Extending a "copper" phone line;!..

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by tony sayer, May 31, 2011.

  1. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.

    Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    they want to keep the existing phone line.

    Anyone know if that can be done with an ATA and thence to ethernet and
    then to another ATA if that can be done or else would they need some
    other gubbins in line with that to act as an exchange of sorts they need
    to be able to use that line to make and receive calls on..

    The radio link can be considered a a long CAT 5 cable in effect..

    Anyone any ideas?..

    TIA...
    --
    Tony Sayer

    Bancom Communications U.K. Tel+44 1223 566577 Fax+44 1223 566588

    4 Wingate close, Cambridge, England, CB2 9HW E-Mail
    tony sayer, May 31, 2011
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. tony sayer

    Paulg0 Guest

    "tony sayer" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    > needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    > some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    > units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >
    > Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    > they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >
    > Anyone know if that can be done with an ATA and thence to ethernet and
    > then to another ATA if that can be done or else would they need some
    > other gubbins in line with that to act as an exchange of sorts they need
    > to be able to use that line to make and receive calls on..
    >
    > The radio link can be considered a a long CAT 5 cable in effect..
    >
    > Anyone any ideas?..
    >


    Do they want traditional wired phones on the far end? If this is not
    essential a DECT cordless solution may be an option with the base station in
    the original site and a strategically placed DECT extender at some point
    along the way. That way they could have up to 6 handsets at the remote
    location with transfer facilities.

    Paul
    Paulg0, May 31, 2011
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. In article <>,
    tony sayer <> wrote:
    >
    >Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >
    >Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >they want to keep the existing phone line.


    So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?

    ie. VoIP PBX (e.g. asterisk) with a PSTN card with an FXS port at the
    BT line end, then VoIP phones everywhere else (including the other end
    of the link)

    That then gives them quite a lot of flexability should they need it.

    Gordon
    Gordon Henderson, May 31, 2011
    #3
  4. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <is3atf$gdk$>, Paulg0
    <> scribeth thus
    >"tony sayer" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >>
    >> Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >> needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >> some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >> units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>
    >> Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >> they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >>
    >> Anyone know if that can be done with an ATA and thence to ethernet and
    >> then to another ATA if that can be done or else would they need some
    >> other gubbins in line with that to act as an exchange of sorts they need
    >> to be able to use that line to make and receive calls on..
    >>
    >> The radio link can be considered a a long CAT 5 cable in effect..
    >>
    >> Anyone any ideas?..
    >>

    >
    >Do they want traditional wired phones on the far end? If this is not
    >essential a DECT cordless solution may be an option with the base station in
    >the original site and a strategically placed DECT extender at some point
    >along the way. That way they could have up to 6 handsets at the remote
    >location with transfer facilities.
    >
    >Paul
    >
    >
    >

    I rather think it's a bit too far and their room is in the basement so
    its got to be up on the roof as such .. And that might be a problem
    having an external handset type base.

    May well give another suggestion a go..
    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 1, 2011
    #4
  5. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <is3mnh$27j1$>, Gordon Henderson
    <> scribeth thus
    >In article <>,
    >tony sayer <> wrote:
    >>
    >>Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >>needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >>some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >>units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>
    >>Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >>they want to keep the existing phone line.

    >
    >So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?


    Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    someone else's PABX !....

    >
    >ie. VoIP PBX (e.g. asterisk) with a PSTN card with an FXS port at the
    >BT line end, then VoIP phones everywhere else (including the other end
    >of the link)
    >
    >That then gives them quite a lot of flexability should they need it.


    I'm trying to get them to understand that sort of concept!..
    >
    >Gordon


    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 3, 2011
    #5
  6. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <>, Jono
    <> scribeth thus
    >tony sayer laid this down on his screen :
    >> Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >> needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >> some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >> units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>
    >> Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >> they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >>
    >> Anyone know if that can be done with an ATA and thence to ethernet and
    >> then to another ATA if that can be done or else would they need some
    >> other gubbins in line with that to act as an exchange of sorts they need
    >> to be able to use that line to make and receive calls on..
    >>
    >> The radio link can be considered a a long CAT 5 cable in effect..
    >>
    >> Anyone any ideas?..
    >>
    >> TIA...

    >
    >This should give you an idea:
    >
    >http://www.provu.co.uk/pdf/sipura/spa_backtoback_1x_spa3000_and_1x_spa1001.pdf
    >
    >bit outdated..
    >
    >

    Thanks looks like that might do what's needed!..

    Cheers...
    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 3, 2011
    #6
  7. In article <>,
    tony sayer <> wrote:
    >In article <is3mnh$27j1$>, Gordon Henderson
    ><> scribeth thus
    >>In article <>,
    >>tony sayer <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >>>needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >>>some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >>>units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>>
    >>>Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >>>they want to keep the existing phone line.

    >>
    >>So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?

    >
    >Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    >someone else's PABX !....


    That's not neccessarily a show-stopper - if you can stick an analogue
    phone on it, then it's still just a POTS line to all intents and purposes.

    >>ie. VoIP PBX (e.g. asterisk) with a PSTN card with an FXS port at the
    >>BT line end, then VoIP phones everywhere else (including the other end
    >>of the link)
    >>
    >>That then gives them quite a lot of flexability should they need it.

    >
    >I'm trying to get them to understand that sort of concept!..


    The down-side of-course is cost!

    You could sell it as a "black box" solution and not tell them it's a PBX :)

    However I think you can make some ATAs ring a SIP phone directly,
    but it's been a while since I've looked... Quick check and I think a
    Grandstream HT503 plus a standard SIP phone might work together with some
    configuration noodling - might be worth reading up on their manuals...

    Gordon
    Gordon Henderson, Jun 3, 2011
    #7
  8. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <>, Jono
    <> scribeth thus
    >tony sayer formulated on Friday :
    >>> So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?

    >>
    >> Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    >> someone else's PABX !....

    >
    >Is the PABX IP capable?
    >
    >


    Pass on that one, we're not allowed near it and quite frankly I don't
    what to be as if anything went wrong with it afterwards guess who'd get
    the blame;!..

    I think this will end up with a VoIP line at the new premises for
    outgoing and forwarding calls from their old line..
    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 5, 2011
    #8
  9. In article <>,
    tony sayer <> wrote:
    >In article <>, Jono
    ><> scribeth thus
    >>tony sayer formulated on Friday :
    >>>> So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?
    >>>
    >>> Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    >>> someone else's PABX !....

    >>
    >>Is the PABX IP capable?

    >
    >Pass on that one, we're not allowed near it and quite frankly I don't
    >what to be as if anything went wrong with it afterwards guess who'd get
    >the blame;!..


    Even it if were capable, or upgradable, I suspect the cost of doing so
    would come close to or exceede a simpler solution...

    >I think this will end up with a VoIP line at the new premises for
    >outgoing and forwarding calls from their old line..


    Go for it!

    Gordon
    Gordon Henderson, Jun 5, 2011
    #9
  10. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <>, R. Mark Clayton
    <> scribeth thus
    >
    >"tony sayer" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> In article <is3mnh$27j1$>, Gordon Henderson
    >> <> scribeth thus
    >>>In article <>,
    >>>tony sayer <> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity



    Umm......

    >>>>needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road





    >>>>some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >>>>units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>>>
    >>>>Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >>>>they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >>>
    >>>So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?

    >>
    >> Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    >> someone else's PABX !....

    >



    >Cat5e will go about 100m if you have decent cables etc.,



    Refer to the line marked above;!...

    > however a typical
    >PABX (e.g. Panasonic KX-TDAnn) can go nearly 400m.
    >
    >Anyway last year we had to set up a satellite office for a month and got
    >four 75m runs out of a box of cable.
    >
    >If it is genuine POTS then you can run two lines in a Cat5E downstream of
    >the master socket and 4 lines upstream., however this won't work with PBX's
    >because there tends to be power and extra signalling in the other cores.
    >
    >>
    >>>
    >>>ie. VoIP PBX (e.g. asterisk) with a PSTN card with an FXS port at the
    >>>BT line end, then VoIP phones everywhere else (including the other end
    >>>of the link)
    >>>
    >>>That then gives them quite a lot of flexability should they need it.

    >>
    >> I'm trying to get them to understand that sort of concept!..
    >>>
    >>>Gordon

    >>
    >> --
    >> Tony Sayer
    >>

    >
    >


    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 5, 2011
    #10
  11. tony sayer

    Dave Saville Guest

    On Tue, 7 Jun 2011 19:17:37 UTC, "R. Mark Clayton"
    <> wrote:

    > Do phone wires cross roads - yes I can see one from where I am typing. It's
    > a private road, but the principle is the same - I suppose you could
    > encounter some regulatory problems if you crossed a public road, but I
    > guessed the buildings were inside a works or similar.


    AFAIK crossing a public road has to be done by BT or similar. Years
    ago we had a site across the road and it was within the distance spec
    for co-ax (IBM 3270's) but we had to use a damn great network box ->
    modem -> BT and back. :-(

    --
    Regards
    Dave Saville
    Dave Saville, Jun 7, 2011
    #11
  12. tony sayer

    Owain Guest

    On Jun 5, 9:21 pm, "R. Mark Clayton" wrote:
    > Cat5e will go about 100m if you have decent cables etc., however a typical
    > PABX (e.g. Panasonic KX-TDAnn) can go nearly 400m.


    A decent PBX should go a lot longer than that.

    Even a Plan 107/107 would go 6 miles on an external extension, and
    that was loop disconnect dialling through to the exchange.

    Owain
    Owain, Jun 7, 2011
    #12
  13. tony sayer

    tony sayer Guest

    In article <>, R. Mark Clayton
    <> scribeth thus
    >
    >"tony sayer" <> wrote in message
    >news:hDpLeNI0d$...
    >> In article <>, R. Mark Clayton
    >> <> scribeth thus
    >>>
    >>>"tony sayer" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:...
    >>>> In article <is3mnh$27j1$>, Gordon Henderson
    >>>> <> scribeth thus
    >>>>>In article <>,
    >>>>>tony sayer <> wrote:
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small
    >>>>>>charity

    >>
    >>
    >> Umm......
    >>
    >>>>>>needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>>>>>some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >>>>>>units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>>Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons
    >>>>>>why
    >>>>>>they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >>>>>
    >>>>>So why don't they go VoIP and keep the existing phone line?
    >>>>
    >>>> Bit of a complex Historic story Gordon but mainly as its a DDI line on
    >>>> someone else's PABX !....
    >>>

    >>
    >>
    >>>Cat5e will go about 100m if you have decent cables etc.,

    >>
    >>
    >> Refer to the line marked above;!...

    >
    >Now let me see 100m = ~110 yards, so distance is OK.
    >
    >Other side of the road - depending on the span you might need to use a "drop
    >wire" essentially the conductors are copper, but there is some steel for
    >strength.
    >
    >Do phone wires cross roads - yes I can see one from where I am typing. It's
    >a private road, but the principle is the same - I suppose you could
    >encounter some regulatory problems if you crossed a public road, but I
    >guessed the buildings were inside a works or similar.
    >
    >>


    This is a public road and a quite busy one at that and stringing a wire
    across it -could- be done but they'd have kittens at the thought.
    Anyways they now have a forward and VoIP answer and there're off my
    back;)...

    cheers...

    >>> however a typical
    >>>PABX (e.g. Panasonic KX-TDAnn) can go nearly 400m.

    >
    >In which case you could follow a more convoluted route.
    >
    >
    >


    --
    Tony Sayer
    tony sayer, Jun 8, 2011
    #13
  14. tony sayer

    Owain Guest

    On Jun 9, 7:40 pm, "R. Mark Clayton" wrote:
    > > Cat5e will go about 100m if you have decent cables etc., however a typical
    > > PABX (e.g. Panasonic KX-TDAnn) can go nearly 400m.

    > :A decent PBX should go a lot longer than that.
    > That is what is says in the manual.


    Panasonics have their appeal as a small office key system but they are
    not what I would call a decent PABX.

    > : Even a Plan 107/107 would go 6 miles on an external extension, and
    > that was loop disconnect dialling through to the exchange.
    > That would have been analog?


    analogue voice with digital signalling :)

    Owain
    Owain, Jun 9, 2011
    #14
  15. In article <>,
    tony sayer <> writes:
    > In article <>, Jono
    > <> scribeth thus
    >>tony sayer laid this down on his screen :
    >>> Heres a bit of an odd one. An outfit we're involved with a small charity
    >>> needs to extend their phone line across to the other side of a road
    >>> some 100 yards in all. We have got some cheap secure microwave link
    >>> units that have a 10/100 type ethernet at either end.
    >>>
    >>> Yes I know they could go VoIP but there are many and several reasons why
    >>> they want to keep the existing phone line.
    >>>
    >>> Anyone know if that can be done with an ATA and thence to ethernet and
    >>> then to another ATA if that can be done or else would they need some
    >>> other gubbins in line with that to act as an exchange of sorts they need
    >>> to be able to use that line to make and receive calls on..
    >>>
    >>> The radio link can be considered a a long CAT 5 cable in effect..
    >>>
    >>> Anyone any ideas?..
    >>>
    >>> TIA...

    >>
    >>This should give you an idea:
    >>
    >>http://www.provu.co.uk/pdf/sipura/spa_backtoback_1x_spa3000_and_1x_spa1001.pdf
    >>
    >>bit outdated..
    >>
    >>

    > Thanks looks like that might do what's needed!..


    I am using pretty much this to redirect a phone line about 70 miles
    with a pair of back-to-back SPA-3000's. (Today, you'd use SPA-3102's.)

    --
    Andrew Gabriel
    [email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]
    Andrew Gabriel, Jun 9, 2011
    #15
  16. tony sayer

    Graham. Guest

    "R. Mark Clayton" <> wrote in message news:...
    >
    > "Owain" <> wrote in message news:...
    > On Jun 9, 7:40 pm, "R. Mark Clayton" wrote:
    >> > Cat5e will go about 100m if you have decent cables etc., however a typical
    >> > PABX (e.g. Panasonic KX-TDAnn) can go nearly 400m.

    >> :A decent PBX should go a lot longer than that.
    >> That is what is says in the manual.

    >
    > Panasonics have their appeal as a small office key system but they are
    > not what I would call a decent PABX.
    >
    >> : Even a Plan 107/107 would go 6 miles on an external extension, and
    >> that was loop disconnect dialling through to the exchange.
    >> That would have been analog?

    >
    > analogue voice with digital signalling :)
    >
    > Owain
    >
    > Loop disconnect is digital - well I suppose so :-}


    Whoosh!


    --
    Graham.

    %Profound_observation%
    Graham., Jun 10, 2011
    #16
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. Academic Technology Services

    Copper GB - crossover needed?

    Academic Technology Services, Feb 27, 2004, in forum: Cisco
    Replies:
    4
    Views:
    6,767
    Chris Thomas
    Mar 2, 2004
  2. Jason G.

    2621xm - Small Copper Pieces?

    Jason G., Aug 27, 2004, in forum: Cisco
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    490
    Simon Marsden
    Aug 29, 2004
  3. Aharon Schkolnik

    Problem Daisy-Chaining 2950 Using Copper Giga

    Aharon Schkolnik, Sep 22, 2005, in forum: Cisco
    Replies:
    5
    Views:
    2,807
    Aharon Schkolnik
    Sep 25, 2005
  4. Replies:
    4
    Views:
    573
    Erik Tamminga
    Feb 1, 2006
  5. Silverstrand
    Replies:
    0
    Views:
    745
    Silverstrand
    Apr 17, 2006
Loading...

Share This Page