Can't receive email

Discussion in 'Computer Support' started by cornwall, Feb 20, 2008.

  1. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    Suddenly I can't receive email using
    Thunderbird. I can send Ok. Checked with ISP
    no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried
    with and without firewall). Baffled. Can
    anyone help?

    Thanks
    Bob
    cornwall, Feb 20, 2008
    #1
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  2. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    Re: Can't receive email EDITED Can't SEND!

    cornwall wrote:
    > Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    > Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with and
    > without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?
    >
    > Thanks
    > Bob

    (Bangs head againt wall)
    I meant I can't SEND email. I can receive ok.
    I can send messages to newsgroups though.

    Bob
    cornwall, Feb 20, 2008
    #2
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  3. cornwall

    Rôgêr Guest

    Re: Can't receive email EDITED Can't SEND!

    cornwall wrote:
    > cornwall wrote:
    >> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    >> and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?
    >>
    >> Thanks
    >> Bob

    > (Bangs head againt wall)
    > I meant I can't SEND email. I can receive ok.
    > I can send messages to newsgroups though.


    Did the ISP have you go through the SMTP settings in Thunderbird?
    Rôgêr, Feb 20, 2008
    #3
  4. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    Re: Can't receive email EDITED Can't SEND!

    Rôgêr wrote:
    > cornwall wrote:
    >> cornwall wrote:
    >>> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >>> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    >>> and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?
    >>>
    >>> Thanks
    >>> Bob

    >> (Bangs head againt wall)
    >> I meant I can't SEND email. I can receive ok.
    >> I can send messages to newsgroups though.

    >
    > Did the ISP have you go through the SMTP settings in Thunderbird?


    Yes, they match exactly. All was working fine a
    few hours ago, nothing loaded or deleted since.
    I have tried a different mail server but the
    result was the same.
    cornwall, Feb 20, 2008
    #4
  5. cornwall

    Whiskers Guest

    Re: Can't receive email EDITED Can't SEND!

    On 2008-02-20, cornwall <> wrote:
    > cornwall wrote:
    >> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with and
    >> without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?
    >>
    >> Thanks
    >> Bob

    > (Bangs head againt wall)
    > I meant I can't SEND email. I can receive ok.
    > I can send messages to newsgroups though.
    >
    > Bob


    Do you get any sort of error message or other response?

    --
    -- ^^^^^^^^^^
    -- Whiskers
    -- ~~~~~~~~~~
    Whiskers, Feb 20, 2008
    #5
  6. cornwall

    VanguardLH Guest

    "cornwall" wrote in message
    news:96Xuj.238314$...
    > Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    > Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    > and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?



    Show the error message. Don't describe it. Don't summarize it. Copy
    and paste it or transcribe it verbatim (although you might want to
    munge out your username).

    Did you configure TB to authenticate to their SMTP server?
    Have you tried disabling e-mail scanning in your anti-virus software?
    What software did you install just before the sudden change?

    Thunderbird has their own newsgroup at mozilla.support.thunderbird.
    If your newsgroups provider doesn't carry the Mozilla newsgroups,
    connect to Mozilla's NNTP server at news.mozilla.org.
    VanguardLH, Feb 20, 2008
    #6
  7. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    VanguardLH wrote:
    > "cornwall" wrote in message
    > news:96Xuj.238314$...
    >> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    >> and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?

    >
    >
    > Show the error message. Don't describe it. Don't summarize it. Copy
    > and paste it or transcribe it verbatim (although you might want to munge
    > out your username).
    >
    > Did you configure TB to authenticate to their SMTP server?
    > Have you tried disabling e-mail scanning in your anti-virus software?
    > What software did you install just before the sudden change?
    >
    > Thunderbird has their own newsgroup at mozilla.support.thunderbird. If
    > your newsgroups provider doesn't carry the Mozilla newsgroups, connect
    > to Mozilla's NNTP server at news.mozilla.org.


    Useful info there, thanks.

    I have already tried TB's help but it didn't help.

    The message I am getting from the 2 different
    servers is "Connecting to SMTP Server
    smtp.*****.*** failed. Server may not be
    accepting connections. I have loaded no new
    sofware in a while and everything was working
    fine a few hours ago.

    I don't think posting a pic of the error message
    is allowed in here...(can't copy it, would have
    to cut and paste and send as a pic)
    cornwall, Feb 20, 2008
    #7
  8. Re: Can't receive email EDITED Can't SEND!

    cornwall wrote:

    > Rôgêr wrote:
    >> cornwall wrote:
    >>> cornwall wrote:
    >>>> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >>>> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    >>>> and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?
    >>>>
    >>>> Thanks
    >>>> Bob
    >>> (Bangs head againt wall)
    >>> I meant I can't SEND email. I can receive ok.
    >>> I can send messages to newsgroups though.

    >>
    >> Did the ISP have you go through the SMTP settings in Thunderbird?

    >
    > Yes, they match exactly. All was working fine a
    > few hours ago, nothing loaded or deleted since.
    > I have tried a different mail server but the
    > result was the same.


    Dude... relax... have a beer... The server on commycraps end just burped.
    Not a big issue. Give it a moment to reboot... or whatever they do over
    there...

    It's not unusual for our local commcraps mails servers to forget who I am
    for a few minutes to hours sometimes... it always comes back though. Real
    quality...



    --

    Jerry McBride ()
    Jerry McBride, Feb 20, 2008
    #8
  9. cornwall

    Evan Platt Guest

    On Wed, 20 Feb 2008 15:50:27 GMT, cornwall <>
    wrote:

    >Useful info there, thanks.
    >
    >I have already tried TB's help but it didn't help.
    >
    >The message I am getting from the 2 different
    >servers is "Connecting to SMTP Server
    >smtp.*****.*** failed. Server may not be
    >accepting connections. I have loaded no new
    >sofware in a while and everything was working
    >fine a few hours ago.
    >
    >I don't think posting a pic of the error message
    >is allowed in here...(can't copy it, would have
    >to cut and paste and send as a pic)


    smtp.*****.*** isn't a valid domain.

    No need to munge that part - makes it impossible for others here to
    help you.

    Try:
    Start, Run, Command <Enter>.
    At the DOS prompt, type
    telnet smtp.****.*** 25<Enter> where obviously *****.*** is whatever
    mail server you have configured in your mail client.

    What do you see?
    --
    To reply via e-mail, remove The Obvious from my e-mail address.
    Evan Platt, Feb 20, 2008
    #9
  10. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    Re: UPDATE. Can't receive email

    cornwall wrote:
    > VanguardLH wrote:
    >> "cornwall" wrote in message
    >> news:96Xuj.238314$...
    >>> Suddenly I can't receive email using Thunderbird. I can send Ok.
    >>> Checked with ISP no problems their end. Firewall is Ok (tried with
    >>> and without firewall). Baffled. Can anyone help?

    >>
    >>
    >> Show the error message. Don't describe it. Don't summarize it. Copy
    >> and paste it or transcribe it verbatim (although you might want to
    >> munge out your username).
    >>
    >> Did you configure TB to authenticate to their SMTP server?
    >> Have you tried disabling e-mail scanning in your anti-virus software?
    >> What software did you install just before the sudden change?
    >>
    >> Thunderbird has their own newsgroup at mozilla.support.thunderbird. If
    >> your newsgroups provider doesn't carry the Mozilla newsgroups, connect
    >> to Mozilla's NNTP server at news.mozilla.org.

    >
    > Useful info there, thanks.
    >
    > I have already tried TB's help but it didn't help.
    >
    > The message I am getting from the 2 different servers is "Connecting to
    > SMTP Server smtp.*****.*** failed. Server may not be accepting
    > connections. I have loaded no new sofware in a while and everything was
    > working fine a few hours ago.
    >
    > I don't think posting a pic of the error message is allowed in
    > here...(can't copy it, would have to cut and paste and send as a pic)


    It may be something to do with my router. I
    change the default mail port from 25 to one the
    ISP says can also be used and it worked. We
    have 3 computers going through a Draytek router,
    could the router be blocking port 25 somehow?
    I've had the same problem on all 3 comps and the
    only common link is the router.
    cornwall, Feb 20, 2008
    #10
  11. cornwall

    VanguardLH Guest

    Re: UPDATE. Can't receive email

    "cornwall" wrote in message
    news:9YYuj.269262$...
    >>
    >> I have already tried TB's help but it didn't help.
    >>
    >> The message I am getting from the 2 different servers is
    >> "Connecting to SMTP Server smtp.*****.*** failed. Server may not be
    >> accepting connections. I have loaded no new sofware in a while and
    >> everything was working fine a few hours ago.
    >>
    >> I don't think posting a pic of the error message is allowed in
    >> here...(can't copy it, would have to cut and paste and send as a
    >> pic)


    Most NNTP and e-mail clients let you copy the error message. If a
    right-click context menu is not available, see if you can highlight
    the error message and hit Ctrl+C to copy the error message and then
    paste it here.

    > It may be something to do with my router. I change the default mail
    > port from 25 to one the ISP says can also be used and it worked. We
    > have 3 computers going through a Draytek router, could the router be
    > blocking port 25 somehow? I've had the same problem on all 3 comps
    > and the only common link is the router.


    Nothing to do with the router. Since it is your router, you would
    have knowledge of its configuration. The router's firewall won't
    block traffic over port 25 unless you configured it to do so. The
    change has to do with policies at your ISP regarding use of off-domain
    (from them) SMTP mail hosts to block spam or volume abuse, or with the
    e-mail provider wanting some authentication that you have permission
    to use their mail services and maybe wanting you to use a non-standard
    port (some also require SSL and SPA for off-domain access).

    Is your e-mail provider the same as your ISP? If not, your ISP may be
    blocking access to an off-domain SMTP server to prevent spam abuse.
    Have you checked with your ISP is they consider you an abuser and have
    blocked traffic over port 25? If you have a *personal* Internet
    service with them then they may deem that your e-mail volume was too
    high and require you to use a business account.

    For info on off-domain port 25 (SMTP) traffic blocked to thwart spam
    from spammers or infected customers, read:

    http://www.commercestreet.com/Blocking_Port_25.htm
    http://help.yahoo.com/help/us/mail/pop/pop-38.html

    http://www.postcastserver.com/help/Port_25_Blocking.aspx
    http://www.aota.net/Troubleshooting/port25.php4

    http://www.google.com/search?q=+block +"port 25" +SMTP +spam

    One, some, or all of the following could have changed or are being
    implemented:

    - Your ISP (the network to which you connect) requires you use their
    mail servers. They do not permit you crossing their network to use an
    off-domain mail server over which they have no control and cannot log
    e-mail traffic that uses their network. Usually this means they block
    e-mail traffic using port 25 that targets an off-domain network;
    however, it is also possible with protocol analyzers to detect traffic
    is for e-mail and block that traffic. This is probably why Gmail
    opted to force SSL connects because they use ports other than the
    standard of 110 for POP3 and 25 for SMTP since everyone using Gmail is
    trying to cross their ISP's network to get at an off-domain mail
    server.

    - The targeted mail server does not allow off-domain connections (or
    requires non-standard setup of SSL, different port numbers, and/or SPA
    to make off-domain connections). You are crossing your ISP's network
    to reach the targeted mail servers, but to those mail servers you are
    not on their network when trying to connect to those mail servers
    (i.e., you are off-domain to them). You will need to check what
    settings AOL requires for off-domain connections which could be
    different than for on-domain connections. My ISP (Comcast) is like
    that: while on their network, you connect to their mail servers using
    110 for POP3 and 25 for SMTP but when coming from off their domain
    then you need to use SSL, 995 for POP3, 465 for SMTP, and also use SPA
    to connect to their mail servers.

    - Some mail providers demand that the sending mail host have a valid
    MX record in the nameserver ran by that domain. That is, the
    receiving mail server gets a connection from a sending mail host that
    wants to send e-mail. During the mail session, the receiving mail
    server asks the nameserver of the sending mail server's domain what
    are its MX (mail exchange) records. The domain should list in their
    nameserver what are the valid mail hosts at that domain. Mail
    originating from any other host at that domain is not authorized to
    send mail from there, like from users operating their own mail servers
    (often which are infected user hosts running trojan mailers). If the
    sending mail host's nameserver doesn't list any MX records, or if the
    sending mail host is not included in those MX records, then the
    receiving mail server rejects the connection because the sending mail
    host is not a valid MX host at that domain. AOL does this so maybe
    your sending mail provider screwed up their MX records or forgot to
    add one. Sometimes e-mail providers have reserve hosts for e-mail
    that kick in when there is a problem with the primary mail host. Now
    e-mail is coming from there but they forgot to add an MX record for it
    in their nameserver (DNS server).

    - Some e-mail providers require that you send before you receive.
    Many e-mail clients receive first and then send. As a result, the
    expectation is that the mail server will reuse the login for the
    receive session also for the send session but the send session has to
    be within a short time after the login for the receive session (not
    from when the receive session ends). If there are lots of mails or
    delays, too much time elapses and those login credentials for the
    receive session are lost so you cannot send. The cure is to enter
    your login credentials for the send session (SMTP) or to change the
    order of sessions within your e-mail client (send and then receive).
    Maybe I missed it but I don't see an option in OE (so it probably
    isn't there in WLM) to change the order of the sessions (i.e., to
    receive first and then send, or to send first and then receive).
    Instead and when defining e-mail accounts in any e-mail client, I
    always configure the SMTP server settings to require authentication
    and then specify the same login credentials as for the POP3 server
    (rather than say to reuse them). This means I have to twice enter my
    login credentials: once for the POP3 configuration and again for the
    SMTP configuration.

    - Some e-mail providers use DNSBLs (DNS blocklists). If your mail
    server gets listed and the receiving mail server uses that list then
    it will reject e-mails from that sending mail server. You can use
    http://member.dnsstuff.com/pages/tools.php to use their DNS Lookup
    tool to check for MX records at the sender's (your) mail server
    domain. Then use the Spam Database Lookup to see if your sending mail
    server is blacklisted.
    VanguardLH, Feb 20, 2008
    #11
  12. cornwall

    G. Morgan Guest

    Re: UPDATE. Can't receive email

    cornwall wrote:

    >It may be something to do with my router. I
    >change the default mail port from 25 to one the
    >ISP says can also be used and it worked. We
    >have 3 computers going through a Draytek router,
    >could the router be blocking port 25 somehow?
    >I've had the same problem on all 3 comps and the
    >only common link is the router.



    For chrissakes man keep all this in ONE thread, this is the thrid one.

    Did you do what Evan asked you to try?

    --

    I kill all Google Group posts, you can too.
    Take back Usenet <--> http://improve-usenet.org
    G. Morgan, Feb 20, 2008
    #12
  13. cornwall wrote:

    > I don't think posting a pic of the error message
    > is allowed in here...(can't copy it, would have
    > to cut and paste and send as a pic)


    That's what free web space is for. Either the space your ISP probably
    gives you, or other free web space.


    --
    Blinky
    Killing all posts from Google Groups
    The Usenet Improvement Project: http://improve-usenet.org
    Blinky: http://blinkynet.net
    Blinky the Shark, Feb 20, 2008
    #13
  14. cornwall

    Guest

    cornwall <> wrote:

    >I don't think posting a pic of the error message
    >is allowed in here...(can't copy it, would have
    >to cut and paste and send as a pic)


    Post it here --> http://tinypic.com/




    --

    Optical Illusion: Contrast Asynchrony
    http://tinyurl.com/2qs5wu
    , Feb 20, 2008
    #14
  15. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    I discovered the problem. My ISP (whose email
    service I don't use) had sudenly decided to
    block port 25 for all users of the package I am
    on. Without telling anyone! I searched their
    site for info and not a mention anywhere. I
    finally found pages of letters from disgruntled
    fellow customers who'd had the same problem on a
    forum. Customer service.....
    Thanks for your time and effort, I did learn
    things from you which will come in handy in the
    future. (Including I seem to have a duff telnet
    connection which may be the subject of another
    post!).

    Thanks again.

    Bob
    cornwall, Feb 22, 2008
    #15
  16. cornwall

    Mike Easter Guest

    cornwall wrote:
    > I discovered the problem.


    Good. Thanks for the feedback.

    > My ISP (whose email
    > service I don't use) had sudenly decided to
    > block port 25 for all users of the package I am
    > on.


    Good for them. That is a good idea. Providers need a way to prevent
    their many hundreds or thousands or millions of users who are trojanized
    from being the unwitting sources of spam.

    > Without telling anyone! I searched their
    > site for info and not a mention anywhere.


    The provider probably thinks that the customers should be doing one of
    two things with their mail. They should be using the provider's smtp
    server or they should be using some other mail provider's smtp server
    over authenticated smtp or over secure and authenticated. Those are
    typically not handled over port 25, but instead over port 587 or 465
    respectively.

    If you enable the customers to use port 25 to connect to some smtp
    server outside the network, that enables them to be spaminjectors by the
    trojanized smtp engine spewing out spam over port 25 direct to MX.

    > I
    > finally found pages of letters from disgruntled
    > fellow customers who'd had the same problem on a
    > forum.


    Searching is a good thing.



    --
    Mike Easter
    Mike Easter, Feb 22, 2008
    #16
  17. cornwall

    cornwall Guest

    Mike Easter wrote:
    > cornwall wrote:
    >> I discovered the problem.

    >
    > Good. Thanks for the feedback.
    >
    >> My ISP (whose email
    >> service I don't use) had sudenly decided to
    >> block port 25 for all users of the package I am
    >> on.

    >
    > Good for them. That is a good idea. Providers need a way to prevent
    > their many hundreds or thousands or millions of users who are trojanized
    > from being the unwitting sources of spam.
    >
    >> Without telling anyone! I searched their
    >> site for info and not a mention anywhere.

    >
    > The provider probably thinks that the customers should be doing one of
    > two things with their mail. They should be using the provider's smtp
    > server or they should be using some other mail provider's smtp server
    > over authenticated smtp or over secure and authenticated. Those are
    > typically not handled over port 25, but instead over port 587 or 465
    > respectively.
    >
    > If you enable the customers to use port 25 to connect to some smtp
    > server outside the network, that enables them to be spaminjectors by the
    > trojanized smtp engine spewing out spam over port 25 direct to MX.
    >
    >> I
    >> finally found pages of letters from disgruntled
    >> fellow customers who'd had the same problem on a
    >> forum.

    >
    > Searching is a good thing.
    >
    >
    >

    I've no objection to them doing it, I just wish
    they'd had the good grace to tell people!
    cornwall, Feb 22, 2008
    #17
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