep Acronis's bootable CD on hand to restore any of the backed up files in
    >case of complete disaster. Further, I have a small batch file which uses
    >Xcopy and some switches to back up a few files each time I make a change to
    >them.

    Jack
    Just certain files, although on occasion, I have cloned an entire
    drive when I had questions about the customer or his lack of knowledge
    as to what he had and/or wanted saved.
    It has always worked well....and they are excellent on tech questions.
    It is probably a bit overkill for the customers but may be the best
    there is. I am keenly interested in the synced type of backup that
    PeeCee and I have been talking about. I am just a bit bothered by the
    software deciding what needs to be synced in order to save time.
    By all appearances, it looks like it may be the smartest way to go for
    the everyday user....and for those who are called when a restore is
    needed.

    It seems like a lot of us use Xcopy for something....

    To what drive do you write the complete system backup to? I too have
    gone back to separate data partitions, a practice that was common when
    hard drives were not as reliable as today.....and neither was Window!
    It just makes recovery easier...and backup too.

    J. Buffet--he is the 5 o'clock somewhere guy, isn't he?

    I appreciate the time.
    Bob

    --
    Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    Bob Bob, Feb 1, 2008
    #9
  10. Bob Bob

    PeeCee Guest

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 20:18:12 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:
    >
    >>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> On Thu, 31 Jan 2008 10:27:59 +1300, "PeeCee" <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>"Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    >>>>news:...
    >>>>> Hi
    >>>>> For longer than I would like to admit, I have been using various
    >>>>> mostly inexpensive backup software for customers to back up their
    >>>>> data and their/our experience has never been that good. What with
    >>>>> companies going out of business, merging with others, lack of support
    >>>>> for some current tasks or for new devices and the like, it seems like
    >>>>> no one is very satisfied. Most of the applications don't seem to build
    >>>>> in a backup process, save some like QBooks, and we still want to get
    >>>>> all the backup data copied to removable media.
    >>>>> We have the removable media down pat, but the software seems to be
    >>>>> like having a moving gun and a moving target.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I am interested in products others have used and their experiences
    >>>>> with them.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> So far, the Second Copy 2000 seems to be the most fundamentally sound
    >>>>> but it does not have a pretty face, like some of the others like
    >>>>> BackupMyPc(since not the same name), Backu4all and even the old Backup
    >>>>> Exec.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> I usually want to backup mostly office type files/data like QBooks,
    >>>>> ACT, My Documents and custom user software to USB drives, to and from
    >>>>> network drives and don't want to write any more batch files.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Anyway, I appreciate the time.
    >>>>> Bob
    >>>>>
    >>>>> --
    >>>>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>>Bob
    >>>>
    >>>>Have a look at Syncback
    >>>>http://www.2brightsparks.com/downloads.html#freeware
    >>>>(halfway down page)
    >>>>
    >>>>Works for myself and several of my clients.
    >>>>Typical setup would be to create a backup profile for each category e.g.
    >>>>My
    >>>>Documents, Emails (OE store folder or OL .pst) Address Book, Favourites,
    >>>>and
    >>>>their particular Book keeping software (MYOB etc)
    >>>>I usually leave it at defaults which means if a file with the same
    >>>>date/time/size is in the destination then ignore it, if it isn't copy it
    >>>>there.
    >>>>This means the first run takes a while as Syncback has to copy every
    >>>>file
    >>>>to
    >>>>the backup device, after than it only copies the new or altered files
    >>>>which
    >>>>means it can be very quick to do.
    >>>>Once I've run each of these profiles and copied the first run of files
    >>>>to
    >>>>the backup device be it an RW disk, external HD or flash stick, I'll
    >>>>create
    >>>>a 'Group' and include all the profiles in it and name the group 'all'
    >>>>Then I write 1 small batch file (sorry it does make it easier) that
    >>>>consists
    >>>>of one line "syncback.exe all" and save it in the Syncback folder in
    >>>>Program
    >>>>Files.
    >>>>
    >>>>A desktop short cut to this batch file means the user only has to put in
    >>>>their backup device, double click the this shortcut, wait for the black
    >>>>window to disappear and their backup is done.
    >>>>Syncback does have the ability to schedule backups using Windows
    >>>>Scheduler
    >>>>if need be.
    >>>>
    >>>>Downside
    >>>>The free version doesn't do shadow copy which means the user has to exit
    >>>>all
    >>>>programs that Syncback backs up otherwise you get a 'in use' error.
    >>>>
    >>>>Upside.
    >>>>Once set up it just plain works.
    >>>>Will compress (zip) files if wanted.
    >>>>Has lots of settings to 'refine' how the files are backed up.
    >>>>
    >>>>Best
    >>>>Paul.
    >>> Paul
    >>> Thanks for the time.
    >>> I am not too keen on the synching idea as it would be a leap of faith
    >>> for me. However...
    >>>
    >>> Have you done any restores with it?
    >>>
    >>> That 'in use' error sounds like Second
    >>> Copy(http://www.centered.com/products.html).
    >>>
    >>> In fact, your descriptions also sound like Second Copy.
    >>>
    >>> Batch files can be very helpful. Sometimes users(customers) get in the
    >>> way as they turn a networked machine, fouling up the drive lettering
    >>> and then the batch file has issues....
    >>>
    >>> I will give the site a look see.
    >>> Again,
    >>> Thanks
    >>> Bob
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >>Bob
    >>
    >>" have I done any restores"
    >>
    >>If you understand a Syncback backup is exactly the same layout as the
    >>parent
    >>(or source)
    >>Then all you have to do is drag & drop from the backup to where ever you
    >>want.
    >>
    >>Case in point.
    >>My personal backups using Syncback go to a Netgear NDAS box (network
    >>attached storage)
    >>One of the profiles I run is to backup my utilities drive which contains
    >>my
    >>(er cough!) password access tools.
    >>A PC I had on the bench had arrived (as usual) without any password
    >>information so I ran one of these tools directly from my utilites drive.
    >>Quick as a wink the PC's Security suite picked up the nature of the tool
    >>and
    >>blithley reported it had stopped the tool and 'deleted' it.
    >>Bugger, that particular tool is very useful.
    >>To get it back all I had to do was go to my NDAS drive find the missing
    >>file
    >>& copy and paste it back in place where it belonged.
    >>
    >>Second Copy, yep from what I can see on their website it is not disimilar
    >>to
    >>Syncback.
    >>
    >>(re reading your OP)
    >>I detect a certain desperation in your post, sort of I want to set it and
    >>forget it plea.
    >>'Fact of life' backup profiles are uniqe and backup systems allways
    >>require
    >>maintenance.
    >>Over the years I have build run and maintained many backup systems from
    >>floppy to tape to CD to Flash etc etc.
    >>All of them have required maintenance if for no other reason than to make
    >>sure the backup archive is valid,
    >>
    >>One of the scary parts of backing up is the restore phase, will it work,
    >>will xyz book keeping program accept the backup I've done.
    >>Well the best advice I can give is to make sure by building a clone of the
    >>client's system and trying it out.
    >>Very quickly you will find out what files you can drag & drop to restore
    >>and
    >>what files need a more formal 'import' routine.
    >>
    >>
    >>Other random observations.
    >>The best backups are done by those that know they will have to do the
    >>restore.
    >>Multiple systems are recommended if the data is at all critical. (took me
    >>two full nights to get one doctors system up that had a defective burner,
    >>a
    >>weeks worth of backups u/s, ouch)
    >>Full image backups (aka True Image) are simple in concept but not allways
    >>the right solution.
    >>Incremental backups are fine (aka Syncback) and quicker
    >>The quicker the backup the more likely it will be done.
    >>After hours (scheduled) backups fall over, someone must be responsible for
    >>reading the log file 'daily'
    >>If you must have low cost shadowed backups then MS Backup is allready in
    >>all
    >>Windows versions up to XP
    >>
    >>I allways suggest each site has it's own formal 'Backup' documentation,
    >>not
    >>all site take this on board.
    >>Backup procedures should include the who, what, when and where components
    >>Persons or positions responsible should be specifically spelled out in
    >>this
    >>backup procedure
    >>That way when the routine review of a backup picks up someone stuffed it
    >>up
    >>by (eg) tuning off the network drive it is easy to give someone a wakeup
    >>call 'before' a backup is needed in realtime.
    >>
    >>One thing is for sure Bob, backups are going to be a continued source of
    >>work for the forseeable future.
    >>
    >>Best
    >>Paul.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    > Paul
    > We seem to have some common thoughts here...can we talk via email?
    > Bob
    >
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >




    Bob

    Re your comment to Jack
    "I am just a bit bothered by the software deciding what needs to be synced"

    Not a problem with Syncback, because "YOU" decide what the rules are for
    what is copied/overwritten/deleted/ignored.
    At first sight setting up a Syncback profile is kinda scary, but if you sit
    and read the screens involved in setting up your backup you will realise you
    can tell it to do almost anything.
    The settings for a backup up in Syncback is called a 'Profile'

    In Syncback there are two modes when you set up a profile.
    A the 'Easy' options
    B 'Expert' options

    If we take the default 'Easy' option when you create a profile the window
    you see has three drop down and typeable spaces (& browsable) at the top
    that allow you to define where the 'Source' files are, where the
    'Destination' of the backup is and what action to take with sub directories.
    The default actions it takes is clearly displayed in a window on this page
    eg.(Using my 'Documents' backup on my Vista PC as an example)

    *Files will be copied from the source directory (C:\Users\PeeCee\Documents)
    to the destination directory (N:\PeeCeeBackups\Documents) [N is my
    Netgear NDAS box]
    *All the sub-directories and their files will be copied
    *If the same file has been changed in both the source and destination
    directories then 'the source file will replace the destination file'.
    *Files only in the source are copied to the destination
    *If a file is only in the destination then it is 'ignored'

    The one 'rule' it doesnt state (as it's rather obvious) is
    * if the Source file has the same attributes as the Destination file then
    ignore it.
    The parameters it examines for this 'sameness' is Name Size and Date but
    even this is customisable under the Expert mode.

    It's the ability to save time by 'not' copying a file that is exactly the
    same in both source and destination that makes it so attractive.
    If you've only changed 1 file today in a folder containing 1000 files, why
    copy the 999 that haven't changed?

    About now I am probably loosing you, so I suggest you go get a copy, it's
    free and in my experience can be installed without breaking anything.
    Then you can explore it's options.
    And there are plenty.
    In the 'Easy' profile setup, there are 5 tabs to explore.
    These tabs cover just about everything you are likely to want your backup to
    do, I'll leave you to check them out.

    'Expert' profile setup screen.
    Looks the same as the 'Easy' screen except it has 14 tabs as against the
    Easy screens 5.
    Suffice it to say here you will find rarer but usefull options like entering
    user/passwords for network shares, sending emails when a backup is run,
    closing apps before the backup, runing other apps 'before' or 'after' the
    backup.........
    i.e. all the tools a Sys Admin finds usefull to manage their often
    disinterested clients.

    Does it work.
    Yes! (though as a true geek the usual rider applies YMMV)
    All things being equal I've found it reliable.
    Sure if the LAN's down, someone turns off the Server, power cuts, coffee,
    wonder what that icon does 'idiots' will stuff it up, but that's part of the
    normal maintenance and oversight of 'any' backup.

    BTW there is quite a difference between a 'Sync' and a 'Backup'

    Best
    Paul.
    PeeCee, Feb 1, 2008
    #10
  11. Bob Bob

    Jack Gillis Guest

    "Bob Bob" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    ------ Much Snipped ------------

    >>>
    >>> Jack
    >>> Have you been using to clone the entire drive or just certain files?
    >>> Thanks for the reply.
    >>> Bob
    >>>
    >>> --
    >>> Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >>>

    >>
    >>The short answer is both.
    >>
    >>Typically, I use it to back up my complete system drive about every two
    >>weeks or just before I make major (whatever that means) changes to my
    >>system
    >>such as installing an SP. And much more often to back up all my data
    >>files
    >>which are on a separate partition, D:. All backups are kept on another HD
    >>in the machine as well as an USB external drive. I know that is probably
    >>overkill if there is such a thing in spite of what J. Buffett says. I
    >>also
    >>keep Acronis's bootable CD on hand to restore any of the backed up files
    >>in
    >>case of complete disaster. Further, I have a small batch file which uses
    >>Xcopy and some switches to back up a few files each time I make a change
    >>to
    >>them.

    > Jack
    > Just certain files, although on occasion, I have cloned an entire
    > drive when I had questions about the customer or his lack of knowledge
    > as to what he had and/or wanted saved.
    > It has always worked well....and they are excellent on tech questions.
    > It is probably a bit overkill for the customers but may be the best
    > there is. I am keenly interested in the synced type of backup that
    > PeeCee and I have been talking about. I am just a bit bothered by the
    > software deciding what needs to be synced in order to save time.
    > By all appearances, it looks like it may be the smartest way to go for
    > the everyday user....and for those who are called when a restore is
    > needed.
    >
    > It seems like a lot of us use Xcopy for something....


    Yes, it probably is. It is a hold over from DOS and OS2 days and is a quick
    and easy way to backup about a half dozen very important financial files.

    >
    > To what drive do you write the complete system backup to? I too have
    > gone back to separate data partitions, a practice that was common when
    > hard drives were not as reliable as today.....and neither was Window!
    > It just makes recovery easier...and backup too.


    All backups go to partition on HD1 (the second physical drive) plus a
    partition on a USB HD. HD0 has the system partition (C:) and a data partion
    (D:) The USB contains three partitions. Each for a clone of the system
    drive for each of my three maciines as they existed just after I installed
    XP plus Office and other major programs and setup the configuration I liked
    at the time.

    I used Norton's Ghost to do the backups for a long time until Norton was no
    longer Norton and I discovered Acronis True Image through someone the NG.
    Whoever you were, I thank you.

    >
    > J. Buffet--he is the 5 o'clock somewhere guy, isn't he?


    If I said Margaritaville, would that jog memory? :). He also wrote a song
    titled "Overkill." Yep, I know my scheme is overkill probably but it
    gives me the warm fuzzies.


    >
    > I appreciate the time.
    > Bob
    >
    > --
    > Posted via a free Usenet account from http://www.teranews.com
    >
    Jack Gillis, Feb 1, 2008
    #11
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