D Brash goes for a free trade agreement with the US

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by thing2, Sep 16, 2005.

  1. thing2

    thing2 Guest

    So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    ships....

    Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    companies, fast enough......?

    regards

    Thing
     
    thing2, Sep 16, 2005
    #1
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  2. "thing2" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    > from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    > ships....
    >
    > Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    > companies, fast enough......?
    >
    > regards
    >
    > Thing
    >


    Nuke powered ships are great.

    Dunno about those ip laws.
     
    news.xtra.co.nz, Sep 16, 2005
    #2
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  3. thing2

    Richard Guest

    Daniel wrote:
    > thing2 wrote:
    >
    >> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP
    >> laws from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear
    >> powered ships....
    >>

    > If it means newegg and zipzoomfly will ship direct to NZ then he's got
    > my vote :p


    Dont forget tigerdirect
     
    Richard, Sep 16, 2005
    #3
  4. thing2

    Daniel Guest

    thing2 wrote:
    > So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    > from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    > ships....
    >

    If it means newegg and zipzoomfly will ship direct to NZ then he's got
    my vote :p
     
    Daniel, Sep 16, 2005
    #4
  5. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:44:00 +1200, "news.xtra.co.nz" <>
    wrote:

    >"thing2" <> wrote in message
    >news:...
    >> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >> ships....
    >>
    >> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >> companies, fast enough......?
    >>
    >> regards
    >>
    >> Thing
    >>

    >
    >Nuke powered ships are great.
    >
    >Dunno about those ip laws.
    >




    Some one forgot to tell you he might put up GST to pay for his promised Tax
    cuts..

    This Man can not be trusted..

    ..
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #5
  6. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:54:03 +1200, Daniel <> wrote:

    >thing2 wrote:
    >> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >> ships....
    >>

    >If it means newegg and zipzoomfly will ship direct to NZ then he's got
    >my vote :p




    What a Stupid twat you are, seems to me you are just a teenager with a comment
    like that..

    So you want the US to run this country..
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #6
  7. thing2

    TomV Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:36:49 +1200, thing2 <>
    wrote:

    >So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >ships....
    >
    >Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >companies, fast enough......?


    Personally I've been pretty happy Aus dived in before us. I'm far from
    convinced the gains of a pseudo FTA with the US outweigh the losses.
    I'm quite happy to see how it pans out for Aus

    ....tom
     
    TomV, Sep 16, 2005
    #7
  8. thing2

    SNOman Guest

    thing2 wrote:
    > So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    > from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    > ships....
    >
    > Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    > companies, fast enough......?
    >
    > regards
    >
    > Thing
    >

    What utter crap!

    If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    holding referendum to get the publics opinion.
     
    SNOman, Sep 16, 2005
    #8
  9. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 14:31:46 +1200, SNOman <> wrote:

    >thing2 wrote:
    >> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >> ships....
    >>
    >> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >> companies, fast enough......?
    >>
    >> regards
    >>
    >> Thing
    >>

    >What utter crap!
    >
    >If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    >let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    >to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    >Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    >holding referendum to get the publics opinion.




    But do you know what is Best..?


    I don't think so..
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #9
  10. thing2

    thing2 Guest

    SNOman wrote:
    > thing2 wrote:
    >
    >> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP
    >> laws from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear
    >> powered ships....
    >>
    >> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >> companies, fast enough......?
    >>
    >> regards
    >>
    >> Thing
    >>

    > What utter crap!
    >
    > If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    > let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    > to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    > Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    > holding referendum to get the publics opinion.


    I never said he would not hold a referendum, what I did say was that
    like OZ we could find that we end up accepting US IP laws as part of the
    "free trade" agreement, and as OZ companies seem to be, homegrown NZ IT
    companies could suffer. So Apple growers or lamb exporters may win his
    ear more than IT companies and may loose out.

    regards

    Thing
     
    thing2, Sep 16, 2005
    #10
  11. thing2

    Mutlley Guest

    XP <> wrote:

    >On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 14:31:46 +1200, SNOman <> wrote:
    >
    >>thing2 wrote:
    >>> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >>> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >>> ships....
    >>>
    >>> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >>> companies, fast enough......?
    >>>
    >>> regards
    >>>
    >>> Thing
    >>>

    >>What utter crap!
    >>
    >>If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    >>let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    >>to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    >>Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    >>holding referendum to get the publics opinion.

    >
    >
    >
    >But do you know what is Best..?
    >
    >
    >I don't think so..
    >

    I think I do . I would rather decide than nanny state which is what
    has happened over the past 6 years..
     
    Mutlley, Sep 16, 2005
    #11
  12. thing2

    Joy Guest

    "XP" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:44:00 +1200, "news.xtra.co.nz"
    > <>
    > wrote:
    >
    >>"thing2" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >>> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >>> ships....
    >>>
    >>> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >>> companies, fast enough......?
    >>>
    >>> regards
    >>>
    >>> Thing
    >>>

    >>
    >>Nuke powered ships are great.
    >>
    >>Dunno about those ip laws.
    >>

    >
    >
    >
    > Some one forgot to tell you he might put up GST to pay for his promised
    > Tax
    > cuts..
    >
    > This Man can not be trusted..


    I don't think we can trust any of them. Helen lied on numerours occasions
    and besides that Labour has squeezed our personal freedoms while at the same
    time liberating the sexual degenerates of our society.
    Joy
     
    Joy, Sep 16, 2005
    #12
  13. In article <>,
    says...
    >
    > Personally I've been pretty happy Aus dived in before us. I'm far from
    > convinced the gains of a pseudo FTA with the US outweigh the losses.
    > I'm quite happy to see how it pans out for Aus
    >
    > ...tom


    Typically a Free Trade Agreement with the US means this: The US has the
    right to dump all their crap (and good stuff) on the other country. The
    other country, unfortunately, will still face quotas and tarrifs since
    there is no way the US government will be prepared to not protect the US
    workers and farmers. Go ask the Canadians and the Mexicans if you don't
    believe me.
    Any politician who tries to sell me anything else, is not votable for
    i.m.o. since (s)he is obviously a naive git. This is not even a question
    of faith (like a lot of 'economic models', but something that can easily
    be checked against facts. (Oh, damn, I've used the 'f' word. I'll be
    starting to tell people to go back to their playstation next).

    -Peter

    --
    =========================================
    firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
     
    Peter Huebner, Sep 16, 2005
    #13
  14. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 15:34:34 +1200, thing2 <> wrote:

    >SNOman wrote:
    >> thing2 wrote:
    >>
    >>> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP
    >>> laws from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear
    >>> powered ships....
    >>>
    >>> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >>> companies, fast enough......?
    >>>
    >>> regards
    >>>
    >>> Thing
    >>>

    >> What utter crap!
    >>
    >> If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    >> let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    >> to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    >> Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    >> holding referendum to get the publics opinion.

    >
    >I never said he would not hold a referendum, what I did say was that
    >like OZ we could find that we end up accepting US IP laws as part of the
    >"free trade" agreement, and as OZ companies seem to be, homegrown NZ IT
    >companies could suffer. So Apple growers or lamb exporters may win his
    >ear more than IT companies and may loose out.
    >
    >regards
    >
    >Thing
    >
    >
    >




    And no more Gray Imports and US copyright laws, it goes on & on..
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #14
  15. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 17:14:22 +1200, Peter Huebner <> wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >>
    >> Personally I've been pretty happy Aus dived in before us. I'm far from
    >> convinced the gains of a pseudo FTA with the US outweigh the losses.
    >> I'm quite happy to see how it pans out for Aus
    >>
    >> ...tom

    >
    >Typically a Free Trade Agreement with the US means this: The US has the
    >right to dump all their crap (and good stuff) on the other country. The
    >other country, unfortunately, will still face quotas and tarrifs since
    >there is no way the US government will be prepared to not protect the US
    >workers and farmers. Go ask the Canadians and the Mexicans if you don't
    >believe me.
    >Any politician who tries to sell me anything else, is not votable for
    >i.m.o. since (s)he is obviously a naive git. This is not even a question
    >of faith (like a lot of 'economic models', but something that can easily
    >be checked against facts. (Oh, damn, I've used the 'f' word. I'll be
    >starting to tell people to go back to their playstation next).




    No the PSP is taking over


    >-Peter
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #15
  16. thing2

    XP Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 16:10:55 +1200, Mutlley <> wrote:

    >XP <> wrote:
    >
    >>On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 14:31:46 +1200, SNOman <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>thing2 wrote:
    >>>> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >>>> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >>>> ships....
    >>>>
    >>>> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >>>> companies, fast enough......?
    >>>>
    >>>> regards
    >>>>
    >>>> Thing
    >>>>
    >>>What utter crap!
    >>>
    >>>If it 'ever' (and I mean ever) got to that then he said that he would
    >>>let the NZ public decide by holding a referendum and thereby listening
    >>>to the NZ public (which Clark has never done on any other referendum).
    >>>Clarks position is that she knows best and is not even prepared to
    >>>holding referendum to get the publics opinion.

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >>But do you know what is Best..?
    >>
    >>
    >>I don't think so..
    >>

    >I think I do . I would rather decide than nanny state which is what
    >has happened over the past 6 years..




    I don't thing you do, as you don't understand all the consequences of what
    will happen, plus you will never be told that, as National will cover that
    up..
     
    XP, Sep 16, 2005
    #16
  17. T'was the Fri, 16 Sep 2005 17:13:48 +1200 when I remembered "Joy"
    <> saying something like this:

    >I don't think we can trust any of them. Helen lied on numerours occasions
    >and besides that Labour has squeezed our personal freedoms while at the same
    >time liberating the sexual degenerates of our society.


    I believe those kind of bills are conscience votes.
    --
    Cheers,

    Waylon Kenning.
     
    Waylon Kenning, Sep 16, 2005
    #17
  18. thing2

    TomV Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 17:13:48 +1200, "Joy" <> wrote:

    >
    >I don't think we can trust any of them. Helen lied on numerours occasions
    >and besides that Labour has squeezed our personal freedoms while at the same
    >time liberating the sexual degenerates of our society.


    I'm not quite sure what specific personal freedoms you've lost, but
    the liberating sexual degenerates line reminded of an excellent
    comment about last years US election, that has become scarily
    appropriate to some of the debate in NZ about this election

    http://philosoraptor.blogspot.com/2004_09_01_philosoraptor_archive.html#109459717903683060

    or

    http://tinyurl.com/7cw5e

    I particularly like

    "It’s never been clear to me how sensible conservatives can get along
    with the neo-puritans on the religious right. And it’s never been
    clear to me what weird, perverse views about sex motivate the
    religious right’s stark, raving phobia of it."

    ....tom

    (followups set to nz.politics)
     
    TomV, Sep 16, 2005
    #18
  19. thing2

    GraB Guest

    On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 12:37:33 +1200, XP
    <> wrote:

    >On Fri, 16 Sep 2005 11:44:00 +1200, "news.xtra.co.nz" <>
    >wrote:
    >
    >>"thing2" <> wrote in message
    >>news:...
    >>> So, a vote for National could well mean we end up accepting the IP laws
    >>> from the USA, how stupid can he get.....not to mention nuclear powered
    >>> ships....
    >>>
    >>> Can you say small NZ companies screwed over real fast by bloated US
    >>> companies, fast enough......?
    >>>
    >>> regards
    >>>
    >>> Thing
    >>>

    >>
    >>Nuke powered ships are great.
    >>
    >>Dunno about those ip laws.
    >>

    >
    >
    >
    >Some one forgot to tell you he might put up GST to pay for his promised Tax
    >cuts..
    >
    >This Man can not be trusted..
    >

    There is no free lunch. Tax cuts mean you will pay somewhere else.
     
    GraB, Sep 16, 2005
    #19
  20. thing2

    Tim Guest

    What you say that seems fairly accurate. There is a heck of a lot more wrong
    with it than that of course.

    While I would prefer DB to HC, these are the big flaws in National's
    sometimes brain dead policies. Economically, I have little doubt that NZ
    would boom under DB - so long as these other policies don't get anywhere. So
    many say that economic good precludes social good. You can't pay for
    hospitals, police etc. without tax = profits.

    NZ has succeeded in the last few years only because HC & Michael Cullen have
    refrained from doing anything tooo stupid. They have done some stupid things
    (EG MC having anything to do with fiscal policy, tax etc), nanny state,
    completely failing to have a viable forward plan on energy policies (lucky I
    have a UPS), not restraining the extreme green policies (a little green is
    OK, but you don't get a Green party formed by moderates - they are
    extremists). Labour laws are diabolical. There are so many business held
    back by bad employees that won't move and can't be pushed that it is holding
    up business and social good. Recently I experienced a very large
    organisation that is riddled with about 10% ineptitude - the rest of the
    staff just have to be good team players and suck on it - they are good. The
    impact is devastating in this case.

    I would prefer the risk and vote National than the risks that Labour has -
    way too much nanny state. Another labour government will be almost an
    endorsement / authorisation for extreme labour policies - that's really
    dangerous.

    If National looked like it was going to implement anything daft (EG FTA
    without the US first dropping *all* its own protectionism and equalising
    things first), then I will be first to chain myself across parliaments
    doors.

    US trade policy is like Bush's polarising 'You are either for us or against
    us' policies - dividing the world into Pro-US and everyone else that likes
    freedom above subjugation (including Cuba). These poicies are being
    propagated by large US companies....



    "Peter Huebner" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <>,
    > says...
    >>
    >> Personally I've been pretty happy Aus dived in before us. I'm far from
    >> convinced the gains of a pseudo FTA with the US outweigh the losses.
    >> I'm quite happy to see how it pans out for Aus
    >>
    >> ...tom

    >
    > Typically a Free Trade Agreement with the US means this: The US has the
    > right to dump all their crap (and good stuff) on the other country. The
    > other country, unfortunately, will still face quotas and tarrifs since
    > there is no way the US government will be prepared to not protect the US
    > workers and farmers. Go ask the Canadians and the Mexicans if you don't
    > believe me.
    > Any politician who tries to sell me anything else, is not votable for
    > i.m.o. since (s)he is obviously a naive git. This is not even a question
    > of faith (like a lot of 'economic models', but something that can easily
    > be checked against facts. (Oh, damn, I've used the 'f' word. I'll be
    > starting to tell people to go back to their playstation next).
    >
    > -Peter
    >
    > --
    > =========================================
    > firstname dot lastname at gmail fullstop com
     
    Tim, Sep 16, 2005
    #20
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