Dumb question about IP phones...

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by Rob Nicholson, Jan 30, 2006.

  1. We're about to start an evaluation of Swyx in preparation for move to a new
    office. So to have a look around, we need a few IP telephones. There are
    lots out there :)

    But the thing that confuses me is that the phones appear to have a fixed set
    of features on the buttons. I kind of expected the keys on an IP phone to be
    entirely programmable and defined on the VOIP PBX, i.e. by Swyx itself.

    For example:

    http://www.best4systems.co.uk/product.asp?ProdID=5431&CtgID=

    This talks about "8 function keys: Hold, Superkey for feature access,
    Message, Speaker, Microphone, Transfer/Conference, shift, Redial,Cancel".

    I can understand different phones having extra features like handsfree,
    two-port Ethernet, bigger displays, colour displays but not fixed feature
    keys.

    Also, what is multiple lines all about? I kind of expected that if you put
    somebody on hold, then that's a feature of the PBX.

    Any pearls of wisdon appreciated.

    Thanks, Rob.
     
    Rob Nicholson, Jan 30, 2006
    #1
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  2. Rob Nicholson

    Paul Hayes Guest

    Rob Nicholson wrote:
    > We're about to start an evaluation of Swyx in preparation for move to a new
    > office. So to have a look around, we need a few IP telephones. There are
    > lots out there :)
    >
    > But the thing that confuses me is that the phones appear to have a fixed set
    > of features on the buttons. I kind of expected the keys on an IP phone to be
    > entirely programmable and defined on the VOIP PBX, i.e. by Swyx itself.
    >
    > For example:
    >
    > http://www.best4systems.co.uk/product.asp?ProdID=5431&CtgID=
    >
    > This talks about "8 function keys: Hold, Superkey for feature access,
    > Message, Speaker, Microphone, Transfer/Conference, shift, Redial,Cancel".
    >
    > I can understand different phones having extra features like handsfree,
    > two-port Ethernet, bigger displays, colour displays but not fixed feature
    > keys.
    >
    > Also, what is multiple lines all about? I kind of expected that if you put
    > somebody on hold, then that's a feature of the PBX.
    >
    > Any pearls of wisdon appreciated.
    >
    > Thanks, Rob.
    >
    >

    Hi,

    have a look at Snom phones:

    www.snom.com

    There are 12 buttons on the 320 & 360 that can be assigned to pretty
    much anything, you can assign custom URLs on a webserver that could be
    scripts to do anything you want them to. Also with the latest firmware
    version you can also assign different functions (again, including URLs)
    to all the normal keys like hold, transfer etc...

    I don't know how well the Snom phones would work with Swyx, I'm aware
    *of* the Sywx system but I've no idea what standards it uses. I'm just
    assuming it uses SIP.
     
    Paul Hayes, Jan 30, 2006
    #2
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  3. > I don't know how well the Snom phones would work with Swyx, I'm aware *of*
    > the Sywx system but I've no idea what standards it uses. I'm just
    > assuming it uses SIP.


    Yes it can use SIP but that's as much as I know :) Hence the reason for the
    trial. We've decided it's the best way to learn about it all.

    Thanks, Rob.
     
    Rob Nicholson, Jan 30, 2006
    #3
  4. Rob Nicholson

    Ian Guest

    "Rob Nicholson" <rob_nicholson@nospam_informed-direct.com> wrote in message
    news:drkvon$s43$1$...
    > We're about to start an evaluation of Swyx in preparation for move to a

    new
    > office. So to have a look around, we need a few IP telephones. There are
    > lots out there :)
    >
    > But the thing that confuses me is that the phones appear to have a fixed

    set
    > of features on the buttons. I kind of expected the keys on an IP phone to

    be
    > entirely programmable and defined on the VOIP PBX, i.e. by Swyx itself.
    >
    > For example:
    >
    > http://www.best4systems.co.uk/product.asp?ProdID=5431&CtgID=


    This is not a SIP complient phone, you can get a 5220 dual boot that will
    work with a sip system but dont expec one at this price
    >
    > This talks about "8 function keys: Hold, Superkey for feature access,
    > Message, Speaker, Microphone, Transfer/Conference, shift, Redial,Cancel".
    >


    > I can understand different phones having extra features like handsfree,
    > two-port Ethernet, bigger displays, colour displays but not fixed feature
    > keys.


    All sets of this level have fixed feature keys, and a set of definable keys
    that are defined set by set
    >
    > Also, what is multiple lines all about? I kind of expected that if you put
    > somebody on hold, then that's a feature of the PBX.
    >

    Multiple lines are what they say they are multiple lines, ie yo phone can
    have more than one line

    > Any pearls of wisdon appreciated.
    >


    Be careful
    for straight SIP look at Snom and aastra or if n a budget the Grandstream
    GX2000 gets good reviews
    avoid the sipura 841 has very poor sound quality.

    Ian Plain
    www.cyber-cottage.co.uk
     
    Ian, Jan 30, 2006
    #4
  5. > Multiple lines are what they say they are multiple lines, ie yo phone can
    > have more than one line


    But shirley, this is the whole point of VOIP - its going through single
    Ethernet connection. On a software PBX, if line 200 and line 210 is
    associated with the same phone is a feature of the PBX, not the phone?

    See, I'm confused :)

    > Be careful
    > for straight SIP look at Snom and aastra or if n a budget the Grandstream
    > GX2000 gets good reviews
    > avoid the sipura 841 has very poor sound quality.


    What about the CISCO IP phones?

    Thanks, Rob.
     
    Rob Nicholson, Jan 31, 2006
    #5
  6. Rob Nicholson wrote:
    >>Multiple lines are what they say they are multiple lines, ie yo phone can
    >>have more than one line

    >
    >
    > But shirley, this is the whole point of VOIP - its going through single
    > Ethernet connection. On a software PBX, if line 200 and line 210 is
    > associated with the same phone is a feature of the PBX, not the phone?
    >
    > See, I'm confused :)
    >

    You're absolutely right, I always assumed that the multiple lines
    functionality was only really useful if you were using the IP phone in
    an environment where there is no local PBX. (a home user).
     
    Thomas Kenyon, Jan 31, 2006
    #6
  7. Rob Nicholson

    Ian Stirling Guest

    Rob Nicholson <rob_nicholson@nospam_informed-direct.com> wrote:
    > We're about to start an evaluation of Swyx in preparation for move to a new
    > office. So to have a look around, we need a few IP telephones. There are
    > lots out there :)


    For backup internet connectivity, I noticed that satellite has come down
    quite a lot.

    You're looking at around 1000 quid down, then 30 quid a month or so, for
    a package with no included data allowance, and 0.5p/Mb.
    This is quite reasonable, if the VOIP system is going to be important to
    your buisness.

    Admittedly, this will make phone calls have small delays when you switch
    to them, but better than no phones.
     
    Ian Stirling, Jan 31, 2006
    #7
  8. > You're absolutely right, I always assumed that the multiple lines
    > functionality was only really useful if you were using the IP phone in an
    > environment where there is no local PBX. (a home user).


    Ahh that would make sense.

    Thanks, Rob.
     
    Rob Nicholson, Jan 31, 2006
    #8
  9. Rob Nicholson

    alexd Guest

    Ian Stirling wrote:

    > Rob Nicholson <rob_nicholson@nospam_informed-direct.com> wrote:
    >> We're about to start an evaluation of Swyx in preparation for move to a
    >> new office. So to have a look around, we need a few IP telephones. There
    >> are lots out there :)

    >
    > For backup internet connectivity, I noticed that satellite has come down
    > quite a lot.


    Yeah, especially Aramiska ;-)

    --
    <http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) ()
    18:57:49 up 5 days, 23:15, 2 users, load average: 0.13, 0.18, 0.16
    This is my BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMSTICK
     
    alexd, Jan 31, 2006
    #9
  10. Rob Nicholson

    alexd Guest

    Rob Nicholson wrote:

    >> You're absolutely right, I always assumed that the multiple lines
    >> functionality was only really useful if you were using the IP phone in an
    >> environment where there is no local PBX. (a home user).

    >
    > Ahh that would make sense.


    Even in an environment with a PBX, it is handy to be able to put someone on
    hold and make another call whilst they are on hold.

    --
    <http://ale.cx/> (AIM:troffasky) ()
    18:58:50 up 5 days, 23:16, 2 users, load average: 0.05, 0.15, 0.15
    This is my BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOMSTICK
     
    alexd, Jan 31, 2006
    #10
  11. > Even in an environment with a PBX, it is handy to be able to put someone
    > on
    > hold and make another call whilst they are on hold.


    Yes true - pretty high on the wishlist. But isn't that a feature of the PBX
    not the phone? Doesn't it stop sending the original call data through whilst
    the original call is on hold? Therefore, only one channel is required.

    I'm sure the penny is going to drop with me soon :)

    Cheers, Rob,
     
    Rob Nicholson, Feb 1, 2006
    #11
  12. Rob Nicholson

    Crumb Guest

    Hi Rob,


    My Name is Ian from Swyx in the UK, Its interesting the read the thread
    you have started. If you need any advice about handset features,
    Satalite Internet Connection or any other subjects then please fell
    free to contact me directly.

    Regards

    Ian
     
    Crumb, Feb 1, 2006
    #12
  13. Rob Nicholson <rob_nicholson@nospam_informed-direct.com> wrote:
    [...]
    > Yes true - pretty high on the wishlist. But isn't that a feature of
    > the PBX not the phone? Doesn't it stop sending the original call
    > data through whilst the original call is on hold? Therefore, only
    > one channel is required.


    IIRC, The handset signals the PBX to put the call on hold, so there's
    only one audio stream. But it still needs to keep track of the calls
    that have been put on hold, which count as "lines".

    --
    In Peoples China, the workers take the lead.
    In capitalist England, the sods also take the copper piping, floorboards,
    wiring, and fillings from your teeth.
     
    Peter Corlett, Feb 1, 2006
    #13
  14. Rob Nicholson

    Ian Guest


    > > Multiple lines are what they say they are multiple lines, ie yo phone

    can
    > > have more than one line

    >
    > But shirley, this is the whole point of VOIP - its going through single
    > Ethernet connection. On a software PBX, if line 200 and line 210 is
    > associated with the same phone is a feature of the PBX, not the phone?
    >
    > See, I'm confused :)
    >

    What you have to understand is that the inteligence is moving ffrom the
    system to the phone(partially)
    In a traditional TDM based system the line keys are programed in the system
    so for example X200 has a seperate line apperance of 210 which is for
    example a DDI for sales etc. This is very normal in an office enviroment and
    as such all busness grade phones have multiple lines, This have been carried
    over to "some" ip phones so they also can have multiple lines. For example I
    am looking at a Aastra 480i on my desk here which ahs x2206 (normal number)
    x2223 (support Queue) and a BLF key for the Dect. then finally 3 speed calls
    for my most dialed numbers and 3 to set the queue to different answer
    points. Then all the other keys are the fixed one for example Hold, Xfer,
    conf, redial, etc
    >
    > > Be careful
    > > for straight SIP look at Snom and aastra or if n a budget the

    Grandstream
    > > GX2000 gets good reviews
    > > avoid the sipura 841 has very poor sound quality.

    >
    > What about the CISCO IP phones?
    >

    Very good but the fact you were looking at swix i assumed you are on a
    budget ;-)
    Just make sure they are licenced and have the correct firmware.
    >


    Ian
    www.cyber-cottage.co.uk
     
    Ian, Feb 1, 2006
    #14
  15. Rob Nicholson

    Ian Guest

    "Thomas Kenyon" <> wrote in message
    news:1tIDf.76773$...
    > Rob Nicholson wrote:
    > >>Multiple lines are what they say they are multiple lines, ie yo phone

    can
    > >>have more than one line

    > >
    > >
    > > But shirley, this is the whole point of VOIP - its going through single
    > > Ethernet connection. On a software PBX, if line 200 and line 210 is
    > > associated with the same phone is a feature of the PBX, not the phone?
    > >
    > > See, I'm confused :)
    > >

    > You're absolutely right, I always assumed that the multiple lines
    > functionality was only really useful if you were using the IP phone in
    > an environment where there is no local PBX. (a home user).

    ?????????????????? No comment......................
     
    Ian, Feb 1, 2006
    #15
  16. >> What about the CISCO IP phones?
    >>

    > Very good but the fact you were looking at swix i assumed you are on a
    > budget ;-)


    No, not particularly (although our accountant always wants a good price) -
    we a communications company so telephones are critical. For that reason,
    we're looking at quite a few vendors inc. Cisco themselves for the VOIP PBX.
    And with this we are considering comprehensive support and warranty.

    Is there any particular reason you're infering Swyx is a cheap system? We're
    looking at a medium sized set-up with 50 stations to start moving up to 100
    stations.

    Thanks, Rob.
     
    Rob Nicholson, Feb 4, 2006
    #16
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