Linux still not ready for the desktop

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Nik Coughlin, May 18, 2009.

  1. Nik Coughlin

    Nik Coughlin Guest

    Nik Coughlin, May 18, 2009
    #1
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  2. Nik Coughlin

    Enkidu Guest

    Nik Coughlin wrote:
    > http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html
    >
    > Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others
    > generally release *nix ports.
    >

    I'd disagree with at least 75% of what he says. For example the whole
    section on sound. There is zero control on Windows, but immense
    flexibility in Linux and for it being difficult to set up sound levels,
    I've no idea what he is on about. Maybe it is because Windows
    automatically levels everything, so that everything sounds the same but
    you lose soft tones and loud tones are, well, butchered by Windows.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    The Internet is interesting in that although the nicknames may change,
    the same old personalities show through.
    Enkidu, May 18, 2009
    #2
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  3. Nik Coughlin

    Nik Coughlin Guest

    "Enkidu" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Nik Coughlin wrote:
    >> http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html
    >>
    >> Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others
    >> generally release *nix ports.
    >>

    > I'd disagree with at least 75% of what he says. For example the whole
    > section on sound. There is zero control on Windows, but immense
    > flexibility in Linux and for it being difficult to set up sound levels,
    > I've no idea what he is on about. Maybe it is because Windows
    > automatically levels everything, so that everything sounds the same but
    > you lose soft tones and loud tones are, well, butchered by Windows.


    I'm running openSUSE (yeah, yeah I know) and haven't noticed any problems
    with sound, I seem to have full control over everything, mixing etc. so I'd
    agree with you there. Not sure what you mean about zero control on Windows
    though, I seem to have the same level of control there as I do on the suse
    install, except in Windows I can set the sound settings on a per-app basis,
    which I haven't figured out how to do in suse yet.
    Nik Coughlin, May 18, 2009
    #3
  4. Nik Coughlin

    Party Animal Guest

    Nik Coughlin wrote:
    > "Enkidu" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Nik Coughlin wrote:
    >>> http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html
    >>>
    >>> Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others
    >>> generally release *nix ports.
    >>>

    >> I'd disagree with at least 75% of what he says. For example the whole
    >> section on sound. There is zero control on Windows, but immense
    >> flexibility in Linux and for it being difficult to set up sound
    >> levels, I've no idea what he is on about. Maybe it is because Windows
    >> automatically levels everything, so that everything sounds the same
    >> but you lose soft tones and loud tones are, well, butchered by Windows.

    >
    > I'm running openSUSE (yeah, yeah I know) and haven't noticed any
    > problems with sound, I seem to have full control over everything, mixing
    > etc. so I'd agree with you there. Not sure what you mean about zero
    > control on Windows though, I seem to have the same level of control
    > there as I do on the suse install, except in Windows I can set the sound
    > settings on a per-app basis, which I haven't figured out how to do in
    > suse yet.


    Windows sound has always been crap, your facilities are entirely
    dependent on the vendor. metering doesn't relate at all to input,
    output, headroom, digital clip, its all guesswork. They just left it all
    to game hardware vendors like Creative.
    To use a Windows system for sound production you need to choose your
    hardware carefully from a restricted pool of vendors, Steinberg RME,
    M-Audio etc.
    Just like Linux.
    If you aren't prepared to deal with all the variables buy a Mac.
    Party Animal, May 18, 2009
    #4
  5. Nik Coughlin

    AD. Guest

    On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    > http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html


    My favourite was this one:

    "8.1 Most distros don't allow you to easily set up a server with e.g.
    such a configuration: Samba, SMTP/POP3, Apache HTTP Auth and FTP where
    all users are virtual. LDAP is a major PITA. Authentication against
    MySQL/any other DB is also a PITA."

    Weren't we talking about desktops? And what else does all that easily
    either?

    --
    Cheers
    Anton
    AD., May 18, 2009
    #5
  6. Nik Coughlin

    Guest

    On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    > http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html
    >
    > Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others generally
    > release *nix ports.
    >
    > Please note, the author is hardly a Microsoft fanboy.  The rest of his site
    > is about Linux.


    Most of his "reasons" are laughable...and frequently in-correct...

    regards

    thing
    , May 19, 2009
    #6
  7. Nik Coughlin

    Guest

    On May 19, 11:03 am, wrote:
    > On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    >
    > >http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html

    >
    > > Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others generally
    > > release *nix ports.

    >
    > > Please note, the author is hardly a Microsoft fanboy.  The rest of his site
    > > is about Linux.

    >
    > Most of his "reasons" are laughable...and frequently in-correct...
    >
    > regards
    >
    > thing


    I mean like it should be possible to configure everything via the
    gui......just because he is a point and click moron.....I'd suggest a
    MAC in hs case.

    Cannot play blueray....most likely because of patent/
    copyright...."security" and actually I see that as an advantage.....no
    hidden apps and secret drm gets installed by Sony et al permanently
    buggering my machine.

    Autocad etc....a $10000NZ ? specialist program...kinda very niche and
    well if the software vendor chooses not to release on Linux that is
    the vendor's choice...

    Games, funny but not everyone wants to play games....

    "Questionable patents and legality status. US Linux users cannot play
    many popular audio and video formats until they purchase appropriate
    codecs. "

    um....this is a MS troll...there is no question.....oh btw where is
    SCO these days?

    ;-]

    Codecs etc well ditto Windows I would think, personally I have
    downloaded codecs for Windows and linux and they have all been free,
    never had an issue.

    etc etc....

    regards

    thing
    , May 19, 2009
    #7
  8. Nik Coughlin

    Nik Coughlin Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...
    On May 19, 11:03 am, wrote:
    > > On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    > >
    > > >http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html

    > >
    > > > Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others
    > > > generally
    > > > release *nix ports.

    > >
    > > > Please note, the author is hardly a Microsoft fanboy. The rest of his
    > > > site
    > > > is about Linux.

    > >
    > > Most of his "reasons" are laughable...and frequently in-correct...
    > >
    > > regards
    > >
    > > thing

    >
    > I mean like it should be possible to configure everything via the
    > gui......just because he is a point and click moron.....I'd suggest a
    > MAC in hs case.
    >
    > Cannot play blueray....most likely because of patent/
    > copyright...."security" and actually I see that as an advantage.....no
    > hidden apps and secret drm gets installed by Sony et al permanently
    > buggering my machine.
    >
    > Autocad etc....a $10000NZ ? specialist program...kinda very niche and
    > well if the software vendor chooses not to release on Linux that is
    > the vendor's choice...
    >
    > Games, funny but not everyone wants to play games....
    >
    > "Questionable patents and legality status. US Linux users cannot play
    > many popular audio and video formats until they purchase appropriate
    > codecs. "
    >
    > um....this is a MS troll...there is no question.....oh btw where is
    > SCO these days?


    I don't know about that, rest of his site which has been around a lot longer
    than that post is about Linux. I think I saw him post elsewhere that this is
    more his personal wishlist than anything.

    Anyway, the guestbook has some fairly good rebuttals etc.

    http://www.narod.ru/guestbook/?owner=97608919
    Nik Coughlin, May 19, 2009
    #8
  9. Nik Coughlin

    impossible Guest

    > wrote in message
    news:...
    >On May 19, 11:03 am, wrote:
    >> On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    >>
    >> >http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html

    >>
    >> > Don't know about *no* games though. I know that id and some others
    >> > generally
    >> > release *nix ports.

    >>
    >> > Please note, the author is hardly a Microsoft fanboy. The rest of his
    >> > site
    >> > is about Linux.

    >>
    >> Most of his "reasons" are laughable...and frequently in-correct...
    >>


    Lame response. Either you can demonstrate what's incorrect or you can't. I'm
    betting you can't.

    >
    >I mean like it should be possible to configure everything via the
    >gui......just because he is a point and click moron.....I'd suggest a
    >MAC in hs case.
    >


    Your elitism is howing. 99.99% of users are "point-and-click morons". Should
    developers then ignore them and cater only to the 0.01% who delight in
    typing arcane commands? If so, you shouldn't be surprised to discover that
    your wish has come true and users in turn are ignoring Linux.


    >Cannot play blueray....most likely because of patent/
    >copyright...."security" and actually I see that as an advantage.....no
    >hidden apps and secret drm gets installed by Sony et al permanently
    >buggering my machine.
    >


    Still, Linux users cannot play Blu-Ray. Perhaps your irrational fear of
    proprietary licensing schemes is getting in the way of acknowleging what,
    for a lot of new users, will be a deal breaker.

    >Autocad etc....a $10000NZ ? specialist program...kinda very niche and
    >well if the software vendor chooses not to release on Linux that is
    >the vendor's choice...
    >


    Still, Linux users cannot play Autocad. With tens of millions of users,
    Autocad is hardly a "niche" product. Are you that out of touch with what
    business users actually do on their desktops? Perhaps it's time to for you
    crawl out admin cave and have a look around in the real world.

    >Games, funny but not everyone wants to play games....
    >


    Still, between "not everyone" and the actual number of gamers in the world,
    there are at least 9 significant digits. That's several orders of magnitude
    greater than the "not everyone" who plays Linux.


    >"Questionable patents and legality status. US Linux users cannot play
    >many popular audio and video formats until they purchase appropriate
    >codecs. "
    >
    >um....this is a MS troll...there is no question.....oh btw where is
    >SCO these days?
    >
    >
    >Codecs etc well ditto Windows I would think, personally I have
    >downloaded codecs for Windows and linux and they have all been free,
    >never had an issue.
    >


    I'm sure you've personally downloaded plenty of software for free. So have
    I. Still, Linux users cannot play many popular audio and video formats until
    they purchase appropriate codecs.
    impossible, May 19, 2009
    #9
  10. Re: Is Linux ready for the desktop?

    I don't think Linux needs to demonstrate overwhelming superiority to Windows
    in all areas of application support in order to succeed. I think it just
    needs to be "good enough".

    To explain why, just look at history--specifically, the early 1990s and
    Windows 3.0 versus the Apple Mac, back when Apple still accounted for quite
    a big chunk of PC sales. Windows was _not_ overwhelmingly superior to the
    Mac, yet it succeeded in achieving much greater popularity. Why? Because it
    offered users choice, instead of tying them to the limited hardware and
    software options of the closed Apple platform. That's what made it "good
    enough".

    Nowadays it is Windows that is limiting your choice, with high minimum
    hardware requirements and inflexible licensing, a software ecosystem which
    favours vendor lock-in where the winner takes the whole market and less-
    successful competitors go out of business, and hardware vendors who can't be
    bothered to update drivers for older, yet still functioning, products when
    new operating system versions come out.

    These are all areas where Open Source is the one offering you freedom.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 19, 2009
    #10
  11. Re: Is Linux ready for the desktop?

    In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > 3: Too many distributions. So what? Choice is a good thing, not a bad
    > thing.


    People get so accustomed to the lack of choice in the proprietary-software
    world, they start implicitly assuming that that's How Things Should Be.

    The only reason proprietary software markets each end up being dominated by
    one product is because of the economics, which make it infeasible for
    competitors to stay competitive when they're not number one. It's so
    expensive to develop software when you bear all the cost, that the dominant
    player can drive prices down to the point where it's the only one making a
    profit, and everybody else goes to the wall.

    Free Software is more like the car market: there are lots of different
    models to choose from, each selling enough to make a comfortable profit for
    its makers, none of which "dominates" the market in any sense, yet nobody
    complains that too much choice confuses car buyers.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 19, 2009
    #11
  12. Nik Coughlin

    Gordon Guest

    On 2009-05-18, AD. <> wrote:
    > On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    >> http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html

    >
    > My favourite was this one:
    >
    > "8.1 Most distros don't allow you to easily set up a server with e.g.
    > such a configuration: Samba, SMTP/POP3, Apache HTTP Auth and FTP where
    > all users are virtual. LDAP is a major PITA. Authentication against
    > MySQL/any other DB is also a PITA."
    >
    > Weren't we talking about desktops? And what else does all that easily
    > either?
    >

    The point has been missed that there distro which are just servers or what
    ever else you might want.
    Gordon, May 19, 2009
    #12
  13. Nik Coughlin

    Party Animal Guest

    Gordon wrote:
    > On 2009-05-18, AD. <> wrote:
    >> On May 19, 8:55 am, "Nik Coughlin" <> wrote:
    >>> http://linuxfonts.narod.ru/why.linux.is.not.ready.for.the.desktop.html

    >> My favourite was this one:
    >>
    >> "8.1 Most distros don't allow you to easily set up a server with e.g.
    >> such a configuration: Samba, SMTP/POP3, Apache HTTP Auth and FTP where
    >> all users are virtual. LDAP is a major PITA. Authentication against
    >> MySQL/any other DB is also a PITA."
    >>
    >> Weren't we talking about desktops? And what else does all that easily
    >> either?
    >>

    > The point has been missed that there distro which are just servers or what
    > ever else you might want.


    Well they are definitely not ready for the desktop.
    Party Animal, May 19, 2009
    #13
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