DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 20, 2010.

  1. <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 20, 2010
    #1
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  2. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Richard Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>


    I have rented one that was like that, could only FF the trailers.

    Usually stopping it and then pressing title 3 or 4 will get to the
    movie, but STOP is disabled on the panasonic player during all the
    startup shit, so you have to madly press stop as you put the disc in to
    have it not start with all the copyright wouldnt steal a car bollix.

    I agree, just pirate it. The discs have none of that crap, and the
    engrish on the liner makes for entertaining reading.
    Richard, Feb 20, 2010
    #2
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  3. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    David Empson Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren't This Bad—Yet...

    Richard <> wrote:

    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > > <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>

    >
    > I have rented one that was like that, could only FF the trailers.


    I've seen several but can't point to one in particular.

    I also recall a friend mentioning that the entire Thunderbirds series
    has several minutes of unskippable ads before you can play the main
    feature. (I don't recall if you could fast forward them.)

    > Usually stopping it and then pressing title 3 or 4 will get to the
    > movie, but STOP is disabled on the panasonic player during all the
    > startup shit, so you have to madly press stop as you put the disc in to
    > have it not start with all the copyright wouldnt steal a car bollix.
    >
    > I agree, just pirate it. The discs have none of that crap, and the
    > engrish on the liner makes for entertaining reading.



    --
    David Empson
    David Empson, Feb 20, 2010
    #3
  4. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 20:57:34 +1300, Richard wrote:

    > I agree, just pirate it.


    I think it would be irresponsible to advocate purchasing pirated copies of films or CDs.

    Having said that, the makers of those DVDs are their own worst enemies because by their actions
    they've in fact pushed people towards pirated copies.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
    Sweetpea, Feb 20, 2010
    #4
  5. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Craig Shore Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 20:57:34 +1300, Richard <> wrote:

    >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>

    >
    >I have rented one that was like that, could only FF the trailers.
    >
    >Usually stopping it and then pressing title 3 or 4 will get to the
    >movie, but STOP is disabled on the panasonic player during all the
    >startup shit, so you have to madly press stop as you put the disc in to
    >have it not start with all the copyright wouldnt steal a car bollix.
    >
    >I agree, just pirate it. The discs have none of that crap, and the
    >engrish on the liner makes for entertaining reading.


    Usually if you press the MENU button it takes you straight past the
    previews and onto the main menu for the movie.
    Craig Shore, Feb 21, 2010
    #5
  6. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    David Empson Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren't This BadËœYet...

    Craig Shore <> wrote:

    > On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 20:57:34 +1300, Richard <> wrote:
    >
    > >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > >> <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>

    > >
    > >I have rented one that was like that, could only FF the trailers.
    > >
    > >Usually stopping it and then pressing title 3 or 4 will get to the
    > >movie, but STOP is disabled on the panasonic player during all the
    > >startup shit, so you have to madly press stop as you put the disc in to
    > >have it not start with all the copyright wouldnt steal a car bollix.
    > >
    > >I agree, just pirate it. The discs have none of that crap, and the
    > >engrish on the liner makes for entertaining reading.

    >
    > Usually if you press the MENU button it takes you straight past the
    > previews and onto the main menu for the movie.


    I'd say "sometimes" rather than "usually".

    I've found one NZ DVD in my collection which has three unskippable
    trailers prior to the main menu: Yes Man.

    The Menu and Title buttons are rejected, and so is the Next button. I
    could fast forward during the trailers, and by using a DVD player on a
    computer I could jump to near the end of each trailer quickly (by
    clicking on the timeline), but this isn't available with a standard DVD
    player.

    Very very annoying.

    Another one which is not quite as bad is Get Smart. It has three
    trailers which can be skipped (one at a time) using the Next button but
    not Menu or Title.

    --
    David Empson
    David Empson, Feb 21, 2010
    #6
  7. Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Sun, 21 Feb 2010 22:39:07 +1300, Craig Shore
    <> wrote:

    >On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 20:57:34 +1300, Richard <> wrote:
    >
    >>Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>> <http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>

    >>
    >>I have rented one that was like that, could only FF the trailers.
    >>
    >>Usually stopping it and then pressing title 3 or 4 will get to the
    >>movie, but STOP is disabled on the panasonic player during all the
    >>startup shit, so you have to madly press stop as you put the disc in to
    >>have it not start with all the copyright wouldnt steal a car bollix.
    >>
    >>I agree, just pirate it. The discs have none of that crap, and the
    >>engrish on the liner makes for entertaining reading.

    >
    >Usually if you press the MENU button it takes you straight past the
    >previews and onto the main menu for the movie.


    No, the MENU button is often locked out too.
    Stephen Worthington, Feb 21, 2010
    #7
  8. Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Sat, 20 Feb 2010 19:27:07 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro
    <_zealand> wrote:

    ><http://i.imgur.com/GxzeV.jpg>


    I don't think I have ever met a DVD that was quite that bad. I have
    met a couple where they annoyed me so much that I ripped them and used
    PGCEdit to unlock everything and burned a fixed copy. But I have
    pretty much stopped worrying about it now, as instead of using a
    commercial DVD player, I now use MythTV under Linux to play DVDs. Its
    player software ignores all the lockout instructions on the DVD and
    allows you to skip or use the Menu button even if the DVD does not
    allow it.
    Stephen Worthington, Feb 21, 2010
    #8
  9. In message <>, Stephen Worthington
    wrote:

    > I don't think I have ever met a DVD that was quite that bad.


    Apparently it’s more common in the US.

    Here’s <http://www.mpucoder.com/DVD/uops.html> a full list of the operations
    your player can be prohibited from performing. Depressing, isn’t it...
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 21, 2010
    #9
  10. In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > Someone should produce a DVD player that ignores the "invalid operations"
    > specified on the DVD.


    They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.

    Similarly, the Freeview licensing conditions prohibit the ability to
    transfer the stream digitally to external drives.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 21, 2010
    #10
  11. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Adam Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren?t This Bad?Yet...

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    > In message <>, Allistar
    > wrote:
    >
    >> Someone should produce a DVD player that ignores the "invalid operations"
    >> specified on the DVD.

    >
    > They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
    >
    > Similarly, the Freeview licensing conditions prohibit the ability to
    > transfer the stream digitally to external drives.


    No standard for DVD format, just proprietry lock-ins.

    But I'm wondering if DMCA-Lite as part of ACTA with disallow
    region-free players.
    Adam, Feb 21, 2010
    #11
  12. In message <>, Allistar wrote:

    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >> In message <>, Allistar
    >> wrote:
    >>
    >>> Someone should produce a DVD player that ignores the "invalid
    >>> operations" specified on the DVD.

    >>
    >> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.

    >
    > Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
    > patent?


    Patents, NDAs, you name it.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 21, 2010
    #12
  13. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:

    >> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.

    >
    > Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
    > patent?


    Yes.

    some kind.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
    Sweetpea, Feb 22, 2010
    #13
  14. In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:

    > On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
    >
    >>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.

    >>
    >> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind of
    >> patent?

    >
    > Yes.
    >
    > some kind.


    Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of the
    DVD spec is under NDA.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 22, 2010
    #14
  15. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    > In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
    >
    >> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
    >>
    >>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
    >>>
    >>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind
    >>> of patent?

    >>
    >> Yes.
    >>
    >> some kind.

    >
    > Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of
    > the DVD spec is under NDA.


    Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
    Sweetpea, Feb 22, 2010
    #15
  16. Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
    <> wrote:

    >On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
    >>
    >>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing conditions.
    >>>>
    >>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some kind
    >>>> of patent?
    >>>
    >>> Yes.
    >>>
    >>> some kind.

    >>
    >> Actually I think it’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest of
    >> the DVD spec is under NDA.

    >
    >Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".


    My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to
    use it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So
    if you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
    (except for the MPEG patents).
    Stephen Worthington, Feb 22, 2010
    #16
  17. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 01:58:16 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:

    > On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>
    >>> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing
    >>>>>> conditions.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some
    >>>>> kind of patent?
    >>>>
    >>>> Yes.
    >>>>
    >>>> some kind.
    >>>
    >>> Actually I think itÂ’s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest
    >>> of the DVD spec is under NDA.

    >>
    >>Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".

    >
    > My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to use
    > it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So if
    > you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
    > (except for the MPEG patents).


    But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.

    If you don't license and implement the DVD specification then you can't use the "DVD" logo. Likewise
    you won't be able to legally decrypt the encryption on the DVD discs.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
    Sweetpea, Feb 22, 2010
    #17
  18. Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:

    > But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.


    There is lots of free software around that doesn’t license the MPEG patents,
    that can play DVDs.
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Feb 22, 2010
    #18
  19. Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:30:20 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
    <> wrote:

    >On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 01:58:16 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:
    >
    >> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 06:44:16 +0000 (UTC), Sweetpea
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 18:28:53 +1300, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> In message <>, Sweetpea wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> On Mon, 22 Feb 2010 12:11:44 +1300, Allistar wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>>> They are required to obey them, as part of the licensing
    >>>>>>> conditions.
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> Licensing what? The DVD specification? Is this protected by some
    >>>>>> kind of patent?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Yes.
    >>>>>
    >>>>> some kind.
    >>>>
    >>>> Actually I think it?s only the MPEG parts that are patented, the rest
    >>>> of the DVD spec is under NDA.
    >>>
    >>>Yes - that's what I said - "some kind".

    >>
    >> My understanding was that "DVD" was a trademark of some kind, so to use
    >> it you have to sign up for the license conditions they impose. So if
    >> you want to sell an "optical disk player", you can do what you want
    >> (except for the MPEG patents).

    >
    >But if you don't license the MPEG patents then you can't play DVDs.
    >
    >If you don't license and implement the DVD specification then you can't use the "DVD" logo. Likewise
    >you won't be able to legally decrypt the encryption on the DVD discs.


    No, my understanding is that there are licenses you can get for the
    MPEG patents that are not DVD specific. The rules requiring you to
    obey a DVD's scripts and turn off things only come with the use of the
    DVD trademark. As for the encryption, I am not sure. You can get
    decryption to install into Linux systems, but whether you can sell
    something that includes it, I do not know.
    Stephen Worthington, Feb 23, 2010
    #19
  20. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    Re: DVDs In NZ Aren’t This Bad—Yet...

    On Tue, 23 Feb 2010 21:45:14 +1300, Stephen Worthington wrote:

    > As for the encryption, I am not sure. You can get decryption to install
    > into Linux systems, but whether you can sell something that includes it,
    > I do not know.


    That CODEC is not legally usable in the USA.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
    Sweetpea, Feb 23, 2010
    #20
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