Is Transcender worth the money?

Discussion in 'MCDST' started by Nocturnal, Mar 19, 2005.

  1. Nocturnal

    Nocturnal Guest

    $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming up with
    the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all just super rich?
    Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
     
    Nocturnal, Mar 19, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Nocturnal

    Jason Guest

    No, we recognize the ROI and TCO of such investments and instead of
    complaining about the cost, we suck it up, pay it, and thank our lucky stars
    that our company also realizes the ROI and TCO by either reimbursing in full
    or in part to help us advance our knowledge base.

    "Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
    news:...
    > $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming up
    > with the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all just
    > super rich? Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    >
     
    Jason, Mar 19, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Nocturnal

    Sean Guest

    What an obnoxious litle punk you are! I for one am amazed that you are even
    employable. I cant believe some of the replies i have seen on this board. I
    have been to alot of different message boards and the people on this one
    excel in being rude. "stop complaining" "suck it up" " stop asking and search
    google" these are typicle replies. Why do you people even bother if thats all
    you have to say? And if your so damned smart and your time is so precious
    that you cant answer simple questions then what are you doing here? Wait,
    dont answer, i will tell you... its because you are losers! get a life, get a
    job and get a girlfriend. I have never seen a message board that made
    newcomers fell so unwelcome. You people should be ashamed of yourselves.

    "Jason" wrote:

    > No, we recognize the ROI and TCO of such investments and instead of
    > complaining about the cost, we suck it up, pay it, and thank our lucky stars
    > that our company also realizes the ROI and TCO by either reimbursing in full
    > or in part to help us advance our knowledge base.
    >
    > "Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming up
    > > with the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all just
    > > super rich? Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    > >

    >
    >
    >
     
    Sean, Mar 21, 2005
    #3
  4. Nocturnal

    Jason Guest

    <rant>
    From this, I take it obnoxious means: 1. learning on your own, 2.
    investing in your own future (or demonstrating the value of it to your
    employer), and 3. motivation to learn on your own rather than ask simple
    questions to others...

    Somehow a person's marital status and career progression got in there too
    (from the get a job and get a girlfriend comment), as well as age (little
    punk).

    I will address the only substantive part of your post: the reason so many
    "newcomers" feel unwelcome. This is because their questions lack substance
    or true interest in the subject matter. Starting from a default location of
    www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:

    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp

    From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of training
    materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are, and 5.
    online (free) resources for determining readiness.

    If possessing the drive to conduct four mouseclicks instead of the three
    required to access this group makes me an obnoxious punk, then so be it. I
    think you are missing the point of these backhanded comments Sean. Those of
    us who refuse to lower the bar for learning are simply trying to maintain
    the quality of the cert and the field. I do not want an employee who
    crammed via braindumps and pirated test software working for me. It shows
    laziness, lack of intelligence and ethics, as well as downright illegal
    behavior.

    However, if someone posts a question about discrepancies between published
    objectives of the exam, and the objectives of training materials (and there
    are countless discrepancies, believe me) not only will I answer the
    question, I might ask for a resume! Recognizing these discrepancies shows
    initiative, intelligence, motivation, and a desire to get it right! And you
    think I am obnoxious? I will never be ashamed of maintaining certification
    and industry integrity, as well as acting as a catalyst for true learning.
    Can you say the same?

    I will, in closing mention that at 35 years of age, I am happily married,
    with our second child on the way. Additionally, I would also consider
    myself insanely successful in the IT sector. (I have only been in IT for
    three years and I an a helpdesk administrator with hiring and firing
    authority over a helpdesk staff, making more in half a year than the likes
    of Sean makes in a year.)
    </rant>

    P.S. Any idea what TCO and ROI refer to Sean? *smirk*

    "Sean" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > What an obnoxious litle punk you are! I for one am amazed that you are
    > even
    > employable. I cant believe some of the replies i have seen on this board.
    > I
    > have been to alot of different message boards and the people on this one
    > excel in being rude. "stop complaining" "suck it up" " stop asking and
    > search
    > google" these are typicle replies. Why do you people even bother if thats
    > all
    > you have to say? And if your so damned smart and your time is so precious
    > that you cant answer simple questions then what are you doing here? Wait,
    > dont answer, i will tell you... its because you are losers! get a life,
    > get a
    > job and get a girlfriend. I have never seen a message board that made
    > newcomers fell so unwelcome. You people should be ashamed of yourselves.
    >
    > "Jason" wrote:
    >
    >> No, we recognize the ROI and TCO of such investments and instead of
    >> complaining about the cost, we suck it up, pay it, and thank our lucky
    >> stars
    >> that our company also realizes the ROI and TCO by either reimbursing in
    >> full
    >> or in part to help us advance our knowledge base.
    >>
    >> "Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >> > $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming up
    >> > with the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all just
    >> > super rich? Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    >> >

    >>
    >>
    >>
     
    Jason, Mar 21, 2005
    #4
  5. Nocturnal

    Sean Guest

    Thats great Jason, i am glad that you are happily married and i am glad that
    you have a nice career. Thats not really the point. I agree with what you
    said.


    "Starting from a default location of
    www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:

    http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp

    From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of training
    materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are, and 5.
    online (free) resources for determining readiness."


    If thats the way everyone feels then why dont we petition to shut the
    message board down and just put up a single page that people look at with
    nothing more than a few hyperlinks, that way nobody has to be inconvenienced
    with a question.
    Oh, and maybe a nice big header that tells everyone they are not worthy of
    asking questions. Yes, the information is all there but thats part of the
    problem. Its ALL there, you have to weed through it all which is fine,
    personally i dont mind. I was under the impression that message boards were
    to help people. Whatever, i am not going to rant on and on... And yes, it was
    childish of me to bring up marital and occupational status. Like i said i was
    just shocked by the repies i see here. You do have a point about lowering the
    bar.. if thats the way feel then why do you even bother to reply? And no, i
    dont know what TCO and ROI refer to but someone on the board was nice enough
    to tell me that the answer is just a Google search away<insert sarcasm> I am
    new to IT, i spend most of my time studying Speed Density Theory and MAP
    sensors (Fuel injection, Volvo/Penta Marine Engines) see, that wasnt so hard!


    "Jason" wrote:

    > <rant>
    > From this, I take it obnoxious means: 1. learning on your own, 2.
    > investing in your own future (or demonstrating the value of it to your
    > employer), and 3. motivation to learn on your own rather than ask simple
    > questions to others...
    >
    > Somehow a person's marital status and career progression got in there too
    > (from the get a job and get a girlfriend comment), as well as age (little
    > punk).
    >
    > I will address the only substantive part of your post: the reason so many
    > "newcomers" feel unwelcome. This is because their questions lack substance
    > or true interest in the subject matter. Starting from a default location of
    > www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:
    >
    > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp
    >
    > From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    > each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of training
    > materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are, and 5.
    > online (free) resources for determining readiness.
    >
    > If possessing the drive to conduct four mouseclicks instead of the three
    > required to access this group makes me an obnoxious punk, then so be it. I
    > think you are missing the point of these backhanded comments Sean. Those of
    > us who refuse to lower the bar for learning are simply trying to maintain
    > the quality of the cert and the field. I do not want an employee who
    > crammed via braindumps and pirated test software working for me. It shows
    > laziness, lack of intelligence and ethics, as well as downright illegal
    > behavior.
    >
    > However, if someone posts a question about discrepancies between published
    > objectives of the exam, and the objectives of training materials (and there
    > are countless discrepancies, believe me) not only will I answer the
    > question, I might ask for a resume! Recognizing these discrepancies shows
    > initiative, intelligence, motivation, and a desire to get it right! And you
    > think I am obnoxious? I will never be ashamed of maintaining certification
    > and industry integrity, as well as acting as a catalyst for true learning.
    > Can you say the same?
    >
    > I will, in closing mention that at 35 years of age, I am happily married,
    > with our second child on the way. Additionally, I would also consider
    > myself insanely successful in the IT sector. (I have only been in IT for
    > three years and I an a helpdesk administrator with hiring and firing
    > authority over a helpdesk staff, making more in half a year than the likes
    > of Sean makes in a year.)
    > </rant>
    >
    > P.S. Any idea what TCO and ROI refer to Sean? *smirk*
    >
    > "Sean" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > > What an obnoxious litle punk you are! I for one am amazed that you are
    > > even
    > > employable. I cant believe some of the replies i have seen on this board.
    > > I
    > > have been to alot of different message boards and the people on this one
    > > excel in being rude. "stop complaining" "suck it up" " stop asking and
    > > search
    > > google" these are typicle replies. Why do you people even bother if thats
    > > all
    > > you have to say? And if your so damned smart and your time is so precious
    > > that you cant answer simple questions then what are you doing here? Wait,
    > > dont answer, i will tell you... its because you are losers! get a life,
    > > get a
    > > job and get a girlfriend. I have never seen a message board that made
    > > newcomers fell so unwelcome. You people should be ashamed of yourselves.
    > >
    > > "Jason" wrote:
    > >
    > >> No, we recognize the ROI and TCO of such investments and instead of
    > >> complaining about the cost, we suck it up, pay it, and thank our lucky
    > >> stars
    > >> that our company also realizes the ROI and TCO by either reimbursing in
    > >> full
    > >> or in part to help us advance our knowledge base.
    > >>
    > >> "Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
    > >> news:...
    > >> > $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming up
    > >> > with the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all just
    > >> > super rich? Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    > >> >
    > >>
    > >>
    > >>

    >
    >
    >
     
    Sean, Mar 21, 2005
    #5
  6. Nocturnal

    Jason Guest

    Um...think you missed part of my point...

    Questions are encouraged! I welcome questions! I would love questions!
    But the stuff being asked are not serious questions. Just once I'd like to
    see someone ask something that shows they actually care about what they are
    learning. For example, if someone were to ask:

    I notice in all of the objectives lisetd both on MS website and in my study
    materials little differentiation between XP Professional and XP Home
    Edition. Are there differences I should be aware of and if so, are these
    tested on the exam or needed in a real world scenario?

    No such luck, I see the questions like I previously mentioned:

    How many questions? What is a passing score? Which exams are needed? Can
    I substitute 270? Does this fulfill part of MCSA MCSE or both? Where can I
    find cheap stuff/braindumps? These questions serve only to lower the bar of
    expertise and it certainly does the profession no favors.

    "Sean" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Thats great Jason, i am glad that you are happily married and i am glad
    > that
    > you have a nice career. Thats not really the point. I agree with what you
    > said.
    >
    >
    > "Starting from a default location of
    > www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:
    >
    > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp
    >
    > From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    > each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of
    > training
    > materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are, and 5.
    > online (free) resources for determining readiness."
    >
    >
    > If thats the way everyone feels then why dont we petition to shut the
    > message board down and just put up a single page that people look at with
    > nothing more than a few hyperlinks, that way nobody has to be
    > inconvenienced
    > with a question.
    > Oh, and maybe a nice big header that tells everyone they are not worthy of
    > asking questions. Yes, the information is all there but thats part of the
    > problem. Its ALL there, you have to weed through it all which is fine,
    > personally i dont mind. I was under the impression that message boards
    > were
    > to help people. Whatever, i am not going to rant on and on... And yes, it
    > was
    > childish of me to bring up marital and occupational status. Like i said i
    > was
    > just shocked by the repies i see here. You do have a point about lowering
    > the
    > bar.. if thats the way feel then why do you even bother to reply? And no,
    > i
    > dont know what TCO and ROI refer to but someone on the board was nice
    > enough
    > to tell me that the answer is just a Google search away<insert sarcasm> I
    > am
    > new to IT, i spend most of my time studying Speed Density Theory and MAP
    > sensors (Fuel injection, Volvo/Penta Marine Engines) see, that wasnt so
    > hard!
    >
    >
    > "Jason" wrote:
    >
    >> <rant>
    >> From this, I take it obnoxious means: 1. learning on your own, 2.
    >> investing in your own future (or demonstrating the value of it to your
    >> employer), and 3. motivation to learn on your own rather than ask simple
    >> questions to others...
    >>
    >> Somehow a person's marital status and career progression got in there too
    >> (from the get a job and get a girlfriend comment), as well as age (little
    >> punk).
    >>
    >> I will address the only substantive part of your post: the reason so many
    >> "newcomers" feel unwelcome. This is because their questions lack
    >> substance
    >> or true interest in the subject matter. Starting from a default location
    >> of
    >> www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:
    >>
    >> http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp
    >>
    >> From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions
    >> on
    >> each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of
    >> training
    >> materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are, and 5.
    >> online (free) resources for determining readiness.
    >>
    >> If possessing the drive to conduct four mouseclicks instead of the three
    >> required to access this group makes me an obnoxious punk, then so be it.
    >> I
    >> think you are missing the point of these backhanded comments Sean. Those
    >> of
    >> us who refuse to lower the bar for learning are simply trying to maintain
    >> the quality of the cert and the field. I do not want an employee who
    >> crammed via braindumps and pirated test software working for me. It
    >> shows
    >> laziness, lack of intelligence and ethics, as well as downright illegal
    >> behavior.
    >>
    >> However, if someone posts a question about discrepancies between
    >> published
    >> objectives of the exam, and the objectives of training materials (and
    >> there
    >> are countless discrepancies, believe me) not only will I answer the
    >> question, I might ask for a resume! Recognizing these discrepancies
    >> shows
    >> initiative, intelligence, motivation, and a desire to get it right! And
    >> you
    >> think I am obnoxious? I will never be ashamed of maintaining
    >> certification
    >> and industry integrity, as well as acting as a catalyst for true
    >> learning.
    >> Can you say the same?
    >>
    >> I will, in closing mention that at 35 years of age, I am happily married,
    >> with our second child on the way. Additionally, I would also consider
    >> myself insanely successful in the IT sector. (I have only been in IT for
    >> three years and I an a helpdesk administrator with hiring and firing
    >> authority over a helpdesk staff, making more in half a year than the
    >> likes
    >> of Sean makes in a year.)
    >> </rant>
    >>
    >> P.S. Any idea what TCO and ROI refer to Sean? *smirk*
    >>
    >> "Sean" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >> > What an obnoxious litle punk you are! I for one am amazed that you are
    >> > even
    >> > employable. I cant believe some of the replies i have seen on this
    >> > board.
    >> > I
    >> > have been to alot of different message boards and the people on this
    >> > one
    >> > excel in being rude. "stop complaining" "suck it up" " stop asking and
    >> > search
    >> > google" these are typicle replies. Why do you people even bother if
    >> > thats
    >> > all
    >> > you have to say? And if your so damned smart and your time is so
    >> > precious
    >> > that you cant answer simple questions then what are you doing here?
    >> > Wait,
    >> > dont answer, i will tell you... its because you are losers! get a life,
    >> > get a
    >> > job and get a girlfriend. I have never seen a message board that made
    >> > newcomers fell so unwelcome. You people should be ashamed of
    >> > yourselves.
    >> >
    >> > "Jason" wrote:
    >> >
    >> >> No, we recognize the ROI and TCO of such investments and instead of
    >> >> complaining about the cost, we suck it up, pay it, and thank our lucky
    >> >> stars
    >> >> that our company also realizes the ROI and TCO by either reimbursing
    >> >> in
    >> >> full
    >> >> or in part to help us advance our knowledge base.
    >> >>
    >> >> "Nocturnal" <noctATsREMOVEupz.net> wrote in message
    >> >> news:...
    >> >> > $250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard time coming
    >> >> > up
    >> >> > with the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys all
    >> >> > just
    >> >> > super rich? Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    >> >> >
    >> >>
    >> >>
    >> >>

    >>
    >>
    >>
     
    Jason, Mar 21, 2005
    #6
  7. Nocturnal

    John O Guest

    > I will address the only substantive part of your post: the reason so many
    > "newcomers" feel unwelcome. This is because their questions lack
    > substance or true interest in the subject matter. Starting from a default
    > location of www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:
    >
    > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp
    >
    > From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    > each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of
    > training materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are,
    > and 5. online (free) resources for determining readiness.


    Jason,

    First, I agree with you completely. However, this sort of question exists in
    every newsgroup and forum where I participate. Even those that have READ
    THIS FIRST as the top message, and FAQs, and frequently posted links to the
    FAQ, and the MVPs all have the link to the FAQ in their sig....it doesn't
    matter. sigh.

    BTW, I have a source of people for you...truly good ones. If you're really
    interested in some outstanding techs, I can put you in front of about 70 of
    them at the end of June...the best that come out of high schools and some
    colleges. And in the spirit of this thread, you know how to reach me. ;-)

    John O
     
    John O, Mar 21, 2005
    #7
  8. Nocturnal

    Sean Guest

    I guess that stuff can get annoying. I and i do agree that people need to
    make an effort to find information for themselves and i know all about
    keeping the bar high. I work on High Performance MerCruiser and Volvo marine
    engines. Although the subject matter is different, the training is organized
    in a similar manor. Some courses are instructor led and others are e-skills.
    In order to weed out people who dont want to do the work; a passing score is
    90% in most cases. You cant afford to make a mistake with an engine that cost
    $20K or more.
    I have been getting frustrated because i have alot of questions and i have
    found alot of answers but sometimes it is nice to have a dialogue. You know,
    here peoples personal expierience and insight. Anyway i am interested in
    making a career change and i am currently taking some computer science
    coures. Anyway, i apologize for my harsh comments. Perhaps i will think of a
    worthy question, although i will keep digging on my own for now.

    "John O" wrote:

    > > I will address the only substantive part of your post: the reason so many
    > > "newcomers" feel unwelcome. This is because their questions lack
    > > substance or true interest in the subject matter. Starting from a default
    > > location of www.microsoft.com , it takes four clicks to get here:
    > >
    > > http://www.microsoft.com/learning/mcp/mcdst/requirements.asp
    > >
    > > From here, you can learn (all on your own): 1. The number of questions on
    > > each exam, 2. what is considered a passing score, 3. what kinds of
    > > training materials Microsoft suggests, 4. what the exam objectives are,
    > > and 5. online (free) resources for determining readiness.

    >
    > Jason,
    >
    > First, I agree with you completely. However, this sort of question exists in
    > every newsgroup and forum where I participate. Even those that have READ
    > THIS FIRST as the top message, and FAQs, and frequently posted links to the
    > FAQ, and the MVPs all have the link to the FAQ in their sig....it doesn't
    > matter. sigh.
    >
    > BTW, I have a source of people for you...truly good ones. If you're really
    > interested in some outstanding techs, I can put you in front of about 70 of
    > them at the end of June...the best that come out of high schools and some
    > colleges. And in the spirit of this thread, you know how to reach me. ;-)
    >
    > John O
    >
    >
    >
     
    Sean, Mar 22, 2005
    #8
  9. Nocturnal

    Guest

    Piratted versions is the way to go.
    >-----Original Message-----
    >$250.00+ is big bucks for myself. I already have a hard

    time coming up with
    >the $250.00 to pay for the Network+ exam. Are you guys

    all just super rich?
    >Or do you guys just use pirated versions?
    >
    >
    >.
    >
     
    , Mar 22, 2005
    #9
  10. Nocturnal

    Jason Guest

    John ),

    I would like to see how they respond to real life troubleshooting situations
    as in the w2k, xp, and winnt newsgroups. I frequent those, and any
    references to slashdot go a long way in my book! I'll keep my eyes out for
    them...

    As far as the READ THIS FIRST, how I wish the MCDST group had one! :)

    > Jason,
    >
    > First, I agree with you completely. However, this sort of question exists
    > in every newsgroup and forum where I participate. Even those that have
    > READ THIS FIRST as the top message, and FAQs, and frequently posted links
    > to the FAQ, and the MVPs all have the link to the FAQ in their sig....it
    > doesn't matter. sigh.
    >
    > BTW, I have a source of people for you...truly good ones. If you're really
    > interested in some outstanding techs, I can put you in front of about 70
    > of them at the end of June...the best that come out of high schools and
    > some colleges. And in the spirit of this thread, you know how to reach me.
    > ;-)
    >
    > John O
    >
     
    Jason, Mar 23, 2005
    #10
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