DrayTel service relaunched

Discussion in 'UK VOIP' started by Alex, Dec 13, 2005.

  1. Alex

    Alex Guest

    DrayTel (not draytek, but loosely linked) have relaunched their voip
    service. It seemed naff before, and I signed up for sipgate, but now it
    seems very competitive. It has the same pricing structure as sipgate, but if
    you buy £20 credit you get put on the 'silver' tariff and then its cheaper
    than sipgate (1p/min landlines in uk, australia, usa etc, 10/8/5p uk
    mobiles). The features seem quite good (pasted):

    a.. Incoming calls from the PSTN
    a.. Your own real phone number
    a.. Voice-Mail (Answerphone)
    a.. Call Forwarding (Divert)
    a.. Group Calling
    a.. Multi-Device Calling
    a.. Music-on-Hold
    a.. Speaking Clock
    a.. Fax-to-Email Service
    a.. CSV Call History Download
    a.. Withhold Caller ID
    a.. No membership fees
    a.. No subscription charges
    and as it says above you get your own free incoming geographic number. No
    subscription charges and free sign-up.

    I'd give it a go if I didn't have £18 sitting in two sipgate accounts, as
    that £18 will last me at least a year! Ah well...

    Alex
    Alex, Dec 13, 2005
    #1
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  2. Alex

    Alex Guest

    "Alex" <> wrote in message
    news:_0znf.31036$...
    > DrayTel (not draytek, but loosely linked) have relaunched their voip

    <snip>

    I forgot to say, the address is www.draytel.org
    Alex, Dec 13, 2005
    #2
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  3. Alex

    John Geddes Guest

    Alex wrote:
    > DrayTel (not draytek, but loosely linked) have relaunched their voip
    > service. It seemed naff before, and I signed up for sipgate, but now it
    > seems very competitive. It has the same pricing structure as sipgate, but if
    > you buy £20 credit you get put on the 'silver' tariff and then its cheaper
    > than sipgate (1p/min landlines in uk, australia, usa etc, 10/8/5p uk
    > mobiles). [snip]


    BAD news for those considering Draytel: Draytel quote prices ex-VAT
    (wheras Sipgate have the decency to show inc-VAT prices)

    GOOD news for those considering Draytel: Draytel charge per second
    rounded to next 1p+VAT, wheras Sipgate charge in whole-minutes.

    For landline calls, there's nothing in it - rounding to the next 1.19p
    rather than 1.175p.

    But for mobiles, Sipgate round up to the next 14.9p as opposed to
    rounding up to the next 1.175p from Draytel. That really DOES dent
    Sipgate's attractiveness. And now Draytel's per-minute rate to UK
    mobiles is usefully cheaper if you spend £20 and qualify for "Silver"
    tariff.

    On their new deal, Draytel look like giving Sipgate a run for their
    money - as long as call quality and customer service are no worse.

    Anyone able to make an informed comparison?

    John Geddes
    John Geddes, Dec 13, 2005
    #3
  4. Alex

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "John Geddes" <> wrote in
    message news:
    > Alex wrote:
    > > DrayTel (not draytek, but loosely linked) have
    > > relaunched their voip service. It seemed naff before,
    > > and I signed up for sipgate, but now it seems very
    > > competitive. It has the same pricing structure as
    > > sipgate, but if you buy £20 credit you get put on the
    > > 'silver' tariff and then its cheaper than sipgate
    > > (1p/min landlines in uk, australia, usa etc, 10/8/5p uk
    > > mobiles). [snip]

    >
    > BAD news for those considering Draytel: Draytel quote
    > prices ex-VAT (wheras Sipgate have the decency to show
    > inc-VAT prices)
    > GOOD news for those considering Draytel: Draytel charge
    > per second rounded to next 1p+VAT, wheras Sipgate charge
    > in whole-minutes.
    > For landline calls, there's nothing in it - rounding to
    > the next 1.19p rather than 1.175p.


    Indeed.

    > But for mobiles, Sipgate round up to the next 14.9p as
    > opposed to rounding up to the next 1.175p from Draytel.
    > That really DOES dent Sipgate's attractiveness. And now
    > Draytel's per-minute rate to UK mobiles is usefully
    > cheaper if you spend £20 and qualify for "Silver" tariff.


    I always use my mobile to call other mobiles, it's a lot cheaper.

    > On their new deal, Draytel look like giving Sipgate a run
    > for their money - as long as call quality and customer
    > service are no worse.
    > Anyone able to make an informed comparison?
    >
    > John Geddes


    I just signed up and the confirmation box that popped up said voiptalk. Oh
    well we'll see what it's like to play with.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Dec 13, 2005
    #4
  5. Alex

    Chris Guest

    John Geddes wrote:
    > Alex wrote:
    >
    >> DrayTel (not draytek, but loosely linked) have relaunched their voip
    >> service. It seemed naff before, and I signed up for sipgate, but now
    >> it seems very competitive. It has the same pricing structure as
    >> sipgate, but if you buy £20 credit you get put on the 'silver' tariff
    >> and then its cheaper than sipgate (1p/min landlines in uk, australia,
    >> usa etc, 10/8/5p uk mobiles). [snip]

    >
    >
    > BAD news for those considering Draytel: Draytel quote prices ex-VAT
    > (wheras Sipgate have the decency to show inc-VAT prices)


    More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need £10 of call credit to
    get a geographic number. An 0870 number costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10
    (all prices ex VAT). So if you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate is still the
    better option.
    Chris, Dec 13, 2005
    #5
  6. Alex

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Chris" <> wrote in message
    news:

    [snip]

    > More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need £10 of
    > call credit to get a geographic number. An 0870 number
    > costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10 (all prices ex VAT). So if
    > you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate is still the better option.


    Indeed. I have one number that doesn't and never will have any credit on
    it. It's a backdoor into my PABX (gives internal dial tone). It's never
    used for outgoing calls and only gets used for incoming calls when I need
    to test something.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Dec 13, 2005
    #6
  7. Alex

    Chris Blunt Guest

    On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 21:13:12 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >
    >"Chris" <> wrote in message
    >news:
    >
    >[snip]
    >
    >> More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need £10 of
    >> call credit to get a geographic number. An 0870 number
    >> costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10 (all prices ex VAT). So if
    >> you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate is still the better option.

    >
    >Indeed. I have one number that doesn't and never will have any credit on
    >it. It's a backdoor into my PABX (gives internal dial tone). It's never
    >used for outgoing calls and only gets used for incoming calls when I need
    >to test something.


    Sipgate's geographic numbers don't expire if you don't use them for a
    while (as might be the case with your PABX number), whereas DrayTel
    will disconnect your number if you don't use it at least once every 60
    days.

    Chris
    Chris Blunt, Dec 14, 2005
    #7
  8. Alex

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Chris Blunt" <> wrote in message
    news:p
    > On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 21:13:12 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    > >
    > >
    > > "Chris" <> wrote in message
    > > news:
    > >
    > > [snip]
    > >
    > > > More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need
    > > > £10 of call credit to get a geographic number. An
    > > > 0870 number costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10 (all
    > > > prices ex VAT). So if you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate
    > > > is still the better option.

    > >
    > > Indeed. I have one number that doesn't and never will
    > > have any credit on it. It's a backdoor into my PABX
    > > (gives internal dial tone). It's never used for
    > > outgoing calls and only gets used for incoming calls
    > > when I need to test something.

    >
    > Sipgate's geographic numbers don't expire if you don't
    > use them for a while (as might be the case with your PABX
    > number), whereas DrayTel will disconnect your number if
    > you don't use it at least once every 60 days.


    Actually, Sipgate do reserve the right to pull a number through disuse,
    but AFAIK it's never happened.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Dec 14, 2005
    #8
  9. Alex

    Mr Flipflops Guest

    >>> More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need £10 of
    >>> call credit to get a geographic number. An 0870 number
    >>> costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10 (all prices ex VAT). So if
    >>> you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate is still the better option.

    >>
    >>Indeed. I have one number that doesn't and never will have any credit on
    >>it. It's a backdoor into my PABX (gives internal dial tone). It's never
    >>used for outgoing calls and only gets used for incoming calls when I need
    >>to test something.

    >
    > Sipgate's geographic numbers don't expire if you don't use them for a
    > while (as might be the case with your PABX number), whereas DrayTel
    > will disconnect your number if you don't use it at least once every 60
    > days.


    Yes, thats a bit on the pants side. You'd think they'd specify it would
    only occur if there was demand in an area and no more numbers available.
    However, when the voipbuster/sipdiscount gravy train derails, it might be
    worth considering (for me)..

    Stuart
    Mr Flipflops, Dec 14, 2005
    #9
  10. Alex

    Chris Blunt Guest

    On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:40:55 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >
    >"Chris Blunt" <> wrote in message
    >news:p
    >> On Tue, 13 Dec 2005 21:13:12 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    >> <> wrote:
    >>
    >> >
    >> >
    >> > "Chris" <> wrote in message
    >> > news:
    >> >
    >> > [snip]
    >> >
    >> > > More bad news compared to Sipgate is that you need
    >> > > £10 of call credit to get a geographic number. An
    >> > > 0870 number costs £3 and an 0845 costs £10 (all
    >> > > prices ex VAT). So if you need a "free" DDI, Sipgate
    >> > > is still the better option.
    >> >
    >> > Indeed. I have one number that doesn't and never will
    >> > have any credit on it. It's a backdoor into my PABX
    >> > (gives internal dial tone). It's never used for
    >> > outgoing calls and only gets used for incoming calls
    >> > when I need to test something.

    >>
    >> Sipgate's geographic numbers don't expire if you don't
    >> use them for a while (as might be the case with your PABX
    >> number), whereas DrayTel will disconnect your number if
    >> you don't use it at least once every 60 days.

    >
    >Actually, Sipgate do reserve the right to pull a number through disuse,
    >but AFAIK it's never happened.


    I didn't know that. Do they specify any particular frequency that you
    are supposed to receive calls within to avoid being disconnected?

    Chris
    Chris Blunt, Dec 15, 2005
    #10
  11. Alex

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Chris Blunt" <> wrote in message
    news:
    > On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:40:55 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    > <> wrote:


    [snip]

    > > Actually, Sipgate do reserve the right to pull a number
    > > through disuse, but AFAIK it's never happened.

    >
    > I didn't know that. Do they specify any particular
    > frequency that you are supposed to receive calls within
    > to avoid being disconnected?


    I'm not 100% sure, I think it's around 6 months, similar to the mobile
    networks. You definitely don't have to make any calls though, as long as
    the account has been used at all in that time it will remain active. As I
    said, I don't think they ever have pulled any numbers through disuse, but
    it's natural that they should be able to, given that they give free
    geographic numbers.

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Dec 15, 2005
    #11
  12. Alex

    Alex Guest

    "Ivor Jones" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    >
    > "Chris Blunt" <> wrote in message
    > news:
    >> On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:40:55 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    >> <> wrote:

    >
    > [snip]
    >
    >> > Actually, Sipgate do reserve the right to pull a number
    >> > through disuse, but AFAIK it's never happened.

    >>
    >> I didn't know that. Do they specify any particular
    >> frequency that you are supposed to receive calls within
    >> to avoid being disconnected?

    >
    > I'm not 100% sure, I think it's around 6 months, similar to the mobile
    > networks. You definitely don't have to make any calls though, as long as
    > the account has been used at all in that time it will remain active. As I
    > said, I don't think they ever have pulled any numbers through disuse, but
    > it's natural that they should be able to, given that they give free
    > geographic numbers.
    >
    > Ivor
    >


    Personally I think that they should pull PSTN numbers that don't get used-
    from what I believe they have to pay a third party to use/register these
    numbers, and with some people registering multiple accounts, getting many
    PSTN numbers and then not using them or giving anything 'back', the cost has
    to be covered elsewhere (by customers that pay to and do use the network-
    resulting in higher charges). Or alternatively they will run out of money
    and no longer offer free numbers without subscription etc.

    Although I'm with sipgate, I agree with Draytel's 60-day setup (as long as
    it allows for users who use the service to for example take an extended
    holiday without loosing their line etc). Fly-by-night (fineria type
    companies) show that the bubble bursts after a certain period of
    unprofitability, which is an inconvenience and bad thing for those who rely
    on the system.

    Please note I'm on about issuing PSTN numbers and people abusing this fact
    as the VOIP provider has to pay a third party for the privelidge of using
    the number, not about VOIP providers that don't so therefore don't incur a
    direct cost for each sign up.

    Alex
    Alex, Dec 15, 2005
    #12
  13. Alex

    Ivor Jones Guest

    "Alex" <> wrote in message
    news:gXdof.11472$
    > "Ivor Jones" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > >
    > >
    > > "Chris Blunt" <> wrote in
    > > message news:
    > > > On Wed, 14 Dec 2005 10:40:55 -0000, "Ivor Jones"
    > > > <> wrote:

    > >
    > > [snip]
    > >
    > > > > Actually, Sipgate do reserve the right to pull a
    > > > > number through disuse, but AFAIK it's never
    > > > > happened.
    > > >
    > > > I didn't know that. Do they specify any particular
    > > > frequency that you are supposed to receive calls
    > > > within to avoid being disconnected?

    > >
    > > I'm not 100% sure, I think it's around 6 months,
    > > similar to the mobile networks. You definitely don't
    > > have to make any calls though, as long as the account
    > > has been used at all in that time it will remain
    > > active. As I said, I don't think they ever have pulled
    > > any numbers through disuse, but it's natural that they
    > > should be able to, given that they give free geographic
    > > numbers. Ivor
    > >

    >
    > Personally I think that they should pull PSTN numbers
    > that don't get used- from what I believe they have to pay
    > a third party to use/register these numbers, and with
    > some people registering multiple accounts, getting many
    > PSTN numbers and then not using them or giving anything
    > 'back', the cost has to be covered elsewhere (by
    > customers that pay to and do use the network- resulting
    > in higher charges). Or alternatively they will run out of
    > money and no longer offer free numbers without
    > subscription etc.


    Indeed. I don't know how much they cost, but Sipgate and all the other
    providers do have to pay people like Magrathea for their numbers.

    > Although I'm with sipgate, I agree with Draytel's 60-day
    > setup (as long as it allows for users who use the service
    > to for example take an extended holiday without loosing
    > their line etc). Fly-by-night (fineria type companies)
    > show that the bubble bursts after a certain period of
    > unprofitability, which is an inconvenience and bad thing
    > for those who rely on the system.


    I agree. If you want to leave your line unused for an extended period of
    time, for example if you get posted overseas (although in that case it
    might make sense to take an ATA with you..!) then any reasonable supplier
    should be prepared to "park" a number for a small fee, maybe with a
    recorded announcement.

    > Please note I'm on about issuing PSTN numbers and people
    > abusing this fact as the VOIP provider has to pay a third
    > party for the privelidge of using the number, not about
    > VOIP providers that don't so therefore don't incur a
    > direct cost for each sign up.


    Indeed. I have a FWD account that rarely gets used except if I need to
    test something.

    I wonder, incidentally, how www.ipkall.com make their money..? I (like
    many others) have a totally free US number from them routing to my Sipgate
    account, where do they get their income..?

    Ivor
    Ivor Jones, Dec 15, 2005
    #13
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