Census online - less than impressed.

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by -=rjh=-, Mar 11, 2006.

  1. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    attempt to complete census forms online.

    I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    how many had problems?

    All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    different networks.

    The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few
    problems with not receiving forms online.

    I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only
    shows the dwelling form as being completed.
    -=rjh=-, Mar 11, 2006
    #1
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  2. -=rjh=-

    Charlie G Guest

    No problem here - Dwelling & five personal forms done at once - all went
    through OK & receipt issued & printed. Collector came next door & commented
    on way past that ours were received so didn't have to visit.

    Charlie


    "-=rjh=-" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first attempt
    > to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    > how many had problems?
    >
    > All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the Dwelling
    > form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the personal forms
    > was received, even though they were both completed, and these were done on
    > two different systems, two different browsers, two different networks.
    >
    > The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper forms
    > that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few problems
    > with not receiving forms online.
    >
    > I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    > issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    > should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only shows
    > the dwelling form as being completed.
    Charlie G, Mar 11, 2006
    #2
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  3. -=rjh=-

    Mercury Guest

    No problems here.
    Considering a 1st attempt, the diabolical volume of people using the system
    during the evening that was bouund to occur I thought it was highly
    responsive, well laid out and so on.

    Using multiple browser types and so multiple cookies (if any) may cause
    issues.



    "-=rjh=-" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first attempt
    > to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    > how many had problems?
    >
    > All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the Dwelling
    > form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the personal forms
    > was received, even though they were both completed, and these were done on
    > two different systems, two different browsers, two different networks.
    >
    > The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper forms
    > that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few problems
    > with not receiving forms online.
    >
    > I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    > issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    > should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only shows
    > the dwelling form as being completed.
    Mercury, Mar 11, 2006
    #3
  4. -=rjh=-

    Ross Dawson Guest

    On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:06:57 +1300, -=rjh=- <> wrote:

    >Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    >attempt to complete census forms online.
    >
    >I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    >how many had problems?
    >
    >All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    >Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    >personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    >these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    >different networks.
    >
    >The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    >forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few
    >problems with not receiving forms online.
    >
    >I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    >issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    >should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only
    >shows the dwelling form as being completed.


    Yep had only one minor problem with the site, logging in where it kept
    moving to the next field as soon as the allotted number of characters
    was reached, the problem for me was that the numbers (hand written
    ones) were a little unclear, 2's looked like 4's, so had to have a few
    goes at logging in.

    Apart from that though I had no problems and in fact it was a joy to
    fill in the forms compared to completing the printed forms.

    Now lets move onto elections!

    --
    Cheers for now

    Ross Dawson.
    Ross Dawson, Mar 11, 2006
    #4
  5. -=rjh=-

    Guest

    -=rjh=- wrote:

    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    > attempt to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    > how many had problems?
    >
    > All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    > Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    > personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    > these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    > different networks.
    >
    > The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    > forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few
    > problems with not receiving forms online.
    >
    > I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    > issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    > should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only
    > shows the dwelling form as being completed.


    Howdy rjh,

    Not a problem here. One brown form and three blue forms done over three
    sessions. Most impressed considering it's a first attempt for NZ Stats.
    Still a bit po'd at being classified as "other: New Zealander"
    (although that's for nz.gen, not nz.comp)

    Regards
    Miguel
    , Mar 11, 2006
    #5
  6. -=rjh=-

    KewlKiwi Guest

    -=rjh=- wrote:
    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    > attempt to complete census forms online.



    Sent without a hitch!

    Mind you, when we did the 'test census' last year I had to try 2
    browsers and several tries before it got through. They did a follow-up
    visit to get our feedback on the test and maybe that helped for the real
    thing.

    Bob
    KewlKiwi, Mar 11, 2006
    #6
  7. -=rjh=-

    KewlKiwi Guest

    wrote:
    >... Most impressed considering it's a first attempt for NZ Stats.


    Actually, it wasn't. They did a sample test last year. It was quite...
    basic... compared with the real one!
    Bob
    KewlKiwi, Mar 11, 2006
    #7
  8. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Ross Dawson wrote:
    > On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:06:57 +1300, -=rjh=- <> wrote:
    >
    >> Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    >> attempt to complete census forms online.
    >>
    >> I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    >> how many had problems?
    >>
    >> All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    >> Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    >> personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    >> these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    >> different networks.
    >>
    >> The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    >> forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few
    >> problems with not receiving forms online.
    >>
    >> I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    >> issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    >> should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only
    >> shows the dwelling form as being completed.

    >
    > Yep had only one minor problem with the site, logging in where it kept
    > moving to the next field as soon as the allotted number of characters
    > was reached, the problem for me was that the numbers (hand written
    > ones) were a little unclear, 2's looked like 4's, so had to have a few
    > goes at logging in.
    >
    > Apart from that though I had no problems and in fact it was a joy to
    > fill in the forms compared to completing the printed forms.


    Yeah, having done both, I'd have to agree :)

    I have no problem with the online forms or the way the site is
    organised, it worked really well - the forms are dynamic so you only see
    what you need to as you work through them. They did a good job, tax
    should be this easy. I really liked the way the cursor moved to the next
    entry almost automatically, but keyboard navigation seemed broken in a
    few places, not a big deal, but it makes it harder for blind people.

    I did have a couple of issues with the process after submitting the
    form, though - you are supposed to view a receipt, but if you have never
    done this before, how do you know this is supposed to happen?

    The other issue was when you log out, you are faced with an error
    message (your session has timed out), which is incorrect and confusing
    for people who aren't confident with online activities - it should thank
    you for completing the form ahead of the (possible) error message.


    >
    > Now lets move onto elections!
    >


    It would be nice, but even a single instance of the problems we've had
    here throws doubt onto the whole process.

    I've phoned the census helpline, and they say that quite a few people
    did have issues, but they can't deal with it, could I call stats (who
    only work normal hours, of course) as they need to talk to Datacom about it.

    The only other factor that I can think of is that both forms were
    completed at the same time on the night before census night.
    -=rjh=-, Mar 11, 2006
    #8
  9. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Mercury wrote:
    > No problems here.
    > Considering a 1st attempt, the diabolical volume of people using the system
    > during the evening that was bouund to occur I thought it was highly
    > responsive, well laid out and so on.
    >
    > Using multiple browser types and so multiple cookies (if any) may cause
    > issues.


    Shouldn't do - there is no way to guarantee that all forms will be
    completed on the same system. Surely cookies would be issued against
    each form, if they were used at all?

    I suppose there are privacy issues, but these days it should be possible
    to save each entry as it is entered, so the state of the form is saved
    between sessions (ie, you don't have to complete it in one session) and
    you can confirm the final result. Like gmail does.

    >
    >
    >
    > "-=rjh=-" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >> Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first attempt
    >> to complete census forms online.
    >>
    >> I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    >> how many had problems?
    >>
    >> All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the Dwelling
    >> form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the personal forms
    >> was received, even though they were both completed, and these were done on
    >> two different systems, two different browsers, two different networks.
    >>
    >> The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper forms
    >> that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few problems
    >> with not receiving forms online.
    >>
    >> I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    >> issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    >> should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only shows
    >> the dwelling form as being completed.

    >
    >
    -=rjh=-, Mar 11, 2006
    #9
  10. -=rjh=-

    Fred Dagg Guest

    On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:06:57 +1300, -=rjh=- <>
    exclaimed:

    >Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    >attempt to complete census forms online.
    >
    >I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    >how many had problems?
    >
    >All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    >Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    >personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    >these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    >different networks.
    >
    >The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    >forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few
    >problems with not receiving forms online.
    >
    >I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    >issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    >should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only
    >shows the dwelling form as being completed.


    The only problem here was that they wouldn't allow 2 people to do it
    at the same time - said that there was already a session open using
    our details, and to wait 10 mins.

    Other than that, no problems experienced.
    Fred Dagg, Mar 12, 2006
    #10
  11. On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:33:38 +1300, Mercury wrote:

    > Using multiple browser types and so multiple cookies (if any) may cause
    > issues.


    How would the use of different browsers affect the ability of the server
    to produce standard HTML, and standard javascript, and to receive the
    results back?

    Isn't this what we have W3C standards for?


    Have A Nice Cup of Tea

    --
    1/ Migration to Linux only costs money once. Higher Windows TCO is forever.
    2/ "Shared source" is a poison pill. Open Source is freedom.
    3/ Only the Windows boxes get the worms.
    Have A Nice Cup of Tea, Mar 12, 2006
    #11
  12. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Fred Dagg wrote:

    > The only problem here was that they wouldn't allow 2 people to do it
    > at the same time - said that there was already a session open using
    > our details, and to wait 10 mins.


    Hmm, we were both online at the same time, didn't get that warning.
    Wonder if that is relevant to the problems we experienced.
    -=rjh=-, Mar 12, 2006
    #12
  13. -=rjh=- wrote:
    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    > attempt to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online -
    > so how many had problems?
    >
    > All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the
    > Dwelling form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the
    > personal forms was received, even though they were both completed, and
    > these were done on two different systems, two different browsers, two
    > different networks.
    >
    > The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper
    > forms that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a
    > few problems with not receiving forms online.
    >
    > I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here
    > had issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN,
    > you should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours
    > only shows the dwelling form as being completed.


    I did mine on-line using Firefox and it worked perfectly. I was very
    impressed.
    --
    Shaun (~misfit~)
    Shaun \(~misfit~\), Mar 12, 2006
    #13
  14. -=rjh=-

    Fred Dagg Guest

    On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 13:26:35 +1300, -=rjh=- <>
    exclaimed:

    >Fred Dagg wrote:
    >
    >> The only problem here was that they wouldn't allow 2 people to do it
    >> at the same time - said that there was already a session open using
    >> our details, and to wait 10 mins.

    >
    >Hmm, we were both online at the same time, didn't get that warning.
    >Wonder if that is relevant to the problems we experienced.


    Hmm, this was on the evening of census night. Maybe they had
    discovered problems earlier, and implemented a check?

    When did you do it?
    Fred Dagg, Mar 12, 2006
    #14
  15. -=rjh=-

    Bruce Hoult Guest

    In article <>, -=rjh=- <>
    wrote:

    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first
    > attempt to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    > how many had problems?


    It worked absolutely fine here.

    I was amused though at the rather curious way that some questions
    excluded others, which resulted in the javascript stopping me from
    answering vast rafts of questions, some of which were relevent to me.

    I was on holiday during the week-to-Sunday before the census, but I was
    working during census week. But as a result of this I was not asked (or
    permitted) to anser any employment-related questions, including how many
    hours I work a week and how I get to work. And because I was not
    looking for work (at least by their definition) I didn't havee to answer
    lots more. Oh, but I was asked if had a job had been available during
    the previous week would I have taken it -- which of course I would
    *not*, being on holiday and all.

    So I don't know what they'll make of that lot.

    --
    Bruce | 41.1670S | \ spoken | -+-
    Hoult | 174.8263E | /\ here. | ----------O----------
    Bruce Hoult, Mar 12, 2006
    #15
  16. On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 12:33:38 +1300, someone purporting to be Mercury didst
    scrawl:

    > No problems here.
    > Considering a 1st attempt, the diabolical volume of people using the system
    > during the evening that was bouund to occur I thought it was highly
    > responsive, well laid out and so on.
    >

    *SNIP*

    They must've spoken to the people at Justice who did the system for
    reporting the election results. That was another example of a
    highly-responsive site despite high load.
    I'd love to know what they're using to back-end these projects, since it'd
    be a fascinating research project for people studying HA.

    --
    Matthew Poole
    "Don't use force. Get a bigger hammer."
    Matthew Poole, Mar 12, 2006
    #16
  17. On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:20:10 +1300, someone purporting to be Have A Nice
    Cup of Tea didst scrawl:

    > On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:33:38 +1300, Mercury wrote:
    >
    >> Using multiple browser types and so multiple cookies (if any) may cause
    >> issues.

    >
    > How would the use of different browsers affect the ability of the server
    > to produce standard HTML, and standard javascript, and to receive the
    > results back?
    >

    The ability to produce code that looks good in IE and in everything else
    can be problematic.

    > Isn't this what we have W3C standards for?
    >

    Indeed it is. Somebody forgot to tell Microsoft.
    --
    Matthew Poole
    "Don't use force. Get a bigger hammer."
    Matthew Poole, Mar 12, 2006
    #17
  18. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Fred Dagg wrote:
    > On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 13:26:35 +1300, -=rjh=- <>
    > exclaimed:
    >
    >> Fred Dagg wrote:
    >>
    >>> The only problem here was that they wouldn't allow 2 people to do it
    >>> at the same time - said that there was already a session open using
    >>> our details, and to wait 10 mins.

    >> Hmm, we were both online at the same time, didn't get that warning.
    >> Wonder if that is relevant to the problems we experienced.

    >
    > Hmm, this was on the evening of census night. Maybe they had
    > discovered problems earlier, and implemented a check?


    I was thinking something like that, but surely they would have told the
    census collectors, so they could better deal with the situation?

    >
    > When did you do it?


    Night before - I thought the system might become quite slow on the night
    (although it turns out, it didn't).
    -=rjh=-, Mar 12, 2006
    #18
  19. -=rjh=-

    -=rjh=- Guest

    Matthew Poole wrote:
    > On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 14:20:10 +1300, someone purporting to be Have A Nice
    > Cup of Tea didst scrawl:
    >
    >> On Sun, 12 Mar 2006 11:33:38 +1300, Mercury wrote:
    >>
    >>> Using multiple browser types and so multiple cookies (if any) may cause
    >>> issues.

    >> How would the use of different browsers affect the ability of the server
    >> to produce standard HTML, and standard javascript, and to receive the
    >> results back?
    >>

    > The ability to produce code that looks good in IE and in everything else
    > can be problematic.
    >
    >> Isn't this what we have W3C standards for?
    >>

    > Indeed it is. Somebody forgot to tell Microsoft.


    Just waiting for the inevitable, couple more posts should do it...
    -=rjh=-, Mar 12, 2006
    #19
  20. -=rjh=-

    Vista Guest

    "-=rjh=-" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Well, I'd have to say that I'm less than impressed with the first attempt
    > to complete census forms online.
    >
    > I figure that just about everyone here will have done theirs online - so
    > how many had problems?
    >
    > All of the forms in our household were done online, and only the Dwelling
    > form was received (and confirmation given) - neither of the personal forms
    > was received, even though they were both completed, and these were done on
    > two different systems, two different browsers, two different networks.
    >
    > The census collector has just left after asking us to fill out paper forms
    > that she will coma back to collect, and she said they'd had a few problems
    > with not receiving forms online.
    >
    > I suspect that this is actually a widespread problem, how many here had
    > issues? When you log in to the census site with your ID and PIN, you
    > should see a list of all the forms completed and received. Ours only shows
    > the dwelling form as being completed.


    I found it a good first attempt. Apparently 5% of people used it, but I also
    heard that doing it online will create double the amount of paper work,
    compared to filling in the paper forms.
    Vista, Mar 12, 2006
    #20
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