Chose digital SLR

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by dimidimi, Nov 23, 2005.

  1. dimidimi

    dimidimi Guest

    Hi everybody,

    I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    please, help me in choosing between?

    1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    3) Canon EOS 20D
    4) Canon EOS-300D
    5) Pentax - IST DS
    6) Sigma - SD10
    7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    8) Something else around this price?

    Thank You very much!!!
     
    dimidimi, Nov 23, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. "dimidimi" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi everybody,
    >
    > I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    > SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    > please, help me in choosing between?
    >
    > 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    > 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    > 3) Canon EOS 20D
    > 4) Canon EOS-300D
    > 5) Pentax - IST DS
    > 6) Sigma - SD10
    > 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    > 8) Something else around this price?


    Most of the above are really good cameras. You also might want to wait a
    while and check out the Nikon D200 which should be available early next
    year.

    I have a 300D and a 20D and like them a lot (the 20D is a lot faster and
    easier to use).
     
    Charles Schuler, Nov 23, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. In article <>,
    dimidimi <> wrote:

    > I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    > SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    > please, help me in choosing between?
    >
    > 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    > 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    > 3) Canon EOS 20D
    > 4) Canon EOS-300D
    > 5) Pentax - IST DS
    > 6) Sigma - SD10
    > 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    > 8) Something else around this price?


    Don't even think of #6.
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Nov 24, 2005
    #3
  4. dimidimi

    Paul Rubin Guest

    "dimidimi" <> writes:
    > 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    > 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    > 3) Canon EOS 20D
    > 4) Canon EOS-300D
    > 5) Pentax - IST DS
    > 6) Sigma - SD10
    > 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    > 8) Something else around this price?


    I think you should cross off #6 and 7, as too limiting. Same with the
    D50 from #1. I'm not so familiar with the Pentax. The D70 and D100
    are no longer made but you might get a used one of either. Between
    the two I think the D70 is better in most ways, and priced about the
    same. The D70S is almost the same as the D70. The EOS 300D (#4) is
    obsolete and I'd get the Rebel instead. The 20D is the best camera on
    your list but it's the most expensive. If you can afford the 20D, you
    should also think about the Nikon D200.

    Frankly I think you should limit it to Nikon vs Canon. That's D70
    vs Rebel XT, or D200 vs 20D. It seems to me that with Nikon you have
    more options for wideangle lenses, and maybe more traditional
    controls. But I haven't used Canons much.
     
    Paul Rubin, Nov 24, 2005
    #4
  5. "Randall Ainsworth" <> wrote in message
    news:231120051854546397%...
    > In article <>,
    > dimidimi <> wrote:
    >
    >> I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    >> SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    >> please, help me in choosing between?
    >>
    >> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >> 8) Something else around this price?

    >
    > Don't even think of #6.


    I agree, don't even think of #6 unless you want to produce high quality
    images for the type of photography you like.
     
    Peter A. Stavrakoglou, Nov 24, 2005
    #5
  6. dimidimi

    Stacey Guest

    Paul Rubin wrote:

    > "dimidimi" <> writes:
    >> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >> 8) Something else around this price?

    >
    > I think you should cross off #6 and 7, as too limiting.


    Unless he's planing on using the kit lens, then I'd cross off 2,3,4 and even
    1 is questionable.. Notice his sample shots are all done in bright
    daylight.... People forget most people buying these don't have the extra
    cash to buy a "decent" lens in addition to the camera kit and expect the
    supplied one to work OK. IMHO the canon kit lens is "too limiting" as it
    only is close to decent stopped WAY down so you end up with a lens that
    works OK at 1 or maybe 2 fstops.

    --

    Stacey
     
    Stacey, Nov 24, 2005
    #6
  7. dimidimi

    Chris Brown Guest

    In article <3Aahf.62$>,
    Peter A. Stavrakoglou <> wrote:
    >"Randall Ainsworth" <> wrote in message
    >news:231120051854546397%...
    >> In article <>,
    >> dimidimi <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    >>> SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    >>> please, help me in choosing between?
    >>>
    >>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>> 8) Something else around this price?

    >>
    >> Don't even think of #6.

    >
    >I agree, don't even think of #6 unless you want to produce high quality
    >images for the type of photography you like.


    ....and that type of photography includes portraits of the mysterious
    cheese-people. ;-)
     
    Chris Brown, Nov 24, 2005
    #7
  8. dimidimi

    Bill Funk Guest

    On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 03:22:26 -0500, Stacey <> wrote:

    >Paul Rubin wrote:
    >
    >> "dimidimi" <> writes:
    >>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>> 8) Something else around this price?

    >>
    >> I think you should cross off #6 and 7, as too limiting.

    >
    >Unless he's planing on using the kit lens, then I'd cross off 2,3,4 and even
    >1 is questionable.. Notice his sample shots are all done in bright
    >daylight.... People forget most people buying these don't have the extra
    >cash to buy a "decent" lens in addition to the camera kit and expect the
    >supplied one to work OK. IMHO the canon kit lens is "too limiting" as it
    >only is close to decent stopped WAY down so you end up with a lens that
    >works OK at 1 or maybe 2 fstops.


    Hogwash.
    The 18-55 EF-S lens certainly isn't an "L" lens by any stretch, but
    it's a lot better than you make it out to be.
    But then, your dislike for anything Canon colors your judgement.
    Do you even have an 18-55 EF-S lens?
    http://www.slrgear.com/reviews/showproduct.php/product/137/sort/2/cat/11/page/1

    --
    Bill Funk
    Replace "g" with "a"
    funktionality.blogspot.com
     
    Bill Funk, Nov 24, 2005
    #8
  9. "Chris Brown" <_uce_please.com> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <3Aahf.62$>,
    > Peter A. Stavrakoglou <> wrote:
    >>"Randall Ainsworth" <> wrote in message
    >>news:231120051854546397%...
    >>> In article <>,
    >>> dimidimi <> wrote:
    >>>
    >>>> I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    >>>> SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    >>>> please, help me in choosing between?
    >>>>
    >>>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>>> 8) Something else around this price?
    >>>
    >>> Don't even think of #6.

    >>
    >>I agree, don't even think of #6 unless you want to produce high quality
    >>images for the type of photography you like.

    >
    > ...and that type of photography includes portraits of the mysterious
    > cheese-people. ;-)


    Yes, very cheesy http://ntotrr.smugmug.com/photos/27233203-M.jpg
     
    Peter A. Stavrakoglou, Nov 24, 2005
    #9
  10. dimidimi

    Monty Bonner Guest

    "dimidimi" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Hi everybody,
    >
    > I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    > SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    > please, help me in choosing between?
    >
    > 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    > 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    > 3) Canon EOS 20D
    > 4) Canon EOS-300D
    > 5) Pentax - IST DS
    > 6) Sigma - SD10
    > 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    > 8) Something else around this price?
    >
    > Thank You very much!!!


    Wont give you purchasing advice, I personally like Nikon D70s or wait for
    the D200 so you have lots of room to grow.

    However, before you purchase you need to determine what type of photo's you
    plan on taking the majority of the time. Then decide which camera will meet
    those requirements, and by the model one step higher up the food chain, so
    you have something to learn about and get good at that won't be out of date
    in 6 months.

    Lens - thousands of books on the subject, again how you will use camera,
    sports, nature, animals, people, etc, each lens has a specific purpose which
    it was designed for. I like the Nikon D70s Kit lens, good glass, but it's
    not good for outside zoom shots, so I have to have another lens for those
    type of situations. The zoom lens in not good for close up inside shots, so
    the kit lens works ok. However, and I believe the most important part,
    learning how the camera operates and all the various settings make things
    look different is more important in the beginning than which model and what
    lens. I have had my D70s for two months, and most of the shots I take with
    it I am personally not happy with. I also don't leave it in the auto mode.
    I keep it in the aperture mode and am trying to learn from there.

    So don't get brand specific until you figure out how it will be used, then
    try different models from different manufacturers until you find one that
    feels good to your hands and the controls are right for your style of using
    it, then you can purchase and start to learn how to use it. Give yourself 6
    months to feel good about the shots you take, unless you are already a
    semi-pro and understand, all the variables which go into taking good
    pictures.

    Monty
     
    Monty Bonner, Nov 24, 2005
    #10
  11. dimidimi

    Skip M Guest

    "Peter A. Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    news:mhlhf.1026$...
    > "Chris Brown" <_uce_please.com> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> In article <3Aahf.62$>,
    >> Peter A. Stavrakoglou <> wrote:
    >>>"Randall Ainsworth" <> wrote in message
    >>>news:231120051854546397%...
    >>>> In article <>,
    >>>> dimidimi <> wrote:
    >>>>
    >>>>> I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a digital
    >>>>> SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    >>>>> please, help me in choosing between?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>>>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>>>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>>>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>>>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>>>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>>>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>>>> 8) Something else around this price?
    >>>>
    >>>> Don't even think of #6.
    >>>
    >>>I agree, don't even think of #6 unless you want to produce high quality
    >>>images for the type of photography you like.

    >>
    >> ...and that type of photography includes portraits of the mysterious
    >> cheese-people. ;-)

    >
    > Yes, very cheesy http://ntotrr.smugmug.com/photos/27233203-M.jpg
    >

    Don't tell me you can't see the yellow skin tones in that shot? Even the
    shadows are tinted yellow.
    Or was that your point, that the Sigma does produce yellowish skin tones?
    Was that what the image was made with? Because there's no EXIF included...
    BTW, that's one pissed off looking child...

    --
    Skip Middleton
    http://www.shadowcatcherimagery.com
     
    Skip M, Nov 24, 2005
    #11
  12. dimidimi

    Bill Guest

    Stacey wrote:

    > "dimidimi" <> writes:
    >>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>> 8) Something else around this price?


    The only two I would not recommend would be the original Rebel/300D and
    the Sigma SD10, unless you're looking for a low priced start. But since
    several others are much more expensive, I would presume you can afford
    newer models.

    Do you have more information on what you want to do with the camera?

    >Unless he's planing on using the kit lens, then I'd cross off 2,3,4 and even
    >1 is questionable..


    Nikon D70 and D70s questionable? Are you serious? Have you used these
    cameras and the 18-70 lense?

    Currently the Nikon D50 with the 18-70 lense is one of the best deals
    available. The D70s with the 18-70 is also a good deal.

    >Notice his sample shots are all done in bright
    >daylight.... People forget most people buying these don't have the extra
    >cash to buy a "decent" lens in addition to the camera kit and expect the
    >supplied one to work OK.


    Sometimes that is true...but the advantage of SLR is interchangeable
    lenses, so a user can always add more and better lenses as they grow
    with the camera.

    If a user doesn't care to improve the image quality, then any other
    lense is likely a waste of money, as is a DSLR.

    > IMHO the canon kit lens is "too limiting" as it
    >only is close to decent stopped WAY down so you end up with a lens that
    >works OK at 1 or maybe 2 fstops.


    The original Canon 18-55 needed to be stopped down to f/8+ to become
    sharper and I wouldn't recommend it. But the newer 18-55 version II
    works fairly well wide open, and for new DSLR users it works well enough
    to help them learn what they do need for lenses.

    Have you actually used these cameras and lenses, or is this just some
    type of brand-snobbery?

    Granted neither 18-55 are the sharpest lenses, but neither are they the
    worst. And for less than $100, what more can you expect...I've seen
    worse from lenses costing 2-3x as much from several different brands.
     
    Bill, Nov 25, 2005
    #12
  13. "Skip M" <> wrote in message
    news:EFohf.8111$dv.1082@fed1read02...
    > "Peter A. Stavrakoglou" <> wrote in message
    > news:mhlhf.1026$...
    >> "Chris Brown" <_uce_please.com> wrote in message
    >> news:...
    >>> In article <3Aahf.62$>,
    >>> Peter A. Stavrakoglou <> wrote:
    >>>>"Randall Ainsworth" <> wrote in message
    >>>>news:231120051854546397%...
    >>>>> In article <>,
    >>>>> dimidimi <> wrote:
    >>>>>
    >>>>>> I'm an amateour outdoor photographer and I would like to bye a
    >>>>>> digital
    >>>>>> SLR, but I'm confused to choose the proper one for me. Could You,
    >>>>>> please, help me in choosing between?
    >>>>>>
    >>>>>> 1) Nikon D70, D70s, D50, D100
    >>>>>> 2) Canon Digital Rebel XT
    >>>>>> 3) Canon EOS 20D
    >>>>>> 4) Canon EOS-300D
    >>>>>> 5) Pentax - IST DS
    >>>>>> 6) Sigma - SD10
    >>>>>> 7) Olimpus - EVOLT E3002
    >>>>>> 8) Something else around this price?
    >>>>>
    >>>>> Don't even think of #6.
    >>>>
    >>>>I agree, don't even think of #6 unless you want to produce high quality
    >>>>images for the type of photography you like.
    >>>
    >>> ...and that type of photography includes portraits of the mysterious
    >>> cheese-people. ;-)

    >>
    >> Yes, very cheesy http://ntotrr.smugmug.com/photos/27233203-M.jpg
    >>

    > Don't tell me you can't see the yellow skin tones in that shot? Even the
    > shadows are tinted yellow.
    > Or was that your point, that the Sigma does produce yellowish skin tones?
    > Was that what the image was made with? Because there's no EXIF
    > included...
    > BTW, that's one pissed off looking child...


    That's accurate color when he's in the sunlight. He's not pissed off, just
    a clown when there's a camera around. The Sigma at times produces yellowish
    skin tones but not on a consistent basis. Most of my shots have good
    skintones, not yellow and not too pink like I've seen from some others.
    Strange that there's no EXIF info, can't explain why.
     
    Peter A. Stavrakoglou, Nov 25, 2005
    #13
  14. dimidimi

    Stacey Guest

    Bill Funk wrote:

    > On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 03:22:26 -0500, Stacey <> wrote:
    >
    > Hogwash.
    > The 18-55 EF-S lens certainly isn't an "L" lens by any stretch, but
    > it's a lot better than you make it out to be.
    >


    Yea right.. Again; MAYBE stopped way down it's useable but then you have 1
    maybe 2 fstops to choose from..
    --

    Stacey
     
    Stacey, Nov 25, 2005
    #14
  15. dimidimi

    Stacey Guest

    Bill wrote:

    > Stacey wrote:


    >
    >> IMHO the canon kit lens is "too limiting" as it
    >>only is close to decent stopped WAY down so you end up with a lens that
    >>works OK at 1 or maybe 2 fstops.

    >
    > The original Canon 18-55 needed to be stopped down to f/8+ to become
    > sharper and I wouldn't recommend it. But the newer 18-55 version II
    > works fairly well wide open, and for new DSLR users it works well enough
    > to help them learn what they do need for lenses.


    If you looked at this guys work, he's far from a "new user".

    >
    > Have you actually used these cameras and lenses, or is this just some
    > type of brand-snobbery?


    Yep, the canon lens isn't much better than a coke bottle bottom. And while
    the nikon kit lens isn't awful, it not a great performer either.

    >
    > Granted neither 18-55 are the sharpest lenses, but neither are they the
    > worst. And for less than $100, what more can you expect...


    That was my point.. Given it sounds like he is probably on a tight budget, I
    maybe wrongly assumed the quality of the kit lens might matter to him?

    --

    Stacey
     
    Stacey, Nov 25, 2005
    #15
  16. dimidimi

    Bill Funk Guest

    On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 23:09:23 -0500, "Peter A. Stavrakoglou"
    <> wrote:

    >> Don't tell me you can't see the yellow skin tones in that shot? Even the
    >> shadows are tinted yellow.
    >> Or was that your point, that the Sigma does produce yellowish skin tones?
    >> Was that what the image was made with? Because there's no EXIF
    >> included...
    >> BTW, that's one pissed off looking child...

    >
    >That's accurate color when he's in the sunlight. He's not pissed off, just
    >a clown when there's a camera around. The Sigma at times produces yellowish
    >skin tones but not on a consistent basis. Most of my shots have good
    >skintones, not yellow and not too pink like I've seen from some others.
    >Strange that there's no EXIF info, can't explain why.
    >


    I've noticed that in portraits taken with SDx cameras, when the skin
    tones are what I think is right, the whites of the eyes have a blue
    cast to them, as does anything else that's supposed to be white.
    To me, that indicates a color correction to reduce the yellow cast
    that these cameras tend to produce.
    Maybe it's just me, but that's what I see.

    --
    Bill Funk
    Replace "g" with "a"
    funktionality.blogspot.com
     
    Bill Funk, Nov 25, 2005
    #16
  17. dimidimi

    Bill Funk Guest

    On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 02:47:00 -0500, Stacey <> wrote:

    >Bill Funk wrote:
    >
    >> On Thu, 24 Nov 2005 03:22:26 -0500, Stacey <> wrote:
    >>
    >> Hogwash.
    >> The 18-55 EF-S lens certainly isn't an "L" lens by any stretch, but
    >> it's a lot better than you make it out to be.
    >>

    >
    >Yea right.. Again; MAYBE stopped way down it's useable but then you have 1
    >maybe 2 fstops to choose from..


    Whatever you say.
    How much experience do you have with one?

    --
    Bill Funk
    Replace "g" with "a"
    funktionality.blogspot.com
     
    Bill Funk, Nov 25, 2005
    #17
  18. dimidimi

    Bill Funk Guest

    On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 02:50:04 -0500, Stacey <> wrote:

    >Bill wrote:
    >
    >> Stacey wrote:

    >
    >>
    >>> IMHO the canon kit lens is "too limiting" as it
    >>>only is close to decent stopped WAY down so you end up with a lens that
    >>>works OK at 1 or maybe 2 fstops.

    >>
    >> The original Canon 18-55 needed to be stopped down to f/8+ to become
    >> sharper and I wouldn't recommend it. But the newer 18-55 version II
    >> works fairly well wide open, and for new DSLR users it works well enough
    >> to help them learn what they do need for lenses.

    >
    >If you looked at this guys work, he's far from a "new user".
    >
    >>
    >> Have you actually used these cameras and lenses, or is this just some
    >> type of brand-snobbery?

    >
    >Yep, the canon lens isn't much better than a coke bottle bottom.


    Do you want to be taken seriously?
    It doesn't seem so.

    --
    Bill Funk
    Replace "g" with "a"
    funktionality.blogspot.com
     
    Bill Funk, Nov 25, 2005
    #18
  19. In article <>, Bill Funk
    <> wrote:

    > I've noticed that in portraits taken with SDx cameras, when the skin
    > tones are what I think is right, the whites of the eyes have a blue
    > cast to them, as does anything else that's supposed to be white.
    > To me, that indicates a color correction to reduce the yellow cast
    > that these cameras tend to produce.
    > Maybe it's just me, but that's what I see.


    Hmmm...on the color wheel...blue and yellow are opposites
    (complimentary).

    You know, I can't believe that Sigma continues to market their crappy
    digital cameras. There's so much better out there for much less money.
     
    Randall Ainsworth, Nov 25, 2005
    #19
  20. dimidimi

    Bill Funk Guest

    On Fri, 25 Nov 2005 05:38:39 -0800, Randall Ainsworth
    <> wrote:

    >In article <>, Bill Funk
    ><> wrote:
    >
    >> I've noticed that in portraits taken with SDx cameras, when the skin
    >> tones are what I think is right, the whites of the eyes have a blue
    >> cast to them, as does anything else that's supposed to be white.
    >> To me, that indicates a color correction to reduce the yellow cast
    >> that these cameras tend to produce.
    >> Maybe it's just me, but that's what I see.

    >
    >Hmmm...on the color wheel...blue and yellow are opposites
    >(complimentary).


    Yes; to remove yellow, add blue. Or, remove yellow, the image turns
    blue.
    >
    >You know, I can't believe that Sigma continues to market their crappy
    >digital cameras. There's so much better out there for much less money.


    --
    Bill Funk
    Replace "g" with "a"
    funktionality.blogspot.com
     
    Bill Funk, Nov 25, 2005
    #20
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