Cost Per 4x6 for Epson Stylus Photo 825

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Larry R Harrison Jr, Dec 28, 2003.

  1. I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper type
    was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6 paper
    costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s, instead
    I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..

    According to what I've read I read it costs about $1 per 8x10. An 8x10 is 80
    square inches(8x10); a 4x6 is 24 square inches. Divide 80/24 that equals a
    factor of 3.333. So either (a) a 4x6 should cost 1/3.333 as much as an 8x10
    (and $1 / 3.3333 equals 30c per 4x6) or (b) you should get 3.3 times as many
    4x6s from a certain amount spent as you'd get 8x10s for the same amount
    spent.

    Instead, this has happened. I blew through 1 color cartridge; I have no idea
    how much black has been used, although I get the impression that black way
    outlasts color when printing photos. Regardless, I'm not even counting the
    black.

    Anyway, the 100 sheets of 4x6 paper was $16.95. I used 55 of them, which
    works outto $9.32. I used all of the ink which was $18.50. So therefore I
    spent $27.82 for 55 photographs, which works out to 50c for every 4x6.

    I guess that isn't terribly shocking in a way given that Kodak Picture Maker
    kiosk prints are that much. But I guess given that an 8x10 supposedly runs
    $1, for a 4x6 to run 50c doesn't compute to me. I don't know.

    Tips? Maybe the Stylus Photo 825 comes with a partial tank of ink ad not a
    full one (although the guy on the phone says it's a full one.)
    LRH
     
    Larry R Harrison Jr, Dec 28, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Larry R Harrison Jr

    steve Guest

    I don't have experience with that particular printer Larry, but it seems
    to me that the amount of ink used would vary dramatically depending on
    each shot -- I guess the cost per print may be a little like the mileage
    sticker on a new car: a general data point but noting we will ever
    achieve unless the car is in 'free fall' :)

    I have yet to empty the tanks on my canon i9100. At least it has 6
    different replaceable tanks. I printed two 13"x19" shots so far and the
    tank level indicator built into the driver does not yet reflect a
    decrease in the tank levels. I suspect this has more to do with the ink
    level resolution being too coarse to see the shift.


    steve



    Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:

    > I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper type
    > was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    > that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    > this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6 paper
    > costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s, instead
    > I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..
    >
    > According to what I've read I read it costs about $1 per 8x10. An 8x10 is 80
    > square inches(8x10); a 4x6 is 24 square inches. Divide 80/24 that equals a
    > factor of 3.333. So either (a) a 4x6 should cost 1/3.333 as much as an 8x10
    > (and $1 / 3.3333 equals 30c per 4x6) or (b) you should get 3.3 times as many
    > 4x6s from a certain amount spent as you'd get 8x10s for the same amount
    > spent.
    >
    > Instead, this has happened. I blew through 1 color cartridge; I have no idea
    > how much black has been used, although I get the impression that black way
    > outlasts color when printing photos. Regardless, I'm not even counting the
    > black.
    >
    > Anyway, the 100 sheets of 4x6 paper was $16.95. I used 55 of them, which
    > works outto $9.32. I used all of the ink which was $18.50. So therefore I
    > spent $27.82 for 55 photographs, which works out to 50c for every 4x6.
    >
    > I guess that isn't terribly shocking in a way given that Kodak Picture Maker
    > kiosk prints are that much. But I guess given that an 8x10 supposedly runs
    > $1, for a 4x6 to run 50c doesn't compute to me. I don't know.
    >
    > Tips? Maybe the Stylus Photo 825 comes with a partial tank of ink ad not a
    > full one (although the guy on the phone says it's a full one.)
    > LRH
    >
    >
     
    steve, Dec 28, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. I have a 785EPX and here is my experience...and solution
    I love the output it makes, the pics are great.
    if it sits a week unused the ink dries and and i have to clena the
    print heads to get anything out. my last 3 inkjets were not this way.

    i have heard that replacement cartridges ALWAYS have more ink than the
    ones included with a printer, so your replacement ones may last
    longer.

    the Epson rep proced to me (well, he is an EPSON rep...) that the
    Epson printers are cheaper per page/print thatn other color printers.

    for regular printing, my 785EPX costs about 6.6 cents a page. my
    ancient laserjet 4p (black only) is a paltry 1.3 cents a page. Umm,
    the Epson sits uused a good bit now....

    I bought replacement ink at Carrot Ink (online - search for them if
    you wish). Their ink DOES NOT dry out. Now i have done no picture with
    it, so i can not say how it compares for quality or how ling it will
    print/last. It is cheaper and does not dry out. I bought 2 color and 1
    laser artrige and they threw in a black ink cartridge. got it ALL for
    $20 LESS than the laser toner cartrdige at staples!

    So what do i do for prints? Walmart. a 4x6 is 24 cents. 5x7 is 96
    cents. 8x10 is $2.86. you can of course in your photoediting software
    put mullitpl pics into one '8x10 picture'. They offer 1 hour service,
    or you can upload at the website and pick em up later. I hear Sams
    club is 19 cents. I put the pics on a CD_RW. it was self service at a
    kiosk, no waiting.

    chris

    PS i have some extra Epson photo paper...



    On Sat, 27 Dec 2003 23:53:35 -0700, "Larry R Harrison Jr"
    <> wrote:

    >I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper type
    >was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    >that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    >this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6 paper
    >costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s, instead
    >I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..
    >
    >According to what I've read I read it costs about $1 per 8x10. An 8x10 is 80
    >square inches(8x10); a 4x6 is 24 square inches. Divide 80/24 that equals a
    >factor of 3.333. So either (a) a 4x6 should cost 1/3.333 as much as an 8x10
    >(and $1 / 3.3333 equals 30c per 4x6) or (b) you should get 3.3 times as many
    >4x6s from a certain amount spent as you'd get 8x10s for the same amount
    >spent.
    >
    >Instead, this has happened. I blew through 1 color cartridge; I have no idea
    >how much black has been used, although I get the impression that black way
    >outlasts color when printing photos. Regardless, I'm not even counting the
    >black.
    >
    >Anyway, the 100 sheets of 4x6 paper was $16.95. I used 55 of them, which
    >works outto $9.32. I used all of the ink which was $18.50. So therefore I
    >spent $27.82 for 55 photographs, which works out to 50c for every 4x6.
    >
    >I guess that isn't terribly shocking in a way given that Kodak Picture Maker
    >kiosk prints are that much. But I guess given that an 8x10 supposedly runs
    >$1, for a 4x6 to run 50c doesn't compute to me. I don't know.
    >
    >Tips? Maybe the Stylus Photo 825 comes with a partial tank of ink ad not a
    >full one (although the guy on the phone says it's a full one.)
    >LRH
    >
     
    Chris P in PA, Dec 28, 2003
    #3
  4. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Ken Weitzel Guest

    Hi...

    steve wrote:
    > I don't have experience with that particular printer Larry, but it seems
    > to me that the amount of ink used would vary dramatically depending on
    > each shot -- I guess the cost per print may be a little like the mileage
    > sticker on a new car: a general data point but noting we will ever
    > achieve unless the car is in 'free fall' :)
    >
    > I have yet to empty the tanks on my canon i9100. At least it has 6
    > different replaceable tanks. I printed two 13"x19" shots so far and the
    > tank level indicator built into the driver does not yet reflect a
    > decrease in the tank levels. I suspect this has more to do with the ink
    > level resolution being too coarse to see the shift.
    >
    >
    > steve
    >
    >
    >
    > Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:
    >
    >> I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper
    >> type
    >> was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    >> that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    >> this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6
    >> paper
    >> costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s,
    >> instead
    >> I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..
    >>
    >> According to what I've read I read it costs about $1 per 8x10. An 8x10
    >> is 80
    >> square inches(8x10); a 4x6 is 24 square inches. Divide 80/24 that
    >> equals a
    >> factor of 3.333. So either (a) a 4x6 should cost 1/3.333 as much as an
    >> 8x10
    >> (and $1 / 3.3333 equals 30c per 4x6) or (b) you should get 3.3 times
    >> as many
    >> 4x6s from a certain amount spent as you'd get 8x10s for the same amount
    >> spent.
    >>
    >> Instead, this has happened. I blew through 1 color cartridge; I have
    >> no idea
    >> how much black has been used, although I get the impression that black
    >> way
    >> outlasts color when printing photos. Regardless, I'm not even counting
    >> the
    >> black.
    >>
    >> Anyway, the 100 sheets of 4x6 paper was $16.95. I used 55 of them, which
    >> works outto $9.32. I used all of the ink which was $18.50. So therefore I
    >> spent $27.82 for 55 photographs, which works out to 50c for every 4x6.
    >>
    >> I guess that isn't terribly shocking in a way given that Kodak Picture
    >> Maker
    >> kiosk prints are that much. But I guess given that an 8x10 supposedly
    >> runs
    >> $1, for a 4x6 to run 50c doesn't compute to me. I don't know.
    >>
    >> Tips? Maybe the Stylus Photo 825 comes with a partial tank of ink ad
    >> not a
    >> full one (although the guy on the phone says it's a full one.)
    >> LRH
    >>


    I don't know that particular printer either, but if it has
    only one combined color ink cartridge as mine does, then
    printing a series of pictures with one predominant color
    in each of them will deplete all of that color, and report
    the cartridge empty. I imagine that the manufacturer
    guestimates that they'll all be used up equally.

    My grand daughter printed tons of the same pictures
    for her girl guide group. A virtual sea of blue dresses,
    blue flags, blue water, blue everything. Cyan disappeared
    really, really quickly! :)

    Take care.

    Ken
     
    Ken Weitzel, Dec 28, 2003
    #4
  5. tell her to join the Rainbow girls LOL

    Yep, using up all of one color will 'kill' the complete cartridge.
    unfortunately, todays printers are the new age equivalent of the
    schick safety razor - give away the razor and make a fortune on the
    blades.

    My last printer was a Zerox, and they were going for $25 to $50 a
    piece at one point, and the ink refills ran $8 / color (4 colors, each
    seperate). Had a similar experience with my first color inkjet, a
    simplistic canon BJ1000. Saw them for $25 at one point, and hte
    refills were abot that...tough decision what to buy!

    chris

    On Sun, 28 Dec 2003 07:28:43 GMT, Ken Weitzel <>
    wrote:

    >Hi...
    >
    >steve wrote:
    >> I don't have experience with that particular printer Larry, but it seems
    >> to me that the amount of ink used would vary dramatically depending on
    >> each shot -- I guess the cost per print may be a little like the mileage
    >> sticker on a new car: a general data point but noting we will ever
    >> achieve unless the car is in 'free fall' :)
    >>
    >> I have yet to empty the tanks on my canon i9100. At least it has 6
    >> different replaceable tanks. I printed two 13"x19" shots so far and the
    >> tank level indicator built into the driver does not yet reflect a
    >> decrease in the tank levels. I suspect this has more to do with the ink
    >> level resolution being too coarse to see the shift.
    >>
    >>
    >> steve
    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:
    >>
    >>> I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper
    >>> type
    >>> was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    >>> that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    >>> this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6
    >>> paper
    >>> costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s,
    >>> instead
    >>> I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..
    >>>
    >>> According to what I've read I read it costs about $1 per 8x10. An 8x10
    >>> is 80
    >>> square inches(8x10); a 4x6 is 24 square inches. Divide 80/24 that
    >>> equals a
    >>> factor of 3.333. So either (a) a 4x6 should cost 1/3.333 as much as an
    >>> 8x10
    >>> (and $1 / 3.3333 equals 30c per 4x6) or (b) you should get 3.3 times
    >>> as many
    >>> 4x6s from a certain amount spent as you'd get 8x10s for the same amount
    >>> spent.
    >>>
    >>> Instead, this has happened. I blew through 1 color cartridge; I have
    >>> no idea
    >>> how much black has been used, although I get the impression that black
    >>> way
    >>> outlasts color when printing photos. Regardless, I'm not even counting
    >>> the
    >>> black.
    >>>
    >>> Anyway, the 100 sheets of 4x6 paper was $16.95. I used 55 of them, which
    >>> works outto $9.32. I used all of the ink which was $18.50. So therefore I
    >>> spent $27.82 for 55 photographs, which works out to 50c for every 4x6.
    >>>
    >>> I guess that isn't terribly shocking in a way given that Kodak Picture
    >>> Maker
    >>> kiosk prints are that much. But I guess given that an 8x10 supposedly
    >>> runs
    >>> $1, for a 4x6 to run 50c doesn't compute to me. I don't know.
    >>>
    >>> Tips? Maybe the Stylus Photo 825 comes with a partial tank of ink ad
    >>> not a
    >>> full one (although the guy on the phone says it's a full one.)
    >>> LRH
    >>>

    >
    >I don't know that particular printer either, but if it has
    >only one combined color ink cartridge as mine does, then
    >printing a series of pictures with one predominant color
    >in each of them will deplete all of that color, and report
    >the cartridge empty. I imagine that the manufacturer
    >guestimates that they'll all be used up equally.
    >
    >My grand daughter printed tons of the same pictures
    >for her girl guide group. A virtual sea of blue dresses,
    >blue flags, blue water, blue everything. Cyan disappeared
    >really, really quickly! :)
    >
    >Take care.
    >
    >Ken
    >
    >
     
    Chris P in PA, Dec 28, 2003
    #5
  6. On 2003-12-28, Larry R Harrison Jr <> wrote:
    > I have purchased an Epson 825. After about 55 photos of 4x6 (the paper type
    > was premium glossy), the color apparently has already run out. I've read
    > that this model costs about $1 per 8x10 page. To me that would seem that
    > this model, with the cartridge costing about $19 and 100 sheets of 4x6 paper
    > costing $16, that would mean I should get about 30c for every 4x6s, instead
    > I'm getting like 50c for every 4x6..

    ....
    The short story is: The cheaper the printer, the more expensive
    the prints.

    I have a Canon S600, which has 4 ink tanks. It is good for printing
    a few images once in a while, but I found images out in the air
    will bleach a lot in a year, but will last well inside plastic.

    For durable and cheaper pictures, I use only printing. The
    price here in Denmark is now up to around $0.15 for 10x15cm
    (approx your 4x6). And you can't make it for that price yourself.

    Twice the size (6x8) is way more expensive, typical around 8 times
    the price, because the market will pay it. So it is only 6x8
    or full A4 (8x10) I print mysellf.
     
    Povl H. Pedersen, Dec 28, 2003
    #6
  7. I'll agree with you there, Wal Mart/Sams is the way to go plus you get
    the Fuji Crystal Archive prints. I use a D-100 and have tried 8 X 10's
    at different resolutions of jpeg and you can't beat that good 'ol Fuji
    quality.

    >
    >So what do i do for prints? Walmart. a 4x6 is 24 cents. 5x7 is 96
    >cents. 8x10 is $2.86. you can of course in your photoediting software
    >put mullitpl pics into one '8x10 picture'. They offer 1 hour service,
    >or you can upload at the website and pick em up later. I hear Sams
    >club is 19 cents. I put the pics on a CD_RW. it was self service at a
    >kiosk, no waiting.
    >
    >chris
     
    Seymour Butts, Dec 29, 2003
    #7
  8. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Larry Lynch Guest

    In article <>,
    says...
    > >
    > >So what do i do for prints? Walmart. a 4x6 is 24 cents. 5x7 is 96
    > >cents. 8x10 is $2.86. you can of course in your photoediting software
    > >put mullitpl pics into one '8x10 picture'. They offer 1 hour service,
    > >or you can upload at the website and pick em up later. I hear Sams
    > >club is 19 cents. I put the pics on a CD_RW. it was self service at a
    > >kiosk, no waiting.
    > >
    > >chris

    >


    I haven't tripped over the original post, but it seems
    this is a good place to pick up the thread.

    I have an Epson Stylus 825 (as well as a Stylus 785 EPX)
    and they BOTH do an excellent job --- BUT ---- the ONLY
    advantage you get from printing at home is the instant
    gratification of seeing the picture within a minute.

    Even if you re-fill the carts with the best ink
    available, re-set the chips with a re-setter, and buy
    your paper in LARGE quantities to save money, you are
    NOT going to consistantly get GOOD prints at a lower
    price than a place like "Sams Club" or "Wal-Mart" photo
    service.

    You WILL get the "instant gratification" and it is fun,
    but for more than a couple of photos at a time, you cant
    save money. Especially since the prints wont last NEAR
    as long as real photo-prints.

    There are Photo Printers available (from Epson) that use
    "archive" inks, and "Archive" quality paper, but the use
    of those to do your own printing is only justified if
    you are selling the prints, or you have some justifiable
    reason to pay at a rate that is 6 to 10 times higher
    than what it costs to run your 825.




    --
    Larry Lynch
    Lasting Imagery
    Mystic, Ct.
     
    Larry Lynch, Dec 29, 2003
    #8
  9. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Steve James Guest

    I'm not familiar with this particular printer, but my Epson Photo 750
    uses some ink to clear the jets every time you turn it on. If that is
    the case with your printer, ink use could depend a lot on whether you
    print one (or a few pictures) at a time, or print them in larger
    batches.

    While it is nice to have the convenience of printing at home, the online
    print services like PhotoAccess or Shutterfly offer high quality long
    life prints on Fuji Crystal Archive paper. PhotoAccess is $.29 for a
    4x6, probably cheaper than what you will pay in ink and paper costs for
    most ink jet printers. And you get a real photographic type print, not
    one that will fade quickly over time. You do have to pay shipping but
    it doesn't add much provided you batch your orders. Another thing I
    like about PhotoAccess is that in addition to the "standard" size photo
    prints, they also offer 4/3 aspect ratio prints in a variety of sizes.
    This is great if you don't want to crop you photo, or want to crop it in
    the 4/3 ratio.

    --
    To email me use: sjusenet AT comcast DOT net
     
    Steve James, Dec 29, 2003
    #9
  10. >You WILL get the "instant gratification" and it is fun,
    >but for more than a couple of photos at a time, you cant
    >save money. Especially since the prints wont last NEAR
    >as long as real photo-prints.


    i agree about instant gratification. I still use it for that at times.

    However, to believe what epson says, their ink and paper combo will
    outlast a 'real' print. Using their archival inks it will outlast and
    then some (factor of 3 or something).

    chris

    On Mon, 29 Dec 2003 09:30:29 -0500, Larry Lynch
    <> wrote:

    >In article <>,
    > says...
    >> >
    >> >So what do i do for prints? Walmart. a 4x6 is 24 cents. 5x7 is 96
    >> >cents. 8x10 is $2.86. you can of course in your photoediting software
    >> >put mullitpl pics into one '8x10 picture'. They offer 1 hour service,
    >> >or you can upload at the website and pick em up later. I hear Sams
    >> >club is 19 cents. I put the pics on a CD_RW. it was self service at a
    >> >kiosk, no waiting.
    >> >
    >> >chris

    >>

    >
    >I haven't tripped over the original post, but it seems
    >this is a good place to pick up the thread.
    >
    >I have an Epson Stylus 825 (as well as a Stylus 785 EPX)
    >and they BOTH do an excellent job --- BUT ---- the ONLY
    >advantage you get from printing at home is the instant
    >gratification of seeing the picture within a minute.
    >
    >Even if you re-fill the carts with the best ink
    >available, re-set the chips with a re-setter, and buy
    >your paper in LARGE quantities to save money, you are
    >NOT going to consistantly get GOOD prints at a lower
    >price than a place like "Sams Club" or "Wal-Mart" photo
    >service.
    >
    >You WILL get the "instant gratification" and it is fun,
    >but for more than a couple of photos at a time, you cant
    >save money. Especially since the prints wont last NEAR
    >as long as real photo-prints.
    >
    >There are Photo Printers available (from Epson) that use
    >"archive" inks, and "Archive" quality paper, but the use
    >of those to do your own printing is only justified if
    >you are selling the prints, or you have some justifiable
    >reason to pay at a rate that is 6 to 10 times higher
    >than what it costs to run your 825.
     
    Chris P in PA, Dec 29, 2003
    #10
  11. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Larry Lynch Guest

    In article <>,
    cash_for_you@nospam_comcast.net says...
    > However, to believe what epson says, their ink and paper combo will
    > outlast a 'real' print. Using their archival inks it will outlast and
    > then some (factor of 3 or something).
    >
    > chris
    >

    Oh yeah! Their archive ink is something else!!
    Pretty expensive though.

    www.inksupply.com sells their own formula of archive ink
    for Epson printers, and recently have been developing
    archive inks for the 785 EPX and the 825 as well as
    other Epson desktop printers NOT designed by Epson to
    use archive (pigment) inks. (I think the pigment
    particles must be smaller for the printers designed for
    dye based inks).

    They also have archive inks for GLOSSY paper.

    From what I've read, they are finished with the ink
    development and are now working on color management for
    the various printers when using these inks.

    (MIS ASSOCIATES has been selling archive inks for Epson
    since long BEFORE Epson started)
    --
    Larry Lynch
    Lasting Imagery
    Mystic, Ct.
     
    Larry Lynch, Dec 29, 2003
    #11
  12. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Arthur Small Guest

    If all you are printing is 4x6 then get a HiTi dye sub printer. Instant 4x6
    $20.00 for 50 prints.
     
    Arthur Small, Dec 30, 2003
    #12
  13. Larry Lynch <> writes:

    > In article <>,
    > says...
    > > >
    > > >So what do i do for prints? Walmart. a 4x6 is 24 cents. 5x7 is 96
    > > >cents. 8x10 is $2.86. you can of course in your photoediting software
    > > >put mullitpl pics into one '8x10 picture'. They offer 1 hour service,
    > > >or you can upload at the website and pick em up later. I hear Sams
    > > >club is 19 cents. I put the pics on a CD_RW. it was self service at a
    > > >kiosk, no waiting.
    > > >
    > > >chris

    > >

    >
    > I haven't tripped over the original post, but it seems
    > this is a good place to pick up the thread.
    >
    > I have an Epson Stylus 825 (as well as a Stylus 785 EPX)
    > and they BOTH do an excellent job --- BUT ---- the ONLY
    > advantage you get from printing at home is the instant
    > gratification of seeing the picture within a minute.
    >
    > Even if you re-fill the carts with the best ink
    > available, re-set the chips with a re-setter, and buy
    > your paper in LARGE quantities to save money, you are
    > NOT going to consistantly get GOOD prints at a lower
    > price than a place like "Sams Club" or "Wal-Mart" photo
    > service.
    >
    > You WILL get the "instant gratification" and it is fun,
    > but for more than a couple of photos at a time, you cant
    > save money. Especially since the prints wont last NEAR
    > as long as real photo-prints.


    For 4x6's I agree, but the price equation changes once you go to larger prints.
    Walmart charges me $2.84 for an 8x10, and the best online print I've seen is
    ~$2. On my HP deskjet 6122, I figure ink costs me ~$0.55 (I get a little more
    than 100 prints from the extra capacity color ink tanks that go for $55) and
    paper ranges from $.20/page for the double sided brochure paper I used for my
    calendars, to ~ $1/page for some of the premium gloss/satin papers (and more
    for the art papers).

    The calendars brings up another point. Walmart, etc. tend to only print single
    sided, and print tracking information on the back of the paper. If you need
    double sided or want a paper type other than the standard gloss or luster, you
    have to look elsewhere.

    --
    Michael Meissner
    email:
    http://www.the-meissners.org
     
    Michael Meissner, Dec 30, 2003
    #13
    1. Advertising

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