degree or certification?

Discussion in 'A+ Certification' started by Ben, Aug 16, 2004.

  1. Ben

    Ben Guest

    I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree or get
    certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
    Or is it best to get both.
    What do employers look for?

    Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.
    Ben, Aug 16, 2004
    #1
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  2. "Michael" <> wrote in message
    news:839Uc.1618$...
    > Ben wrote:
    >
    > > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree

    or get
    > > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
    > > Or is it best to get both.
    > > What do employers look for?
    > >
    > > Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.

    >
    > Do whichever you like. I will say the certs are absolutely

    worthless
    > outside of IT. The college degree carries more weight in other

    fields.
    >
    > michael


    indeed. there are many jobs out there where they say "bachelor's
    degree required", and what that means is you could have a BS/A in
    diddlysquat, but just because you have a piece of paper, you get the
    job. probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
    grads are morons (especially public school grads) and that one is
    actually forced to use his head in college. doesnt matter what you
    have a degree *in* as long as you *have* a degree.

    not to mention, you wont be banging sorority sisters at keggers at the
    sylvan learning center
    --
    Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    Solomon Kozanski, Aug 28, 2004
    #2
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  3. On Sat, 28 Aug 2004 10:45:35 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >"Michael" <> wrote in message
    >news:839Uc.1618$...
    >> Ben wrote:
    >>
    >> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree

    >or get
    >> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
    >> > Or is it best to get both.
    >> > What do employers look for?
    >> >
    >> > Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.

    >>
    >> Do whichever you like. I will say the certs are absolutely

    >worthless
    >> outside of IT. The college degree carries more weight in other

    >fields.
    >>
    >> michael

    >
    >indeed. there are many jobs out there where they say "bachelor's
    >degree required", and what that means is you could have a BS/A in
    >diddlysquat


    A degree is recognized for what it is...a long-term effort to achieve
    a goal.

    Tom

    >, but just because you have a piece of paper, you get the
    >job. probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
    >grads are morons (especially public school grads) and that one is
    >actually forced to use his head in college. doesnt matter what you
    >have a degree *in* as long as you *have* a degree.
    >
    >not to mention, you wont be banging sorority sisters at keggers at the
    >sylvan learning center
    Tom MacIntyre, Aug 28, 2004
    #3
  4. "Bobster123" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > >>"Michael" <> wrote in message
    > >>news:839Uc.1618$...
    > >>> Ben wrote:
    > >>>
    > >>> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university

    degree
    > >>or get
    > >>> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
    > >>> > Or is it best to get both.
    > >>> > What do employers look for?

    >
    >
    > I would say do both. Find a college program where you can take the
    > certification exams as you complete the courses in the degree.
    >
    > If I had to choose- I'd say get the college degree. Certifications

    don't carry
    > anywhere near the weight they did five years ago.


    indeed. anybody can memorize a table of processor FSB speeds, but
    knowing exactly *why* and what ramifications this has... some things
    you only learn in college, like, for example, peecees suck and macs
    and amigas rule.

    if i were an employer who needed comp techs, i would most likely hire
    people off the street for $8/hr who know something about computers,
    give them training to bring them up to the level of A+, and simply not
    acknowledge the existance or credibility of comptia certs. allow me
    to elaborate:

    you create your own "tech+" certification system for your company (no
    flames from ham ops please) based on comptia's A+

    you hire people for $6/hr as computer technician trainees/apprentices
    with the understanding that when they complete your BS in-house tech
    training, they get a buck or so raise (or 25 cents, whatever you can
    get away with - haha, imagine getting $15/hr pc techs for $7!)

    give them the opportunity to take the tests at any time to get that
    raise and cert. this saves you money by not having to acknowledge or
    pay inflated prevailing tech wages to those who already have the A+
    and also saves them money by graciously giving them a tech job with a
    moderate wage and not having to pay for the high priced tests.

    the only thing you need to do is orally screen your applicants to make
    sure they're minimally competent and can actually *learn* (those of
    you who dont know how to screen applicants have no business in
    business)

    its quite ironic that the computer industry would create a
    certification so they can ensure their staff conform to some minimum
    standard only to have it blow up in their faces creating a class of
    technicians who demand more money because of a letter - not that they
    don't deserve the higher wage, but that depends solely on which side
    of the employee/employer equation you sit.

    oh and the other side effect to this is that your employees cannot
    expect competitors to recognize their fly-by-night certification from
    timbuktu inc., thus reducing your turnover and your price to earnings
    ratio. remember, comptia has neither authority nor regulatory power!

    i would have made a much better satan.
    --
    Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    Solomon Kozanski, Aug 29, 2004
    #4
  5. "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > The same? No. But BETTER, if the job opening was for an executive

    chef.
    >
    > The best doctor in the world can't write a legal brief, and the best
    > attorney can't do surgery. And neither could configure a LAN from
    > scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients.


    the best doctor and the best attorney in the world can certainly LEARN
    to write legal briefs, practice surgery AND configure a LAN from
    scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients (btw, surgery and law require
    WAY MORE skill/intellect than tinkering with transistors)
    --
    Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    Solomon Kozanski, Sep 7, 2004
    #5
  6. "Developwebsites" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > > probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
    > >grads are morons (especially public school grads)

    >
    >
    > so how do public colleges such as those in CUNY compare to private

    ones such as
    > NYU, Harvard, MIT, Pace, Columbia, Yale, etc.?


    they compare poorly

    > could I have a BS/BA in cooking from Hunter college with a 3.99gpa

    and claim
    > its the same as a BA in law from Harvard?


    hahaha... keep dreaming. just remember, the world is run on three
    things: bullsh*t, oil, and ivy league intellect. remove any one and
    the whole thing will come tumbling down
    --
    Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    Solomon Kozanski, Sep 7, 2004
    #6
  7. On Tue, 7 Sep 2004 09:14:21 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >"Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> The same? No. But BETTER, if the job opening was for an executive

    >chef.
    >>
    >> The best doctor in the world can't write a legal brief, and the best
    >> attorney can't do surgery. And neither could configure a LAN from
    >> scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients.

    >
    >the best doctor and the best attorney in the world can certainly LEARN
    >to write legal briefs, practice surgery AND configure a LAN from
    >scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients (btw, surgery and law require
    >WAY MORE skill/intellect than tinkering with transistors)


    I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
    area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
    came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's, TV's,
    converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
    skill and intellect?

    Tom
    Tom MacIntyre, Sep 7, 2004
    #7
  8. Ben

    CLV3 Guest

    I think your way of saying it is better Tom. No skill requires more talent
    or "intellect" than another. Just a different type. I know people who are
    whizzes when it comes to cars but would not know how to do something as
    simple as install more RAM inside a computer.
    I am sure some medical professionals would be the same way.
    CLV3, Sep 7, 2004
    #8
  9. "Tom MacIntyre" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
    > area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
    > came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's,

    TV's,
    > converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
    > skill and intellect?
    >
    > Tom


    more like sloth, indifference, and/or ego (i'm a doctor, i'm too good
    to program my VCR! muhahaha!)
    --
    Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    Solomon Kozanski, Sep 8, 2004
    #9
  10. On Wed, 8 Sep 2004 08:53:47 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
    <> wrote:

    >
    >"Tom MacIntyre" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
    >> area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
    >> came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's,

    >TV's,
    >> converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
    >> skill and intellect?
    >>
    >> Tom

    >
    >more like sloth, indifference, and/or ego (i'm a doctor, i'm too good
    >to program my VCR! muhahaha!)


    Not the case here.

    Tom
    Tom MacIntyre, Sep 8, 2004
    #10
  11. Ben

    merlin8 Guest

    No. Cooking and Law are two different subjects. Unless you talking about
    cooking the law books.

    On 06 Sep 2004 17:42:32 GMT, Developwebsites
    <> wrote:

    >> probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
    >> grads are morons (especially public school grads)

    >
    >
    > so how do public colleges such as those in CUNY compare to private ones
    > such as
    > NYU, Harvard, MIT, Pace, Columbia, Yale, etc.?
    > could I have a BS/BA in cooking from Hunter college with a 3.99gpa and
    > claim
    > its the same as a BA in law from Harvard?
    >




    --
    Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
    merlin8, Sep 15, 2004
    #11
  12. Ben

    merlin8 Guest

    must not been a smart doctor to not know that most vcrs have a menu button
    to allow you to get to time/date and schedule menus. Okay, I can
    understand if say he had used equiptment and no remote anymore and wanted
    someone else to handle it? but still, if thats the case wy not just get a
    uni remote or use the old
    ones as vhs copy machines only? who cares about the time and date anyways?
    its is just an invention of the suits to control you.

    On Tue, 07 Sep 2004 20:06:04 GMT, Tom MacIntyre
    <> wrote:

    > On Tue, 7 Sep 2004 09:14:21 -0400, "Solomon Kozanski"
    > <> wrote:
    >
    >>
    >> "Barry Watzman" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> The same? No. But BETTER, if the job opening was for an executive

    >> chef.
    >>>
    >>> The best doctor in the world can't write a legal brief, and the best
    >>> attorney can't do surgery. And neither could configure a LAN from
    >>> scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients.

    >>
    >> the best doctor and the best attorney in the world can certainly LEARN
    >> to write legal briefs, practice surgery AND configure a LAN from
    >> scratch with 4 servers and 150 clients (btw, surgery and law require
    >> WAY MORE skill/intellect than tinkering with transistors)

    >
    > I don't know if he's a surgeon, but a few years back a doctor in my
    > area called the electronics repair shop where I worked every time he
    > came back home from vacation. The reason...he needed his VCR's, TV's,
    > converters, etc. reprogrammed. Instead of way more, maybe different
    > skill and intellect?
    >
    > Tom




    --
    Using Opera's revolutionary e-mail client: http://www.opera.com/m2/
    merlin8, Sep 15, 2004
    #12
  13. On Wed, 15 Sep 2004 09:45:57 -0800, merlin8 <>
    wrote:

    >must not been a smart doctor to not know that most vcrs have a menu button
    >to allow you to get to time/date and schedule menus. Okay, I can
    >understand if say he had used equiptment and no remote anymore and wanted
    >someone else to handle it? but still, if thats the case wy not just get a
    >uni remote or use the old
    >ones as vhs copy machines only? who cares about the time and date anyways?
    >its is just an invention of the suits to control you.


    He wasn't technically inclined.

    Tom
    Tom MacIntyre, Sep 15, 2004
    #13
  14. Ben

    G W Guest

    depends on what job your looking for! if you are working in IT get the
    certs, if you want to be the suit in the IT dept get the degree with the
    cert.
    GW
    MCSE-Security 2000 & 2003 A+ Net+ Security+


    "Solomon Kozanski" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > "Michael" <> wrote in message
    > news:839Uc.1618$...
    >> Ben wrote:
    >>
    >> > I want to know if it is better to take a college/university degree

    > or get
    >> > certified for A+ N+ and MCSA.
    >> > Or is it best to get both.
    >> > What do employers look for?
    >> >
    >> > Does Mike Meyers still hang out here.

    >>
    >> Do whichever you like. I will say the certs are absolutely

    > worthless
    >> outside of IT. The college degree carries more weight in other

    > fields.
    >>
    >> michael

    >
    > indeed. there are many jobs out there where they say "bachelor's
    > degree required", and what that means is you could have a BS/A in
    > diddlysquat, but just because you have a piece of paper, you get the
    > job. probably has something to do with companies realizing that HS
    > grads are morons (especially public school grads) and that one is
    > actually forced to use his head in college. doesnt matter what you
    > have a degree *in* as long as you *have* a degree.
    >
    > not to mention, you wont be banging sorority sisters at keggers at the
    > sylvan learning center
    > --
    > Brought to you courtesy of Kozanski's Morgue & Grill
    >
    G W, Oct 30, 2004
    #14
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