Does anybody have some docs on "kickstart" for Suse?

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by thingy, Jul 30, 2005.

  1. thingy

    thingy Guest

    ie automated builds....

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #1
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  2. In article <>,
    thingy <> wrote:

    >ie automated builds....


    I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Jul 30, 2005
    #2
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  3. thingy

    thingy Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > thingy <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>ie automated builds....

    >
    >
    > I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.


    Yeah, saw that too, not sure if I can autoyast off a non-suse server
    (due to licence costs). Ive kickstart mentioned and I know I can
    kickstart a rh box off a debian server. Im hoping its very similar to rh
    so I can do both off the debian box, hence me asking.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #3
  4. In article <>,
    thingy <> wrote:

    >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> In article <>,
    >> thingy <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>ie automated builds....

    >>
    >> I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.

    >
    >Yeah, saw that too, not sure if I can autoyast off a non-suse server
    >(due to licence costs).


    Alternatively, how about doing a manual install on one machine, and
    simply using rsync from there to the other machines?
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Jul 30, 2005
    #4
  5. On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:23:56 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    D'Oliveiro didst scrawl:

    > In article <>,
    > thingy <> wrote:
    >

    *SNIP*
    > Alternatively, how about doing a manual install on one machine, and
    > simply using rsync from there to the other machines?


    Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.
    I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.

    --
    Matthew Poole
    "Don't use force. Get a bigger hammer."
     
    Matthew Poole, Jul 30, 2005
    #5
  6. In article <>,
    Matthew Poole <> wrote:

    >On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:23:56 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    >D'Oliveiro didst scrawl:
    >
    >> Alternatively, how about doing a manual install on one machine, and
    >> simply using rsync from there to the other machines?

    >
    >Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    >custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.


    I don't see what difference it makes--choosing options in the installer
    directly versus setting them up in a script beforehand is going to take
    the same amount of time.

    >I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    >to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    >putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.


    Seven minutes--doesn't sound like you're installing much. My SuSE
    installs take more like 20 minutes off DVD, perhaps because they're
    quite full-featured desktop installs.
     
    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro, Jul 30, 2005
    #6
  7. On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 21:28:27 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    D¹Oliveiro didst scrawl:

    > In article <>,
    > Matthew Poole <> wrote:
    >

    *SNIP*
    >>Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    >>custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.

    >
    > I don't see what difference it makes--choosing options in the installer
    > directly versus setting them up in a script beforehand is going to take
    > the same amount of time.
    >

    You only do the script once. Then you burn it onto every new CD you build
    and it's all there for you. If you do it in the installer, you have to do
    it every time. Did I mention that the kickstart script takes care of
    things like disk partitioning, too, including RAID1 in software if you so
    desire? That cuts a lot of time out of your install time.

    >>I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    >>to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    >>putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.

    >
    > Seven minutes--doesn't sound like you're installing much. My SuSE
    > installs take more like 20 minutes off DVD, perhaps because they're
    > quite full-featured desktop installs.


    No, it's a base install that then gets installed with apache, MySQL and
    the other things required to turn it into a full server, via apt4rpm.
    Total install process is under 20 minutes, including a couple of reboots
    for things like enabling quotas - all done in the kickstart, as well as
    creating a non-executable /tmp directory.
    Does that 20 minutes include manual disk partitioning and package
    selection? My seven minutes is from the moment the installer starts
    loading to the moment it ejects the CD and reboots.

    You don't need to be so consistently condescending, y'know. You AREN'T a
    god, of any sort.

    --
    Matthew Poole
    "Don't use force. Get a bigger hammer."
     
    Matthew Poole, Jul 30, 2005
    #7
  8. In article <>,
    Matthew Poole <> wrote:

    >On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 21:28:27 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    >D¹Oliveiro didst scrawl:
    >
    >> In article <>,
    >> Matthew Poole <> wrote:
    >>

    >*SNIP*
    >>>Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    >>>custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.

    >>
    >> I don't see what difference it makes--choosing options in the installer
    >> directly versus setting them up in a script beforehand is going to take
    >> the same amount of time.
    >>

    >You only do the script once. Then you burn it onto every new CD you build
    >and it's all there for you. If you do it in the installer, you have to do
    >it every time. Did I mention that the kickstart script takes care of
    >things like disk partitioning, too, including RAID1 in software if you so
    >desire? That cuts a lot of time out of your install time.
    >
    >>>I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    >>>to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    >>>putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.

    >>
    >> Seven minutes--doesn't sound like you're installing much. My SuSE
    >> installs take more like 20 minutes off DVD, perhaps because they're
    >> quite full-featured desktop installs.

    >
    >No, it's a base install that then gets installed with apache, MySQL and
    >the other things required to turn it into a full server, via apt4rpm.
    >Total install process is under 20 minutes, including a couple of reboots
    >for things like enabling quotas - all done in the kickstart, as well as
    >creating a non-executable /tmp directory.
    >Does that 20 minutes include manual disk partitioning and package
    >selection? My seven minutes is from the moment the installer starts
    >loading to the moment it ejects the CD and reboots.
    >
    >You don't need to be so consistently condescending, y'know. You AREN'T a
    >god, of any sort.


    Let's see ... the OP had a question about automated SuSE installs. I
    tried to be helpful with a couple of suggestions. Then you came in
    boasting about how easily you could do a Red Hat install.

    Who was the one being condescending, again?
     
    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro, Jul 30, 2005
    #8
  9. thingy

    Shane Guest


    > Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    > custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.
    > I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    > to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    > putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.


    Does the script have to install off CD?
    Isnt it possible to run the script from floppy/network?
    Maybe with pxe NIC's?

    --
    Hardware, n.: The parts of a computer system that can be kicked

    The best way to get the right answer on usenet is to post the wrong one.
     
    Shane, Jul 30, 2005
    #9
  10. thingy

    thingy Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > thingy <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >>
    >>>In article <>,
    >>> thingy <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>
    >>>>ie automated builds....
    >>>
    >>>I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.

    >>
    >>Yeah, saw that too, not sure if I can autoyast off a non-suse server
    >>(due to licence costs).

    >
    >
    > Alternatively, how about doing a manual install on one machine, and
    > simply using rsync from there to the other machines?


    Nope.

    I have custom scripting on RH to build each machine to completion. Also
    I have ES3, 4, AS3, 4 and the 64 bit verions so that's 8 builds
    depending on the OS alone let alone hardware and disk layouts plus
    applications. Kickstart works pretty well, I can have a fully built,
    hardened and patched machine in under an hour.

    From experience with RH KS i know the docs suck, just wondered if
    anybody had written their own.

    I will start googling this week anyway.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #10
  11. thingy

    thingy Guest

    Matthew Poole wrote:
    > On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 19:23:56 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    > D'Oliveiro didst scrawl:
    >
    >
    >>In article <>,
    >> thingy <> wrote:
    >>

    >
    > *SNIP*
    >
    >>Alternatively, how about doing a manual install on one machine, and
    >>simply using rsync from there to the other machines?

    >
    >
    > Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    > custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.
    > I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    > to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    > putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.
    >



    Full install? @everything? in 7 minutes? seems to take me way longer....

    I do a minimal plus server tools in 2 mins 40sec, then the up2date
    patching which takes 20~40mins, then the custom scripts finish...it was
    a lot of work but re-building a box in under an hour is just neat.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #11
  12. thingy

    thingy Guest

    Shane wrote:
    >>Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    >>custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.
    >>I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    >>to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    >>putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.

    >
    >
    > Does the script have to install off CD?
    > Isnt it possible to run the script from floppy/network?
    > Maybe with pxe NIC's?
    >


    Yes in theory. I have tried to do that but not succeeded so far. I
    kickstart CD is mostly nfs copying anyway and pretty simple. Once all my
    servers come with dvd I shouldnt even need a nfs server as the dvd will
    hold all 4~5 cds contents.

    Also bootp isnt to happy over different subnets so its not that practical.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #12
  13. thingy

    thingy Guest

    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > Matthew Poole <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 21:28:27 +1200, someone purporting to be Lawrence
    >>D¹Oliveiro didst scrawl:
    >>
    >>
    >>>In article <>,
    >>> Matthew Poole <> wrote:
    >>>

    >>
    >>*SNIP*
    >>
    >>>>Because to rsync you have to first do an install. A kickstart file is a
    >>>>custom installer script that controls every aspect of the installation.
    >>>
    >>>I don't see what difference it makes--choosing options in the installer
    >>>directly versus setting them up in a script beforehand is going to take
    >>>the same amount of time.


    see below

    >>You only do the script once. Then you burn it onto every new CD you build
    >>and it's all there for you. If you do it in the installer, you have to do
    >>it every time. Did I mention that the kickstart script takes care of
    >>things like disk partitioning, too, including RAID1 in software if you so
    >>desire? That cuts a lot of time out of your install time.
    >>
    >>
    >>>>I've done quite a bit of work with RH's kickstart system, and have managed
    >>>>to get a full install down to seven minutes, entirely unattended beyond
    >>>>putting in the CD and removing it again once the install is completed.
    >>>
    >>>Seven minutes--doesn't sound like you're installing much. My SuSE
    >>>installs take more like 20 minutes off DVD, perhaps because they're
    >>>quite full-featured desktop installs.

    >>
    >>No, it's a base install that then gets installed with apache, MySQL and
    >>the other things required to turn it into a full server, via apt4rpm.
    >>Total install process is under 20 minutes, including a couple of reboots
    >>for things like enabling quotas - all done in the kickstart, as well as
    >>creating a non-executable /tmp directory.
    >>Does that 20 minutes include manual disk partitioning and package
    >>selection? My seven minutes is from the moment the installer starts
    >>loading to the moment it ejects the CD and reboots.
    >>
    >>You don't need to be so consistently condescending, y'know. You AREN'T a
    >>god, of any sort.

    >
    >
    > Let's see ... the OP had a question about automated SuSE installs. I
    > tried to be helpful with a couple of suggestions. Then you came in
    > boasting about how easily you could do a Red Hat install.
    >
    > Who was the one being condescending, again?


    now...now

    RH Kickstart achieves a few things,

    QA the standard build means every box gets built the same every time.

    eg we have a prod, test and dev box, if the test box "blows up" we know
    we can rebuild it to the same build as the prod.

    So its also a neat disaster recovery proceedure and I dont have to be
    there a NT or DBA guy can insert the cd and its done for them, no
    thinking is needed.

    It is also un-attended minimum labour installs, I spend 10 minutes on a
    box, 2mins to put the cd in, 2 to take it out and 3 or 4 to register the
    box with RHN. I can build 6 ~ 8 boxes in a day, that is cost effective.

    What is not cost effective though is RH's pricing, their proxy server
    software has jumped 25% in one year, they dont give any academic
    discounts, they dont really have any enterprise level tools, they dont
    have NZ support as such and their distro has severe quality problems.

    So Suse is 50% cheaper, seems better put together and they have
    Enterprise tools, oh and NZ support (Novell), if I can kickstart boxes
    aka RH, we are swapping over.

    Plus the educational agreement just signed makes life interesting.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thingy, Jul 30, 2005
    #13
  14. On Sat, 30 Jul 2005 14:42:44 +1200, thingy wrote:

    > ie automated builds....


    I can't give you much information about Suse, but I know Fedora Core Two
    comes with a Kickstart Configurator tool, called Kickstart Configurator
    which is a graphical interface for creating a Kickstart file. If you want,
    I can send you a file created with that tool if it helps.

    --
    Regards,

    Waylon Kenning.
     
    Waylon Kenning, Jul 31, 2005
    #14
  15. On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 09:54:48 +1200, thingy wrote:

    > So Suse is 50% cheaper, seems better put together and they have
    > Enterprise tools, oh and NZ support (Novell), if I can kickstart boxes
    > aka RH, we are swapping over.
    >
    > Plus the educational agreement just signed makes life interesting.


    And cheaper no doubt?

    --
    Regards,

    Waylon Kenning.
     
    Waylon Kenning, Jul 31, 2005
    #15
  16. thingy

    Steven Ellis Guest

    thingy wrote:
    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > > In article <>,
    > > thingy <> wrote:
    > >
    > >
    > >>ie automated builds....

    > >
    > >
    > > I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.

    >
    > Yeah, saw that too, not sure if I can autoyast off a non-suse server
    > (due to licence costs). Ive kickstart mentioned and I know I can
    > kickstart a rh box off a debian server. Im hoping its very similar to rh
    > so I can do both off the debian box, hence me asking.


    You could autoyast off a windows server if you so wish. All you need is
    a server with either http/ftp/nfs support. I've had a RH box setup as
    both a kickstart server and autoyast server, plus with the appropriate
    network settings I can do full PXE based builds.

    The docs on Suse's website that describe how to setup autoyast are
    reasonably good

    Steve
     
    Steven Ellis, Aug 1, 2005
    #16
  17. In article <>,
    thingy <> wrote:

    >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> In article <>,
    >> thingy <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>ie automated builds....

    >>
    >> I think it's called "AutoYaST". Try Googling for that.

    >
    >Yeah, saw that too, not sure if I can autoyast off a non-suse server
    >(due to licence costs).


    Do you mean a non-SuSE distro of Linux? Since YaST and AutoYaST are both
    open-source, licence costs shouldn't be an issue.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Aug 1, 2005
    #17
  18. thingy

    thing2 Guest

    Waylon Kenning wrote:
    > On Sun, 31 Jul 2005 09:54:48 +1200, thingy wrote:
    >
    >
    >>So Suse is 50% cheaper, seems better put together and they have
    >>Enterprise tools, oh and NZ support (Novell), if I can kickstart boxes
    >>aka RH, we are swapping over.
    >>
    >>Plus the educational agreement just signed makes life interesting.

    >
    >
    > And cheaper no doubt?
    >


    30~50% cheaper....it seems while people choose to leave MS land for
    Linux land due to cost, the commercial people in Linux land are really
    little better....IMHO.

    regards

    thing
     
    thing2, Aug 1, 2005
    #18
  19. In article <>,
    thingy <> wrote:

    >RH Kickstart achieves a few things,
    >
    >QA the standard build means every box gets built the same every time.
    >
    >eg we have a prod, test and dev box, if the test box "blows up" we know
    >we can rebuild it to the same build as the prod.


    My rsync idea can achieve that.

    >So its also a neat disaster recovery proceedure and I dont have to be
    >there a NT or DBA guy can insert the cd and its done for them, no
    >thinking is needed.
    >
    >It is also un-attended minimum labour installs, I spend 10 minutes on a
    >box, 2mins to put the cd in, 2 to take it out and 3 or 4 to register the
    >box with RHN. I can build 6 ~ 8 boxes in a day, that is cost effective.


    It would be easy enough to build a minimal custom boot CD that goes
    straight into the rsync run.
     
    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro, Aug 4, 2005
    #19
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