Faster Hard Drives?

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Chris Lim, Jul 3, 2006.

  1. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    and bigger but not a lot faster.

    Given that they are the bottleneck in most systems, I would've thought
    that some progress would've been made in this area by now. Is this
    anything in the pipeline? I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    budget Celeron!
    Chris Lim, Jul 3, 2006
    #1
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  2. Chris Lim

    thingy Guest

    Chris Lim wrote:
    > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > and bigger but not a lot faster.
    >
    > Given that they are the bottleneck in most systems, I would've thought
    > that some progress would've been made in this area by now. Is this
    > anything in the pipeline? I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!
    >


    The Raptor sata drives are really scsi drives with a sata interface, so
    the fastest you can get, but they have small capacity, high heat and
    very high prices.

    Otherwise no, you are reading off a mechanical device it has
    limitations. You can get solid state disks which are very fast, and
    about 8 gig of so, but these are not cheap.....

    regards

    thing
    thingy, Jul 4, 2006
    #2
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  3. Chris Lim wrote:
    > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > and bigger but not a lot faster.
    >
    > Given that they are the bottleneck in most systems, I would've thought
    > that some progress would've been made in this area by now. Is this
    > anything in the pipeline? I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!


    FWIW Windows Vista includes several technologies that are specifically
    designed to improve perf off the HDD, plug in a fast USB2 FD and gain
    some perf, or buy a new HDD that includes some Flash on it (Hybrid
    HDDs). Also the motherboard manufacturers are working on building some
    Flash into mobo's coming out next year too

    http://www.microsoft.com/whdc/system/sysperf/accelerator.mspx

    Windows ReadyBoost-capable Flash Devices
    The use of a flash device that supports Windows ReadyBoost technology
    extends the disk caching capabilities of Windows Vista main memory.
    ReadyBoost-capable devices can be implemented in a variety of form
    factors, including USB 2.0 flash drives, Secure Digital (SD) cards, and
    CompactFlash cards.

    Using ReadyBoost-capable flash memory devices for caching allows
    Windows Vista to service random disk reads with performance that is
    typically 8-10 times faster than random reads from traditional hard
    drives. This caching is applied to all disk content, not just the page
    file or system DLLs.

    Of course, most flash devices are slower than the hard drive for
    sequential I/O. To maximize performance, ReadyBoost includes logic to
    recognize large, sequential read requests and then allows these
    requests to be serviced by the hard drive.

    An external ReadyBoost-capable device could be removed at any time. As
    a result, one of the design goals for ReadyBoost was to ensure there
    could be no interruption of system service or loss of data when removal
    occurs. All data writes are made to the hard disk before being copied
    to the flash device, so every bit of data held within the flash device
    is safely duplicated on the hard disk.

    After some period of usage, the flash device will likely contain
    sensitive information. ReadyBoost encrypts the content for use only on
    the PC system where the data was generated.

    Windows ReadyDrive and Hybrid Hard Disk Drives
    Windows ReadyDrive technology supports the use of hybrid hard disk
    drives (H HDD). These are standard hard drives that include both
    rotating media and an integrated cache of non-volatile flash memory
    (also known as NVRAM). This cache buffers disk writes and allows the
    disk drive to stay spun down for longer periods of time to increase
    battery life and the overall reliability of the drives in mobile
    systems. In addition, serving data from the non-volatile cache
    increases the performance of the boot and resume processes as well as
    disk- and memory-intensive applications by avoiding the latency of
    random disk I/Os.
    Nathan Mercer, Jul 4, 2006
    #3
  4. Chris Lim

    Daniel Guest

    Chris Lim wrote:
    > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > and bigger but not a lot faster.
    >
    > Given that they are the bottleneck in most systems, I would've thought
    > that some progress would've been made in this area by now. Is this
    > anything in the pipeline? I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!
    >


    If you're using Windows XP, I'm not sure getting a faster hard drive
    will actually make an awful lot of difference.
    Just thinking that the issues you're experiencing may be related to some
    bit-rot (ie. software related) - assuming you're using Windows of course.

    Just a thought.
    Daniel, Jul 4, 2006
    #4
  5. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    Daniel wrote:
    > If you're using Windows XP, I'm not sure getting a faster hard drive
    > will actually make an awful lot of difference.
    > Just thinking that the issues you're experiencing may be related to some
    > bit-rot (ie. software related) - assuming you're using Windows of course.


    You think XP is so bad that some functions (e.g. boot up) perform the
    same across different processor speeds? That someone it slows down a P4
    3.2ghz CPU so that it takes about the same time to boot as a Celeron
    2.0ghz?

    I think I'll assume that the HD is the bottleneck rather than XP for
    now.
    Chris Lim, Jul 4, 2006
    #5
  6. Chris Lim

    juicyjuice Guest

    Re: Faster Hard Drives? -holographic storage

    Not faster yet really, but alot of potential.

    http://www.p2pnet.net/story/7124


    "Colossal Storage will be the only drive in the world that will be able to
    read any phase change disk with the capability of overwriting or infinitely
    rewriting data to any phase change disk by changing the internal molecular
    structure of the polarized atom dipole geometry without heat and cooling,"

    fun words there heh


    "Chris Lim" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > and bigger but not a lot faster.
    >
    > Given that they are the bottleneck in most systems, I would've thought
    > that some progress would've been made in this area by now. Is this
    > anything in the pipeline? I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!
    >
    juicyjuice, Jul 4, 2006
    #6
  7. Chris Lim

    Daniel Guest

    Chris Lim wrote:
    > Daniel wrote:
    >> If you're using Windows XP, I'm not sure getting a faster hard drive
    >> will actually make an awful lot of difference.
    >> Just thinking that the issues you're experiencing may be related to some
    >> bit-rot (ie. software related) - assuming you're using Windows of course.

    >
    > You think XP is so bad that some functions (e.g. boot up) perform the
    > same across different processor speeds? That someone it slows down a P4
    > 3.2ghz CPU so that it takes about the same time to boot as a Celeron
    > 2.0ghz?
    >


    I didn't say Win XP is bad. I said it might be related to bit-rot (which
    may be the wrong term).
    But, basically - yes, a Win XP machine can (and does) degrade in
    performance over time - registry size & fragmentation, disk
    fragmentation, malware, performance-degrading services etc etc.
    Daniel, Jul 4, 2006
    #7
  8. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    Daniel wrote:
    > I didn't say Win XP is bad. I said it might be related to bit-rot (which
    > may be the wrong term).
    > But, basically - yes, a Win XP machine can (and does) degrade in
    > performance over time - registry size & fragmentation, disk
    > fragmentation, malware, performance-degrading services etc etc.


    Oh, I see. Nah I just did a fresh install of a couple of machines, a
    high spec one and a low spec one, and both had about the same boot up
    time.
    Chris Lim, Jul 4, 2006
    #8
  9. Chris Lim

    XPD Guest

    "Chris Lim" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!
    >


    I dunno..... you tried booting WIn98 from a p4 3.0ghz 1gb system ? Boots
    pretty damn fast compared to P2 with 98 :)
    --
    XPD^
    http://www.xpd.co.nz/
    XPD, Jul 4, 2006
    #9
  10. Chris Lim

    MaHogany Guest

    On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 15:56:39 -0700, Chris Lim wrote:

    > I hate the fact that a top end Pentium with
    > an IDE or SATA drive still takes around the same time to boot as a
    > budget Celeron!


    Then don't use Intal chips - use something better - like AMD64s.


    Ma Hogany

    --
    Q: How do I make Windows(TM) go faster?
    A: Throw it harder...
    MaHogany, Jul 4, 2006
    #10
  11. Chris Lim

    MaHogany Guest

    On Mon, 03 Jul 2006 19:57:19 -0700, Chris Lim wrote:

    > Oh, I see. Nah I just did a fresh install of a couple of machines, a
    > high spec one and a low spec one, and both had about the same boot up
    > time.


    If that;'s the case then you're obviously using the wrong OS.

    Have you tried using the better OS?


    Ma Hogany

    --
    Q: How do I make Windows(TM) go faster?
    A: Throw it harder...
    MaHogany, Jul 4, 2006
    #11
  12. Chris Lim

    Max Burke Guest

    > Daniel scribbled:
    > If you're using Windows XP, I'm not sure getting a faster hard
    > drive will actually make an awful lot of difference.
    > Just thinking that the issues you're experiencing may be related
    > to some bit-rot (ie. software related) - assuming you're using
    > Windows of course.


    >> You think XP is so bad that some functions (e.g. boot up) perform
    >> the same across different processor speeds? That someone it slows
    >> down a P4 3.2ghz CPU so that it takes about the same time to boot as a
    >> Celeron
    >> 2.0ghz?


    > I didn't say Win XP is bad. I said it might be related to bit-rot
    > (which may be the wrong term).
    > But, basically - yes, a Win XP machine can (and does) degrade in
    > performance over time - registry size & fragmentation, disk
    > fragmentation, malware, performance-degrading services etc etc.


    Half an hour a week doing basic 'housekeeping' will stop all of that
    happening and keep XP happy and healthy....

    Dont want to do it yourself? Automate it so it's all done in the background.

    --

    Replace the obvious with paradise.net to email me
    Found Images
    http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/~mlvburke
    Max Burke, Jul 4, 2006
    #12
  13. Chris Lim

    gimp Guest

    Chris Lim wrote:
    > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > and bigger but not a lot faster.


    raid. :) i havn't it used it recently though, i prefer just raptors.
    they make a huge difference in app and file load time, and OS load time.
    its so much nicer having a raptor as an OS disk, going back to
    7,200rpm systems i notice the disk access seems to go on forever after a
    boot-up.
    gimp, Jul 4, 2006
    #13
  14. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    gimp wrote:
    > Chris Lim wrote:
    > > Where are all the faster hard drives? They seem to be getting bigger
    > > and bigger but not a lot faster.

    >
    > raid. :) i havn't it used it recently though, i prefer just raptors.
    > they make a huge difference in app and file load time, and OS load time.
    > its so much nicer having a raptor as an OS disk, going back to
    > 7,200rpm systems i notice the disk access seems to go on forever after a
    > boot-up.


    Thanks, I think I might have to get a Raptor drive then.

    Also does the type of motherboard make a difference in terms of how
    fast hard drives are able to transfer data? The reason I ask is, if I
    try and burn 2 DVD's at the same time from the same hard drive, it
    takes much longer than burning them one after the other, and while it's
    burning my PC seems to grind to a halt with all the HD activity (even
    though I'm burning off a secondary HD and not the OS one). It seems
    like as well as the HD being a bottleneck, the IDE/SATA bus on the
    motherboard is getting clogged up. Do more expensive motherboards have
    faster IDE/SATA bus speeds, or does the IDE/SATA standard limit them to
    a certain speed?
    Chris Lim, Jul 6, 2006
    #14
  15. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    MaHogany wrote:
    > Have you tried using the better OS?


    I'm tempted to give Linux a go and see what you're always on about :)

    Seriously though, the main applications I use on my PC are:

    1) DVD Shrink and Nero, to encode and burn DVDs.
    2) ConvertXToDVD, an excellent utility that converts just about all
    video files to DVD.

    I presume there are decent equivalents on the Linux plaform?

    Also what flavour of Linux would you recommend? I'm a newbie when it
    comes to Linux on a PC, but I have used Unix on a Sun/Solaris before.

    Chris
    Chris Lim, Jul 6, 2006
    #15
  16. Chris Lim

    MaHogany Guest

    On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 21:42:01 -0700, Chris Lim wrote:

    > MaHogany wrote:
    >> Have you tried using the better OS?

    >
    > I'm tempted to give Linux a go and see what you're always on about :)


    Cool!


    > Seriously though, the main applications I use on my PC are:
    >
    > 1) DVD Shrink and Nero, to encode and burn DVDs.
    > 2) ConvertXToDVD, an excellent utility that converts just about all
    > video files to DVD.
    >
    > I presume there are decent equivalents on the Linux plaform?


    I have created AVI files of DVDs, but haven't burnt video DVDs. I believe
    that there is software that can create video DVDS but I have never tried
    to install or to use it, and the software that I use to create AVIs is not
    included in SuSE Linux.

    But once all the necessary software is installed, creating AVIs is
    trivially easy to do.

    My preference of Linux distro has been SuSE Linux, altho' the latest
    version has a few issues, and I'm thinking that I'll try Kubuntu when I
    next upgrade the system to a newer version.


    > Also what flavour of Linux would you recommend? I'm a newbie when it
    > comes to Linux on a PC, but I have used Unix on a Sun/Solaris before.


    If you're familiar with Solaris, then you'll find many parts of Linux are
    very similar - as both Solaris and Linux follow the Single Unix
    specification.

    I think that desktop Linux is presently on the cusp of including
    functionality which will make M$'s very newest stuff look old and tatty by
    comparison.


    Ma Hogany

    --
    Q: How do I make Windows(TM) go faster?
    A: Throw it harder...
    MaHogany, Jul 6, 2006
    #16
  17. Chris Lim

    a_l_p Guest

    MaHogany wrote:
    > On Wed, 05 Jul 2006 21:42:01 -0700, Chris Lim wrote:
    >
    >
    >>MaHogany wrote:
    >>
    >>>Have you tried using the better OS?

    >>
    >>I'm tempted to give Linux a go and see what you're always on about :)

    >
    >
    > Cool!
    >
    >
    >
    >>Seriously though, the main applications I use on my PC are:
    >>
    >>1) DVD Shrink and Nero, to encode and burn DVDs.
    >>2) ConvertXToDVD, an excellent utility that converts just about all
    >>video files to DVD.
    >>
    >>I presume there are decent equivalents on the Linux plaform?

    >
    >
    > I have created AVI files of DVDs, but haven't burnt video DVDs. I believe
    > that there is software that can create video DVDS but I have never tried
    > to install or to use it, and the software that I use to create AVIs is not
    > included in SuSE Linux.
    >
    > But once all the necessary software is installed, creating AVIs is
    > trivially easy to do.
    >
    > My preference of Linux distro has been SuSE Linux, altho' the latest
    > version has a few issues, and I'm thinking that I'll try Kubuntu when I
    > next upgrade the system to a newer version.
    >



    I've just installed the newest Kubuntu (6.06) on my other machine, replacing the
    one before.. Very easy, a few clicks and choose name and password and that's
    about it, it chuffs along and gets itself sorted, no worries.

    www.kubuntu.org
    www.canonical.com
    To request free Ubuntu (has the Gnome desktop, Kubuntu's is KDE) CDs, visit
    shipit.canonical.org.
    >
    >>Also what flavour of Linux would you recommend? I'm a newbie when it
    >>comes to Linux on a PC, but I have used Unix on a Sun/Solaris before.

    >
    >
    > If you're familiar with Solaris, then you'll find many parts of Linux are
    > very similar - as both Solaris and Linux follow the Single Unix
    > specification.
    >
    > I think that desktop Linux is presently on the cusp of including
    > functionality which will make M$'s very newest stuff look old and tatty by
    > comparison.


    There are still people who like the command-line earning-my-geek-badge style but
    for those who don't there are well-presented, very usable programs for most of
    the purposes most people want. If anything the problem is sorting out the
    programs that suit you, out of rather an oversupply!

    A L P
    a_l_p, Jul 6, 2006
    #17
  18. Chris Lim

    MaHogany Guest

    On Thu, 06 Jul 2006 21:35:43 +1200, a_l_p wrote:

    > I've just installed the newest Kubuntu (6.06) on my other machine,
    > replacing the one before.. Very easy, a few clicks and choose name and
    > password and that's about it, it chuffs along and gets itself sorted, no
    > worries.
    >
    > www.kubuntu.org
    > www.canonical.com
    > To request free Ubuntu (has the Gnome desktop, Kubuntu's is KDE) CDs,
    > visit shipit.canonical.org.


    I don't like Gnome - too dumbed down for my linking.

    Does canonical also ship Kubuntu?


    Ma Hogany

    --
    Q: How do I make Windows(TM) go faster?
    A: Throw it harder...
    MaHogany, Jul 6, 2006
    #18
  19. Chris Lim

    a_l_p Guest

    MaHogany wrote:
    > On Thu, 06 Jul 2006 21:35:43 +1200, a_l_p wrote:


    >>
    >>www.kubuntu.org
    >>www.canonical.com
    >>To request free Ubuntu (has the Gnome desktop, Kubuntu's is KDE) CDs,
    >>visit shipit.canonical.org.

    >
    >
    > I don't like Gnome - too dumbed down for my linking.
    >
    > Does canonical also ship Kubuntu?
    >


    Yes.

    A L P
    a_l_p, Jul 6, 2006
    #19
  20. Chris Lim

    Chris Lim Guest

    MaHogany wrote:
    > My preference of Linux distro has been SuSE Linux, altho' the latest
    > version has a few issues, and I'm thinking that I'll try Kubuntu when I
    > next upgrade the system to a newer version.


    I've just downloaded Ubuntu 6.06 so I'll have a play with it tonight.
    I'll try running it from the CD first before installing it. Does this
    mean you don't even need to go through any length installation process
    to run it?? If so, I'm impressed already! :)
    Chris Lim, Jul 6, 2006
    #20
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