Legality of Decoding SkyTV

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by JohnO, Jun 21, 2004.

  1. JohnO

    JohnO Guest

    I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:

    Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?

    My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to cellular
    phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to a tv signal but
    would have thought it was the same issue.

    Any comments?

    Cheers,JohnO
    JohnO, Jun 21, 2004
    #1
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  2. JohnO

    Howard Guest

    JohnO wrote:

    > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    >
    > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    >
    > Any comments?


    Yes, it is technically illegal.

    http://www.aardvark.co.nz/daily/2002/0724.shtml

    -H
    Howard, Jun 21, 2004
    #2
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  3. JohnO

    EMB Guest

    In news:gcrBc.2030$,
    JohnO <> expelled:
    > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    >
    > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    >
    > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to
    > cellular phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to
    > a tv signal but would have thought it was the same issue.
    >
    > Any comments?
    >

    I understand that you cannot act on anything you eavesdrop on - I guess
    watching the programme (or even decoding the data stream) is acting on the
    information you have found, so it's probably illegal.

    --
    EMB
    change two to number to reply
    EMB, Jun 21, 2004
    #3
  4. JohnO

    JohnO Guest

    "EMB" <> wrote in message
    news:cb5l8o$cao$...
    > In news:gcrBc.2030$,
    > JohnO <> expelled:
    > > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    > >
    > > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    > >
    > > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to
    > > cellular phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to
    > > a tv signal but would have thought it was the same issue.
    > >
    > > Any comments?
    > >

    > I understand that you cannot act on anything you eavesdrop on - I guess
    > watching the programme (or even decoding the data stream) is acting on the
    > information you have found, so it's probably illegal.


    Well no, listening on a radio transmission is not itself illegal so your
    argument doen't really follow, unless listening-to is not 'acting on'
    whereas looking-at is.

    However as Bruce Sinclair's article pointed out, there appears to be
    specific legislation around recieving 'programmes' that would make
    decrypting Sky without their permission illegal.

    Cheers,
    JohnO

    >
    > --
    > EMB
    > change two to number to reply
    >
    >
    JohnO, Jun 21, 2004
    #4
  5. JohnO wrote:
    > Well no, listening on a radio transmission is not itself illegal so your
    > argument doen't really follow, unless listening-to is not 'acting on'
    > whereas looking-at is.


    Surely the process of receiving the signal and converting it to audible
    sound would also be considered "acting on" if this were the case?

    The Other Guy
    The Other Guy, Jun 21, 2004
    #5
  6. JohnO

    Ren Guest

    While we're on the subject.

    Do a search on Trademe and see how many Traders are selling the Software for
    Decrypting Sky UHF.
    Ive seen some bidders pay as high as $50 for a 200Kb Copy of HVCPlus.
    A quik search of Google soon brings up some results as to where to obtain it
    from..

    Some people huh !.






    "JohnO" <> wrote in message
    news:9QsBc.2067$...
    >
    > "EMB" <> wrote in message
    > news:cb5l8o$cao$...
    > > In news:gcrBc.2030$,
    > > JohnO <> expelled:
    > > > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    > > >
    > > > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    > > >
    > > > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > > > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > > > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to
    > > > cellular phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to
    > > > a tv signal but would have thought it was the same issue.
    > > >
    > > > Any comments?
    > > >

    > > I understand that you cannot act on anything you eavesdrop on - I guess
    > > watching the programme (or even decoding the data stream) is acting on

    the
    > > information you have found, so it's probably illegal.

    >
    > Well no, listening on a radio transmission is not itself illegal so your
    > argument doen't really follow, unless listening-to is not 'acting on'
    > whereas looking-at is.
    >
    > However as Bruce Sinclair's article pointed out, there appears to be
    > specific legislation around recieving 'programmes' that would make
    > decrypting Sky without their permission illegal.
    >
    > Cheers,
    > JohnO
    >
    > >
    > > --
    > > EMB
    > > change two to number to reply
    > >
    > >

    >
    >
    Ren, Jun 21, 2004
    #6
  7. JohnO

    JohnO Guest

    "The Other Guy" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > JohnO wrote:
    > > Well no, listening on a radio transmission is not itself illegal so your
    > > argument doen't really follow, unless listening-to is not 'acting on'
    > > whereas looking-at is.

    >
    > Surely the process of receiving the signal and converting it to audible
    > sound would also be considered "acting on" if this were the case?
    >
    > The Other Guy


    That sounds logical TOG, but receiving encrypted GSM signals and listening
    is apparently legal*. I think 'acting on' really means doing something with
    the information such as forwarding it to another party, using it in a
    decision etc.

    * cannot cite references to this - I'm pretty sure this is the case though.
    JohnO, Jun 21, 2004
    #7
  8. JohnO

    thing Guest

    JohnO wrote:
    > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    >
    > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    >
    > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to cellular
    > phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to a tv signal but
    > would have thought it was the same issue.
    >
    > Any comments?
    >
    > Cheers,JohnO
    >
    >
    >


    Possibly not a criminal offence, but a civil one. You have not really
    stole anything because it was loose.....

    Interesting point, if they transmit "willy nilly" and you pick up the
    signal and decode it, is that illegal? should it be? They have freely
    transmitted the signal, its the desktop decoder box that costs.

    regards

    Thing
    thing, Jun 21, 2004
    #8
  9. JohnO

    steve Guest

    JohnO wrote:

    > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    >
    > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    >
    > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to cellular
    > phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to a tv signal
    > but would have thought it was the same issue.
    >
    > Any comments?
    >
    > Cheers,JohnO


    If you have to unscramble it, it's probably illegal.

    The next question is: how would anyone know you've done it if you don't tell
    them?
    steve, Jun 22, 2004
    #9
  10. JohnO

    JohnO Guest

    "steve" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > JohnO wrote:
    >
    > > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    > >
    > > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    > >
    > > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    > > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    > > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to

    cellular
    > > phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to a tv signal
    > > but would have thought it was the same issue.
    > >
    > > Any comments?
    > >
    > > Cheers,JohnO

    >
    > If you have to unscramble it, it's probably illegal.
    >
    > The next question is: how would anyone know you've done it if you don't

    tell
    > them?
    >


    I seem to recall, but damned if I can find authoratative reference, that it
    is *not* illegal to decode GSM cellphone signals, as long as the information
    is not acted on.. That is why I wondered about the Sky signal. However it
    does seem that there is specific legislation relating to protecting
    'programme' content as opposed to general communication between parites.
    JohnO, Jun 22, 2004
    #10
  11. JohnO

    JohnO Guest

    "Roger_Nickel" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > JohnO wrote:
    >
    > > That sounds logical TOG, but receiving encrypted GSM signals and

    listening
    > > is apparently legal*. I think 'acting on' really means doing something

    with
    > > the information such as forwarding it to another party, using it in a
    > > decision etc.

    >
    > I doubt that decrypting privileged content would be seen as "fair
    > dealing for private study or research" within the context of the
    > copyright act.


    Don't you have to make a copy for the copyright act? I.e. you can read a
    book without photocopying it and that is legal.

    Similarly watching or listening to content without storing it should not be
    an issue with regard to copyright, no?
    JohnO, Jun 22, 2004
    #11
  12. JohnO

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    JohnO wrote:

    > That sounds logical TOG, but receiving encrypted GSM signals and listening
    > is apparently legal*. I think 'acting on' really means doing something with
    > the information such as forwarding it to another party, using it in a
    > decision etc.


    I doubt that decrypting privileged content would be seen as "fair
    dealing for private study or research" within the context of the
    copyright act.
    Roger_Nickel, Jun 22, 2004
    #12
  13. JohnO

    Roger_Nickel Guest

    JohnO wrote:
    > "Roger_Nickel" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >>JohnO wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>That sounds logical TOG, but receiving encrypted GSM signals and

    >
    > listening
    >
    >>>is apparently legal*. I think 'acting on' really means doing something

    >
    > with
    >
    >>>the information such as forwarding it to another party, using it in a
    >>>decision etc.

    >>
    >> I doubt that decrypting privileged content would be seen as "fair
    >>dealing for private study or research" within the context of the
    >>copyright act.

    >
    >
    > Don't you have to make a copy for the copyright act? I.e. you can read a
    > book without photocopying it and that is legal.
    >
    > Similarly watching or listening to content without storing it should not be
    > an issue with regard to copyright, no?
    >
    >

    you could be right but decrypting the content involves making at least a
    transient copy and this could be an opening for the lawers.

    Section 227 of the Copyright Act covers this explicitly.


    227.Offence of fraudulently receiving programmes—

    (1)Every person commits an offence and is liable on summary conviction
    to a fine not exceeding $5000 who, with intent to avoid payment of any
    charge applicable to the reception of a programme included in a
    broadcasting service or cable programme service provided from a place in
    New Zealand, receives such a programme.

    (2)Where any body corporate is convicted of an offence against this
    section, every director and every person concerned in the management of
    the body corporate shall be guilty of the offence if it is proved—
    (a)That the act that constituted the offence took place with his or her
    authority, permission, or consent; and

    (b)That he or she—

    (i)Knew, or could reasonably be expected to have known, that the
    offence was to be or was being committed; and

    (ii)Failed to take all reasonable steps to prevent or stop it.

    Cf Copyright, Designs and Patents Act 1988, s 297 (UK); 1991 No 69 s 340
    Roger_Nickel, Jun 23, 2004
    #13
  14. JohnO

    notme Guest

    On Tue, 22 Jun 2004 16:43:27 +1200, "JohnO" <> wrote:

    >
    >"steve" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> JohnO wrote:
    >>
    >> > I'm sure one of the resident nz.comp bush lawyers can answer this:
    >> >
    >> > Is it technically illegal to decode and view sky's broadcast?
    >> >
    >> > My vague recollection is that it is not illegal to eavesdrop on radio
    >> > transmissions as long as you do not pass on or publish the results. I
    >> > believe this has been borne out over the issue of listening in to

    >cellular
    >> > phone calls with scanners. I'm not sure how this applies to a tv signal
    >> > but would have thought it was the same issue.
    >> >
    >> > Any comments?
    >> >
    >> > Cheers,JohnO

    >>
    >> If you have to unscramble it, it's probably illegal.
    >>
    >> The next question is: how would anyone know you've done it if you don't

    >tell
    >> them?
    >>

    >
    >I seem to recall, but damned if I can find authoratative reference, that it
    >is *not* illegal to decode GSM cellphone signals, as long as the information
    >is not acted on.. That is why I wondered about the Sky signal. However it
    >does seem that there is specific legislation relating to protecting
    >'programme' content as opposed to general communication between parites.
    >

    Here we go again with another attempt by some wanker to sell free
    software allowing the decoding of Sky. I wonder how long this listing
    will last .....

    http://www.trademe.co.nz/structure/auction_detail.asp?id=12822664
    Closes: Sat, 26 Jun
    Starting bid: $ 30

    You are bidding on software to enable sky UHF to be watched on your
    computer.

    With the help of a cheap TV card, and this software you can watch:
    SKY MOVIES
    SKY SPORT
    MAORI TV
    DISCOVERY
    PRIME
    TRIANGLE
    tv 1 2 3 4.

    Also includes a "help" option which will with ease show you how to
    operate this.

    **This is for educational purposes only, i am in no way connected with
    Sky Television**
    notme, Jun 23, 2004
    #14
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