Dimdows Home Server In NZ

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 12, 2010.

  1. I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they’re offering two
    configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other for
    a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay “from†$129 extra for
    “installation and trainingâ€.

    These are running “Windows Home Serverâ€, which is built on an outdated
    version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.

    When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    Somehow I don’t see these flying off the shelves...
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 12, 2010
    #1
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  2. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Richard Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they’re offering two
    > configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other for
    > a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay “from†$129 extra for
    > “installation and trainingâ€.
    >
    > These are running “Windows Home Serverâ€, which is built on an outdated
    > version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    > Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.
    >
    > When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    > “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home appliance?
    >
    > Somehow I don’t see these flying off the shelves...


    All the time with home theaters, tvs etc.

    Not everyone can put the red plug in the red socket etc.

    People pay to have wireless routers installed. Thats a much simpler
    appliance than a server.
     
    Richard, May 12, 2010
    #2
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  3. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    On Wed, 12 May 2010 21:55:33 +1200, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    > When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    > for “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home
    > appliance?


    Better question: When was the last time you saw anyone pay more than $50 for training on how to use
    _any_ "home" version of Microsoft Windows?

    The "Home" versions of Microsoft Windows are crippled and limited versions of Microsoft Windows. No
    sensible person would pay _any_ money for them let alone pay for training on how to use them!


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
     
    Sweetpea, May 12, 2010
    #3
  4. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    On Wed, 12 May 2010 22:27:44 +1200, EMB wrote:

    >> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >> for “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home
    >> appliance?

    >
    > That is fairly normal with dishwashers, washing machines and the like.


    Bullshit!

    You get the instruction booklet. No training is offered - purchased or otherwise - on how to operate or
    maintain the appliance!


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
     
    Sweetpea, May 12, 2010
    #4
  5. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    PeeCee Guest

    "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    > I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they’re offering two
    > configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other
    > for
    > a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay “from†$129 extra for
    > “installation and trainingâ€.
    >
    > These are running “Windows Home Serverâ€, which is built on an outdated
    > version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    > Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.
    >
    > When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    > “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    snip

    Lawrence

    See it all the time.
    There are a lot of people out there who are 'very' happy to fork out money
    for some one to just 'make it happen'
    PC's are not an 'home appliance' they are way more complex under the skin
    than that.
    Think in terms of : you don't have to be an Electrician to work the lights /
    power points, but you have to be an Electrician to put it together in the
    first place.

    You have to remember you know how computers work, a significant chunk of the
    population do not.
    They are often to young, to old, not interested or to busy.
    In fact a lot of them find Personal Computers 'frustrating' to use, not an
    endless source of fascination and entertainment.

    Let me put it to you this way:
    Think of something you do 'not' like doing.
    Washing the dog/cat/car, mowing the lawn, grocery shopping or doing the
    books? ie something you keep putting off because it is uninteresting or 'too
    hard'
    So what do you do?
    Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the task
    'and you pay them money' for doing so.

    Sure you won't pay the groomer/Lawn mower/student to much, but what about
    the accountant?
    Yes they do very nicely thank you very much, because sorting the books is
    not something a lot of people want/can do.
    If you're an accountant it's easy, you understand how it works but because
    of the depth of knowledge required the market will stand a higher fee.
    Exactly the same as other people understand how computers work and will 'fix
    it' for those that don't (for a price)

    How much would 'you' charge to pick up a PC, deliver, unpack, setup, test
    for?
    $25 ?
    Give me a break, if some one is employing you to do that they are also going
    to consume time 'consulting' with you on what to buy and who to buy it from.
    Then when you get it set up they do the classic 'oh while you are here'
    routine and produce a list as long as your arm.
    Then when you do finish for the next few days you get a stream of phone
    calls 'how do i ...' 'where is my' questions.
    How long did all that take?


    Paul.
     
    PeeCee, May 12, 2010
    #5
  6. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    peterwn Guest

    On May 12, 11:36 pm, Richard <> wrote:
    ...
    >
    > All the time with home theaters, tvs etc.
    >
    > Not everyone can put the red plug in the red socket etc.
    >
    > People pay to have wireless routers installed. Thats a much simpler
    > appliance than a server.


    Someone I knew signed up for Orcon DSL. They couriered a pre-
    configured modem but she could not get it to work. I went to help and
    connected filters to her phones. Still did not work. She assured me
    all phones were accounted for. This was the first time I had brushed
    with DSL (I have cable) so I did not know quite what to expect. She
    got a technician who unearthed another phone! Grrrrr!
     
    peterwn, May 12, 2010
    #6
  7. In message <hse9aq$hq5$>, PeeCee wrote:

    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >>
    >> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >> for “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    >
    > Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the task
    > 'and you pay them money' for doing so.


    Yes, but none of those payments includes “training†for _you_ to do the job.
    You pay them, _they_ do the work.

    It seems to me there’s a market for a specialist, like an accountant or
    plumber, to install and look after this sort of thing for customers. The
    question is, how much would they be willing to pay for it?
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 13, 2010
    #7
  8. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Somewhere on teh intarwebs PeeCee wrote:
    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in
    > message news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >> I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they're offering two
    >> configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the
    >> other for
    >> a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay "from" $129 extra
    >> for "installation and training".
    >>
    >> These are running "Windows Home Server", which is built on an
    >> outdated version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware
    >> vendor that Microsoft has persuaded into building products around
    >> this software. When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a
    >> hundred
    >> bucks for "installation and training" for what is meant to be a home
    >> appliance?

    > snip
    >
    > Lawrence
    >
    > See it all the time.
    > There are a lot of people out there who are 'very' happy to fork out
    > money for some one to just 'make it happen'
    > PC's are not an 'home appliance' they are way more complex under the
    > skin than that.
    > Think in terms of : you don't have to be an Electrician to work the
    > lights / power points, but you have to be an Electrician to put it
    > together in the first place.
    >
    > You have to remember you know how computers work, a significant chunk
    > of the population do not.
    > They are often to young, to old, not interested or to busy.
    > In fact a lot of them find Personal Computers 'frustrating' to use,
    > not an endless source of fascination and entertainment.
    >
    > Let me put it to you this way:
    > Think of something you do 'not' like doing.
    > Washing the dog/cat/car, mowing the lawn, grocery shopping or doing
    > the books? ie something you keep putting off because it is
    > uninteresting or 'too hard'
    > So what do you do?
    > Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the
    > task 'and you pay them money' for doing so.
    >
    > Sure you won't pay the groomer/Lawn mower/student to much, but what
    > about the accountant?
    > Yes they do very nicely thank you very much, because sorting the
    > books is not something a lot of people want/can do.
    > If you're an accountant it's easy, you understand how it works but
    > because of the depth of knowledge required the market will stand a
    > higher fee. Exactly the same as other people understand how computers
    > work and will 'fix it' for those that don't (for a price)
    >
    > How much would 'you' charge to pick up a PC, deliver, unpack, setup,
    > test for?
    > $25 ?
    > Give me a break, if some one is employing you to do that they are
    > also going to consume time 'consulting' with you on what to buy and
    > who to buy it from. Then when you get it set up they do the classic
    > 'oh while you are here' routine and produce a list as long as your
    > arm. Then when you do finish for the next few days you get a stream of
    > phone calls 'how do i ...' 'where is my' questions.
    > How long did all that take?


    The voice of reason Paul. :)

    When I was in my locl DSE last month the manager[ess] asked me if I wanted
    to be one of their 'nerds'. They offer a service where you can get a 'nerd'
    to come and set up your purchase. In fact I think it might go further than
    that... Anyway, she said that the demand was too high to send out shop staff
    all the time...

    There's certainly a market for that sort of thing, getting someone to set up
    / fine-tune your increasingly complicated AV system, or computer system (or
    a convergence of the two).... Consumer electronics aren't as
    consumer-friendly as they once were, and I used to be the guy to call in my
    neighbourhood back in the days when VCRs first hit the market. I must have
    set up more than 50% of them in the community. People would talk, say "I
    can't even get the clock set yet alone programme it" and get told "Shaun set
    mine up for me after I'd given up and there was a blinking display all the
    time...". Word of mouth cost me a lot of time. <g>
    --
    Cheers,
    Shaun.

    "When we dream.... that's just our brains defragmenting" G Jackson.
     
    ~misfit~, May 13, 2010
    #8
  9. In article <hsdvqu$9ug$>, EMB <> wrote:
    >On 12/05/2010 9:55 p.m., Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they’re offering two
    >> configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other for
    >> a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay “from†$129 extra for
    >> “installation and trainingâ€.
    >>
    >> These are running “Windows Home Serverâ€, which is built on an outdated
    >> version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    >> Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.
    >>
    >> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    >> “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    >
    >That is fairly normal with dishwashers, washing machines and the like.


    ... in what universe ? :) Dishwashers etc are plugin, switch on appliances
    ... OK, often fairly clever ones these days, but "installation" ? ...
    "training" ? :)
    ... and paying for this ? incredible. Maybe for delivery ... up to $20 maybe
    if you are a long way from the shop ? :)
     
    Bruce Sinclair, May 13, 2010
    #9
  10. In article <hsetqa$5o4$>, EMB <> wrote:
    >On 12/05/2010 11:41 p.m., Sweetpea wrote:
    >> On Wed, 12 May 2010 22:27:44 +1200, EMB wrote:
    >>>> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >>>> for “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home
    >>>> appliance?
    >>> That is fairly normal with dishwashers, washing machines and the like.

    >> Bullshit!
    >> You get the instruction booklet. No training is offered - purchased or

    > otherwise - on how to operate or
    >> maintain the appliance!

    >You really are an ignorant **** aren't you. Try getting either of the
    >above delivered and installed from say your local Noel Leemings. They
    >will charge you for the service, and the installation monkey will give
    >you some training before he departs.


    Ah, well there's your problem then. Why would you pay for anything from a
    monkey ?
    They can't charge you extra for something you don't want/agree to, so don't.
    "Problem" solved. :)
     
    Bruce Sinclair, May 13, 2010
    #10
  11. In message <hse3s5$8jl$>, Richard wrote:

    > All the time with home theaters, tvs etc.


    But home-cinema systems, in particular, are low-volume, high-margin
    products. They need to be calibrated to individual viewing and listening
    conditions. When a customer is paying in the five figures, you can afford to
    take some time handholding them, at least to start with.

    This HP Mediasmart thing, on the other hand, has a price that’s barely in
    the four figures. It’s priced for the mass market. But I don’t think it will
    sell in numbers to match that.
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, May 13, 2010
    #11
  12. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Another Me Guest

    On 13/05/10 12:34 PM, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    > But home-cinema systems, in particular, are low-volume, high-margin
    > products. They need to be calibrated to individual viewing and listening
    > conditions. When a customer is paying in the five figures, you can afford to
    > take some time handholding them, at least to start with.


    Five figures? What the hell are you talking, you can get a very nice
    home theatre in the low four figure range.
     
    Another Me, May 13, 2010
    #12
  13. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    PeeCee Guest

    "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    news:hsfcvu$hb4$...
    > In message <hse9aq$hq5$>, PeeCee wrote:
    >
    >> "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    >> news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >>>
    >>> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >>> for “installation and training†for what is meant to be a home
    >>> appliance?

    >>
    >> Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the
    >> task
    >> 'and you pay them money' for doing so.

    >
    > Yes, but none of those payments includes “training†for _you_ to do the
    > job.
    > You pay them, _they_ do the work.



    Don't see what your getting at.
    Is this training the service provider or training the customer?



    >
    > It seems to me there’s a market for a specialist, like an accountant or
    > plumber, to install and look after this sort of thing for customers. The
    > question is, how much would they be willing to pay for it?


    For some people cost is not a consideration, particularly for a business.
    If the PC is down and the secretary can't send out invoices then paying some
    one $150 / hr to sort it is worth every cent.
    For a beneficiary it won't be an option, so they will use their spare time
    to do it themselves.
    Horses for courses.

    Paul.
     
    PeeCee, May 13, 2010
    #13
  14. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Gordon Guest

    On 2010-05-12, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:
    > I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they?re offering two
    > configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other for
    > a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay ?from? $129 extra for
    > ?installation and training?.
    >
    > These are running ?Windows Home Server?, which is built on an outdated
    > version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    > Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.
    >
    > When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    > ?installation and training? for what is meant to be a home appliance?


    a) They do not have to
    b) nor do they have to pay for an extended warranty
    c) Home appliances are getting more complex. Remember those who could
    programme their VCR?

    >
    > Somehow I don?t see these flying off the shelves...


    Ms Windows at Home serving has gotten good reviews. The gate swing game is
    now to show people that the average home with more than one PC needs to be
    networked. The irony, as I see it is that multimedia is driving this need.

    It is the concept of the LAN which needs to be common place in the medida as
    Facebook and Twitter.

    HP have taken a business decision, they are first out of the block and if
    people "get it" shortly then HP will make $. If not the idea will re-appear
    and Ms Windows will be happy.

    Ms Windows is a powerful brand. To many people it is a Good Thing (Tm) just
    as Telecom is.
     
    Gordon, May 13, 2010
    #14
  15. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Gordon Guest

    On 2010-05-12, PeeCee <> wrote:
    >
    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >> I see in the latest Harvey Norman brochure they?re offering two
    >> configurations of the HP Mediasmart Server, one for $1099 and the other
    >> for
    >> a couple hundred less. On top of which you can pay ?from? $129 extra for
    >> ?installation and training?.
    >>
    >> These are running ?Windows Home Server?, which is built on an outdated
    >> version of Windows Server. HP seem to be the only hardware vendor that
    >> Microsoft has persuaded into building products around this software.
    >>
    >> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks for
    >> ?installation and training? for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    > snip
    >
    > Lawrence
    >
    > See it all the time.
    > There are a lot of people out there who are 'very' happy to fork out money
    > for some one to just 'make it happen'


    And they think it is money well spent. They want a working server. Point and
    click.

    >
    > You have to remember you know how computers work, a significant chunk of the
    > population do not.
    > They are often to young, to old, not interested or to busy.
    > In fact a lot of them find Personal Computers 'frustrating' to use, not an
    > endless source of fascination and entertainment.


    The rest of us, all of the above. But yes, people want to use the PC, as I
    want to use the dishwasher to wash the dishes. I care not how it does it.
     
    Gordon, May 13, 2010
    #15
  16. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Gordon Guest

    On 2010-05-13, PeeCee <> wrote:
    >
    > "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    > news:hsfcvu$hb4$...
    >> In message <hse9aq$hq5$>, PeeCee wrote:
    >>
    >>> "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    >>> news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >>>>
    >>>> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >>>> for ?installation and training? for what is meant to be a home
    >>>> appliance?
    >>>
    >>> Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the
    >>> task
    >>> 'and you pay them money' for doing so.

    >>
    >> Yes, but none of those payments includes ?training? for _you_ to do the
    >> job.
    >> You pay them, _they_ do the work.

    >
    >
    > Don't see what your getting at.
    > Is this training the service provider or training the customer?


    Training the customer. Really it showing the customers how to use the
    appliance.

    >>
    >> It seems to me there?s a market for a specialist, like an accountant or
    >> plumber, to install and look after this sort of thing for customers. The
    >> question is, how much would they be willing to pay for it?

    >
    > For some people cost is not a consideration, particularly for a business.
    > If the PC is down and the secretary can't send out invoices then paying some
    > one $150 / hr to sort it is worth every cent.
    > For a beneficiary it won't be an option, so they will use their spare time
    > to do it themselves.
    > Horses for courses.
    >

    Nope. Time is money. As the saying goes
     
    Gordon, May 13, 2010
    #16
  17. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Gordon Guest

    On 2010-05-12, Lawrence D'Oliveiro <_zealand> wrote:
    > In message <hse9aq$hq5$>, PeeCee wrote:
    >
    >> "Lawrence D'Oliveiro" <_zealand> wrote in message
    >> news:hsdtul$lcc$...
    >>>
    >>> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >>> for ?installation and training? for what is meant to be a home appliance?

    >>
    >> Yep you employ a groomer, lawn mower, student or accountant to do the task
    >> 'and you pay them money' for doing so.

    >
    > Yes, but none of those payments includes ?training? for _you_ to do the job.
    > You pay them, _they_ do the work.
    >
    > It seems to me there?s a market for a specialist, like an accountant or
    > plumber, to install and look after this sort of thing for customers. The
    > question is, how much would they be willing to pay for it?


    Market forces will Govern.
    As much as they think it is worth. Which is really just the above in
    different words.

    What are your charges, what are you willing to do it for Lawrence? Lets
    haggle.
     
    Gordon, May 13, 2010
    #17
  18. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Gordon Guest

    On 2010-05-12, EMB <> wrote:
    > On 12/05/2010 11:41 p.m., Sweetpea wrote:
    >> On Wed, 12 May 2010 22:27:44 +1200, EMB wrote:
    >>
    >>>> When was the last time you heard of anyone paying over a hundred bucks
    >>>> for ?installation and training? for what is meant to be a home
    >>>> appliance?
    >>>
    >>> That is fairly normal with dishwashers, washing machines and the like.

    >>
    >> Bullshit!
    >>
    >> You get the instruction booklet. No training is offered - purchased or otherwise - on how to operate or
    >> maintain the appliance!

    >
    > You really are an ignorant **** aren't you.


    EMB, had a bad day? This is like you, playing the poster and not the
    subject.
     
    Gordon, May 13, 2010
    #18
  19. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    On Wed, 12 May 2010 23:36:37 +1200, Richard wrote:

    > All the time with home theaters, tvs etc.
    >
    > Not everyone can put the red plug in the red socket etc.


    So let the morons be content with a transistor radio and with a 14" TV.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
     
    Sweetpea, May 13, 2010
    #19
  20. Lawrence D'Oliveiro

    Sweetpea Guest

    On Thu, 13 May 2010 12:34:18 +1200, Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    > When a customer is paying in the five figures, you can afford to take
    > some time handholding them, at least to start with.


    5 figures???

    More like 4 figures max for a standard domestic TV and Dolby Pro Logic decoder and 5.1 worth of
    speakers.


    --
    "Filtering the Internet is like trying to boil the ocean"
     
    Sweetpea, May 13, 2010
    #20
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