changing from Telecom jetstream to UBS adsl notes

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by Brendan, Nov 22, 2004.

  1. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    I have recently changed from Telecom's jetstream plus to Orcon's UBS
    system. I then received my most recent bill from telecom, and on it was a
    charge for jetstream plus for a month I did not have it as i was on UBS. So
    I rang them up about this over charge. Here are some notes for others to
    remember if they wish to change as I did:

    1. You will be charged for the whole month by telecom ($60 or more) even if
    you went into that billing period by only one day and it wasn't your fault.
    They refuse to give a 'pro-rata' refund.

    2. Make sure you are switched over before the start of the billing period.
    Contact Telecom to inform them as much, do not rely on your ISP to do that.

    3. There is no official explanation for this stupid policy; obviously it is
    a punishment for changing. A lucrative one.

    4. They claim this is part of the contract you signed. I doubt a Disputes
    Tribunal would be so understanding.

    5. If you were not informed of the contract, they might offer you a partial
    refund after you inform them of options surrounding Disputes Tribunal and
    the CGA act.

    I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this scam.
    Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?

    "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...

    --

    .... Brendan

    "Golf may be played on Sunday, not being a game within the view of the law, but being a form of moral effort." -- Stephen Leacock

    Note: All my comments are copyright 22/11/2004 12:31:38 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 22, 2004
    #1
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  2. Brendan

    Dorado Guest

    Brendan wrote:
    > I have recently changed from Telecom's jetstream plus to Orcon's UBS
    > system. I then received my most recent bill from telecom, and on it
    > was a charge for jetstream plus for a month I did not have it as i
    > was on UBS. So I rang them up about this over charge. Here are some
    > notes for others to remember if they wish to change as I did:
    >
    > 1. You will be charged for the whole month by telecom ($60 or more)
    > even if you went into that billing period by only one day and it
    > wasn't your fault. They refuse to give a 'pro-rata' refund.
    >
    > 2. Make sure you are switched over before the start of the billing
    > period. Contact Telecom to inform them as much, do not rely on your
    > ISP to do that.
    >
    > 3. There is no official explanation for this stupid policy; obviously
    > it is a punishment for changing. A lucrative one.
    >
    > 4. They claim this is part of the contract you signed. I doubt a
    > Disputes Tribunal would be so understanding.
    >
    > 5. If you were not informed of the contract, they might offer you a
    > partial refund after you inform them of options surrounding Disputes
    > Tribunal and the CGA act.
    >
    > I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this scam.
    > Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?
    >
    > "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...


    I personally think that the public should be made aware of the underhanded
    dirty tactics that Telecom have been doing ever since UBS was introduced.
    Might be a good thing to let the general public know about these things.
     
    Dorado, Nov 22, 2004
    #2
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  3. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 17:19:12 +1300, Dorado wrote:

    >> I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this scam.
    >> Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?
    >>
    >> "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...

    >
    > I personally think that the public should be made aware of the underhanded
    > dirty tactics that Telecom have been doing ever since UBS was introduced.
    > Might be a good thing to let the general public know about these things.


    Well, that's two of us. Any others want to put their name on the bottom of
    a email to a few of the news outfits ?

    --

    .... Brendan

    "Some mornings it just doesn't seem worth it to gnaw through the leather straps." -- Emo Philips

    Note: All my comments are copyright 22/11/2004 9:40:48 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 22, 2004
    #3
  4. Brendan

    HillBilly Guest

    > I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this scam.
    > Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?
    >
    > "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...
    >



    just send an email to

    fairgo at tvnz.co.nz
     
    HillBilly, Nov 22, 2004
    #4
  5. Brendan

    DoggNZ Guest

    On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 17:09:23 +1300, Brendan <>
    wrote:

    >
    >I have recently changed from Telecom's jetstream plus to Orcon's UBS
    >system. I then received my most recent bill from telecom, and on it was a
    >charge for jetstream plus for a month I did not have it as i was on UBS. So
    >I rang them up about this over charge. Here are some notes for others to
    >remember if they wish to change as I did:
    >

    <snip>

    Yep, same here.

    --
    BOINC SETI
    http://boinc.mundayweb.com/seti2/stats.php?userID=1469&trans=off
     
    DoggNZ, Nov 22, 2004
    #5
  6. Brendan

    Nik Coughin Guest

    Brendan wrote:
    > On Mon, 22 Nov 2004 17:19:12 +1300, Dorado wrote:
    >
    >>> I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this
    >>> scam. Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?
    >>>
    >>> "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...

    >>
    >> I personally think that the public should be made aware of the
    >> underhanded dirty tactics that Telecom have been doing ever since
    >> UBS was introduced. Might be a good thing to let the general public
    >> know about these things.

    >
    > Well, that's two of us. Any others want to put their name on the
    > bottom of a email to a few of the news outfits ?


    How about:

    * A website, collecting people's experiences and summarising the main points
    * A few phone calls to radio stations around the country -- talkback and
    student stations especially. Maybe email would be better for this.
    Summarise the situation and give a pointer to the website and a contact
    email address.
    * An email/phone call to Fair Go probably couldn't hurt either
    * There must be at least another couple of things that I haven't thought of.
    Anyone want to add to the list?

    Hasn't affected me personally, but I still think it sucks. If anyone is
    actually going to do anything about this I'd be more than willing to knock
    up a website and host it, provided that someone else collects all the
    information.

    Cheers.
     
    Nik Coughin, Nov 22, 2004
    #6
  7. Brendan wrote:
    > I have recently changed from Telecom's jetstream plus to Orcon's UBS
    > system. I then received my most recent bill from telecom, and on it was a
    > charge for jetstream plus for a month I did not have it as i was on UBS. So
    > I rang them up about this over charge. Here are some notes for others to
    > remember if they wish to change as I did:
    >
    > 1. You will be charged for the whole month by telecom ($60 or more) even if
    > you went into that billing period by only one day and it wasn't your fault.
    > They refuse to give a 'pro-rata' refund.
    >
    > 2. Make sure you are switched over before the start of the billing period.
    > Contact Telecom to inform them as much, do not rely on your ISP to do that.
    >
    > 3. There is no official explanation for this stupid policy; obviously it is
    > a punishment for changing. A lucrative one.
    >
    > 4. They claim this is part of the contract you signed. I doubt a Disputes
    > Tribunal would be so understanding.
    >
    > 5. If you were not informed of the contract, they might offer you a partial
    > refund after you inform them of options surrounding Disputes Tribunal and
    > the CGA act.
    >
    > I wonder if any of the news agencies would be interested in this scam.
    > Should we email a few reporters ? Fair Go ?
    >
    > "Customers outraged as Telecom charges for cancelled services" ...
    >


    I would be the last to support Telecom, but on my phone bill since Sept
    has been the wording about "30 days notice of cancellation" .

    The finer points about who cancelled when do become slightly irrelevant
    with those key words.
     
    -=[Waylon Smithers]=-, Nov 22, 2004
    #7
  8. Brendan

    Chris Mayhew Guest

    -=[Waylon Smithers]=- wrote:

    >
    > I would be the last to support Telecom, but on my phone bill since Sept
    > has been the wording about "30 days notice of cancellation" .
    >
    > The finer points about who cancelled when do become slightly irrelevant
    > with those key words.

    Nothing like that on my Telecom bill


    --
     
    Chris Mayhew, Nov 22, 2004
    #8
  9. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 10:24:27 +1300, -=[Waylon Smithers]=- wrote:

    > I would be the last to support Telecom, but on my phone bill since Sept
    > has been the wording about "30 days notice of cancellation" .


    Mine doesn't.

    > The finer points about who cancelled when do become slightly irrelevant
    > with those key words.


    Not necessarily. It'd still be a scam, and still be worth agitating about.
    It's not as if disconnecting you from a Telecom service actually takes that
    long - it can be done in minutes.

    E.g. it is an unreasonable condition and is only possible given Telecom's
    monopoly position. It is therefore a consumer rights issue and possibly
    under the purview of the commerce commission.

    Certainly, they were not keen to appear in a Disputes Tribunal hearing when
    I suggested it.

    aside: the girl *I* was talking to was quite sympathetic, but obviously
    constrained as to what she could say with a supervisor hovering over her...
    So don't nut off at the ones on the phone - it's the pricks in management
    we need to bring to heel.

    --

    .... Brendan

    "'He says gods like to see an atheist around. Gives them something to aim at.'" -- Terry Pratchett, _Small Gods_

    Note: All my comments are copyright 23/11/2004 1:03:14 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 23, 2004
    #9
  10. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:23:32 +1300, Nik Coughin wrote:

    > How about:
    >
    > * A website, collecting people's experiences and summarising the main points
    > * A few phone calls to radio stations around the country -- talkback and
    > student stations especially. Maybe email would be better for this.
    > Summarise the situation and give a pointer to the website and a contact
    > email address.
    > * An email/phone call to Fair Go probably couldn't hurt either
    > * There must be at least another couple of things that I haven't thought of.
    > Anyone want to add to the list?


    Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    telecom is trying to scam.

    > Hasn't affected me personally, but I still think it sucks. If anyone is
    > actually going to do anything about this I'd be more than willing to knock
    > up a website and host it, provided that someone else collects all the
    > information.


    That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?

    --

    .... Brendan

    "One of the advantages of being disorderly is that one is constantly making new discoveries." -- A. A. Milne

    Note: All my comments are copyright 23/11/2004 12:59:39 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 23, 2004
    #10
  11. Brendan <> wrote:

    > On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:23:32 +1300, Nik Coughin wrote:
    >
    > > How about:
    > >
    > > * A website, collecting people's experiences and summarising the main points
    > > * A few phone calls to radio stations around the country -- talkback and
    > > student stations especially. Maybe email would be better for this.
    > > Summarise the situation and give a pointer to the website and a contact
    > > email address.
    > > * An email/phone call to Fair Go probably couldn't hurt either
    > > * There must be at least another couple of things that I haven't thought of.
    > > Anyone want to add to the list?

    >
    > Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    > in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    > telecom is trying to scam.


    What about the Listener's tech reporter - Russell Brown
    <>? Anyone else read his Wide Area News column (used
    to be the Computers column)?

    > > Hasn't affected me personally, but I still think it sucks. If anyone is
    > > actually going to do anything about this I'd be more than willing to knock
    > > up a website and host it, provided that someone else collects all the
    > > information.

    >
    > That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?


    Sounds like a fine idea. I'm still stuck with 256K and Telecom lied to
    me about the order for the 2Mbit service being loaded and that it would
    be actioned on the 21st. Orcon's tech support have yet to respond to my
    request for help - but I'm sure they're overwhelmed at the moment so I
    can accept a delay. Plus I guarantee it's not Orcon's fault. Bloody
    Telecom jackasses.

    Regards,
    Jamie Kahn Genet
    --
    If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
     
    Jamie Kahn Genet, Nov 23, 2004
    #11
  12. In article <f9pwh1sygbci$>, Brendan <> wrote:
    >On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 09:23:32 +1300, Nik Coughin wrote:

    *SNIP*
    >Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    >in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    >telecom is trying to scam.
    >

    *SNIP*

    Juha Saarinen is aware of the issue, which means that the Herald and IDG
    are aware of the issue.
    Whether anything will be done remains to be seen. It was Juha who told
    me that the Act gives no grounds for compliance or monitoring, so I
    suspect that the only avenues open are civil ones. Disputes being the
    best bet, given that any other fora will allow in Telecon's attack do...
    lawyers.

    --
    Matthew Poole Auckland, New Zealand
    "Veni, vidi, velcro...
    I came, I saw, I stuck around"

    My real e-mail is mattATp00leDOTnet
     
    Matthew Poole, Nov 23, 2004
    #12
  13. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 20:46:16 GMT, Matthew Poole wrote:

    > *SNIP*
    >>Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    >>in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    >>telecom is trying to scam.
    >>

    > *SNIP*
    >
    > Juha Saarinen is aware of the issue, which means that the Herald and IDG
    > are aware of the issue.
    > Whether anything will be done remains to be seen. It was Juha who told
    > me that the Act gives no grounds for compliance or monitoring, so I
    > suspect that the only avenues open are civil ones. Disputes being the
    > best bet, given that any other fora will allow in Telecon's attack do...
    > lawyers.


    A good amount of negative publicity would help too. Obviously the commerce
    commission needs to be given more teeth. Some of the IRD's teeth would
    help...

    --

    .... Brendan

    ACHIEVEMENT, n. The death of endeavor and the birth of disgust. -- Ambrose Bierce

    Note: All my comments are copyright 24/11/2004 11:53:29 a.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 23, 2004
    #13
  14. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:48:46 +1300, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:

    >> Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    >> in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    >> telecom is trying to scam.

    >
    > What about the Listener's tech reporter - Russell Brown
    > <>? Anyone else read his Wide Area News column (used
    > to be the Computers column)?


    Would be a good one... But I think we need a few more people - a voice in
    the wilderness is one thing, but an angry mob is another ;)

    >> That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?

    >
    > Sounds like a fine idea. I'm still stuck with 256K and Telecom lied to
    > me about the order for the 2Mbit service being loaded and that it would
    > be actioned on the 21st. Orcon's tech support have yet to respond to my
    > request for help - but I'm sure they're overwhelmed at the moment so I
    > can accept a delay. Plus I guarantee it's not Orcon's fault. Bloody
    > Telecom jackasses.


    Oh, don't suppose for a minute it's all a mistake. Telecom has a room FULL
    of arse holes paid 100,000 a year and all they do is think up shit like
    this.

    But the incompetence argument has it's attractions: if NZ's biggest company
    cannot run itself properly, the right wing ideology is proven to be useless
    yet again.

    --

    .... Brendan

    "Every time I try to define a perfectly stable person, I am appalled by the dullness of that person." -- J. D. Griffin

    Note: All my comments are copyright 24/11/2004 11:44:17 a.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 23, 2004
    #14
  15. In article <19gngz4z1av41$> in nz.comp on Wed, 24 Nov
    2004 12:08:53 +1300, Brendan <> says...
    > On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:48:46 +1300, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    >
    > >> Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    > >> in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    > >> telecom is trying to scam.

    > >
    > > What about the Listener's tech reporter - Russell Brown
    > > <>? Anyone else read his Wide Area News column (used
    > > to be the Computers column)?

    >
    > Would be a good one... But I think we need a few more people - a voice in
    > the wilderness is one thing, but an angry mob is another ;)
    >
    > >> That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?

    > >
    > > Sounds like a fine idea. I'm still stuck with 256K and Telecom lied to
    > > me about the order for the 2Mbit service being loaded and that it would
    > > be actioned on the 21st. Orcon's tech support have yet to respond to my
    > > request for help - but I'm sure they're overwhelmed at the moment so I
    > > can accept a delay. Plus I guarantee it's not Orcon's fault. Bloody
    > > Telecom jackasses.

    >
    > Oh, don't suppose for a minute it's all a mistake. Telecom has a room FULL
    > of arse holes paid 100,000 a year and all they do is think up shit like
    > this.
    >
    > But the incompetence argument has it's attractions: if NZ's biggest company
    > cannot run itself properly, the right wing ideology is proven to be useless
    > yet again.


    I think you should stick to facts and keep out of the politics.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 24, 2004
    #15
  16. Brendan

    Brendan Guest

    On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 17:09:28 +1300, Patrick Dunford wrote:

    > I think you should stick to facts and keep out of the politics.


    I think you should get a girlfriend and stop tugging it.

    --

    .... Brendan

    "It is much easier to be critical than to be correct." -- Benjamin Disraeli

    Note: All my comments are copyright 24/11/2004 10:01:55 p.m. and are opinion only where not otherwise stated and always "to the best of my recollection". www.computerman.orcon.net.nz.
     
    Brendan, Nov 24, 2004
    #16
  17. In article <6vcuqnpsyaoz$> in nz.comp on Wed, 24 Nov
    2004 22:29:13 +1300, Brendan <> says...
    > On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 17:09:28 +1300, Patrick Dunford wrote:
    >
    > > I think you should stick to facts and keep out of the politics.

    >
    > I think you should get a girlfriend and stop tugging it.


    Since you've missed the point:

    You can get money from people to support most community groups, provided
    you are not engaged in political activities.

    Charitable organisations are not allowed to engage in political
    activities or else they become ineligible.

    Microsoft's definition of a community agency that they will give support
    to does not include political activities. This is not at all unusual.

    In your case, getting into political conspiracy theory has destroyed the
    credibility of your argument.
     
    Patrick Dunford, Nov 24, 2004
    #17
  18. Brendan <> wrote:

    > On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:48:46 +1300, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    >
    > >> Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    > >> in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    > >> telecom is trying to scam.

    > >
    > > What about the Listener's tech reporter - Russell Brown
    > > <>? Anyone else read his Wide Area News column (used
    > > to be the Computers column)?

    >
    > Would be a good one... But I think we need a few more people - a voice in
    > the wilderness is one thing, but an angry mob is another ;)


    I'll play the part of the angry mob (just ask others in this NG -
    aparently I've developed an "angry man" reputation :) ) if you be the
    voice in the wilderness.

    > >> That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?

    > >
    > > Sounds like a fine idea. I'm still stuck with 256K and Telecom lied to
    > > me about the order for the 2Mbit service being loaded and that it would
    > > be actioned on the 21st. Orcon's tech support have yet to respond to my
    > > request for help - but I'm sure they're overwhelmed at the moment so I
    > > can accept a delay. Plus I guarantee it's not Orcon's fault. Bloody
    > > Telecom jackasses.

    >
    > Oh, don't suppose for a minute it's all a mistake. Telecom has a room FULL
    > of arse holes paid 100,000 a year and all they do is think up shit like
    > this.
    >
    > But the incompetence argument has it's attractions: if NZ's biggest company
    > cannot run itself properly, the right wing ideology is proven to be useless
    > yet again.


    I find it easy to loath Telecom after their incompetent new phone
    install after I moved recently. I could fill pages with the sordid
    details, but suffice to say they f**ked up - repeatedly and could not
    communicate with their own freakin' contractors if they were superglued
    together (or so it seemed to me).

    I had ditches dug to replace faulty pre-existing lines (but how the f**k
    did they miss the fault when they did the initial install!?!? Do they do
    _any_ testing?), phone jackpoints left partially installed, no ADSL for
    several days (despite being told it would be hooked up at the local
    exchange the day I moved) and even no phone for a while. I finally had
    one phone call to their faults line and the static was so bad that I had
    to scream down the line just to be heard.

    Oh, and naturally enough their contractors turned up always earlier or
    later than they said they would. NEVER on time or even close.

    God I hate them. I'm writing this as a recorded voice tells me I've a 20
    minute wait to speak to their Jetstream helpdesk (been over an 45
    minutes now) which I'm doing because Orcon says I have to talk to them
    about my freakin' plan not being changed from 256K to 2Mbit, DESPITE
    f**king Telecom telling me the other day I HAD to talk to Orcon. F**k!
    F**k it!

    I swear I'm a nice, normal calm geek most of the time. Really... Telecom
    have just f**ked me over once too often of late.

    Regards,
    Jamie Kahn Genet
    --
    If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
     
    Jamie Kahn Genet, Nov 24, 2004
    #18
  19. Brendan

    Chris Mayhew Guest

    Brendan wrote:
    > On Tue, 23 Nov 2004 22:48:46 +1300, Jamie Kahn Genet wrote:
    >
    >
    >>>Sounds like a good idea, although I think that an email to a tech reporter
    >>>in nz would be nice too. Nothing like targeting it to the very people
    >>>telecom is trying to scam.

    >>
    >>What about the Listener's tech reporter - Russell Brown
    >><>? Anyone else read his Wide Area News column (used
    >>to be the Computers column)?

    >
    >
    > Would be a good one... But I think we need a few more people - a voice in
    > the wilderness is one thing, but an angry mob is another ;)
    >
    >
    >>>That's great. A sort of explanation and testimonials site you think ?

    >>
    >>Sounds like a fine idea. I'm still stuck with 256K and Telecom lied to
    >>me about the order for the 2Mbit service being loaded and that it would
    >>be actioned on the 21st. Orcon's tech support have yet to respond to my
    >>request for help - but I'm sure they're overwhelmed at the moment so I
    >>can accept a delay. Plus I guarantee it's not Orcon's fault. Bloody
    >>Telecom jackasses.

    >
    >
    > Oh, don't suppose for a minute it's all a mistake. Telecom has a room FULL
    > of arse holes paid 100,000 a year and all they do is think up shit like
    > this.


    I think a large part of the $100K would be *dirt* money
    >
    > But the incompetence argument has it's attractions: if NZ's biggest company
    > cannot run itself properly, the right wing ideology is proven to be useless
    > yet again.
    >




    --
     
    Chris Mayhew, Nov 24, 2004
    #19
  20. Brendan

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Brendan wrote:
    > On Wed, 24 Nov 2004 17:09:28 +1300, Patrick Dunford wrote:
    >
    >> I think you should stick to facts and keep out of the politics.

    >
    > I think you should get a girlfriend and stop tugging it.


    LOL, like that'll ever happen.
    --
    ~misfit~
     
    ~misfit~, Nov 24, 2004
    #20
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