DVD player - weird problem

Discussion in 'DVD Video' started by Richard Fangnail, Apr 10, 2009.

  1. I have an older Sony DVD player. I just rented a dvd (Slumdog) and
    whenever it displayed the menu or scene selections, a low-pitched hum
    came out of the player itself, as if something was wrong with the
    motor. Sometimes this hum came out when just playing the film.

    I tried two other discs and didn't have that problem. If the problem
    is scratches, why would it cause this? I've never heard the player
    make that noise before.

    If the problem is only with one disc, you'd think the problem would be
    the disc, and yet why would one disc cause that problem??

    When you are just looking at the menu or scene selections for a disc,
    is the disc turning the same way it turns when you are watching the
    film?

    Thanks
    Richard Fangnail, Apr 10, 2009
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:28:22 -0700 (PDT), Richard Fangnail
    <> wrote:

    >I have an older Sony DVD player. I just rented a dvd (Slumdog) and
    >whenever it displayed the menu or scene selections, a low-pitched hum
    >came out of the player itself, as if something was wrong with the
    >motor. Sometimes this hum came out when just playing the film.
    >
    >I tried two other discs and didn't have that problem. If the problem
    >is scratches, why would it cause this? I've never heard the player
    >make that noise before.
    >
    >If the problem is only with one disc, you'd think the problem would be
    >the disc, and yet why would one disc cause that problem??
    >
    >When you are just looking at the menu or scene selections for a disc,
    >is the disc turning the same way it turns when you are watching the
    >film?
    >
    >Thanks



    It is probably wobble due to a slightly out of balance disc. It can also
    be an oversized hole, which is far less likely, however.

    The reason it does it on the menu is because of the menu file's
    location on the disc.

    Take one of those notebook punched hole reinforcement stickers, and
    place it out at the outer edge (on the face not the edge) of the top side
    of the disc. Touch it to your thumb face a few times first so it is not
    so sticky that it is hard to get off... not too much though, it does
    have to stick.

    If the balance improves, you are done. Replace the test sticker with a
    fresh one in that location that has full tackiness. If it gets worse,
    re-orient the placement 180 degrees from the original position, retest,
    and find the correct balance point.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 10, 2009
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Thanks for the responses.

    Is the menu/scene selection stuff near the hole or the outside edge of
    the disc?
    Richard Fangnail, Apr 10, 2009
    #3
  4. On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:59:31 -0700, "The Mighty T.B."
    <> wrote:

    >Yes, the disc is spinning even when a menu is accessed. The speed the dvd
    >spins will vary as the player reads sectors on various parts of the disc.



    DVDs are not sectored. Speed varies as a function of the physical
    location, with respect to radius, the read head is from the center hub as
    lineal traverse per rotation varies with that location.

    As in CLV. Constant linear velocity. No sectoring needed or utilized.

    Of course, most intelligent folks that claim to have been in the
    industry as long as you do, already know this trivial fact. You must be
    exceptionally... stupid.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #4
  5. On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 11:36:26 -0700 (PDT), Richard Fangnail
    <> wrote:

    >
    >Thanks for the responses.
    >
    >Is the menu/scene selection stuff near the hole or the outside edge of
    >the disc?



    I depends on who does the mastering session, and how it got outlined.

    Outer edge is ideal as it spins the disc the slowest. I think discs
    are read from inside to outside though for the movie stream, so even a
    movie would start fast and move toward a slower spin, until it hits the
    layer change which may then read from edge back to the hub so that the
    head doesn't have to transition across the entire disc face after the
    layer change, it can have a short hop to the lead in.

    Leaving a menu up exercises one's player unnecessarily. I put in a
    disc, and play the flic or extras or whatever, and then make sure I
    remove it. Even with the movie stopped on the PS3, it still reads a
    screen shot and some music for the XMB menu on the PS3.

    I think it is a major design flaw to have java run things but be so
    stupid as to not cache the data and let it run from the cache instead of
    the disc, only spinning up the disc and read head when an actual call to
    the disc is made via the menus.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #5
  6. On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 08:38:10 -0400, Fred C. Dobbs <>
    wrote:

    >On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:28:22 -0700 (PDT), Richard Fangnail
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >>I have an older Sony DVD player. I just rented a dvd (Slumdog) and
    >>whenever it displayed the menu or scene selections, a low-pitched hum
    >>came out of the player itself, as if something was wrong with the
    >>motor. Sometimes this hum came out when just playing the film.
    >>
    >>I tried two other discs and didn't have that problem. If the problem
    >>is scratches, why would it cause this? I've never heard the player
    >>make that noise before.
    >>
    >>If the problem is only with one disc, you'd think the problem would be
    >>the disc, and yet why would one disc cause that problem??
    >>
    >>When you are just looking at the menu or scene selections for a disc,
    >>is the disc turning the same way it turns when you are watching the
    >>film?
    >>
    >>Thanks

    >
    >
    >If it is a rental , does it have a paper bar code label around the
    >center hole? If so, it may be may the culprit, the dis may be out of
    >balance due to the label causing it to vibrate.
    >Fred



    If it has a label on it, of course that is the problem if it is not a
    symmetrical label.

    The only non-symetrical label that can go on a disc is when the label
    is meant for correcting an out of balance disc.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #6
  7. On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 09:28:26 -0700, "The Mighty T.B."
    <> wrote:

    >"Archimedes' Lever" babbled:
    >
    >> DVDs are not sectored. Speed varies as a function of the physical
    >> location, with respect to radius, the read head is from the center hub as
    >> lineal traverse per rotation varies with that location.
    >>
    >> As in CLV. Constant linear velocity. No sectoring needed or utilized.
    >>
    >> Of course, most intelligent folks that claim to have been in the
    >> industry as long as you do, already know this trivial fact. You must be
    >> exceptionally... stupid.

    >
    >
    >Yo brainiac. Dvds contain usually 2,298,496 sectors (4,707,319,808 bytes).
    >
    >Case (or in your instance), Cretin closed.
    >
    >T.B.



    No, idiot. A sectored DVD would be a CAV implementation. There are no
    CAV DVDs.

    CLV discs maintain the same lineal speed throughout the read.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #7
  8. On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 10:54:19 -0700, "The Mighty T.B."
    <> wrote:

    >"Archimedes' Lever" farted:
    >>
    >> If it has a label on it, of course that is the problem if it is not a
    >> symmetrical label.
    >>
    >> The only non-symetrical label that can go on a disc is when the label
    >> is meant for correcting an out of balance disc.

    >
    >
    >Maybe you should stick post-it notes all over the dvd. That might do the
    >trick.
    >
    >T.B.



    Considering that the solution I gave was viable, and is in use around
    the world today, and your is not, and never has been... I feel pretty
    safe in my superiority over a total fucking retard like you.

    Maybe you should stick to being stupid... oh wait! You *are* doing
    just that!

    Bwuahahahahaha!
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #8
  9. On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 11:13:08 -0700, "The Mighty T.B."
    <> wrote:

    >"Archimedes' Lever" babbled:
    > >
    >> No, idiot. A sectored DVD would be a CAV implementation. There are no
    >> CAV DVDs.
    >>
    >> CLV discs maintain the same lineal speed throughout the read.

    >
    >That has nothing to do with the fact a dvd does indeed have sectors.


    It does, however, have a lot to do with your remarks about why he had
    noise. You were wrong. Period. I was talking about hard sectoring.

    All file systems have soft sectoring, dumbass.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #9
  10. On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 13:11:29 -0700, "The Mighty T.B."
    <> wrote:


    >Aside from 3rd grade kids, who writes "Bwuahahahahaha!" in a e-mail like
    >they're Dr Evil or something?
    >
    >Oh wait. We're forgetting Archie here.
    >
    >T.B.



    This ain't e-mail, you fucking total retard. Yet more proof of just how
    jack-brained you are.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 11, 2009
    #10
  11. Richard Fangnail

    Franc Zabkar Guest

    On Fri, 10 Apr 2009 10:28:22 -0700 (PDT), Richard Fangnail
    <> put finger to keyboard and composed:

    >I have an older Sony DVD player. I just rented a dvd (Slumdog) and
    >whenever it displayed the menu or scene selections, a low-pitched hum
    >came out of the player itself, as if something was wrong with the
    >motor. Sometimes this hum came out when just playing the film.
    >
    >I tried two other discs and didn't have that problem.


    Try your disc in a PC DVD ROM drive. Copy the files from the DVD to
    your hard drive while listening for noise. A PC optical drive spins
    must faster than a DVD player, so any out-of-balance condition may be
    easier to detect.

    ISTR the voice coil positioner in an old Philips/Marantz CD player
    moving significantly in a radial direction during the playing of
    certain CDs. There must have been quite a bit of eccentricity for the
    wobble to be noticeable. I don't know if DVDs are manufactured any
    more precisely. Of course eccentricity and balance may be two
    unrelated concerns ...

    - Franc Zabkar
    --
    Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
    Franc Zabkar, Apr 12, 2009
    #11
  12. On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 09:03:15 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    <> wrote:

    >
    >ISTR the voice coil positioner in an old Philips/Marantz CD player
    >moving significantly in a radial direction during the playing of
    >certain CDs.


    There are no "voice coils" in a CD player. ANY of them. There are
    "primary lens positioners" that position the primary lens.

    You should have seen the ones (lens positioners)on the old gas tube
    Laser Disc players.
    They actually did look like a speaker tail assembly.

    > There must have been quite a bit of eccentricity for the
    >wobble to be noticeable.


    It could match up with a resonant point for that one and only disc and
    his player.

    > I don't know if DVDs are manufactured any
    >more precisely. Of course eccentricity and balance may be two
    >unrelated concerns ...


    The spectrum that DVDs and newer BD discs are at allow for, and so are
    used, a much finer pit size and track pitch than CD were at. A LOT more.

    You can google for disc capacities and likely find a nice, graphical
    chart.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 12, 2009
    #12
  13. Richard Fangnail

    Franc Zabkar Guest

    On Sat, 11 Apr 2009 17:24:49 -0700, Archimedes' Lever
    <> put finger to keyboard and composed:

    >On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 09:03:15 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>ISTR the voice coil positioner in an old Philips/Marantz CD player
    >>moving significantly in a radial direction during the playing of
    >>certain CDs.

    >
    > There are no "voice coils" in a CD player. ANY of them. There are
    >"primary lens positioners" that position the primary lens.


    I have a Philips CD204 which has a "radial motor". This positioner
    consists of two coils rotating around a stationery permanent magnet.

    Page 16 (RHS) of the following Marantz 74CD50 service manual shows the
    circuit for the "radial drive" servo, and page 8 has a mechanical
    drawing of same, although not very clear.

    http://www.audio-circuit.dk/Schematics/Marantz-CD50-cd-sm.pdf (5.3MB)

    The principal is similar to what you see in a hard disc drive, but the
    coil orientation differs. To me it looks like a radial voice coil.
    There is no tracking coil within the laser assembly as there is in
    stepper motor CD players.

    > You should have seen the ones (lens positioners)on the old gas tube
    >Laser Disc players.
    >They actually did look like a speaker tail assembly.
    >
    >> There must have been quite a bit of eccentricity for the
    >>wobble to be noticeable.

    >
    > It could match up with a resonant point for that one and only disc and
    >his player.
    >
    >> I don't know if DVDs are manufactured any
    >>more precisely. Of course eccentricity and balance may be two
    >>unrelated concerns ...

    >
    > The spectrum that DVDs and newer BD discs are at allow for, and so are
    >used, a much finer pit size and track pitch than CD were at. A LOT more.


    I would think that the track pitch is irrelevant. If the hole is not
    exactly in the centre of the disc, or there is something that is
    preventing the disc from being clamped correctly, then you will see
    eccentricity. The arm of the radial motor will move from side to side,
    much as the tracking coil does in a stepper motor system, although you
    can't see the latter because it is obscured by the spinning disc.

    > You can google for disc capacities and likely find a nice, graphical
    >chart.


    - Franc Zabkar
    --
    Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
    Franc Zabkar, Apr 12, 2009
    #13
  14. On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    <> wrote:

    >
    >I have a Philips CD204 which has a "radial motor". This positioner
    >consists of two coils rotating around a stationery permanent magnet.



    But they are NOT now, nor have they ever been "voice coils".

    Positioning coils would be as close as you could get to using the term.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 12, 2009
    #14
  15. On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    <> wrote:

    >
    >I would think that the track pitch is irrelevant.



    It makes for a doubling of capacity. You have no clue.

    Look at a CD with a cheap microscope, then try a DVD.

    There are thousands more tracks on the DVD.

    More is more. Simple math.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 12, 2009
    #15
  16. On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    <> wrote:

    > If the hole is not
    >exactly in the centre of the disc, or there is something that is
    >preventing the disc from being clamped correctly, then you will see
    >eccentricity.



    No shit. That is why discs are stamped. The die is absolute.

    eccentricities are VERY rare. Coins get mis-struck more often.

    Hot plastic stamping makes ALL discs EXACTLYthe same.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 12, 2009
    #16
  17. Richard Fangnail

    Franc Zabkar Guest

    On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 10:46:33 -0700, Archimedes' Lever
    <> put finger to keyboard and composed:

    >On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>I would think that the track pitch is irrelevant.

    >
    >
    > It makes for a doubling of capacity. You have no clue.
    >
    > Look at a CD with a cheap microscope, then try a DVD.
    >
    > There are thousands more tracks on the DVD.
    >
    > More is more. Simple math.


    The track pitch is completely irrelevant when considering the
    eccentricity of a disc. If a disc is clamped 1mm off-centre, say, then
    the tracking coil or voice coil positioner will wobble 1mm from
    side-to-side. It doesn't matter whether the tracks are 0.1mm wide or 1
    Angstrom.

    - Franc Zabkar
    --
    Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
    Franc Zabkar, Apr 12, 2009
    #17
  18. Richard Fangnail

    Franc Zabkar Guest

    On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 10:48:06 -0700, Archimedes' Lever
    <> put finger to keyboard and composed:

    >On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >> If the hole is not
    >>exactly in the centre of the disc, or there is something that is
    >>preventing the disc from being clamped correctly, then you will see
    >>eccentricity.

    >
    >
    > No shit. That is why discs are stamped. The die is absolute.
    >
    > eccentricities are VERY rare. Coins get mis-struck more often.
    >
    > Hot plastic stamping makes ALL discs EXACTLYthe same.


    One would think so, that's why I suggested that any wobble may be due
    to improper clamping. But the fact remains that I have seen it for
    myself.

    - Franc Zabkar
    --
    Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
    Franc Zabkar, Apr 12, 2009
    #18
  19. Richard Fangnail

    Franc Zabkar Guest

    On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 10:45:07 -0700, Archimedes' Lever
    <> put finger to keyboard and composed:

    >On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >>I have a Philips CD204 which has a "radial motor". This positioner
    >>consists of two coils rotating around a stationery permanent magnet.

    >
    >
    > But they are NOT now, nor have they ever been "voice coils".
    >
    > Positioning coils would be as close as you could get to using the term.


    It's a radial motor voice coil positioner.

    The earliest hard drives used a "linear motor voice coil positioner".
    This term appears frequently in various patents, as does "radial
    motor", "voice coil positioner", "voice coil motor", "voice-coil
    actuator".

    See http://www.alasir.com/books/hards/016-018.html

    "Two main types of voice-coil positioner mechanisms are available: •
    Linear voice-coil actuators: • Rotary voice-coil actuators ..."

    The above article refers specifically to hard drives, but the
    principle is the same in the early Marantz CD players.

    - Franc Zabkar
    --
    Please remove one 'i' from my address when replying by email.
    Franc Zabkar, Apr 12, 2009
    #19
  20. On Mon, 13 Apr 2009 06:02:03 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    <> wrote:

    >On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 10:45:07 -0700, Archimedes' Lever
    ><> put finger to keyboard and composed:
    >
    >>On Sun, 12 Apr 2009 14:45:07 +1000, Franc Zabkar
    >><> wrote:
    >>
    >>>
    >>>I have a Philips CD204 which has a "radial motor". This positioner
    >>>consists of two coils rotating around a stationery permanent magnet.

    >>
    >>
    >> But they are NOT now, nor have they ever been "voice coils".
    >>
    >> Positioning coils would be as close as you could get to using the term.

    >
    >It's a radial motor voice coil positioner.
    >
    >The earliest hard drives used a "linear motor voice coil positioner".


    WRONG!

    Despite the design having a resemblance to the transducer of an audio
    output driver, it is 100% wrong to call them a voice coil.

    I HAVE a couple of the hard drives you refer to and the name is LINEAR
    MOTOR, not "voice coil positioner".

    >This term appears frequently in various patents,


    So a stupid engineer was as dumb as anybody else that uses the name of
    a similar device to describe their device. My drives are high end ESDI
    drives and the term was never used by their engineers. So who is right?
    I'll stick with calling a spade a spade. If it ain't driving a speaker
    cone, it ain't a fucking voice coil.

    > as does "radial
    >motor", "voice coil positioner", "voice coil motor", "voice-coil
    >actuator".


    Okie dokie. You go right ahead and stay on that bandwagon you're on.

    >See http://www.alasir.com/books/hards/016-018.html
    >
    >"Two main types of voice-coil positioner mechanisms are available: •
    >Linear voice-coil actuators: • Rotary voice-coil actuators ..."


    Still not an industry wide usage of the term, so that doesn't make
    those that do use the term correct in using it.

    >The above article refers specifically to hard drives, but the
    >principle is the same in the early Marantz CD players.


    Principle and names are two different things in most realms.

    We do not refer to a Hydrogen Cobalt ICBM as a "Nuclear Power Reactor",
    even though that what it does.
    Archimedes' Lever, Apr 12, 2009
    #20
    1. Advertising

Want to reply to this thread or ask your own question?

It takes just 2 minutes to sign up (and it's free!). Just click the sign up button to choose a username and then you can ask your own questions on the forum.
Similar Threads
  1. hardhose

    Weird DVD writter problem

    hardhose, Jan 3, 2005, in forum: Computer Support
    Replies:
    1
    Views:
    539
    ftran999
    Jan 3, 2005
  2. Patrick D. Rockwell

    Weird problem with DVD folder.

    Patrick D. Rockwell, Feb 24, 2005, in forum: Computer Support
    Replies:
    2
    Views:
    510
    Patrick D. Rockwell
    Feb 24, 2005
  3. Andrea
    Replies:
    5
    Views:
    793
    Andrea
    Jan 16, 2004
  4. Nick

    Using DVD player as CD player

    Nick, Sep 6, 2004, in forum: DVD Video
    Replies:
    3
    Views:
    1,372
    LASERandDVDfan
    Sep 9, 2004
  5. Dragon

    Weird Dvd problem

    Dragon, Jun 6, 2005, in forum: DVD Video
    Replies:
    4
    Views:
    483
    Dragon
    Jun 7, 2005
Loading...

Share This Page