Firefox improvements ?

Discussion in 'Firefox' started by Keith (Southend), May 17, 2005.

  1. Two areas of Firefox I was wondering whether there was likely to be any
    fixes for:

    1. Coloured scroll bars, these work on IE but not on Firefox.

    2. MS Excel 'Save as Web Page' function. Although I think this has
    improved I do find that often the text and borders are still jumbled, is
    this likely tobe looked at in future updates?

    Examples of both these error can be found on my website links as follows:

    Scrollbars...
    http://www.southendweather.net/

    Excel...
    http://www.southendweather.net/col0110.htm
    http://www.southendweather.net/eu0504full.htm

    Although, a refresh of the browser when displayed does now seem to
    correct this in the first instance.

    But both Firefox and Thunderbird are superb.

    Thanks
    --
    Keith (Southend)

    'Weather Home & Abroad'
    http://www.southendweather.net
     
    Keith (Southend), May 17, 2005
    #1
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  2. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:

    > Two areas of Firefox I was wondering whether there was likely to be any
    > fixes for:
    >
    > 1. Coloured scroll bars, these work on IE but not on Firefox.
    >
    > 2. MS Excel 'Save as Web Page' function. Although I think this has
    > improved I do find that often the text and borders are still jumbled, is
    > this likely tobe looked at in future updates?
    >
    > Examples of both these error can be found on my website links as follows:
    >
    > Scrollbars...
    > http://www.southendweather.net/
    >
    > Excel...
    > http://www.southendweather.net/col0110.htm Errors: 2410
    > http://www.southendweather.net/eu0504full.htm
    >
    > Although, a refresh of the browser when displayed does now seem to
    > correct this in the first instance.
    >
    > But both Firefox and Thunderbird are superb.
    >


    Yes, Mozilla Suite, Firefox and Thunderbird are superb. For one thing
    because they support the Web standards, and that's the reason they
    don't support the colored scrollbars.

    *My* browsers scrollbars are *mine* to choose what colors *I* want
    them to have, not any web designers toys to mess around with! Use your
    CSS file to more intuitive styling of your site.

    http://www.southendweather.net/col0110.htm have 2410 errors according
    to the validator ( http://validator.w3.org/ ), so if Excel has
    improved the number of errors must have been huge with earlier
    versions. Still, it's not a webpage editor and will never be. But you
    can use the output from Excel if you can clean up the source code to a
    reasonable level.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 17, 2005
    #2
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  3. Keith (Southend)

    xModem Guest

    On Wed, 18 May 2005 00:14:19 +0200, Arne <> wrote:

    >Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    >
    >> Two areas of Firefox I was wondering whether there was likely to be any
    >> fixes for:
    >>
    >> 1. Coloured scroll bars, these work on IE but not on Firefox.
    >>
    >> 2. MS Excel 'Save as Web Page' function. Although I think this has
    >> improved I do find that often the text and borders are still jumbled, is
    >> this likely tobe looked at in future updates?
    >>
    >> Examples of both these error can be found on my website links as follows:
    >>
    >> Scrollbars...
    >> http://www.southendweather.net/


    <snip>
    You might want to try the SphereGnome theme;
    https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/?application=firefox
    3D coloured scrollbars, etc.
     
    xModem, May 18, 2005
    #3
  4. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *xModem* wrote:
    > On Wed, 18 May 2005 00:14:19 +0200, Arne <> wrote:
    >
    >>Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    >>
    >>> Two areas of Firefox I was wondering whether there was likely to be any
    >>> fixes for:
    >>>
    >>> 1. Coloured scroll bars, these work on IE but not on Firefox.
    >>>
    >>> 2. MS Excel 'Save as Web Page' function. Although I think this has
    >>> improved I do find that often the text and borders are still jumbled, is
    >>> this likely tobe looked at in future updates?
    >>>
    >>> Examples of both these error can be found on my website links as follows:
    >>>
    >>> Scrollbars...
    >>> http://www.southendweather.net/

    >
    > <snip>
    > You might want to try the SphereGnome theme;
    > https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/?application=firefox
    > 3D coloured scrollbars, etc.


    First, since you are replying to my post, why snip out everything I
    posted?

    Second, SphereGnome is not any answer to Keith' questions. The themes
    (skins) give *your* browser the look *you* want it to have. Keith is
    asking about how *he* can change (with CSS) the look of *your* browser
    to what *he* want, when you visit his website

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 18, 2005
    #4
  5. Keith (Southend)

    xModem Guest

    On Wed, 18 May 2005 10:24:17 +0200, Arne <> wrote:

    >Once upon a time *xModem* wrote:
    >> On Wed, 18 May 2005 00:14:19 +0200, Arne <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> Two areas of Firefox I was wondering whether there was likely to be any
    >>>> fixes for:
    >>>>
    >>>> 1. Coloured scroll bars, these work on IE but not on Firefox.
    >>>>
    >>>> 2. MS Excel 'Save as Web Page' function. Although I think this has
    >>>> improved I do find that often the text and borders are still jumbled, is
    >>>> this likely tobe looked at in future updates?
    >>>>
    >>>> Examples of both these error can be found on my website links as follows:
    >>>>
    >>>> Scrollbars...
    >>>> http://www.southendweather.net/

    >>
    >> <snip>
    >> You might want to try the SphereGnome theme;
    >> https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/?application=firefox
    >> 3D coloured scrollbars, etc.

    >
    >First, since you are replying to my post, why snip out everything I
    >posted?


    My mistake, sorry.
    As for snipping, since my reply only concerned scrollbars, there was no need
    to include the rest. Were I replying to the OP. ;-)

    >Second, SphereGnome is not any answer to Keith' questions. The themes
    >(skins) give *your* browser the look *you* want it to have. Keith is
    >asking about how *he* can change (with CSS) the look of *your* browser
    >to what *he* want, when you visit his website


    Wow, I really have to read for comprehension.
    My apologies to the OP.
     
    xModem, May 18, 2005
    #5
  6. Arne wrote:

    > Second, SphereGnome is not any answer to Keith' questions. The themes
    > (skins) give *your* browser the look *you* want it to have. Keith is
    > asking about how *he* can change (with CSS) the look of *your* browser
    > to what *he* want, when you visit his website
    >


    I'm glad I spotted this post before I installed that theme.
    So basically Firefox 'does not' display scrollbars in colour from a CSS
    file and as yet this has not become part of the standard build which
    surprises me as coloured scrollbars are quite common?

    I guess the second part of my question was is this likely to be included
    in future updates?

    Thanks
    --
    Keith (Southend)

    'Weather Home & Abroad'
    http://www.southendweather.net
     
    Keith (Southend), May 18, 2005
    #6
  7. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    > Arne wrote:
    >
    >> Second, SphereGnome is not any answer to Keith' questions. The themes
    >> (skins) give *your* browser the look *you* want it to have. Keith is
    >> asking about how *he* can change (with CSS) the look of *your* browser
    >> to what *he* want, when you visit his website
    >>

    >
    > I'm glad I spotted this post before I installed that theme.
    > So basically Firefox 'does not' display scrollbars in colour from a CSS
    > file and as yet this has not become part of the standard build which
    > surprises me as coloured scrollbars are quite common?


    They may be common among people that code for IE and M$ don't seams to
    care to offer any alter theams for their browser. But I doubt they
    never will be standard CSS since the scrollbar is a part of the
    browser, not any web page. And I'm glad it stays that way.


    > I guess the second part of my question was is this likely to be included
    > in future updates?
    >


    Non standard HTML and CSS will never be included in the Mozilla
    browsers, I hope and belive. It's nothing wrong with the current
    Mozilla versions, the problem is the software that claims it can save
    content as HTML. As I said, you can use the output from Excel (and
    some other software) but the code need to be cleaned if you want it to
    be rendered properly.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 18, 2005
    #7
  8. Keith (Southend)

    Victor Guest

    "Arne" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    :
    > Yes, Mozilla Suite, Firefox and Thunderbird are superb. For one thing
    > because they support the Web standards, and that's the reason they
    > don't support the colored scrollbars.


    Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    scrollbars - especially paying visitors.

    Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
     
    Victor, May 19, 2005
    #8
  9. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Victor* wrote:
    > "Arne" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > :
    >> Yes, Mozilla Suite, Firefox and Thunderbird are superb. For one thing
    >> because they support the Web standards, and that's the reason they
    >> don't support the colored scrollbars.

    >
    > Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    > scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >
    > Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    > care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >


    Did I say something wrong, sutch as indicate it's important or that I
    care about the colored scrollbars? I don't, I have the same opinion on
    this as you have. That reply of mine was the same, without saying it.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 19, 2005
    #9
  10. Victor wrote:

    > Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    > scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >
    > Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    > care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    >

    Whatever happened to freedom of choice, personally I find bland grey
    pretty aweful, the sky in the UK is always that colour!

    --
    Keith (Southend)

    'Weather Home & Abroad'
    http://www.southendweather.net
     
    Keith (Southend), May 19, 2005
    #10
  11. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:

    > Victor wrote:
    >
    >> Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    >> scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >>
    >> Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    >> care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >>
    >>

    > Whatever happened to freedom of choice, personally I find bland grey
    > pretty aweful, the sky in the UK is always that colour!
    >


    Depends on whos freedom of choice you are talking about. Yours to
    choose the color of my browser, or mine to keep the color I like on my
    own browser. I prefer the freedom of choosing my preferences for my
    own browser. You can do what you like with your browser as long as you
    don't tuch mine.

    As I understand you can choose among many themes, if you use and like
    to change a Mozilla browser. I don't have the grey IE color on mine.
    But that's true, you don't have that choice with IE. As with the
    scrollbars, Microsoft don't like to give the freedom of choise to
    those who use their browser.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 19, 2005
    #11
  12. Arne wrote:
    > Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Victor wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    >>>scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >>>
    >>>Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    >>>care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >>>
    >>>

    >>
    >>Whatever happened to freedom of choice, personally I find bland grey
    >>pretty aweful, the sky in the UK is always that colour!
    >>

    >
    >
    > Depends on whos freedom of choice you are talking about. Yours to
    > choose the color of my browser, or mine to keep the color I like on my
    > own browser. I prefer the freedom of choosing my preferences for my
    > own browser. You can do what you like with your browser as long as you
    > don't tuch mine.
    >
    > As I understand you can choose among many themes, if you use and like
    > to change a Mozilla browser. I don't have the grey IE color on mine.
    > But that's true, you don't have that choice with IE. As with the
    > scrollbars, Microsoft don't like to give the freedom of choise to
    > those who use their browser.
    >


    Mmm, you can look a this from two angles, an individuals webpage is how
    that individual has designed it, if it was meant that the scrollbars
    were to be grey so beit, my point is surely the browser should display
    the full story of that website not a 'modified' version. I'm not wanting
    to change grey scrollbars of other websites, just displaying coloured
    ones if that's how they were designed. A bit like buying a colour
    magazine and printing it in black and white. I thought CSS was a
    standard html language?

    Some interesting points here all the same :)

    Thanks
    --
    Keith (Southend)

    'Weather Home & Abroad'
    http://www.southendweather.net
     
    Keith (Southend), May 19, 2005
    #12
  13. Keith (Southend)

    xModem Guest

    On Thu, 19 May 2005 21:02:54 +0100, "Keith (Southend)"
    <> wrote:

    >Victor wrote:
    >
    >> Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    >> scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >>
    >> Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    >> care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>

    >Whatever happened to freedom of choice, personally I find bland grey
    >pretty aweful, the sky in the UK is always that colour!


    You might want to try the SphereGnome theme;
    https://addons.mozilla.org/themes/?application=firefox
    It'll colour your world, and your world alone.

    Hey Arne, I think I got it right this time. ;-)
     
    xModem, May 19, 2005
    #13
  14. Keith (Southend)G, May 20, 2005
    #14
  15. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    > Arne wrote:
    >> Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>Victor wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>Unimportant. Visitors are more concerned with content than pretty
    >>>>scrollbars - especially paying visitors.
    >>>>
    >>>>Not supporting colored scrollbars does not make or break a website. I could
    >>>>care less if Firefox ever supports it or not.
    >>>>
    >>>>
    >>>
    >>>Whatever happened to freedom of choice, personally I find bland grey
    >>>pretty aweful, the sky in the UK is always that colour!
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >> Depends on whos freedom of choice you are talking about. Yours to
    >> choose the color of my browser, or mine to keep the color I like on my
    >> own browser. I prefer the freedom of choosing my preferences for my
    >> own browser. You can do what you like with your browser as long as you
    >> don't tuch mine.
    >>
    >> As I understand you can choose among many themes, if you use and like
    >> to change a Mozilla browser. I don't have the grey IE color on mine.
    >> But that's true, you don't have that choice with IE. As with the
    >> scrollbars, Microsoft don't like to give the freedom of choise to
    >> those who use their browser.
    >>

    >
    > Mmm, you can look a this from two angles, an individuals webpage is how
    > that individual has designed it, if it was meant that the scrollbars
    > were to be grey so beit, my point is surely the browser should display
    > the full story of that website not a 'modified' version. I'm not wanting
    > to change grey scrollbars of other websites, just displaying coloured
    > ones if that's how they were designed. A bit like buying a colour
    > magazine and printing it in black and white. I thought CSS was a
    > standard html language?
    >
    > Some interesting points here all the same :)
    >


    I guess you could go on for ever on this. But the basic stands, the
    browser is mine, not in any way a part of somebodys website.

    Think of it this way. If I come to visit you at your home, should you
    go out and repaint my car just because you don't like the color on it
    and you want it to "match" the color of your house?

    CSS is a standard "language", but as with any human language you are
    expected to talk in decent maner so others who hear you don't get
    upset or offended.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 20, 2005
    #15
  16. Arne wrote:

    > I guess you could go on for ever on this. But the basic stands, the
    > browser is mine, not in any way a part of somebodys website.
    >
    > Think of it this way. If I come to visit you at your home, should you
    > go out and repaint my car just because you don't like the color on it
    > and you want it to "match" the color of your house?
    >
    > CSS is a standard "language", but as with any human language you are
    > expected to talk in decent maner so others who hear you don't get
    > upset or offended.
    >


    Arne,

    I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one and see who
    has the last say (post) or runs out of steam.

    Using your philosophy with the car, the 'car' on my website is blue,
    I've driven it to your place it's now grey <g>

    But surely the scroll bars are determined by the size of the web page
    and the display resolution that is set. A simple page normally wouldn't
    'force' the browser into displaying scrollbars for navigation purposes.
    So I guess you're right when you say the scroll bars are part of the
    browser not the website. I just can't understand why you find them so
    offensive or intrusive, when so many websites use this.

    No offense meant.

    Regards
    --
    Keith (Southend)

    'Weather Home & Abroad'
    http://www.southendweather.net
     
    Keith (Southend), May 20, 2005
    #16
  17. Keith (Southend)

    Arne Guest

    Once upon a time *Keith (Southend)* wrote:
    > Arne wrote:
    >
    >> I guess you could go on for ever on this. But the basic stands, the
    >> browser is mine, not in any way a part of somebodys website.
    >>
    >> Think of it this way. If I come to visit you at your home, should you
    >> go out and repaint my car just because you don't like the color on it
    >> and you want it to "match" the color of your house?
    >>
    >> CSS is a standard "language", but as with any human language you are
    >> expected to talk in decent maner so others who hear you don't get
    >> upset or offended.
    >>

    >
    > Arne,
    >
    > I guess we will just have to agree to disagree on this one and see who
    > has the last say (post) or runs out of steam.


    At least we can du that :)


    > Using your philosophy with the car, the 'car' on my website is blue,
    > I've driven it to your place it's now grey <g>


    No, it's the color you had before. Because I don't change anybodys
    colors on cars, browsers or anything else that don't belong to me :)

    > But surely the scroll bars are determined by the size of the web page
    > and the display resolution that is set. A simple page normally wouldn't
    > 'force' the browser into displaying scrollbars for navigation purposes.
    > So I guess you're right when you say the scroll bars are part of the
    > browser not the website. I just can't understand why you find them so
    > offensive or intrusive, when so many websites use this.


    I guess they are "common" in a way, I just don't see them (and don't
    want to) when I use a "third party browser" as Microsoft puts it.
    (where the hell did they get that from :))

    > No offense meant.


    The same.

    --
    /Arne

    Top posters will be ignored. Quote the part you
    are replying to, no more and no less! And don't
    quote signatures, thank you.
     
    Arne, May 20, 2005
    #17
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