ECC, registered RAM

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by No Spam, May 30, 2005.

  1. No Spam

    No Spam Guest

    Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333
    Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333, ECC, Registered

    What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.
    No Spam, May 30, 2005
    #1
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  2. No Spam

    AD. Guest

    On Mon, 30 May 2005 18:03:49 +1200, No Spam wrote:

    > Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333 Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM,
    > DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >
    > What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.


    Can correct 1 bit memory errors on the fly. Very handy on a server, but
    not really value for money on a desktop. From memory, Opterons require
    registered ECC memory (correct me if I'm wrong).

    As for the difference between registered and unregistered - I forget :)

    --
    Cheers
    Anton
    AD., May 30, 2005
    #2
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  3. No Spam

    Harry Guest

    AD. wrote:

    > On Mon, 30 May 2005 18:03:49 +1200, No Spam wrote:
    >
    >> Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333 Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM,
    >> DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >>
    >> What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.

    >
    > Can correct 1 bit memory errors on the fly. Very handy on a server, but
    > not really value for money on a desktop. From memory, Opterons require
    > registered ECC memory (correct me if I'm wrong).
    >
    > As for the difference between registered and unregistered - I forget :)
    >


    It can also detect 2 bits of error.
    Handy if you don't trust ram manufacturers to produce 100% reliable
    memory, given the cut-throat profit motive prevalent today.
    Harry, May 30, 2005
    #3
  4. In article <>, says...
    > Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333
    > Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >
    > What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.
    >


    ECC Registered is slower. As others have pointed out it has error
    correction but unless I am very much mistaken your motherboard has to
    have support for that in the momory controller or it's an utter waste of
    money.

    Typically only used in high end active servers a.f.a.i.k.

    B.t.w. it's the 'Registered' that costs all the extra money - just
    'ECC' memory is not all that much more expensive than the common or
    garden variety.

    Some of the ram manufacturers have interesting articles on the subject
    on their websites; try Legend and Crucial for instance.

    -P.
    Peter Huebner, May 30, 2005
    #4
  5. No Spam

    Harry Guest

    Peter Huebner wrote:

    > In article <>, says...
    >> Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333
    >> Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >>
    >> What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.
    >>

    >
    > ECC Registered is slower.


    ECC is not slower.
    PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) is exactly the same speed at
    PC3200 DDR (400MHz) ECC.

    > As others have pointed out it has error
    > correction but unless I am very much mistaken your motherboard has to
    > have support for that in the momory controller or it's an utter waste of
    > money.


    All motherboards support ECC.

    Any fool knows that ECC is implemented on the ram module so the only
    extra communication between ram and motherboard is NMI - and every
    motherboard supports NMI because they all have same interrupt controller.

    You don't know s**t from c**y.
    Harry, May 30, 2005
    #5
  6. Harry wrote:
    >>>What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.


    >>ECC Registered is slower.


    > ECC is not slower.
    > PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) is exactly the same speed at
    > PC3200 DDR (400MHz) ECC.


    how come it performs slower in pretty much every benchmark ever made?
    Dave - Dave.net.nz, May 30, 2005
    #6
  7. No Spam

    gimp Guest

    Dave - Dave.net.nz wrote:
    > how come it performs slower in pretty much every benchmark ever made?



    i noticed on the OCZ site ECC memory always seems to have slower timings
    (eg 3-3-3 at best)... i'm not sure if manufacturers do this deliberatly
    for stability or even if it makes a difference... i don't really know
    what i'm talking about on this :)
    gimp, May 30, 2005
    #7
  8. gimp wrote:
    >> how come it performs slower in pretty much every benchmark ever made?


    > i noticed on the OCZ site ECC memory always seems to have slower timings
    > (eg 3-3-3 at best)... i'm not sure if manufacturers do this deliberatly
    > for stability or even if it makes a difference... i don't really know
    > what i'm talking about on this :)


    if it has higher latency it will have a little lag a/effecting
    performance a bit.

    Kinda like how a 2Mbit fibre connection seems so much faster than a
    2Mbit DSL account, even thouigh they are the same speed, the latency is
    so much lower with fibre.
    Dave - Dave.net.nz, May 30, 2005
    #8
  9. No Spam

    Bok Guest

    Harry wrote:
    > ECC is not slower.
    > PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) is exactly the same speed at
    > PC3200 DDR (400MHz) ECC.


    There can be a 1-2% degradation due to increased latency with ECC.

    >>As others have pointed out it has error
    >>correction but unless I am very much mistaken your motherboard has to
    >>have support for that in the momory controller or it's an utter waste of
    >>money.

    > All motherboards support ECC.

    Not true, Peter was correct.

    > Any fool knows that ECC is implemented on the ram module so the only
    > extra communication between ram and motherboard is NMI - and every
    > motherboard supports NMI because they all have same interrupt controller.



    You are partially correct in that ECC is implemented on the RAM module
    and ECC uses NMI to intterupt the CPU, but it also requires chipset
    support for the feature to work. You can install ECC RAM on a non-ECC
    capable M/B but you don't get the benefits. The majority of current
    desktop M/Bs don't support ECC RAM, whereas the majority of serverboards
    (excluding some entry level boards) do.
    Bok, May 31, 2005
    #9
  10. In article <2FDme.4061$>,
    says...
    >
    > You don't know s**t from c**y.
    >


    Oh DARLING, you are so MASTERFUL. <flicks limp wrist in Harry's
    direction>

    But seriously, I am a bit of an expert on bullshit, really. After all I
    have 160 of the buggers running around just behind my house. If you
    email your address, I could have a truckload delivered right to your
    doorstep.

    Oh, and go to the bathroom and wipe that egg off your face, you look
    silly.

    -P.
    Peter Huebner, May 31, 2005
    #10
  11. No Spam

    Andrew Guest

    No Spam wrote:
    > Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333
    > Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >
    > What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.


    - from
    http://www.dalantech.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/31393/an/0/page/1

    ECC:
    ECC stands for "Error Checking and Correction". To figure out whether
    you have ECC, parity, or non-parity RAM you need to count the number of
    chips on the stick or module. If the total number of chips is divisible
    by 3, then the RAM is ECC or parity. Otherwise, the stick or module is
    non-parity. To differentiate if the RAM is ECC or parity, look at the
    part numbers on the chips of the stick. If the part numbers are the
    same, then you have ECC. Otherwise, you have parity. What is the
    difference between parity and ECC? ECC and parity will both work in ECC
    mode, but ECC won't work in parity (see Table 2) because although ECC
    adds a bit just like parity for error checking, the bit isn't able to be
    individually accessed like in parity. When building a system, keep in
    mind that ECC is said to decrease your PC's performance by 2% as ECC is
    intended for servers or workstations that are serving data that needs
    such precautions.

    On a side note: ECC and non-ECC RAM can't be mixed.

    BUFFERED:
    Buffered refers to where the RAM contains a buffer to help the chipset
    with the large electrical load for when a computer has a lot of memory,
    while unbuffered lacks a buffer. They are two different types of
    modules, and are not interchangeable as some even use different printed
    circuit boards (PCBs). To determine if the RAM is buffered or not, check
    the leads next to the first notch. If evenly spaced the RAM is buffered.
    If you attempt to install the wrong type, the stick will not sit
    properly and be offset.

    REGISTERED
    Registered RAM means that the RAM has a delay on information transferred
    to the stick or module by one (1) clock cycle. This type of RAM is meant
    for servers or workstations that serve data to multiple users to ensure
    the quality of the data being served. Also note that unbuffered and
    registered RAM is not interchangeable
    Andrew, Jun 1, 2005
    #11
  12. No Spam

    Tim Guest

    ECC and non ECC RAM can be mixed - it depends on the motherboard, bios, and
    chipset.
    - Tim

    "Andrew" <> wrote in message
    news:iW8ne.4450$...
    > No Spam wrote:
    >> Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333
    >> Kingston 512MB, DDR-SDRAM, DIMM, DDR333, ECC, Registered
    >>
    >> What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.

    >
    > - from
    > http://www.dalantech.com/ubbthreads/showflat.php/Cat/0/Number/31393/an/0/page/1
    >
    > ECC:
    > ECC stands for "Error Checking and Correction". To figure out whether you
    > have ECC, parity, or non-parity RAM you need to count the number of chips
    > on the stick or module. If the total number of chips is divisible by 3,
    > then the RAM is ECC or parity. Otherwise, the stick or module is
    > non-parity. To differentiate if the RAM is ECC or parity, look at the part
    > numbers on the chips of the stick. If the part numbers are the same, then
    > you have ECC. Otherwise, you have parity. What is the difference between
    > parity and ECC? ECC and parity will both work in ECC mode, but ECC won't
    > work in parity (see Table 2) because although ECC adds a bit just like
    > parity for error checking, the bit isn't able to be individually accessed
    > like in parity. When building a system, keep in mind that ECC is said to
    > decrease your PC's performance by 2% as ECC is intended for servers or
    > workstations that are serving data that needs such precautions.
    >
    > On a side note: ECC and non-ECC RAM can't be mixed.
    >
    > BUFFERED:
    > Buffered refers to where the RAM contains a buffer to help the chipset
    > with the large electrical load for when a computer has a lot of memory,
    > while unbuffered lacks a buffer. They are two different types of modules,
    > and are not interchangeable as some even use different printed circuit
    > boards (PCBs). To determine if the RAM is buffered or not, check the leads
    > next to the first notch. If evenly spaced the RAM is buffered. If you
    > attempt to install the wrong type, the stick will not sit properly and be
    > offset.
    >
    > REGISTERED
    > Registered RAM means that the RAM has a delay on information transferred
    > to the stick or module by one (1) clock cycle. This type of RAM is meant
    > for servers or workstations that serve data to multiple users to ensure
    > the quality of the data being served. Also note that unbuffered and
    > registered RAM is not interchangeable
    Tim, Jun 1, 2005
    #12
  13. No Spam

    Richard Guest

    Dave - Dave.net.nz wrote:
    > Harry wrote:
    >
    >>>> What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.

    >
    >
    >>> ECC Registered is slower.

    >
    >
    >> ECC is not slower.
    >> PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) is exactly the same speed at
    >> PC3200 DDR (400MHz) ECC.

    >
    >
    > how come it performs slower in pretty much every benchmark ever made?


    The extra cycle while the buffer between the ram and the cpu stabalizes...
    Richard, Jun 1, 2005
    #13
  14. No Spam

    Scooter Guest

    On , , Tue, 31 May 2005 07:43:50 +1200, Re: ECC, registered RAM,
    "Dave - Dave.net.nz" <> wrote:

    >Harry wrote:
    >>>>What's the difference other than twice the cost for ECC? Thanks.

    >
    >>>ECC Registered is slower.

    >
    >> ECC is not slower.
    >> PC3200 DDR (400Mhz) is exactly the same speed at
    >> PC3200 DDR (400MHz) ECC.

    >
    >how come it performs slower in pretty much every benchmark ever made?


    Because "harry" is Roger.

    --
    "You look a little shy; let me introduce you to that
    leg of mutton" said the Red Queen.
    "Alice - Mutton; Mutton - Alice."
    Lewis Carroll
    Scooter, Jun 3, 2005
    #14
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