Concert photos

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Cynicor, Mar 12, 2008.

  1. Cynicor

    Cynicor Guest

    Cynicor, Mar 12, 2008
    #1
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  2. Rita Berkowitz, Mar 12, 2008
    #2
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  3. Cynicor

    Cynicor Guest

    Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    > Cynicor wrote:
    >
    >> I gave this another try last week - two bands in Seattle.
    >>
    >> British Sea Power
    >> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4460220_f7tAK/3#262478326
    >>
    >> Colourmusic
    >> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4463775_txiMB#262497207

    >
    > Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows that
    > detract from the moment.


    Neeeeeever! All the pictures without flash are crap. I'd have to either
    bring a MUCH larger lens, or kick the ISO up beyond 3200. I tried a
    30/1.4, but couldn't get close enough for good face shots, even twenty
    feet away. The contrast would completely blow out depending on what part
    of the performer was lit at that moment.
     
    Cynicor, Mar 12, 2008
    #3
  4. Cynicor wrote:

    >>> I gave this another try last week - two bands in Seattle.
    >>>
    >>> British Sea Power
    >>> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4460220_f7tAK/3#262478326
    >>>
    >>> Colourmusic
    >>> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4463775_txiMB#262497207

    >>
    >> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >> that detract from the moment.

    >
    > Neeeeeever! All the pictures without flash are crap. I'd have to
    > either bring a MUCH larger lens, or kick the ISO up beyond 3200. I
    > tried a 30/1.4, but couldn't get close enough for good face shots,
    > even twenty feet away. The contrast would completely blow out
    > depending on what part of the performer was lit at that moment.


    I can understand that, but if you *MUST* use flash you really need to get it
    off the camera, way off. And add the Larry Thong LightBottle or some other
    type of diffuser to soften the light and eliminate those shadows. You're
    goal is to enhance the light of the environment, not replace it. I don't
    know the feasibility for you to set up before the show and use Pocket
    Wizards? If you can, strategically get those flash units up and out of the
    way. While the pictures are good, I just don't get the feeling I'm at a
    concert. As for the ISO 3200 and up, the D300 will add a nice nostalgic
    film like grain to the pics, which will further enhance the aura of being
    there. If it were me shooting that I would definitely use the D300's noise
    to my advantage.





    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Mar 12, 2008
    #4
  5. Cynicor

    Matt Ion Guest

    Cynicor wrote:
    > Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    >> Cynicor wrote:
    >>
    >>> I gave this another try last week - two bands in Seattle.
    >>>
    >>> British Sea Power
    >>> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4460220_f7tAK/3#262478326
    >>>
    >>> Colourmusic
    >>> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4463775_txiMB#262497207

    >>
    >> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows that
    >> detract from the moment.

    >
    > Neeeeeever! All the pictures without flash are crap. I'd have to either
    > bring a MUCH larger lens, or kick the ISO up beyond 3200. I tried a
    > 30/1.4, but couldn't get close enough for good face shots, even twenty
    > feet away. The contrast would completely blow out depending on what part
    > of the performer was lit at that moment.


    Yeah, flash is a necessary evil in a lot of clubs. I find the trick is
    to use one with a tilt/swivel head, so I can angle it away from the
    performers, sometimes with the aid of a reflector card, sometimes with a
    diffuser. I find at least with my 300D and 420EX flash, the E-TTL can
    be fooled by all the darkness on the stage and overexposes the
    performers, so flash exposure compensation is really handy as well
    (typically -1 FEV).

    Check out a few of my live shots, if you're so inclined.
    These are at clubs with very poor lighting:
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/InMemoryOfMikeRicciWithKradleAndWreckinCrew
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/ANTIQUUSWFirstReignEntropia

    These are clubs with much better lighting:
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/MuffgoatEntropia
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/ReEntryScarstruck
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/Threshold07Jan04BuffaloClub

    ....and FOG! FOG is the saviour of concert shots (as long as it's not
    overdone):
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/Severfuse27July2007Cheers
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/Shiftkit27July2007Cheers
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/KJBAgents26July2007Cheers
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/CrystalPistolTheLamplighter
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/SocialDiseaseTheLamplighter
    http://picasaweb.google.com/soundy106/TheSmearsTheLamplighter
     
    Matt Ion, Mar 12, 2008
    #5
  6. Cynicor

    RustY© Guest

    "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I gave this another try last week - two bands in Seattle.
    >

    They look good. My only niggle is that you have cropped them rather tight.
    Pull back a little to show the action.
     
    RustY©, Mar 12, 2008
    #6
  7. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Rita Berkowitz" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Cynicor wrote:
    >
    >> I gave this another try last week - two bands in Seattle.
    >>
    >> British Sea Power
    >> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4460220_f7tAK/3#262478326
    >>
    >> Colourmusic
    >> http://trupin.smugmug.com/gallery/4463775_txiMB#262497207

    >
    > Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows that
    > detract from the moment.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Rita


    Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.

    Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you are in a
    good position...

    Dudley
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 12, 2008
    #7
  8. Dudley Hanks wrote:

    >> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >> that detract from the moment.

    >
    > Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.


    In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he played
    his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would have been
    nice.

    > Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    > are in a good position...


    Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to prearrange
    to get some great shots.




    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Mar 12, 2008
    #8
  9. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Rita Berkowitz" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >
    >>> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >>> that detract from the moment.

    >>
    >> Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.

    >
    > In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he played
    > his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would have been
    > nice.


    It helps to have two bodies hanging around your neck. Then, just grab the
    one with the best lens for the shot, and presto, on to the next shot.

    >
    >> Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    >> are in a good position...

    >
    > Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    > refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to prearrange
    > to get some great shots.
    >
    >
    >

    I found it very effective to chat with the manager / promoter and offer to
    put advertising in local papers. Advertising means increased attendance,
    which in turn means the band can demand more at succeeding performances.
    Add a little cash to band members, and you're pretty much guarrantteed great
    shots and, probably, a backstage pass if one is available.

    >
    > Rita
    >

    Dudley
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #9
  10. Cynicor

    Cynicor Guest

    Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    > Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >
    >>> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >>> that detract from the moment.

    >>
    >> Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.

    >
    > In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he
    > played his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would
    > have been nice.


    Taking a 6 1/2 lb lens to shoot a club concert really isn't an option. I
    had a 30/1.4 and an 18-200.

    >
    >> Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    >> are in a good position...

    >
    > Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    > refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to
    > prearrange to get some great shots.


    I am NOT sleeping with the bass player. I'll just bring a flash.
     
    Cynicor, Mar 13, 2008
    #10
  11. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    >> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>
    >>>> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >>>> that detract from the moment.
    >>>
    >>> Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.

    >>
    >> In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he played
    >> his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would have been
    >> nice.

    >
    > Taking a 6 1/2 lb lens to shoot a club concert really isn't an option. I
    > had a 30/1.4 and an 18-200.
    >
    >>
    >>> Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    >>> are in a good position...

    >>
    >> Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    >> refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to
    >> prearrange to get some great shots.

    >
    > I am NOT sleeping with the bass player. I'll just bring a flash.


    But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and executing
    the light show. When you can integrate the light show into your photos, you
    know you're getting there.

    Dudley
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #11
  12. Cynicor

    Cynicor Guest

    Dudley Hanks wrote:
    > "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    >>> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>>
    >>>>> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >>>>> that detract from the moment.
    >>>> Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.
    >>> In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he played
    >>> his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would have been
    >>> nice.

    >> Taking a 6 1/2 lb lens to shoot a club concert really isn't an option. I
    >> had a 30/1.4 and an 18-200.
    >>
    >>>> Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    >>>> are in a good position...
    >>> Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    >>> refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to
    >>> prearrange to get some great shots.

    >> I am NOT sleeping with the bass player. I'll just bring a flash.

    >
    > But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and executing
    > the light show. When you can integrate the light show into your photos, you
    > know you're getting there.


    It wasn't exactly ELO or Pink Floyd up there. There wasn't a big light show.
     
    Cynicor, Mar 13, 2008
    #12
  13. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >> "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> Rita Berkowitz wrote:
    >>>> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>>> Nice! But leave the flash home since it creates too many shadows
    >>>>>> that detract from the moment.
    >>>>> Yep, concert photography is all about getting up close and personal.
    >>>> In most cases, yes! He only needed three lenses, really two if he
    >>>> played his cards right. A 50/1.4 and 85/1.4. An option 200/2 would
    >>>> have been nice.
    >>> Taking a 6 1/2 lb lens to shoot a club concert really isn't an option. I
    >>> had a 30/1.4 and an 18-200.
    >>>
    >>>>> Besides, most musicians are hams and will play to the camera if you
    >>>>> are in a good position...
    >>>> Especially if you ask them before the show and make an offer they can't
    >>>> refuse. These little tavern or corner pub concerts are easy to
    >>>> prearrange to get some great shots.
    >>> I am NOT sleeping with the bass player. I'll just bring a flash.

    >>
    >> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show into
    >> your photos, you know you're getting there.

    >
    > It wasn't exactly ELO or Pink Floyd up there. There wasn't a big light
    > show.


    Then, if you can do it without a flash, you really are getting there...
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #13
  14. Cynicor

    Matt Ion Guest

    Dudley Hanks wrote:

    > But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and executing
    > the light show. When you can integrate the light show into your photos, you
    > know you're getting there.


    Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light SHOW.
    At best most will have a dozen or so cans with three different colors of
    gels set on some kind of automatic pattern.
     
    Matt Ion, Mar 13, 2008
    #14
  15. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Matt Ion" <> wrote in message
    news:fraa5n$5r1$...
    > Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >
    >> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show into
    >> your photos, you know you're getting there.

    >
    > Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light SHOW. At
    > best most will have a dozen or so cans with three different colors of gels
    > set on some kind of automatic pattern.


    Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #15
  16. Dudley Hanks wrote:

    >> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>
    >>> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >>> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show
    >>> into your photos, you know you're getting there.

    >>
    >> Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light
    >> SHOW. At best most will have a dozen or so cans with three different
    >> colors of gels set on some kind of automatic pattern.

    >
    > Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...


    Yep, that is what I told him earlier. His biggest challenge at the moment
    is getting the flash off the camera. If he must use flash he would be
    better suited to use several strategically placed SB800s/Pocket Wizards with
    a Larry Thong LightBottle attached. Or his other option is to simply get a
    D3. With the D3's insanely high ISO performance he could even get himself
    an LED type flashlight that randomly generates different colors and bring
    his own lightshow to the band. It all comes down to bringing the right
    tools to the job. The D3 is that amazing!




    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Mar 13, 2008
    #16
  17. Cynicor

    Cynicor Guest

    Dudley Hanks wrote:
    > "Matt Ion" <> wrote in message
    > news:fraa5n$5r1$...
    >> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>
    >>> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >>> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show into
    >>> your photos, you know you're getting there.

    >> Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light SHOW. At
    >> best most will have a dozen or so cans with three different colors of gels
    >> set on some kind of automatic pattern.

    >
    > Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...


    Someone actually posted videos from the show. This is the lighting. (And
    no, those aren't all my flashes going off. Other people had them too -
    you can tell which ones are doing the red-eye pre-flash.

    http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=gKBkvle8BSQ
     
    Cynicor, Mar 13, 2008
    #17
  18. Cynicor wrote:

    >>>> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >>>> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show
    >>>> into your photos, you know you're getting there.
    >>> Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light
    >>> SHOW. At best most will have a dozen or so cans with three
    >>> different colors of gels set on some kind of automatic pattern.

    >>
    >> Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...

    >
    > Someone actually posted videos from the show. This is the lighting.
    > (And no, those aren't all my flashes going off. Other people had them
    > too - you can tell which ones are doing the red-eye pre-flash.
    >
    > http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=gKBkvle8BSQ


    Hell, that's bright! You need to take a pair of sunglasses to that concert.
    That said, the lighting is beautiful and really adds to the emotion of the
    concert. Any type of flash detracts from this immensely and totally
    destroys the aura you would demand. Oh well, I'd leave the flash home.




    Rita
     
    Rita Berkowitz, Mar 13, 2008
    #18
  19. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Rita Berkowitz" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Cynicor wrote:
    >
    >>>>> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >>>>> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show
    >>>>> into your photos, you know you're getting there.
    >>>> Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light
    >>>> SHOW. At best most will have a dozen or so cans with three
    >>>> different colors of gels set on some kind of automatic pattern.
    >>>
    >>> Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...

    >>
    >> Someone actually posted videos from the show. This is the lighting.
    >> (And no, those aren't all my flashes going off. Other people had them
    >> too - you can tell which ones are doing the red-eye pre-flash.
    >>
    >> http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=gKBkvle8BSQ

    >
    > Hell, that's bright! You need to take a pair of sunglasses to that
    > concert.
    > That said, the lighting is beautiful and really adds to the emotion of the
    > concert. Any type of flash detracts from this immensely and totally
    > destroys the aura you would demand. Oh well, I'd leave the flash home.
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > Rita
    >


    I learnt concert photography back in the days when film was either daylight,
    tungsten or flourescent. Lighting sources didn't mix as well as they do
    with digital. Flashes shot at a different temp than the light show, so you
    either had to go with film that was balanced for your flash and then try to
    overpower the stage lighting, or use film balanced for the show and leave
    the flash at home.

    I chose the latter because it gave more colourful results, and it didn't
    interfere with the show. Besides, if you ever want to shoot in a stadium
    that is holding 20,000++ fans in addition to yourself, you're going to have
    to learn to shoot without a flash. The big bands don't like you messing
    around with their effects.

    Why not start small and get used to it.

    Dudley
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #19
  20. Cynicor

    Dudley Hanks Guest

    "Cynicor" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >> "Matt Ion" <> wrote in message
    >> news:fraa5n$5r1$...
    >>> Dudley Hanks wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> But, flashes tend to ruin all the hard work put into planning and
    >>>> executing the light show. When you can integrate the light show into
    >>>> your photos, you know you're getting there.
    >>> Your typical pub/nightclub barely HAS lights, let alone a light SHOW. At
    >>> best most will have a dozen or so cans with three different colors of
    >>> gels set on some kind of automatic pattern.

    >>
    >> Sounds like more of a challenge than a single flash to me...

    >
    > Someone actually posted videos from the show. This is the lighting. (And
    > no, those aren't all my flashes going off. Other people had them too - you
    > can tell which ones are doing the red-eye pre-flash.
    >
    > http://ca.youtube.com/watch?v=gKBkvle8BSQ
    >


    I'm sure red-eye is a real problem when you're shooting from the back corner
    with a 200mm lens after consuming six or eight shooters...
     
    Dudley Hanks, Mar 13, 2008
    #20
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