Go Large Alternatives

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by David, Nov 5, 2006.

  1. David

    David Guest

    Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    using it and how does it perform?
     
    David, Nov 5, 2006
    #1
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  2. David

    Chris Lim Guest

    David wrote:
    > Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    > with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    > offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    > slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    > using it and how does it perform?


    I'm on that Slingshot plan and am switching to Xtra's Go Large.
    Speed-wise things have been slow for the last couple of weeks, so maybe
    what you're experiencing isn't ISP-related. I haven't been able to get
    anything above 32KB/s with either torrents or http downloads lately.
    Even torrents with thousands of seeds, which I used to get over 100KB/s
    with, have been as slow as dial-up at times.
     
    Chris Lim, Nov 5, 2006
    #2
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  3. David

    whome Guest

    "David" <> wrote in message
    news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    > Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    > with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    > offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the slingshot
    > plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone using it and
    > how does it perform?


    My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider you
    select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.

    People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.

    Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a sham.
    Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As usual.
     
    whome, Nov 5, 2006
    #3
  4. David

    Crash Guest

    whome wrote:
    > "David" <> wrote in message
    > news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the slingshot
    >> plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone using it and
    >> how does it perform?

    >
    > My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider you
    > select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >

    My understanding is different. Other ISPs use Telecom infrastructure to provide
    a service to you. This is certainly true for the copper cable from your house
    to the exchange but also may go a little further. Your ISP provides Usenet and
    email services and connectivity to 'the internet' and it is my belief that they
    have a number of choices when it comes to provisioning these services.

    There are a variety of reasons why many ISPs base their plans on those of Xtra -
    but as I understand it they are not 'reselling' in the normal sense but simply
    matching the offerings of the dominant player (Xtra, owned by Telecom).

    I changed from Xtra to Orcon and got noticeably better performance.

    > People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >
    > Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a sham.
    > Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As usual.


    I was on a 3.5 mb/512 kb plan and happy because my router connect speeds were at
    or above the speed cap. I was changed over to Orcon's new PRO plan (max/max)
    last week. At first I could get only a marginal improvement (4nnn/5nn - various
    speeds over several reboots - but this went to 5200/710 when I removed what
    proved to be troublesome line filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter
    installed (means adsl router is directly connected and all other phone jack are
    filtered - no plug-in filters needed) to see if that will further improve things.

    I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload speed.

    My new plan is $20 per month cheaper than the old one because I can choose a
    data cap closer to my needs.

    It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good service
    understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those who experience
    degraded performance or bad service.

    Crash.
     
    Crash, Nov 5, 2006
    #4
  5. David

    Zipper Guest

    Crash wrote:
    > whome wrote:
    >> "David" <> wrote in message
    >> news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >>> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s),
    >>> even with HTTP download from local servers. What are the
    >>> alternatives? Xtra offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap.
    >>> How about the slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good
    >>> deal, is anyone using it and how does it perform?

    >>
    >> My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider
    >> you select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >>

    > My understanding is different. Other ISPs use Telecom infrastructure to
    > provide a service to you. This is certainly true for the copper cable
    > from your house to the exchange but also may go a little further. Your
    > ISP provides Usenet and email services and connectivity to 'the
    > internet' and it is my belief that they have a number of choices when it
    > comes to provisioning these services.
    >
    > There are a variety of reasons why many ISPs base their plans on those
    > of Xtra - but as I understand it they are not 'reselling' in the normal
    > sense but simply matching the offerings of the dominant player (Xtra,
    > owned by Telecom).
    >
    > I changed from Xtra to Orcon and got noticeably better performance.
    >
    >> People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >>
    >> Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a
    >> sham. Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As
    >> usual.

    >
    > I was on a 3.5 mb/512 kb plan and happy because my router connect speeds
    > were at or above the speed cap. I was changed over to Orcon's new PRO
    > plan (max/max) last week. At first I could get only a marginal
    > improvement (4nnn/5nn - various speeds over several reboots - but this
    > went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be troublesome line
    > filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter installed (means adsl
    > router is directly connected and all other phone jack are filtered - no
    > plug-in filters needed) to see if that will further improve things.


    I am would be very interested to know if that improves things please
    post back when they install the splitter and what effect it has on your
    connection.

    The troublesome line filters, where did you get those from?



    >
    > I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload speed.
    >
    > My new plan is $20 per month cheaper than the old one because I can
    > choose a data cap closer to my needs.
    >
    > It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    > represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good
    > service understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those
    > who experience degraded performance or bad service.
    >
    > Crash.
    >
    >
     
    Zipper, Nov 5, 2006
    #5
  6. David

    Blue Guest

    On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 16:10:40 +1300, Crash wrote:

    > It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    > represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good service
    > understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those who experience
    > degraded performance or bad service.


    Indeed. However this does not discount those who say that things are not
    as they should be.
     
    Blue, Nov 5, 2006
    #6
  7. David

    Stu Fleming Guest

    Chris Lim wrote:
    > David wrote:
    >> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    >> slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    >> using it and how does it perform?

    >
    > I'm on that Slingshot plan and am switching to Xtra's Go Large.
    > Speed-wise things have been slow for the last couple of weeks, so maybe
    > what you're experiencing isn't ISP-related. I haven't been able to get
    > anything above 32KB/s with either torrents or http downloads lately.
    > Even torrents with thousands of seeds, which I used to get over 100KB/s
    > with, have been as slow as dial-up at times.
    >


    This may be a side-effect of overseas ISPs starting to throttle BT
    traffic rather than an NZ-specific issue. Of course, it varies
    considerably, but 100-200KB/sec on our pipe is now normal rather than
    the 350-500 we used to get until fairly recently. That's on
    infrastructure independent of ADSL/Telecom and where "normal" downloads
    are...normal, expected speeds.
     
    Stu Fleming, Nov 5, 2006
    #7
  8. David

    MaHogany Guest

    On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 18:07:52 +1300, Stu Fleming wrote:

    > That's on
    > infrastructure independent of ADSL/Telecom and where "normal" downloads
    > are...normal, expected speeds.


    What is a "normal" download?


    Ma Hogany

    --
    "The average user doesn't know what he wants. The average user wants
    fries with that, if prompted."
     
    MaHogany, Nov 5, 2006
    #8
  9. David

    Vista Guest

    "whome" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    >
    > "David" <> wrote in message
    > news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the slingshot
    >> plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone using it and
    >> how does it perform?

    >
    > My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider you
    > select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >
    > People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >
    > Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a
    > sham. Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As
    > usual.
    >
    >
    >
    >


    It is largely because there has been a huge increase in the number of people
    connecting to it, and not enough harware being installed to cope with the
    loads. There is also a huge lack of technicans to install the hardware
    (brain drain), so over time it should get better once hardware is installed
    to cope with the high loads.
     
    Vista, Nov 5, 2006
    #9
  10. David

    Earl Grey Guest

    Vista wrote:

    >
    > It is largely because there has been a huge increase in the number of people
    > connecting to it, and not enough harware being installed to cope with the
    > loads. There is also a huge lack of technicans to install the hardware
    > (brain drain), so over time it should get better once hardware is installed
    > to cope with the high loads.
    >
    >

    There has been much less takeup than they predicted to the government.
    It was completely intentional for them to oversubscribe their network
    because they knew they could get away with it.
     
    Earl Grey, Nov 5, 2006
    #10
  11. David

    David Guest

    Stu Fleming wrote:
    > Chris Lim wrote:
    >> David wrote:
    >>> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >>> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >>> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    >>> slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    >>> using it and how does it perform?

    >>
    >> I'm on that Slingshot plan and am switching to Xtra's Go Large.
    >> Speed-wise things have been slow for the last couple of weeks, so maybe
    >> what you're experiencing isn't ISP-related. I haven't been able to get
    >> anything above 32KB/s with either torrents or http downloads lately.
    >> Even torrents with thousands of seeds, which I used to get over 100KB/s
    >> with, have been as slow as dial-up at times.
    >>

    >
    > This may be a side-effect of overseas ISPs starting to throttle BT
    > traffic rather than an NZ-specific issue. Of course, it varies
    > considerably, but 100-200KB/sec on our pipe is now normal rather than
    > the 350-500 we used to get until fairly recently. That's on
    > infrastructure independent of ADSL/Telecom and where "normal" downloads
    > are...normal, expected speeds.


    Well on Go Large I'm finding the opposite. Torrents go faster than
    "normal" http downloads. Perhaps this is because torrents use multiple
    connections. With an HTTP download I'm lucky to get 30kB/s, while
    torrents can exceed 50kB/s.
     
    David, Nov 5, 2006
    #11
  12. David

    Stu Fleming Guest

    MaHogany wrote:
    > On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 18:07:52 +1300, Stu Fleming wrote:
    >
    >> That's on
    >> infrastructure independent of ADSL/Telecom and where "normal" downloads
    >> are...normal, expected speeds.

    >
    > What is a "normal" download?


    Any large, streamed transfer (FTP, HTTP etc).
    e.g. Ubuntu 6.10 (640MB) in 15min
     
    Stu Fleming, Nov 5, 2006
    #12
  13. David

    whome Guest

    "Crash" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > whome wrote:
    >> "David" <> wrote in message
    >> news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >>> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >>> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >>> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    >>> slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    >>> using it and how does it perform?

    >>
    >> My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider you
    >> select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >>

    > My understanding is different. Other ISPs use Telecom infrastructure to
    > provide a service to you. This is certainly true for the copper cable
    > from your house to the exchange but also may go a little further. Your
    > ISP provides Usenet and email services and connectivity to 'the internet'
    > and it is my belief that they have a number of choices when it comes to
    > provisioning these services.
    >
    > There are a variety of reasons why many ISPs base their plans on those of
    > Xtra - but as I understand it they are not 'reselling' in the normal sense
    > but simply matching the offerings of the dominant player (Xtra, owned by
    > Telecom).
    >
    > I changed from Xtra to Orcon and got noticeably better performance.
    >
    >> People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >>
    >> Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a
    >> sham. Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As
    >> usual.

    >
    > I was on a 3.5 mb/512 kb plan and happy because my router connect speeds
    > were at or above the speed cap. I was changed over to Orcon's new PRO
    > plan (max/max) last week. At first I could get only a marginal
    > improvement (4nnn/5nn - various speeds over several reboots - but this
    > went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be troublesome line
    > filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter installed (means adsl
    > router is directly connected and all other phone jack are filtered - no
    > plug-in filters needed) to see if that will further improve things.
    >
    > I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload speed.
    >
    > My new plan is $20 per month cheaper than the old one because I can choose
    > a data cap closer to my needs.
    >
    > It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    > represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good
    > service understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those who
    > experience degraded performance or bad service.
    >
    > Crash.
    >
    >


    But, telecom own the everything between the premises and the service
    provider.

    To that extent, you are screwed right?
     
    whome, Nov 5, 2006
    #13
  14. David

    Crash Guest

    whome wrote:
    > "Crash" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> whome wrote:
    >>> "David" <> wrote in message
    >>> news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >>>> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s), even
    >>>> with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives? Xtra
    >>>> offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    >>>> slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    >>>> using it and how does it perform?
    >>> My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider you
    >>> select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >>>

    >> My understanding is different. Other ISPs use Telecom infrastructure to
    >> provide a service to you. This is certainly true for the copper cable
    >> from your house to the exchange but also may go a little further. Your
    >> ISP provides Usenet and email services and connectivity to 'the internet'
    >> and it is my belief that they have a number of choices when it comes to
    >> provisioning these services.
    >>
    >> There are a variety of reasons why many ISPs base their plans on those of
    >> Xtra - but as I understand it they are not 'reselling' in the normal sense
    >> but simply matching the offerings of the dominant player (Xtra, owned by
    >> Telecom).
    >>
    >> I changed from Xtra to Orcon and got noticeably better performance.
    >>
    >>> People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >>>
    >>> Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a
    >>> sham. Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As
    >>> usual.

    >> I was on a 3.5 mb/512 kb plan and happy because my router connect speeds
    >> were at or above the speed cap. I was changed over to Orcon's new PRO
    >> plan (max/max) last week. At first I could get only a marginal
    >> improvement (4nnn/5nn - various speeds over several reboots - but this
    >> went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be troublesome line
    >> filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter installed (means adsl
    >> router is directly connected and all other phone jack are filtered - no
    >> plug-in filters needed) to see if that will further improve things.
    >>
    >> I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload speed.
    >>
    >> My new plan is $20 per month cheaper than the old one because I can choose
    >> a data cap closer to my needs.
    >>
    >> It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    >> represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good
    >> service understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those who
    >> experience degraded performance or bad service.
    >>
    >> Crash.
    >>
    >>

    >
    > But, telecom own the everything between the premises and the service
    > provider.
    >
    > To that extent, you are screwed right?


    What have I said that leads you that conclusion? Telecom ARE a line-provider -
    but in my experience there is a difference between ADSL service providers (Orcon
    vs Xtra) and in spite of the privileged position Xtra enjoy (through their owner
    Telecom) Orcon, in my experience, perform better.

    Crash.
     
    Crash, Nov 5, 2006
    #14
  15. David

    EMB Guest

    David wrote:

    > Well on Go Large I'm finding the opposite. Torrents go faster than
    > "normal" http downloads. Perhaps this is because torrents use multiple
    > connections. With an HTTP download I'm lucky to get 30kB/s, while
    > torrents can exceed 50kB/s.


    A lot of servers will limit http or ftp downloads to around 256kb/s (ie
    30kB/s) per thread. I can often get 200+kB/s speeds on these servers by
    using a multi-threaded download client.


    --
    EMB
     
    EMB, Nov 5, 2006
    #15
  16. David

    MaHogany Guest

    On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 18:59:12 +1300, Stu Fleming wrote:

    >> What is a "normal" download?

    >
    > Any large, streamed transfer (FTP, HTTP etc).
    > e.g. Ubuntu 6.10 (640MB) in 15min


    I download Linux & FreeBSD ISO images over BitTorrent.

    BitTorrent *is* a mormal method of lownloading disc images.


    Ma Hogany

    --
    "The average user doesn't know what he wants. The average user wants
    fries with that, if prompted."
     
    MaHogany, Nov 5, 2006
    #16
  17. David

    whome Guest

    "Crash" <> wrote in message
    news:454d9dca$...
    > whome wrote:
    >> "Crash" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> whome wrote:
    >>>> "David" <> wrote in message
    >>>> news:eijbdn$g1v$...
    >>>>> Go Large is now performing below the old jetstart speeds (15kB/s),
    >>>>> even with HTTP download from local servers. What are the alternatives?
    >>>>> Xtra offers nothing affordable with a decent data cap. How about the
    >>>>> slingshot plan, 25GB for $49.95, it looks like a good deal, is anyone
    >>>>> using it and how does it perform?
    >>>> My understanding is that it doesn't matter which DSL service provider
    >>>> you select, they all resell telecoms DSL services.
    >>>>
    >>> My understanding is different. Other ISPs use Telecom infrastructure to
    >>> provide a service to you. This is certainly true for the copper cable
    >>> from your house to the exchange but also may go a little further. Your
    >>> ISP provides Usenet and email services and connectivity to 'the
    >>> internet' and it is my belief that they have a number of choices when it
    >>> comes to provisioning these services.
    >>>
    >>> There are a variety of reasons why many ISPs base their plans on those
    >>> of Xtra - but as I understand it they are not 'reselling' in the normal
    >>> sense but simply matching the offerings of the dominant player (Xtra,
    >>> owned by Telecom).
    >>>
    >>> I changed from Xtra to Orcon and got noticeably better performance.
    >>>
    >>>> People on this group seem to have swapped to just about every ISP.
    >>>>
    >>>> Telecoms recent DSL speed increases have been predictably exposed as a
    >>>> sham. Our only hope is for the commerce commission to investigate. As
    >>>> usual.
    >>> I was on a 3.5 mb/512 kb plan and happy because my router connect speeds
    >>> were at or above the speed cap. I was changed over to Orcon's new PRO
    >>> plan (max/max) last week. At first I could get only a marginal
    >>> improvement (4nnn/5nn - various speeds over several reboots - but this
    >>> went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be troublesome line
    >>> filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter installed (means adsl
    >>> router is directly connected and all other phone jack are filtered - no
    >>> plug-in filters needed) to see if that will further improve things.
    >>>
    >>> I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload speed.
    >>>
    >>> My new plan is $20 per month cheaper than the old one because I can
    >>> choose a data cap closer to my needs.
    >>>
    >>> It is, IMHO, a mistake to believe that what you see posted here fairly
    >>> represents anything. People seeing performance improvements or good
    >>> service understandably are not so motivated to post as often as those
    >>> who experience degraded performance or bad service.
    >>>
    >>> Crash.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >> But, telecom own the everything between the premises and the service
    >> provider.
    >>
    >> To that extent, you are screwed right?

    >
    > What have I said that leads you that conclusion? Telecom ARE a
    > line-provider - but in my experience there is a difference between ADSL
    > service providers (Orcon vs Xtra) and in spite of the privileged position
    > Xtra enjoy (through their owner Telecom) Orcon, in my experience, perform
    > better.
    >
    > Crash.
    >
    >

    Nothing really. But, I still think the services are largely the same.

    Non-Xtra ISP's tinker around with value added services but they cannot
    change the core product. And, certain aspects of the core product such as
    speed/latency are at telecoms discretion.
     
    whome, Nov 5, 2006
    #17
  18. On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 03:07:01 +1300, MaHogany wrote:

    > I download Linux & FreeBSD ISO images over BitTorrent.
    >
    > BitTorrent *is* a mormal method of lownloading disc images.


    When downloading Xubuntu 6.10 the other day I had to go to http over
    BitTorrent thanks to shaping somewhere along the way. If many people find
    this, those who running servers will be carrying an extra load just so
    that ISPs, etc. don't have to.

    --
    Rupert Boleyn <>
     
    Rupert Boleyn, Nov 5, 2006
    #18
  19. David

    juicyjuice Guest

    Crash wrote:

    > - but this went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be
    > troublesome line filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter
    > installed (means adsl router is directly connected and all other
    > phone jack are filtered - no plug-in filters needed) to see if that
    > will further improve things.
    > I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload
    > speed.


    Would have been given your argument more leverage if you had removed the
    troublesome filter before changing to Orcon, because you didn't until
    changing, your comparison is somewhat flawed. :(
     
    juicyjuice, Nov 5, 2006
    #19
  20. David

    David Guest

    juicyjuice wrote:
    > Crash wrote:
    >
    >> - but this went to 5200/710 when I removed what proved to be
    >> troublesome line filters. This coming week I am getting a splitter
    >> installed (means adsl router is directly connected and all other
    >> phone jack are filtered - no plug-in filters needed) to see if that
    >> will further improve things.
    >> I work from home and have noticed the substantially better upload
    >> speed.

    >
    > Would have been given your argument more leverage if you had removed the
    > troublesome filter before changing to Orcon, because you didn't until
    > changing, your comparison is somewhat flawed. :(
    >
    >


    Changing ISP won't affect the connection speed your modem is able to
    obtain in any way. However it will affect the actual speed you get when
    you use the connection.
     
    David, Nov 6, 2006
    #20
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