HP's strategy explained :

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by mark_hpq@yahoo.com, Sep 26, 2005.

  1. Guest

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  2. Guest

    Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    > Once again, please do not post unadorned URLs.
    >
    > I looked at that page and there was just some statistics, no explanation.
    >
    > If you think the statistics (in many different areas) prove something,
    > by all means post your belief in the newsgroup, rather than making all
    > of us waste our time looking at your URL because of your false belief
    > that we will see the statistics the way you do.


    Well these statistics seems pretty clear :

    http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/insiders.asp?symb=hpq&sid=2385&siteid=mktw


    04/01/2005 MARK V HURD
    Chief Executive Officer 400,000 HPQ Award of Stock
    <---------------------- ****
    *** Undefined Type ***




    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO
    Director 94,875 HPQ Open Market Sale
    proceeds of $2,272,256.25

    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO
    Director 94,875 HPQ Exercise of Stock Options
    at cost of $1,452,536.25

    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBIO
    Director 94,875 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144)
    estimated proceeds of $2,267,512.50

    06/14/2005 RICHARD TODD BRADLEY
    Officer 100,000 HPQ Award of Stock
    *** Undefined Type ***

    05/19/2005 KOMISAR DUNN FAMILY TRUST
    Trustee 18,750 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144)
    estimated proceeds of $422,062.50

    05/18/2005 MICHAEL ENGLANDER
    Shareholder 8,000 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144)
    estimated proceeds of $180,400.00

    03/17/2005 ANN M LIVERMORE
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock
    *** Undefined Type ***

    03/17/2005 SHANE V ROBISON
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock
    *** Undefined Type ***

    03/17/2005 VYOMESH JOSHI
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stock
    *** Undefined Type ***
     
    , Sep 26, 2005
    #2
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  3. Guest

    Larry Kilgallen wrote:
    > > Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    > Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stock
    > market stuff. If you have something to say, post it.



    You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,000
    HP stocks
    and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase of
    the profits of HP.

    The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company.
     
    , Sep 26, 2005
    #3
  4. Ray Fischer Guest

    <> wrote:
    >Larry Kilgallen wrote:
    >> > Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    >> Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stock
    >> market stuff. If you have something to say, post it.

    >
    >You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,000
    >HP stocks
    >and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase of
    >the profits of HP.
    >
    >The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company.


    20 years ago the average CEO earned about 40 times as much as the
    average production worker.

    Today the average CEO earn 400+ tiems as much as the production worker.

    That's why all those rich CEOs need all of those tax cuts.
    --
    Ray Fischer
     
    Ray Fischer, Sep 27, 2005
    #4
  5. Guest

    Larry Kilgallen wrote

    > Once again, please do not post unadorned URLs


    > I looked at that page and there was just some statistics, no explanation


    > If you think the statistics (in many different areas) prove something
    > by all means post your belief in the newsgroup, rather than making al
    > of us waste our time looking at your URL because of your false belie
    > that we will see the statistics the way you do


    Well these statistics seems pretty clear

    http://www.marketwatch.com/tools/quotes/insiders.asp?symb=hpq&sid=2385&siteid=mkt

    04/01/2005 MARK V HUR
    Chief Executive Officer 400,000 HPQ Award of Stoc
    <---------------------- ***
    *** Undefined Type **


    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBI
    Director 94,875 HPQ Open Market Sal
    proceeds of $2,272,256.2

    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBI
    Director 94,875 HPQ Exercise of Stock Option
    at cost of $1,452,536.2

    06/16/2005 LAWRENCE T BABBI
    Director 94,875 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144
    estimated proceeds of $2,267,512.5

    06/14/2005 RICHARD TODD BRADLE
    Officer 100,000 HPQ Award of Stoc
    *** Undefined Type **

    05/19/2005 KOMISAR DUNN FAMILY TRUS
    Trustee 18,750 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144
    estimated proceeds of $422,062.5

    05/18/2005 MICHAEL ENGLANDE
    Shareholder 8,000 HPQ Proposed Sale (Form 144
    estimated proceeds of $180,400.0

    03/17/2005 ANN M LIVERMOR
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stoc
    *** Undefined Type **

    03/17/2005 SHANE V ROBISO
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stoc
    *** Undefined Type **

    03/17/2005 VYOMESH JOSH
    Officer 150,000 HPQ Award of Stoc
    *** Undefined Type **
     
    , Oct 5, 2005
    #5
  6. Guest

    Larry Kilgallen wrote
    > > Larry Kilgallen wrote

    > Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stoc
    > market stuff. If you have something to say, post it


    You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,00
    HP stock
    and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase o
    the profits of HP

    The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company
     
    , Oct 5, 2005
    #6
  7. They used to be, pre-Carly.

    Art

    wrote:

    > Larry Kilgallen wrote:
    >
    >>>Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    >>
    >>Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stock
    >>market stuff. If you have something to say, post it.

    >
    >
    >
    > You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,000
    > HP stocks
    > and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase of
    > the profits of HP.
    >
    > The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company.
    >
     
    Arthur Entlich, Oct 5, 2005
    #7
  8. Ron Hunter Guest

    wrote:
    > Larry Kilgallen wrote:
    >>> Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    >> Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stock
    >> market stuff. If you have something to say, post it.

    >
    >
    > You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,000
    > HP stocks
    > and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase of
    > the profits of HP.
    >
    > The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company.
    >
    >

    While there is nothing unethical about reducing the workforce by 15%, it
    may affect customer service in a negative way, and may also affect
    employee loyalty negatively as well. Some managers can only see today's
    bottom line as they don't plan to be with that company in 10 years.....


    --
    Ron Hunter
     
    Ron Hunter, Oct 5, 2005
    #8
  9. Guest

  10. In article <>,
    wrote:

    > Larry Kilgallen wrote:
    > > > Larry Kilgallen wrote:

    > > Not at all to those of us who are engaged in VMS rather than stock
    > > market stuff. If you have something to say, post it.

    >
    >
    > You can see that (among other things) Mark Hurd got a bonus of 400,000
    > HP stocks
    > and now he is laying off 15 % of the employees despite an increase of
    > the profits of HP.
    >
    > The funny thing is that HP claims to be an "ethical" company.


    Ethics is a guide to life, not a justification for the sacrifice of life.
    <http://www.aynrand.org>

    --
    ==================================================
    A man of judgement, who could look both before and after.
    HOMER, THE ILIAD
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Radically systematic, radical metaphysics: "Existence 2"
    http://home.att.net/~sdgross
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Stephen Grossman Fairhaven, MA, USA
    ==================================================
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Radically systematic radical metaphysics: Existence 2
    http://home.att.net/~sdgross
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Stephen Grossman Fairhaven, MA, USA
    ===============================================
     
    Stephen Grossman, Dec 14, 2005
    #10
  11. Guest

    , Dec 14, 2005
    #11
  12. ynotssor Guest

    <> wrote in message
    news:...

    > Latest news on the layoffs :
    > http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/


    "HP will also try to take advantage of a shift towards decentralised,
    low-cost corporate IT systems, or 'data centre architectures', which are
    less labour-intensive but require more sophisticated management software
    than traditional mainframe computers."

    Hurd is about 15 years behind-the-times on that model.
     
    ynotssor, Dec 14, 2005
    #12
  13. In article <>,
    wrote:

    > Latest news on the layoffs :
    >
    > http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/


    Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    downsizing of
    companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    horse and buggy,
    and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    consumers starting
    buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of man-pushed
    plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick makers!!
    I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!

    --
    ==================================================
    A man of judgement, who could look both before and after.
    HOMER, THE ILIAD
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Radically systematic, radical metaphysics: "Existence 2"
    http://home.att.net/~sdgross
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Stephen Grossman Fairhaven, MA, USA
     
    Stephen Grossman, Dec 20, 2005
    #13
  14. Charles Guest

    On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 16:10:27 GMT, (Stephen Grossman)
    wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Latest news on the layoffs :
    >>
    >> http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/

    >
    >Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    >downsizing of
    >companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    >horse and buggy,
    >and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    >consumers starting
    >buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of man-pushed
    >plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick makers!!
    >I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!



    I think you got your "X" and "Y" mixed up.
     
    Charles, Dec 20, 2005
    #14
  15. Might be a nice excuse for making you feel better about being
    unsupportive to workers and people who are trying to make a living and
    raise their families, but it doesn't convince me, and its a bogus
    argument in this case.

    Companies are not necessarily making changes due to "progress" but
    because they think they are evolving the way their stockholders wish, or
    at least, that whatever they do will be perceived as "positive" by those
    stockholders. Unfortunately, often stockholders have the ethics
    of sharks, in other words, none. Many don't even know what it is they
    "own", only if it is making them a profit or not.

    Its no way to run a company, and in the longer term and bigger picture,
    it almost always fails.

    Apparently, there is still a market for those buggy whips... they get
    used on the workers, but forcing them to work under lowest common
    denominator conditions or they will be replaced with workers who are
    even more desperate and will work for less under even harsher
    conditions. This is the new "global" international workplace we live
    with, and it is creating a downward spiral, rather than lifting up those
    who are worse off. And it is indeed fueled by greedy stockholders who
    only care about their returns.

    Art

    Stephen Grossman wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Latest news on the layoffs :
    >>
    >>http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/

    >
    >
    > Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    > downsizing of
    > companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    > horse and buggy,
    > and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    > consumers starting
    > buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of man-pushed
    > plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick makers!!
    > I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!
    >
     
    Arthur Entlich, Dec 21, 2005
    #15
  16. Might be a nice excuse for making you feel better about being
    unsupportive to workers and people who are trying to make a living and
    raise their families, but it doesn't convince me, and its a bogus
    argument in this case.

    Companies are not necessarily making changes due to "progress" but
    because they think they are evolving the way their stockholders wish, or
    at least, that whatever they do will be perceived as "positive" by those
    stockholders. Unfortunately, often stockholders have the ethics
    of sharks, in other words, none. Many don't even know what it is they
    "own", only if it is making them a profit or not.

    Its no way to run a company, and in the longer term and bigger picture,
    it almost always fails.

    Apparently, there is still a market for those buggy whips... they get
    used on the workers, but forcing them to work under lowest common
    denominator conditions or they will be replaced with workers who are
    even more desperate and will work for less under even harsher
    conditions. This is the new "global" international workplace we live
    with, and it is creating a downward spiral, rather than lifting up those
    who are worse off. And it is indeed fueled by greedy stockholders who
    only care about their returns.

    Art

    Stephen Grossman wrote:

    > In article <>,
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Latest news on the layoffs :
    >>
    >>http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/

    >
    >
    > Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    > downsizing of
    > companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    > horse and buggy,
    > and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    > consumers starting
    > buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of man-pushed
    > plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick makers!!
    > I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!
    >
     
    Arthur Entlich, Dec 21, 2005
    #16
  17. > I think you got your "X" and "Y" mixed up.

    Well, you never know, maybe he was thinking that company X was selling
    their goods below cost and losing money on each sale ;-)

    Art

    Charles wrote:

    > On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 16:10:27 GMT, (Stephen Grossman)
    > wrote:
    >
    >
    >>In article <>,
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>Latest news on the layoffs :
    >>>
    >>>http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/

    >>
    >>Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    >>downsizing of
    >>companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    >>horse and buggy,
    >>and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    >>consumers starting
    >>buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of man-pushed
    >>plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick makers!!
    >>I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!

    >
    >
    >
    > I think you got your "X" and "Y" mixed up.
     
    Arthur Entlich, Dec 21, 2005
    #17
  18. In article <>, Charles
    <> wrote:

    > On Tue, 20 Dec 2005 16:10:27 GMT, (Stephen Grossman)
    > wrote:
    >
    > >In article <>,
    > > wrote:
    > >
    > >> Latest news on the layoffs :
    > >>
    > >> http://hpwfr.blogspot.com/

    > >
    > >Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    > >downsizing of
    > >companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    > >horse and buggy,
    > >and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    > >consumers starting
    > >buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of

    man-pushed
    > >plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!! Mud-brick

    makers!!
    > >I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!

    >
    >
    > I think you got your "X" and "Y" mixed up.


    I wail and gnash my teeth!

    --
    ====================================================
    Reason is the basic method of human survival. AYN RAND
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Radically systematic, radical metaphysics: "Existence 2"
    http://home.att.net/~sdgross
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Stephen Grossman Fairhaven, MA, USA
     
    Stephen Grossman, Jan 2, 2006
    #18
  19. In article <I6eqf.164475$Gd6.88730@pd7tw3no>, Arthur Entlich
    <> wrote:

    > Might be a nice excuse for making you feel better about being
    > unsupportive to workers and people who are trying to make a living and
    > raise their families, but it doesn't convince me, and its a bogus
    > argument in this case.


    Personal attacks are an illogical evasion of the need to judge ideas.

    > Companies are not necessarily making changes due to "progress" but
    > because they think they are evolving the way their stockholders wish, or
    > at least, that whatever they do will be perceived as "positive" by those
    > stockholders. Unfortunately, often stockholders have the ethics
    > of sharks, in other words, none. Many don't even know what it is they
    > "own", only if it is making them a profit or not.


    Profits are made by producing the goods and services needed for human life.
    This is both moral and practical since morality is a guide to life, not to the
    sacrifice of life; and moral, because profits, ie, values, are a need of life.
    A farmer whose work was unprofitable, ie, without personal value
    for him, would starve to death. Capitalism requires mutually profitable trade
    and those firms which dont meet the market, go out of business unless
    altruists like you vote for govt subsidies or laws which destroy the
    competition.

    > Apparently, there is still a market for those buggy whips... they get
    > used on the workers, but forcing them to work under lowest common
    > denominator conditions or they will be replaced with workers who are
    > even more desperate and will work for less under even harsher
    > conditions. This is the new "global" international workplace we live
    > with, and it is creating a downward spiral, rather than lifting up those
    > who are worse off. And it is indeed fueled by greedy stockholders who
    > only care about their returns.


    Youre a commie liar. The economic history of the last several centuries,
    of growing capitalism, is radically different from the endless poverty
    of all preceding history (partially excepting Greece and Rome).
    The spreading, growing wealth of the new capitalism in China, India
    and even Africa gives the lie to your absurd "downward spiral."
    Capitalism is practical because it is the economics of
    the mind's ability to guide the production of the values needed for life.
    You are typing at a computer, not dragging out your days as a serf
    pulling a plow w/your own body and living in a dirt-floored hut
    with your farm animals (and w/o room spray!). Capitalism ended
    famines and tyranny and increased
    life spans. Of course, if mindlessness is your ideal, then the
    rationality needed for capitalism will be hateful. Im sorry but the
    Garden of Eden (or Marx's communism) is impossible. Focusing your mind,
    logically and thru the senses, onto the concrete, material universe,
    is a need of human life. The mind is not a game show for neurotic,
    disinterested, pseudo-intellectuals. Its mans main tool of survival.
    People in capitalist economies live better than was even imagined
    centuries ago.

    FOCUS YOUR MIND! BAD IDEAS CAUSE ADD!


    > > Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    > > downsizing of
    > > companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    > > horse and buggy,
    > > and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    > > consumers starting
    > > buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of

    man-pushed
    > > plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!!

    Mud-brick makers!!
    > > I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!
    > >


    --
    ====================================================
    Reason is the basic method of human survival. AYN RAND
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Radically systematic, radical metaphysics: "Existence 2"
    http://home.att.net/~sdgross
    -------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Stephen Grossman Fairhaven, MA, USA
     
    Stephen Grossman, Jan 2, 2006
    #19
  20. measekite Guest

    Stephen Grossman wrote:

    >In article <I6eqf.164475$Gd6.88730@pd7tw3no>, Arthur Entlich
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >
    >
    >>Might be a nice excuse for making you feel better about being
    >>unsupportive to workers and people who are trying to make a living and
    >>raise their families, but it doesn't convince me, and its a bogus
    >>argument in this case.
    >>
    >>

    >
    >Personal attacks are an illogical evasion of the need to judge ideas.
    >
    >
    >
    >>Companies are not necessarily making changes due to "progress" but
    >>because they think they are evolving the way their stockholders wish, or
    >>at least, that whatever they do will be perceived as "positive" by those
    >>stockholders. Unfortunately, often stockholders have the ethics
    >>of sharks, in other words, none. Many don't even know what it is they
    >>"own", only if it is making them a profit or not.
    >>
    >>

    >
    >Profits are made by producing the goods and services needed for human life.
    >This is both moral and practical since morality is a guide to life, not to the
    >sacrifice of life; and moral, because profits, ie, values, are a need of life.
    >A farmer whose work was unprofitable, ie, without personal value
    >for him, would starve to death. Capitalism requires mutually profitable trade
    >and those firms which dont meet the market, go out of business unless
    >altruists like you vote for govt subsidies or laws which destroy the
    >competition.
    >
    >
    >
    >>Apparently, there is still a market for those buggy whips... they get
    >>used on the workers, but forcing them to work under lowest common
    >>denominator conditions or they will be replaced with workers who are
    >>even more desperate and will work for less under even harsher
    >>conditions. This is the new "global" international workplace we live
    >>with, and it is creating a downward spiral, rather than lifting up those
    >>who are worse off. And it is indeed fueled by greedy stockholders who
    >>only care about their returns.
    >>
    >>

    >
    >Youre a commie liar.
    >

    YOU TELL THE KNOW IT ALL RIGHTEOUS CHURCH MOUSE

    >The economic history of the last several centuries,
    >of growing capitalism, is radically different from the endless poverty
    >of all preceding history (partially excepting Greece and Rome).
    >The spreading, growing wealth of the new capitalism in China, India
    >and even Africa gives the lie to your absurd "downward spiral."
    >Capitalism is practical because it is the economics of
    >the mind's ability to guide the production of the values needed for life.
    >You are typing at a computer, not dragging out your days as a serf
    >pulling a plow w/your own body and living in a dirt-floored hut
    >with your farm animals (and w/o room spray!). Capitalism ended
    >famines and tyranny and increased
    >life spans. Of course, if mindlessness is your ideal, then the
    >rationality needed for capitalism will be hateful. Im sorry but the
    >Garden of Eden (or Marx's communism) is impossible. Focusing your mind,
    >logically and thru the senses, onto the concrete, material universe,
    >is a need of human life. The mind is not a game show for neurotic,
    >disinterested, pseudo-intellectuals. Its mans main tool of survival.
    >People in capitalist economies live better than was even imagined
    >centuries ago.
    >
    >FOCUS YOUR MIND! BAD IDEAS CAUSE ADD!
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >>>Every time you buy x instead of y, you are indirectly causing the
    >>>downsizing of
    >>>companies which make X. Just think of all the lost jobs in the candle,
    >>>horse and buggy,
    >>>and typewriter companies when anti-social, unfeeling, plutocratic
    >>>consumers starting
    >>>buying light bulbs, cars and computers! And what about the makers of
    >>>
    >>>

    >man-pushed
    >
    >
    >>>plows!! And water buckets balanced on the head!! And spears!!
    >>>
    >>>

    >Mud-brick makers!!
    >
    >
    >>>I weep for them all. Solidarity Now!!
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>

    >
    >
    >
     
    measekite, Jan 2, 2006
    #20
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