Looking for good backup power supply (UPS)

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by Daniel, Oct 25, 2003.

  1. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need one that
    can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last through
    short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3 systems every
    time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often, but about
    once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this occures.
    I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any time (two 350W
    power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15" monitors, cable modem,
    router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend much if
    possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be enough).
     
    Daniel, Oct 25, 2003
    #1
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  2. Daniel

    Meat-Plow Guest

    On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 10:11:10 -0500, Daniel wrote:

    > Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need one that
    > can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last through
    > short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3 systems every
    > time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often, but about
    > once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this occures.
    > I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any time (two 350W
    > power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15" monitors, cable modem,
    > router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend much if
    > possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be enough).


    APC Matrix series.
     
    Meat-Plow, Oct 25, 2003
    #2
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  3. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    "Meat-Plow" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 10:11:10 -0500, Daniel wrote:
    >
    > > Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need one

    that
    > > can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last

    through
    > > short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3 systems

    every
    > > time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often, but

    about
    > > once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this occures.
    > > I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any time (two 350W
    > > power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15" monitors, cable

    modem,
    > > router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend much

    if
    > > possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be enough).

    >
    > APC Matrix series.


    Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not willing to
    risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up consumer reporst
    on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings on PriceWatch.com?
    Nearly every time they suck as a business & are more of a rip off company.
    But if a company has a good reputation & low price, then I'll buy from
    them.)
     
    Daniel, Oct 25, 2003
    #3
  4. Daniel

    Rick Merrill Guest

    Daniel wrote:

    > "Meat-Plow" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    >
    >>On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 10:11:10 -0500, Daniel wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need one

    >
    > that
    >
    >>>can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last

    >
    > through
    >
    >>>short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3 systems

    >
    > every
    >
    >>>time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often, but

    >
    > about
    >
    >>>once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this occures.
    >>>I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any time (two 350W
    >>>power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15" monitors, cable

    >
    > modem,
    >
    >>>router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend much

    >
    > if
    >
    >>>possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be enough).

    >>
    >>APC Matrix series.

    >
    >
    > Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not willing to
    > risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up consumer reporst
    > on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings on PriceWatch.com?
    > Nearly every time they suck as a business & are more of a rip off company.
    > But if a company has a good reputation & low price, then I'll buy from
    > them.)
    >
    >


    Try EBAY:

    http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&category=3751&item=2760534616

    (not mine)
     
    Rick Merrill, Oct 25, 2003
    #4
  5. Daniel

    pcbutts1 Guest

    Try http://catalog.belkin.com/IWCatSectionView.process?Section_Id=201476

    --


    The best live web video on the internet http://www.seedsv.com/webdemo.htm
    Sharpvision simply the best http://www.seedsv.com



    "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need one that
    > can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last

    through
    > short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3 systems

    every
    > time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often, but about
    > once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this occures.
    > I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any time (two 350W
    > power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15" monitors, cable

    modem,
    > router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend much

    if
    > possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be enough).
    >
    >
     
    pcbutts1, Oct 25, 2003
    #5
  6. Daniel

    Sultan Guest

    Daniel wrote in news::

    > "Meat-Plow" <> wrote in message
    > news:p...
    >> On Sat, 25 Oct 2003 10:11:10 -0500, Daniel wrote:
    >>
    >> > Can anyone recommend a good uninteruptable power supply? I need
    >> > one

    > that
    >> > can handle about 2000W (yes, about 2KW) & really only needs to last

    > through
    >> > short power flickers or brown-outs. I'm tired of losing all 3
    >> > systems

    > every
    >> > time there is a slight power flicker (doesn't happen that often,
    >> > but

    > about
    >> > once a month). All systems reboot due to power loss when this
    >> > occures. I've estimated I'm not pulling more than a max 2KW at any
    >> > time (two 350W power supplies, one 250W power supply, 21" 19" & 15"
    >> > monitors, cable

    > modem,
    >> > router, hub, speakers, printer & scanner). I'm trying to not spend
    >> > much

    > if
    >> > possible (so one of those 15 minute backup batteries would be
    >> > enough).

    >>
    >> APC Matrix series.

    >
    > Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not
    > willing to risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up
    > consumer reporst on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings
    > on PriceWatch.com? Nearly every time they suck as a business & are
    > more of a rip off company. But if a company has a good reputation &
    > low price, then I'll buy from them.)
    >
    >


    Check out http://www.cdw.com they are not always the lowest price but you
    will never have to worry about getting ripped off.

    Sultan


    -----= Posted via Newsfeeds.Com, Uncensored Usenet News =-----
    http://www.newsfeeds.com - The #1 Newsgroup Service in the World!
    -----== Over 100,000 Newsgroups - 19 Different Servers! =-----
     
    Sultan, Oct 25, 2003
    #6
  7. "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:

    > Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not willing
    > to risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up consumer
    > reporst on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings on
    > PriceWatch.com? Nearly every time they suck as a business & are more of a
    > rip off company. But if a company has a good reputation & low price, then
    > I'll buy from them.)


    McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com

    EVERYTHING in the way of industrial equipment and supplies. You can
    literally build a factory from the ground up using their catalog. Fast
    service, good prices. HIGHLY recommended.

    You have to be a bit of a geek I suppose, but just browsing through their
    site is a lot of fun. :)
    --
    Gary G. Taylor * Rialto, CA
    gary at donavan dot org / http:// geetee dot donavan dot org
    "The two most abundant things in the universe
    are hydrogen and stupidity." --Harlan Ellison
     
    Gary G. Taylor, Oct 25, 2003
    #7
  8. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    "Gary G. Taylor" <> wrote in message
    news:JaBmb.61$...
    > "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:
    >
    > > Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not

    willing
    > > to risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up consumer
    > > reporst on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings on
    > > PriceWatch.com? Nearly every time they suck as a business & are more of

    a
    > > rip off company. But if a company has a good reputation & low price,

    then
    > > I'll buy from them.)

    >
    > McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com
    >

    http://www.resellerratings.com/seller4064.html

    You're not the only one saying this about them.

    > EVERYTHING in the way of industrial equipment and supplies. You can
    > literally build a factory from the ground up using their catalog. Fast
    > service, good prices. HIGHLY recommended.
    >
    > You have to be a bit of a geek I suppose, but just browsing through their
    > site is a lot of fun. :)
    > --
    > Gary G. Taylor * Rialto, CA
    > gary at donavan dot org / http:// geetee dot donavan dot org
    > "The two most abundant things in the universe
    > are hydrogen and stupidity." --Harlan Ellison
     
    Daniel, Nov 7, 2003
    #8
  9. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    On page 755 they list their UPSs. However they mention Volt-Amps & Watts as
    different measurements. I always thought V * A = W, so if that is true then
    why / how are they different numbers?

    Also I'm needing this for 2 computers (350W power supply each, though I
    doubt they're actually using that much), + 19 & 21" monitors, cable modem &
    router. I know I'm not using more than 15 amps (thats all the breaker I'm
    on can handle).

    "Gary G. Taylor" <> wrote in message
    news:JaBmb.61$...
    > "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:
    >
    > > Do you know who sells them or for the lower cost (best price, not

    willing
    > > to risk buying from a bad company...for example ever looked up consumer
    > > reporst on almost all of the top ranked lowest price listings on
    > > PriceWatch.com? Nearly every time they suck as a business & are more of

    a
    > > rip off company. But if a company has a good reputation & low price,

    then
    > > I'll buy from them.)

    >
    > McMaster-Carr: http://www.mcmaster.com
    >
    > EVERYTHING in the way of industrial equipment and supplies. You can
    > literally build a factory from the ground up using their catalog. Fast
    > service, good prices. HIGHLY recommended.
    >
    > You have to be a bit of a geek I suppose, but just browsing through their
    > site is a lot of fun. :)
    > --
    > Gary G. Taylor * Rialto, CA
    > gary at donavan dot org / http:// geetee dot donavan dot org
    > "The two most abundant things in the universe
    > are hydrogen and stupidity." --Harlan Ellison
     
    Daniel, Nov 7, 2003
    #9
  10. Daniel

    nemo Guest

    Daniel,

    For a purely resistive load, the power dissipated, in watts, is simply
    volts rms times amps rms (watts == volt-amps).

    If the load contains inductors (eg most motors or transformers), or
    capacitors, the current either lags behind or leads the voltage.
    Voltage and current are out of phase. When the voltage reaches its
    peak the current is not at its peak. If the difference in time
    between voltage peak and current peak is given as an angle, theta (one
    complete cycle = 360 degrees), then the power is volts rms times amps
    rms times cosine(theta). Volt-amps is greater than watts.

    When the alternating current supply is rectified to obtain the direct
    current needed by most electronics, the current waveform may be far
    from sinusoidal, for example "square-wave"-like or a series of
    impulses. Here the power must be determined by calculating the product
    of the instantaneous voltage and current, and integrating the product
    over a full cycle. Watts will generally not be equal to volts times
    amps.

    So, in sizing a UPS, make sure that the total load requires fewer
    watts, AND fewer volt-amps than the rating of the UPS.

    Regards

    nemo

    >On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 14:46:44 -0600, "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:


    >On page 755 they list their UPSs. However they mention Volt-Amps & Watts as
    >different measurements. I always thought V * A = W, so if that is true then
    >why / how are they different numbers?
    >
    >Also I'm needing this for 2 computers (350W power supply each, though I
    >doubt they're actually using that much), + 19 & 21" monitors, cable modem &
    >router. I know I'm not using more than 15 amps (thats all the breaker I'm
    >on can handle).
    >
    >
     
    nemo, Nov 8, 2003
    #10
  11. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    "nemo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Daniel,
    >
    > For a purely resistive load, the power dissipated, in watts, is simply
    > volts rms times amps rms (watts == volt-amps).
    >
    > If the load contains inductors (eg most motors or transformers), or
    > capacitors, the current either lags behind or leads the voltage.
    > Voltage and current are out of phase. When the voltage reaches its
    > peak the current is not at its peak. If the difference in time
    > between voltage peak and current peak is given as an angle, theta (one
    > complete cycle = 360 degrees), then the power is volts rms times amps
    > rms times cosine(theta). Volt-amps is greater than watts.
    >
    > When the alternating current supply is rectified to obtain the direct
    > current needed by most electronics, the current waveform may be far
    > from sinusoidal, for example "square-wave"-like or a series of
    > impulses. Here the power must be determined by calculating the product
    > of the instantaneous voltage and current, and integrating the product
    > over a full cycle. Watts will generally not be equal to volts times
    > amps.
    >
    > So, in sizing a UPS, make sure that the total load requires fewer
    > watts, AND fewer volt-amps than the rating of the UPS.
    >

    But thats the problem. How do I know how many volt-amps I need?

    > Regards
    >
    > nemo
    >
    > >On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 14:46:44 -0600, "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom>

    wrote:
    >
    > >On page 755 they list their UPSs. However they mention Volt-Amps & Watts

    as
    > >different measurements. I always thought V * A = W, so if that is true

    then
    > >why / how are they different numbers?
    > >
    > >Also I'm needing this for 2 computers (350W power supply each, though I
    > >doubt they're actually using that much), + 19 & 21" monitors, cable modem

    &
    > >router. I know I'm not using more than 15 amps (thats all the breaker

    I'm
    > >on can handle).
    > >
    > >
     
    Daniel, Nov 8, 2003
    #11
  12. Daniel

    nemo Guest

    Daniel,

    In your application I the watts and volt-amps are effectively going to
    be the same; if there is a difference it will be negligible. Power
    factor is only normally a problem in factories where they have large
    motors etc.

    Regards

    nemo

    On Sat, 8 Nov 2003 14:52:20 -0600, "Daniel"
    <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:

    >"nemo" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> Daniel,
    >>
    >> For a purely resistive load, the power dissipated, in watts, is simply
    >> volts rms times amps rms (watts == volt-amps).
    >>
    >> If the load contains inductors (eg most motors or transformers), or
    >> capacitors, the current either lags behind or leads the voltage.
    >> Voltage and current are out of phase. When the voltage reaches its
    >> peak the current is not at its peak. If the difference in time
    >> between voltage peak and current peak is given as an angle, theta (one
    >> complete cycle = 360 degrees), then the power is volts rms times amps
    >> rms times cosine(theta). Volt-amps is greater than watts.
    >>
    >> When the alternating current supply is rectified to obtain the direct
    >> current needed by most electronics, the current waveform may be far
    >> from sinusoidal, for example "square-wave"-like or a series of
    >> impulses. Here the power must be determined by calculating the product
    >> of the instantaneous voltage and current, and integrating the product
    >> over a full cycle. Watts will generally not be equal to volts times
    >> amps.
    >>
    >> So, in sizing a UPS, make sure that the total load requires fewer
    >> watts, AND fewer volt-amps than the rating of the UPS.
    >>

    >But thats the problem. How do I know how many volt-amps I need?
    >
    >> Regards
    >>
    >> nemo
    >>
    >> >On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 14:46:44 -0600, "Daniel" <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom>

    >wrote:
    >>
    >> >On page 755 they list their UPSs. However they mention Volt-Amps & Watts

    >as
    >> >different measurements. I always thought V * A = W, so if that is true

    >then
    >> >why / how are they different numbers?
    >> >
    >> >Also I'm needing this for 2 computers (350W power supply each, though I
    >> >doubt they're actually using that much), + 19 & 21" monitors, cable modem

    >&
    >> >router. I know I'm not using more than 15 amps (thats all the breaker

    >I'm
    >> >on can handle).
    >> >
    >> >

    >
     
    nemo, Nov 9, 2003
    #12
  13. Daniel

    Daniel Guest

    "nemo" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Daniel,
    >
    > In your application I the watts and volt-amps are effectively going to
    > be the same; if there is a difference it will be negligible. Power
    > factor is only normally a problem in factories where they have large
    > motors etc.
    >

    So you're saying I only need to focus on making sure the watts is enough? I
    saw some which were 1K volt-amps but only 700W. I'd assume as long as I'm
    within the 700W then I'm OK there.

    Now does anyone know likely how many watts I'm using in 2 computers with
    350W power supplies? I know it isn't over 700 (or I'd be burning out the
    power supplies). I'm running the following:
    ** AMD Athlon/Thunderbird 1.2GHz, 512MB RAM (100MHz), ATI All-in-Wonder
    Radeon 7500 AGP video card (64MB RAM), ocasionally use it's TV tuner, SB
    Live sound card, floppy drive, 2 hard drives (30 & 45GB, 5400RPM), DVD/CD-RW
    combo drive.
    ** AMD Athlon XP2200, 512MB RAM (2700DDR), ATI All-in-Wonder Radeon 7500 AGP
    video card (64MB RAM), also using it's tuner (more often than on other
    system), on board audio, floppy drive, 120 & 80 GB 7200RPM hard drives,
    DVD-ROM & CD-RW (seperate drives).

    Again I only need to protect agains the power spikes, brown outs, flickers,
    things like that to keep the systems from resetting on me, so not needing
    much backup time on the battery (really 30 seconds would do). I just don't
    want a bunch of power surges hitting the systems if something happens
    (flickering power on & off). And I'd prefer a UPS which would shut itself
    off (permanently until manually switched back on) if power goes out or out
    of normal operation (too high/low voltage, not enough current) & doesn't
    return to normal by the time the UPS's battery runs down (where even if the
    battery is able to recharge, the UPS would stay off until manually powered
    back on, so that way I don't have a problem of on/off/on/off/on/off when I'm
    away, it would be on/off.....off....off).

    > Regards
    >
    > nemo
    >
    > On Sat, 8 Nov 2003 14:52:20 -0600, "Daniel"
    > <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom> wrote:
    >
    > >"nemo" <> wrote in message
    > >news:...
    > >> Daniel,
    > >>
    > >> For a purely resistive load, the power dissipated, in watts, is simply
    > >> volts rms times amps rms (watts == volt-amps).
    > >>
    > >> If the load contains inductors (eg most motors or transformers), or
    > >> capacitors, the current either lags behind or leads the voltage.
    > >> Voltage and current are out of phase. When the voltage reaches its
    > >> peak the current is not at its peak. If the difference in time
    > >> between voltage peak and current peak is given as an angle, theta (one
    > >> complete cycle = 360 degrees), then the power is volts rms times amps
    > >> rms times cosine(theta). Volt-amps is greater than watts.
    > >>
    > >> When the alternating current supply is rectified to obtain the direct
    > >> current needed by most electronics, the current waveform may be far
    > >> from sinusoidal, for example "square-wave"-like or a series of
    > >> impulses. Here the power must be determined by calculating the product
    > >> of the instantaneous voltage and current, and integrating the product
    > >> over a full cycle. Watts will generally not be equal to volts times
    > >> amps.
    > >>
    > >> So, in sizing a UPS, make sure that the total load requires fewer
    > >> watts, AND fewer volt-amps than the rating of the UPS.
    > >>

    > >But thats the problem. How do I know how many volt-amps I need?
    > >
    > >> Regards
    > >>
    > >> nemo
    > >>
    > >> >On Fri, 7 Nov 2003 14:46:44 -0600, "Daniel"

    <daniel_h_wATyyahooDOTccom>
    > >wrote:
    > >>
    > >> >On page 755 they list their UPSs. However they mention Volt-Amps &

    Watts
    > >as
    > >> >different measurements. I always thought V * A = W, so if that is

    true
    > >then
    > >> >why / how are they different numbers?
    > >> >
    > >> >Also I'm needing this for 2 computers (350W power supply each, though

    I
    > >> >doubt they're actually using that much), + 19 & 21" monitors, cable

    modem
    > >&
    > >> >router. I know I'm not using more than 15 amps (thats all the breaker

    > >I'm
    > >> >on can handle).
    > >> >
    > >> >

    > >

    >
     
    Daniel, Nov 9, 2003
    #13
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