Firewall enough?

Discussion in 'Computer Security' started by Ravi, Dec 13, 2003.

  1. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.

    When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    need to be installed!

    So is my comp secure?

    One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?

    I hope these are not faq's.

    TIA.

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 13, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Ravi

    johns Guest


    > So is my comp secure?


    No. Not at all. You need the two virus patches for
    Lovsan and ( the other one ? ). Also, you need to
    install Service Pack 1 for XP ( Pro I assume ? ).
    Then, most of all, you need to install Sun Java for
    Windows. That is a biggie !!!!! as most of the hacker
    goons have not hacked that ... yet. Probably won't
    either, and absolutely none of these exploits will get
    through it. If you just did that by itself, it would probably
    hold. Finally, stay off the nudy sites. Most of them
    are traps and loaded with trojans, etc .. with the
    most annoying one being a homepage hijacker that
    is really difficult to remove ( unless you have SunJ ..
    and then it simply can't get through. ) As for Firewall
    .... I have yet to see one work because the User will
    always grant a request off a web site they are interested
    in, and bingo your firewall is useless after that. Exploits
    through Windows Messenger Service are in the wild, and
    it is just a matter of time before that is the hacker route
    of choice. Shut that service off ... -> Contr P > Admin
    Tools > Services > 2click on Messenger ... STOP ...
    startup type to DISABLE. Email: that ain't funny
    anymore. If you are getting the usual 90 - 100 "Patch"
    emails a day, it is probably coming from your ISP
    who would like for you to subscribe to their Mailwasher
    service ... probably Postini. Do it. It is not that expensive,
    and it will keep the typical crooked ISP off your back.
    Finally: you need at least a 60 gig hard drive, split 30:30
    Buy a good drive imaging program ( DriveQuest ),
    and every couple weeks do an image of C: to D: , and
    back that copy of the image up on D: Never erase
    the image until you have a copy of it stored in a folder
    on D: and date that folder. Then do the image. If you
    get hacked, restore the latest image that you think
    predates the hack. Do the image fairly often. As for
    pirated OS. It will rat you out on the first day you
    install it. I imagine somebody up there just does't
    give a hoot. If you keep doing that, sooner or later
    you are going to install something like AutoCAD,
    and it will call the AutoCAD cops on you, and they
    will get you for sure. I say don't do that sort of thing
    as it becomes a bad habit, and one day you will do
    it on a job, and lose your job !

    johns
    johns, Dec 13, 2003
    #2
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  3. Ravi

    Pete Guest

    Ravi , over to you ... :

    >I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    >When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >
    >When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    >need to be installed!
    >
    >So is my comp secure?
    >
    >One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    >be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >
    >I hope these are not faq's.
    >
    >TIA.


    "X-No-Archive: yes"

    Do not feed the trolls.

    Regards,

    Pete.
    Pete, Dec 13, 2003
    #3
  4. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 19:57:56 +0000, Pete
    <> wrote:

    >Ravi , over to you ... :
    >
    >>I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    >>When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.


    http://security.symantec.com/

    Scan for security risks.

    >>When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    >>need to be installed!
    >>
    >>So is my comp secure?
    >>
    >>One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    >>be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >>
    >>I hope these are not faq's.
    >>
    >>TIA.

    >
    >"X-No-Archive: yes"
    >
    >Do not feed the trolls.


    My God. What sort of logic is that?

    What do you think is "troll" like in the post? :)

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 13, 2003
    #4
  5. Ravi

    ian holding Guest

    Trace you? man I am doing time for just for logging on with an pirate copy ,
    do your self a favour and get rid quick! These people sent the government
    round and in no time they threw
    away the keys, me and my family are suffering for some dumb ass decision to
    a short cut, what should I have done? well, got a job save my heard earned
    savinge and made Mr Gates a little richer, and by the way get those patches
    fast!
    "Ravi" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    > When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >
    > When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    > need to be installed!
    >
    > So is my comp secure?
    >
    > One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    > be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >
    > I hope these are not faq's.
    >
    > TIA.
    >
    > --
    > main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    > int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    ian holding, Dec 13, 2003
    #5
  6. Ravi

    *Vanguard* Guest

    "Ravi" wrote
    in news:p:
    <snip>
    > ... If I am using a pirated copy of xp ...


    From your post, and especially since you are concerned about Microsoft
    seeing that your product registration matches someone else's, it is
    highly likely that your "if" is superfluous and your real statement is
    "I *AM* using a pirated copy".

    You stole and you're afraid of getting caught. And you want sympathy
    and help from us to abet in your theft? If you don't want to pay for
    the operating system, get a freebie *NIX operating system, use Open
    Office for word processing, spreadsheets, etc., and get e-mail and news
    clients that run on *NIX.
    *Vanguard*, Dec 13, 2003
    #6
  7. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 21:14:41 -0000, "ian holding"
    <> wrote:

    >Trace you? man I am doing time for just for logging on with an pirate copy ,
    >do your self a favour and get rid quick! These people sent the government
    >round and in no time they threw
    > away the keys, me and my family are suffering for some dumb ass decision to
    >a short cut, what should I have done? well, got a job save my heard earned
    >savinge and made Mr Gates a little richer, and by the way get those patches
    >fast!


    I have my doubts. One of my friend said that MS actually
    traces when a person uses a pirated copy and all the
    bullshit... I don't bellieve.

    So they get my dynamic ip.
    Contact my isp (from another continent)
    Get a court order.
    Check the dynamic ip logs.

    Get my telephone number.

    Go to my telephone company ...

    Get my address...

    Send someone....

    Fight a case against me?


    So they indeed do all of that?!

    >"Ravi" <> wrote in message
    >news:p...
    >> I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    >> When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >>
    >> When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    >> need to be installed!
    >>
    >> So is my comp secure?
    >>
    >> One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    >> be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >>
    >> I hope these are not faq's.
    >>
    >> TIA.
    >>
    >> --
    >> main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    >> int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}

    >


    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #7
  8. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 11:34:27 -0800, "johns"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >> So is my comp secure?

    >

    <snip great reply!>

    First of all thanks.

    Since my email id is I have till today
    never got a single email virus :) I get to see a spam mail
    about once in 6 months...

    I disabled the messenger service a long time ago.

    I have a 20 G hard drive, very less space remaining :(

    And if my comp is really insecure why does the symantec site
    http://security.symantec.com/

    (scan for security risks)

    Show that my comp is safe?

    I generally disallow activex controls and applets while
    using IE. Most of the times I use Opera or Netscape.

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #8
  9. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sat, 13 Dec 2003 22:24:38 GMT, "*Vanguard*"
    <> wrote:

    >"Ravi" wrote
    >in news:p:
    ><snip>
    >> ... If I am using a pirated copy of xp ...

    >
    >From your post, and especially since you are concerned about Microsoft
    >seeing that your product registration matches someone else's, it is
    >highly likely that your "if" is superfluous and your real statement is
    >"I *AM* using a pirated copy".


    No.

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #9
  10. Ravi

    Leythos Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    > When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >
    > When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    > need to be installed!


    You need these updates for things that NIS is not going to protect you
    from. In addition, you need these updates for stability reasons.

    > So is my comp secure?


    Not in my opinion.

    > One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    > be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?


    From what I've seen, most people installed a keyed version and the
    update site will apply updates for IE, but the Service Packs for XP will
    not work. We've got a key for our MSDN Universal version of XP Prof,
    when we went to apply SP1 it failed, stated that they key was no good.
    We had to reinstall (upgrade) using the new key in order to apply the
    SP's.

    For the cost of XP Home Upgrade, you should buy it.

    If I remember correctly, it is a $10,000 fine PER license violation.

    --
    --

    (Remove 999 to reply to me)
    Leythos, Dec 14, 2003
    #10
  11. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 13:19:38 GMT, Leythos <>
    wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >> I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    >> When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >>
    >> When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    >> need to be installed!

    >
    >You need these updates for things that NIS is not going to protect you
    >from.


    Example?

    >In addition, you need these updates for stability reasons.




    >> So is my comp secure?

    >
    >Not in my opinion.


    Give an example as to what security loop holes may be
    present.

    >> One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    >> be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?

    >
    >From what I've seen, most people installed a keyed version and the
    >update site will apply updates for IE, but the Service Packs for XP will
    >not work. We've got a key for our MSDN Universal version of XP Prof,
    >when we went to apply SP1 it failed, stated that they key was no good.
    >We had to reinstall (upgrade) using the new key in order to apply the
    >SP's.
    >
    >For the cost of XP Home Upgrade, you should buy it.
    >
    >If I remember correctly, it is a $10,000 fine PER license violation.


    Thanks for the info. But my question was "will they /do they
    attempt to trace users from the winupdate site?"

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #11
  12. Ravi

    Leythos Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > >> So is my comp secure?

    > >
    > >Not in my opinion.

    >
    > Give an example as to what security loop holes may be
    > present.


    All of the security holes that were there before NIS was installed are
    there now. Since NIS is a "personal" firewall application it's
    susceptible to anything that you incorrectly configure, anything that
    you incorrectly create a rule for, and any thing that NIS does not cover
    that would have been corrected should you have installed the patches.

    Just because you are running NIS, and it passes the inbound attack test
    does not mean your computer is secure.

    --
    --

    (Remove 999 to reply to me)
    Leythos, Dec 14, 2003
    #12
  13. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 14:27:18 GMT, Leythos <>
    wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >> >> So is my comp secure?
    >> >
    >> >Not in my opinion.

    >>
    >> Give an example as to what security loop holes may be
    >> present.

    >
    >All of the security holes that were there before NIS was installed are
    >there now. Since NIS is a "personal" firewall application it's
    >susceptible to anything that you incorrectly configure, anything that
    >you incorrectly create a rule for, and any thing that NIS does not cover
    >that would have been corrected should you have installed the patches.
    >
    >Just because you are running NIS, and it passes the inbound attack test
    >does not mean your computer is secure.


    "This bulletin outlined further weaknesses in the Windows
    RPC DCOM implementation, including two vulnerabilities that
    could allow remote code execution and one DoS vulnerability.
    "

    Lets take into account for example the dcom port that took
    advantage of rpc. Now if that port is any way blocked...
    What possible harm can it do to a machine that is not
    patched? Infact I noticed even without NIS just with xp's
    built in firewall port dcom was blocked (stealth).

    Now talking only about this...
    Can I assume that as long as my rules are right. I am safe?

    TIA.

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #13
  14. Ravi

    Leythos Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > "This bulletin outlined further weaknesses in the Windows
    > RPC DCOM implementation, including two vulnerabilities that
    > could allow remote code execution and one DoS vulnerability.
    > "
    >
    > Lets take into account for example the dcom port that took
    > advantage of rpc. Now if that port is any way blocked...
    > What possible harm can it do to a machine that is not
    > patched? Infact I noticed even without NIS just with xp's
    > built in firewall port dcom was blocked (stealth).
    >
    > Now talking only about this...
    > Can I assume that as long as my rules are right. I am safe?


    If you trust your ability to make the correct decision about the rules,
    and you trust your ability to make decisions about things that have not
    yet been made public, then you have got to be one heck of a security
    expert (or lack of one).

    I guess what this comes down to is: You have a pirate copy of XP and
    want to know if another application can protect you so that you don't
    have to load any of the updates from MS that are there to protect you or
    to make your system more stable.

    I suppose you are running a pirated copy of NIS also?

    Just accept that NIS, while it's a nice package, is a "personal"
    firewall that is subject to all the mistakes that PERSON'S make.

    Since I have a real firewall, and not a personal one, and since I don't
    run NIS, I can only address your situation based on my experience, which
    covers many clients, many offices, many situations...

    I would suggest that you do the MS Update and do NOT rely on NIS to keep
    you completely safe.

    --
    --

    (Remove 999 to reply to me)
    Leythos, Dec 14, 2003
    #14
  15. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 16:09:33 GMT, Leythos <>
    wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >> "This bulletin outlined further weaknesses in the Windows
    >> RPC DCOM implementation, including two vulnerabilities that
    >> could allow remote code execution and one DoS vulnerability.
    >> "
    >>
    >> Lets take into account for example the dcom port that took
    >> advantage of rpc. Now if that port is any way blocked...
    >> What possible harm can it do to a machine that is not
    >> patched? Infact I noticed even without NIS just with xp's
    >> built in firewall port dcom was blocked (stealth).
    >>
    >> Now talking only about this...
    >> Can I assume that as long as my rules are right. I am safe?

    >
    >If you trust your ability to make the correct decision about the rules,
    >and you trust your ability to make decisions about things that have not
    >yet been made public, then you have got to be one heck of a security
    >expert (or lack of one).
    >
    >I guess what this comes down to is: You have a pirate copy of XP and
    >want to know if another application can protect you so that you don't
    >have to load any of the updates from MS that are there to protect you or
    >to make your system more stable.
    >
    >I suppose you are running a pirated copy of NIS also?
    >
    >Just accept that NIS, while it's a nice package, is a "personal"
    >firewall that is subject to all the mistakes that PERSON'S make.
    >
    >Since I have a real firewall, and not a personal one, and since I don't
    >run NIS, I can only address your situation based on my experience, which
    >covers many clients, many offices, many situations...
    >
    >I would suggest that you do the MS Update and do NOT rely on NIS to keep
    >you completely safe.


    Don't assume things! The updates are a pain. I don't have
    that much money to stay online and get all the updates. A
    total of about 50 MB!
    Impossible...

    That is why I am asking.

    Now, next you will say I am running a pirated copy of forte
    agent. Won't you?

    I am curious to know how far the issue of MS using its
    update site to check piracy is true.... That's it.

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #15
  16. "Ravi" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    > I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    > When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >
    > When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    > need to be installed!
    >
    > So is my comp secure?


    In certain circumstances. If you are planning to turn it on and either
    connect to the 'net or insert CDs/disks/whatever, then "no".

    > One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    > be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >
    > I hope these are not faq's.


    Trace? Not worth the effort. It's easier by far to simply block and let you
    suffer the consequences. The downside (for the rest of us) is that *we*
    could also suffer.

    While I have no idea on what is the norm in India, do you know the UK term
    "MoT"?. Basically, it's a Gov'mint certificate saying that the car probably
    won't kill you in the first 5 minutes of driving it. Ditto a bottle of pills
    that say "Aspirin" on the label, but you *know* aren't from the stated
    manufacturer.

    Fake MoT == compromised OS, in my view - you *know* someone "did" something,
    you don't know *what* Or, until something falls-off, what could happen in
    normal use.

    Ditto with those pills - although, for the rest of us, that's safer than the
    car ("Darwin Awards" ring a bell..? ;o)

    "How lucky do you feel, punk?" (that's a quote, not an insult, BTW ;o)

    --

    Hairy One Kenobi

    Disclaimer: the opinions expressed in this opinion do not necessarily
    reflect the opinions of the highly-opinionated person expressing the opinion
    in the first place. So there!
    Hairy One Kenobi, Dec 14, 2003
    #16
  17. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 16:09:33 GMT, Leythos <>
    wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >> "This bulletin outlined further weaknesses in the Windows
    >> RPC DCOM implementation, including two vulnerabilities that
    >> could allow remote code execution and one DoS vulnerability.
    >> "
    >>
    >> Lets take into account for example the dcom port that took
    >> advantage of rpc. Now if that port is any way blocked...
    >> What possible harm can it do to a machine that is not
    >> patched? Infact I noticed even without NIS just with xp's
    >> built in firewall port dcom was blocked (stealth).
    >>
    >> Now talking only about this...
    >> Can I assume that as long as my rules are right. I am safe?

    >
    >If you trust your ability to make the correct decision about the rules,
    >and you trust your ability to make decisions about things that have not
    >yet been made public, then you have got to be one heck of a security
    >expert (or lack of one).


    BTW you have a patch only after things HAVE been made
    public. Before that only a firewall can project you...
    Right?

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #17
  18. Ravi

    Ravi Guest

    On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 18:07:06 -0000, "Hairy One Kenobi"
    <abuse@[127.0.0.1]> wrote:

    >
    >"Ravi" <> wrote in message
    >news:p...
    >> I have norton internet security installed in winxp.
    >> When I goto the symantec site it says my comp is secure.
    >>
    >> When I go to the winupdate site it says: 45 critical updates
    >> need to be installed!
    >>
    >> So is my comp secure?

    >
    >In certain circumstances. If you are planning to turn it on and either
    >connect to the 'net or insert CDs/disks/whatever, then "no".
    >
    >> One more thing. If I am using a pirated copy of xp will they
    >> be able to trace my if I do a winupdate?
    >>
    >> I hope these are not faq's.

    >
    >Trace? Not worth the effort. It's easier by far to simply block and let you
    >suffer the consequences. The downside (for the rest of us) is that *we*
    >could also suffer.


    I wanted an answer from a person, who had the correct
    details. I did not want people to think or imagine what
    could/can/is being done.

    Well let me make the question more clear...

    "Does Microsoft use its update site to check for piracy?"

    Thanks for answering (only) that question.
    I just hope someone would frankly post below this saying
    "we don't know"

    (Spare my English).

    --
    main(){char s[37]="CSbwjAjocpy/mw!PS!sbwjAeftqbnnfe/dpn";
    int i;for(i=0;i<36;putchar(s[i++]-1));return 0;}
    Ravi, Dec 14, 2003
    #18
  19. Ravi

    Leythos Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > On Sun, 14 Dec 2003 16:09:33 GMT, Leythos <>
    > wrote:
    >
    > >In article <>,
    > > says...
    > >> "This bulletin outlined further weaknesses in the Windows
    > >> RPC DCOM implementation, including two vulnerabilities that
    > >> could allow remote code execution and one DoS vulnerability.
    > >> "
    > >>
    > >> Lets take into account for example the dcom port that took
    > >> advantage of rpc. Now if that port is any way blocked...
    > >> What possible harm can it do to a machine that is not
    > >> patched? Infact I noticed even without NIS just with xp's
    > >> built in firewall port dcom was blocked (stealth).
    > >>
    > >> Now talking only about this...
    > >> Can I assume that as long as my rules are right. I am safe?

    > >
    > >If you trust your ability to make the correct decision about the rules,
    > >and you trust your ability to make decisions about things that have not
    > >yet been made public, then you have got to be one heck of a security
    > >expert (or lack of one).

    >
    > BTW you have a patch only after things HAVE been made
    > public. Before that only a firewall can project you...
    > Right?


    I have several firewall appliances and several sets of rules in addition
    to AV software. I install an OS, apply the patches, setup the security,
    and do it all before the machine is first exposed to the internet.

    --
    --

    (Remove 999 to reply to me)
    Leythos, Dec 14, 2003
    #19
  20. Ravi

    Leythos Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > Well let me make the question more clear...
    >
    > "Does Microsoft use its update site to check for piracy?"


    While MS does NOT actively track hacked copies of XP, they can easily
    determine that your copy is hacked and the update programs will not let
    you apply select service packs. In addition, unless you capture the
    packet traffic and monitor it, you have no clue as to what they are
    sending back to MS if they detect an invalid key for your installation.


    --
    --

    (Remove 999 to reply to me)
    Leythos, Dec 14, 2003
    #20
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