Cheap studio lights (was:Re: 10D Flash question)

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Lionel, Jul 1, 2003.

  1. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 08:02:44 -0700, in
    <300620030802446670%>, Randall Ainsworth
    <> said:

    >You need to learn how to do professional lighting and then use
    >professional lighting equipment.


    Speaking of which, I owe somebody here (I don't remember who) a big
    'thank you' for suggesting quartz-halogen worklights (minus the wire
    guards) from a hardware store as a discount substitute for standard
    studio lights.
    I have a couple of lovely young friends who are wannabe actresses /
    models. They've asked me to do some folio photos for them, but I don't
    do studio work myself, so I'm not set up for it. OTOH, I'd love to
    photograph them, & I'd certainly like some studio experience.
    I went & bought two dual head worklights yesterday for the huge *cough*
    sum of $93AUD (~$56USD) each, for a total of 2000W of pretty good light.
    The stands are good & sturdy, can be extended to put the lights up to
    about 7' or so, & collapse down to be fairly compact & portable. The
    colour temperature is also a good match for Canon's 'tungsten' WB
    setting, which is a time saver. The major difference I can see between
    these units & pro studio lights is that the metalwork is finished in
    yellw, rather than black. Considering the price difference, I think I
    can live with this.
    Now I just need to rig up some cheap reflectors, diffusers & a couple of
    backdrops. :)

    For any other Australians reading this, the lamps I used are Nelson
    MWLT033 "500W Twin-head Quartz Halogen Work Lights", from the Bunnings
    Hardware chain at about $93 a set. I bought mine from the Melbourne city
    shop, but they're a national chain.
    I'd supply the URLs for Bunnings & Nelson Lamps, but both of them have
    totally useless, amateur websites.

    --
    W
    . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
    \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
    ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
     
    Lionel, Jul 1, 2003
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Lionel

    Scott Coutts Guest

    Lionel wrote:
    > On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 08:02:44 -0700, in
    > <300620030802446670%>, Randall Ainsworth
    > <> said:
    >
    >
    >>You need to learn how to do professional lighting and then use
    >>professional lighting equipment.

    >
    >
    > Speaking of which, I owe somebody here (I don't remember who) a big
    > 'thank you' for suggesting quartz-halogen worklights (minus the wire
    > guards) from a hardware store as a discount substitute for standard
    > studio lights.
    > I have a couple of lovely young friends who are wannabe actresses /
    > models. They've asked me to do some folio photos for them, but I don't
    > do studio work myself, so I'm not set up for it. OTOH, I'd love to
    > photograph them, & I'd certainly like some studio experience.
    > I went & bought two dual head worklights yesterday for the huge *cough*
    > sum of $93AUD (~$56USD) each, for a total of 2000W of pretty good light.
    > The stands are good & sturdy, can be extended to put the lights up to
    > about 7' or so, & collapse down to be fairly compact & portable. The
    > colour temperature is also a good match for Canon's 'tungsten' WB
    > setting, which is a time saver. The major difference I can see between
    > these units & pro studio lights is that the metalwork is finished in
    > yellw, rather than black. Considering the price difference, I think I
    > can live with this.
    > Now I just need to rig up some cheap reflectors, diffusers & a couple of
    > backdrops. :)
    >
    > For any other Australians reading this, the lamps I used are Nelson
    > MWLT033 "500W Twin-head Quartz Halogen Work Lights", from the Bunnings
    > Hardware chain at about $93 a set. I bought mine from the Melbourne city
    > shop, but they're a national chain.
    > I'd supply the URLs for Bunnings & Nelson Lamps, but both of them have
    > totally useless, amateur websites.
    >


    Yup, I've bought another one of the too. Last time, I couldnt remember
    the brand name of mine. You can also get Arlec ones which is what I use
    - they're also fro Bunnings. They're also that oh-so-unprofessional
    orange :) But hey, you can buy the Alien Bees professional monos in
    bright orange if you want (or green, or yellow, or boring black)!

    Also, I have found some good, very small, steel housings for the
    downlights that I mentioned last time. It makes them much easier to deal
    with and direct. I use these as intense lights for spots in normal shots
    and as bright lighting for macro. The good thing about them is the fact
    that they dont get very hot at the front (it's focussed at the back).
    Anyhow, the housings are about $25 each and they can be easily attached
    to whatever support you want, including a tripod mount. I cant remember
    the brand at the moment, but I'll post it later when I get home, since
    there seemed to be a few people interested last time.
     
    Scott Coutts, Jul 1, 2003
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Lionel

    ahennell Guest

    Lionel wrote:

    > Speaking of which, I owe somebody here (I don't remember who) a big
    > 'thank you' for suggesting quartz-halogen worklights (minus the wire
    > guards) from a hardware store as a discount substitute for standard
    > studio lights.


    When I've done corporate/industrial work, it's far from ideal studio
    conditions. I've built up a little 'field' lighitng kit' (I dont have or
    use a studio, so it's silly for me to call it a field kit, but I do
    anyway). gets me out of trouble in almost all circumstances.

    It has:
    - 4 x 500w Quartz Halogen lamps
    - 2 x 150w Quarts Halogen lamps
    - 2 x dimmer (suitable for either)
    - 2 x small flouro banks (very similar to a small slide lightbox) (240v)
    - 1 x small slide lightbox (battery or power)
    - range of coloured gels, barn doors, reflecters, etc
    - compulsory roll of gaffa tape, spring clamps, etc, etc.
    all fits in a neat little black storage bin with a lid.
    + 3 x manfrotto light stands

    Along with Nikon speedlights, radio &/or IR remotes, etc..
     
    ahennell, Jul 1, 2003
    #3
  4. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 14:13:22 +1000, in
    <>, Scott Coutts
    <> said:

    >Yup, I've bought another one of the too. Last time, I couldnt remember
    >the brand name of mine. You can also get Arlec ones which is what I use
    >- they're also fro Bunnings. They're also that oh-so-unprofessional
    >orange :) But hey, you can buy the Alien Bees professional monos in
    >bright orange if you want (or green, or yellow, or boring black)!


    I saw the Arlecs next to the Nelsons, but they were little more
    expensive, had shorter power cords (1.8m vs 3m) & seemed to be otherwise
    identical. Besides, I prefer yellow to orange anyway. ;)

    >Also, I have found some good, very small, steel housings for the
    >downlights that I mentioned last time. It makes them much easier to deal
    >with and direct. I use these as intense lights for spots in normal shots
    >and as bright lighting for macro. The good thing about them is the fact
    >that they dont get very hot at the front (it's focussed at the back).
    >Anyhow, the housings are about $25 each and they can be easily attached
    >to whatever support you want, including a tripod mount. I cant remember
    >the brand at the moment, but I'll post it later when I get home, since
    >there seemed to be a few people interested last time.


    Yes please, I'd interested in checking them out.

    --
    W
    . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
    \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
    ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
     
    Lionel, Jul 1, 2003
    #4
  5. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 14:49:24 +1000, in
    <>, ahennell
    <> said:

    >- 2 x 150w Quarts Halogen lamps


    What do you use the 150W lamps for? Spots? Shadow killers?

    >- 2 x dimmer (suitable for either)


    Have you found the dimmers to cause problems with the colour
    temperature? I'm hesitant to buy dimmers for my lights for that reason.

    >- range of coloured gels, barn doors, reflecters, etc


    I need to get these too. Any tips on cheap sources? (Particularly for
    the barn doors - a friend has reccomended CC's, but I suspect they'll be
    a bit pricy.)

    >- compulsory roll of gaffa tape


    <grin> It's not a real lighting or sound kit unless you have a couple of
    rolls of gaffer tape. ;)
     
    Lionel, Jul 1, 2003
    #5
  6. Lionel

    ahennell Guest

    Lionel wrote:

    > On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 14:49:24 +1000, in
    > <>, ahennell
    > <> said:
    >
    > >- 2 x 150w Quarts Halogen lamps

    >
    > What do you use the 150W lamps for? Spots? Shadow killers?


    heck - anything! illuminating back walls, killing shadows, dropping in
    barrels.. anything!

    There's a Kodak book "

    > >- 2 x dimmer (suitable for either)

    >
    > Have you found the dimmers to cause problems with the colour
    > temperature? I'm hesitant to buy dimmers for my lights for that reason.


    yup - but sometimes that's nice :)

    > >- range of coloured gels, barn doors, reflecters, etc

    >
    > I need to get these too. Any tips on cheap sources? (Particularly for
    > the barn doors - a friend has reccomended CC's, but I suspect they'll be
    > a bit pricy.)


    I used to hang around theatres & stages & gigs a bit in light & sound techy
    type roles, so I kinda accumulated a fw bits 'n pieces (and my obsession for
    gaffa!). Most theatrical supply companies can supply it, or Lightmoves in
    Sydney (Petersham), or similar. Good gel isn't cheap tho :eek:\

    > >- compulsory roll of gaffa tape

    >
    > <grin> It's not a real lighting or sound kit unless you have a couple of
    > rolls of gaffer tape. ;)


    there's nothing you cnan't do with gaffa tape & cable ties. And the little
    spring clamps are just as useful - can mount a light or background almost
    anywhere now :eek:)
     
    ahennell, Jul 1, 2003
    #6
  7. Lionel

    Scott Coutts Guest

    Lionel wrote:

    >>
    >>- 2 x dimmer (suitable for either)
    >>

    >
    > Have you found the dimmers to cause problems with the colour
    > temperature? I'm hesitant to buy dimmers for my lights for that reason.
    >


    I guess you could white-card the scene first at different brightness
    levels and set the custom white balance, or set the white balance
    afterwards.
     
    Scott Coutts, Jul 1, 2003
    #7
  8. Lionel

    ahennell Guest

    ahennell wrote:

    > Lionel wrote:
    >
    > > On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 14:49:24 +1000, in
    > > <>, ahennell
    > > <> said:
    > >
    > > >- 2 x 150w Quarts Halogen lamps

    > >
    > > What do you use the 150W lamps for? Spots? Shadow killers?

    >
    > heck - anything! illuminating back walls, killing shadows, dropping in
    > barrels.. anything!
    >
    > There's a Kodak book "


    helps if I finish the sentence!!!

    There's a Kodak book " Corporate and Location Photography" by Gary Gladstone -
    *very* good value if you can find it. Lots of tricks.

    http://search.barnesandnoble.com/booksearch/isbnInquiry.asp?isbn=0879857846
    or
    http://www.amazon.com/exec/obidos/tg/detail/-/0879857846/

    Cheers,
    Andrew :eek:)
     
    ahennell, Jul 1, 2003
    #8
  9. Lionel

    Danny Smith Guest

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 15:13:04 +1000, Lionel <> wrote:

    ....<chomp>...

    >Have you found the dimmers to cause problems with the colour
    >temperature? I'm hesitant to buy dimmers for my lights for that reason.


    I know this is only going to be of use for the digital folk, but how
    about including a grey card in each shot and shooting in RAW?

    It'd mean mucking about with each shot individually, but you'd have a
    pretty good chance of nailing the white balance!

    Cheers,

    Danny
     
    Danny Smith, Jul 1, 2003
    #9
  10. Lionel

    Scott Coutts Guest

    Lionel wrote:
    > On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 16:05:44 +1000, in
    > <>, Scott Coutts
    > <> said:
    >
    > [dimmers on quartz-halogens]
    >
    >>I guess you could white-card the scene first at different brightness
    >>levels and set the custom white balance, or set the white balance
    >>afterwards.

    >
    >
    > I imagine so, if you do it at the time, but I would expect to lose
    > dynamic range in red & green if the correction required later (post
    > shoot) is really huge. That said, I don't know nearly as much as I'd
    > like to about how the camera image sensor & sense amp electronics work
    > (ie; it's mostly educated guesswork, based on designing similar
    > devices), so it's /possible/ that you lose dynamic range with any sort
    > of WB correction.
    > Boy, I sure miss the days when you got schematics when you bought
    > something expensive, or least a reasonably detailed block diagram.
    >


    Lets see you get THAT out of Canon! :) It's hard enough getting any
    code-based info out of them (other than the SDK).
     
    Scott Coutts, Jul 1, 2003
    #10
  11. "Danny Smith" <> wrote in message
    news:3f014458.253296721@news...
    > On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 15:13:04 +1000, Lionel <> wrote:
    >
    > ...<chomp>...
    >
    > >Have you found the dimmers to cause problems with the colour
    > >temperature? I'm hesitant to buy dimmers for my lights for that reason.

    >
    > I know this is only going to be of use for the digital folk, but how
    > about including a grey card in each shot and shooting in RAW?
    >
    > It'd mean mucking about with each shot individually, but you'd have a
    > pretty good chance of nailing the white balance!
    >
    > Cheers,
    >
    > Danny


    It doesn't need to be in each shot, you could either take one grey card at
    the beginning of each lighting setup and then...

    1: Apply that WB setting in camera for shots under that lighting setup
    (Using JPG or RAW)

    or

    2: Shoot RAW and apply the WB setting later as a global setting for all
    images selected using Capture One (no good for JPG)

    I would use option 2... that way you have total control in post and you only
    need to work it out on one image then apply to the rest (takes about a
    second longer than it takes you to select the images).... Capture One makes
    this kind of thing sooooooo easy!

    Of course if you are shooting film the same thing applies..... shoot one
    frame under each light setup with a grey card included. Once you images are
    scanned select the grey balance from the card and apply to the rest of the
    images.... once again Capture One makes it soooo easy! :)

    Did I tell you I like Capture One?? LOL :)
     
    Russell Stewart, Jul 1, 2003
    #11
  12. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 11:39:24 GMT, in
    <>, Scott Coutts
    <> said:

    >Lionel wrote:
    >> Boy, I sure miss the days when you got schematics when you bought
    >> something expensive, or least a reasonably detailed block diagram.
    >>

    >
    >Lets see you get THAT out of Canon! :) It's hard enough getting any
    >code-based info out of them (other than the SDK).


    Back when I worked for them, it was easy. It's just a shame I didn't
    work for the photographic division. ;)
    I think I still have my service manual (complete with schematics) for my
    old Canon (long gone now) laser printer.
     
    Lionel, Jul 2, 2003
    #12
  13. Lionel

    Auspics Guest

    Quartz lights are quite happy working at reduced voltage and in some cases
    increased voltage so... Why not just buy a variable transformer? I've seen
    these where you can dial in the output voltage and provided they will handle
    the current, should be ideal.
    JT

    "Lionel" <> wrote in message news:bdqg35$b9$...
    > On Mon, 30 Jun 2003 08:02:44 -0700, in
    > <300620030802446670%>, Randall Ainsworth
    > <> said:
    >
    > >You need to learn how to do professional lighting and then use
    > >professional lighting equipment.

    >
    > Speaking of which, I owe somebody here (I don't remember who) a big
    > 'thank you' for suggesting quartz-halogen worklights (minus the wire
    > guards) from a hardware store as a discount substitute for standard
    > studio lights.
    > I have a couple of lovely young friends who are wannabe actresses /
    > models. They've asked me to do some folio photos for them, but I don't
    > do studio work myself, so I'm not set up for it. OTOH, I'd love to
    > photograph them, & I'd certainly like some studio experience.
    > I went & bought two dual head worklights yesterday for the huge *cough*
    > sum of $93AUD (~$56USD) each, for a total of 2000W of pretty good light.
    > The stands are good & sturdy, can be extended to put the lights up to
    > about 7' or so, & collapse down to be fairly compact & portable. The
    > colour temperature is also a good match for Canon's 'tungsten' WB
    > setting, which is a time saver. The major difference I can see between
    > these units & pro studio lights is that the metalwork is finished in
    > yellw, rather than black. Considering the price difference, I think I
    > can live with this.
    > Now I just need to rig up some cheap reflectors, diffusers & a couple of
    > backdrops. :)
    >
    > For any other Australians reading this, the lamps I used are Nelson
    > MWLT033 "500W Twin-head Quartz Halogen Work Lights", from the Bunnings
    > Hardware chain at about $93 a set. I bought mine from the Melbourne city
    > shop, but they're a national chain.
    > I'd supply the URLs for Bunnings & Nelson Lamps, but both of them have
    > totally useless, amateur websites.
    >
    > --
    > W
    > . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
    > \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
    > ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
     
    Auspics, Jul 2, 2003
    #13
  14. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Wed, 02 Jul 2003 20:54:06 GMT, in
    <ODHMa.10$>, "Auspics"
    <> said:

    >Quartz lights are quite happy working at reduced voltage and in some cases
    >increased voltage so... Why not just buy a variable transformer? I've seen
    >these where you can dial in the output voltage and provided they will handle
    >the current, should be ideal.


    Yes, I'm considering buying a variac, rather than an electronic dimmer
    (an electronic dimmer will produce a LOT of electrical noise at 2000W).
    The only drawback is that heavy duty variacs aren't cheap, & I'd
    probably need several. I suspect that I can get by just by adding barn
    doors to the heads, & by using diffusers & reflectors.

    --
    W
    . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
    \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
    ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
     
    Lionel, Jul 3, 2003
    #14
  15. Lionel

    Lionel Guest

    On Tue, 01 Jul 2003 16:20:47 +1000, in
    <>, ahennell
    <> said:

    >There's a Kodak book " Corporate and Location Photography" by Gary Gladstone -
    >*very* good value if you can find it. Lots of tricks.


    Thanks for the tip, Andrew! :)

    You sold me on it so well that I went & ordered a used copy through
    Amazon, which arrived a few days ago. A very nice book indeed. Lot's of
    meaty information in it, & some great tricks that I can definitely use
    in my own work.

    --
    W
    . | ,. w , "Some people are alive only because
    \|/ \|/ it is illegal to kill them." Perna condita delenda est
    ---^----^---------------------------------------------------------------
     
    Lionel, Jul 10, 2003
    #15
  16. Lionel

    zcream

    Joined:
    Jun 22, 2007
    Messages:
    1
    Barn Doors

    Just trying to start a dead thread. Did Scott ever get to post the link to the barn doors ?
    i.e. good, very small, steel housings for the
    downlights

    ??
    Email is anmol_mishra (at) yahoo (dot) COM
     
    zcream, Jun 22, 2007
    #16
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