Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller + 5D - take multiple exposures on a single frame?

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by paro, Apr 5, 2007.

  1. paro

    paro Guest

    Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used with a
    5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame? Like, an
    image of the moon taken every hour, all on the same image? I've read on the
    canon page for this product but cannot disambiguate the terminology.
    Thanks
     
    paro, Apr 5, 2007
    #1
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  2. paro

    Ken Lucke Guest

    In article <>, paro wrote:

    > Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used with
    > a
    > 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame? Like, an
    > image of the moon taken every hour, all on the same image? I've read on the
    > canon page for this product but cannot disambiguate the terminology.
    > Thanks


    It trips the shutter just as if you had pressed the shutter button
    yourself, including autofocusing if the camera is set to it, with a
    self-timer up to 99:59:59 delay before the first shot, intervals up to
    99:59:59 between each shot, exposures up to 99:59:59 in length each,
    and up to 99 exposures per iteration.

    So unless the 5D allows multiple exposures (I don't think it does),
    then it won't work. Of course, if it DOES allow them, then it will.

    --
    You need only reflect that one of the best ways to get yourself a
    reputation as a dangerous citizen these days is to go about repeating
    the very phrases which our founding fathers used in the struggle for
    independence.
    -- Charles A. Beard
     
    Ken Lucke, Apr 5, 2007
    #2
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  3. paro

    paro Guest

    On 04/04/2007 Ken Lucke <> wrote:
    >In article <>, paro wrote:
    >
    >> Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used with
    >> a
    >> 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame? Like, an
    >> image of the moon taken every hour, all on the same image? I've read on

    the
    >> canon page for this product but cannot disambiguate the terminology.
    >> Thanks

    >
    >It trips the shutter just as if you had pressed the shutter button
    >yourself, including autofocusing if the camera is set to it, with a
    >self-timer up to 99:59:59 delay before the first shot, intervals up to
    >99:59:59 between each shot, exposures up to 99:59:59 in length each,
    >and up to 99 exposures per iteration.
    >
    >So unless the 5D allows multiple exposures (I don't think it does),
    >then it won't work. Of course, if it DOES allow them, then it will.
    >


    OK, thanks for that response...anyone with good working knowledge of the 5D
    who can tell me if it's going to be possible?
     
    paro, Apr 5, 2007
    #3
  4. paro writes:

    > Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when
    > used with a 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single
    > frame?


    Why would you want to do that, versus post-processing?
     
    Richard J Kinch, Apr 5, 2007
    #4
  5. paro

    paro Guest

    On 04/04/2007 Richard J Kinch <> wrote:
    >paro writes:
    >
    >> Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when
    >> used with a 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single
    >> frame?

    >
    >Why would you want to do that, versus post-processing?


    I'm not sure what you mean by post processing. You mean digitally blend
    images? I've just never done that, though I have photoshop. I am coming from
    fairly in depth film camera experience, but a long time ago...at that time an
    image like I posited was doable depending on the camera one had. I'd expect an
    advanced camera like the 5d to offer such but someone that is more on the
    nikon side of things said something to the effect that this feature is present
    on most nikons (or some, I don't know) but not the 5d. I'd not be averse to
    doing things the digital way, but would also like to know what the camera +
    controllers can do before photoshop etc get involved.
     
    paro, Apr 5, 2007
    #5
  6. paro

    Annika1980 Guest

    On Apr 5, 2:58 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    > I'd not be averse to
    > doing things the digital way, but would also like to know what the camera +
    > controllers can do before photoshop etc get involved.


    Not a problem with the 20D:
    http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969

    I don't believe that the 5D has the function you seek. Probably just
    as well since a true double-exposure doesn't look as good as one done
    digitally.
    For example, if there was a bright star or planet near the moon it
    could appear right inside the moon on the next shot in the sequence.
     
    Annika1980, Apr 5, 2007
    #6
  7. paro

    paro Guest

    On 05/04/2007 "Annika1980" <> wrote:
    >On Apr 5, 2:58 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    >> I'd not be averse to
    >> doing things the digital way, but would also like to know what the camera +
    >> controllers can do before photoshop etc get involved.

    >
    >Not a problem with the 20D:
    >http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969
    >
    >I don't believe that the 5D has the function you seek. Probably just
    >as well since a true double-exposure doesn't look as good as one done
    >digitally.
    >For example, if there was a bright star or planet near the moon it
    >could appear right inside the moon on the next shot in the sequence.
    >


    It might be that you are not that well attuned to astronomy, the moon and the
    stars move almost at the same rate in the night sky, so you'd not likely see
    them cross paths in a photo <g>. But anyways, I'm not sure why digitally
    merging several images wouldn't create the same potential issue?

    But the photo of the pitcher made me wonder, with a multiple exposure like
    that, there would seem to be issues with lighting. I mean, the pitcher himself
    in each exposure reflects the light for a single exposure; but the anything
    static in the image (background, pitcher's mound) would have four exposure's
    worth of light built up. Not apparent in that image though. And how do you
    know that Bret is using a 20D and that that image is a multiple exposure? I
    couldn't find anything on the site.
     
    paro, Apr 5, 2007
    #7
  8. paro

    paro Guest

    On 05/04/2007 "paro" <paro> wrote:
    >On 05/04/2007 "Annika1980" <> wrote:
    >>On Apr 5, 2:58 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    >>> I'd not be averse to
    >>> doing things the digital way, but would also like to know what the camera +
    >>> controllers can do before photoshop etc get involved.

    >>
    >>Not a problem with the 20D:
    >>http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969
    >>
    >>I don't believe that the 5D has the function you seek. Probably just
    >>as well since a true double-exposure doesn't look as good as one done
    >>digitally.
    >>For example, if there was a bright star or planet near the moon it
    >>could appear right inside the moon on the next shot in the sequence.
    >>

    >

    I've not done the post processing that would make this kind of multiple
    exposure effect, but I think I can see what you meant by saying that with the
    digital approach, one could avoid image overlap issues. I guess one can
    somehow select the target object and have it render in a completely opaque
    manner, so no overlapping. The pitcher image shows no overlapping at all...but
    you said it was not done digitally?
     
    paro, Apr 5, 2007
    #8
  9. paro

    J. Clarke Guest

    paro wrote:
    > On 05/04/2007 "Annika1980" <> wrote:
    >> On Apr 5, 2:58 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    >>> I'd not be averse to
    >>> doing things the digital way, but would also like to know what the
    >>> camera + controllers can do before photoshop etc get involved.

    >>
    >> Not a problem with the 20D:
    >> http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969
    >>
    >> I don't believe that the 5D has the function you seek. Probably just
    >> as well since a true double-exposure doesn't look as good as one done
    >> digitally.
    >> For example, if there was a bright star or planet near the moon it
    >> could appear right inside the moon on the next shot in the sequence.
    >>

    >
    > It might be that you are not that well attuned to astronomy, the moon
    > and the stars move almost at the same rate in the night sky, so you'd
    > not likely see them cross paths in a photo <g>. But anyways, I'm not
    > sure why digitally merging several images wouldn't create the same
    > potential issue?


    In astrophography with a clock drive this is not an issue. In
    photography with the camera in a fixed orientation all astronomical
    bodies will move between exposures. If you're doing multiple exposures
    on the same frame then the risk described does occur and further if the
    exposure is long enough to show stars then you're going to see multiple
    sky images slightly displaced. Editing this out of a single-frame
    multiple exposure would be a pain in the butt, doing it from multiple
    frames you can just block the sky out on all but one.

    > But the photo of the pitcher made me wonder, with a multiple exposure
    > like that, there would seem to be issues with lighting. I mean, the
    > pitcher himself in each exposure reflects the light for a single
    > exposure; but the anything static in the image (background, pitcher's
    > mound) would have four exposure's worth of light built up. Not
    > apparent in that image though. And how do you know that Bret is using
    > a 20D and that that image is a multiple exposure? I couldn't find
    > anything on the site.


    --
    --
    --John
    to email, dial "usenet" and validate
    (was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)
     
    J. Clarke, Apr 5, 2007
    #9
  10. paro

    Annika1980 Guest

    On Apr 5, 9:54 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    > >Not a problem with the 20D:
    > >http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969


    > It might be that you are not that well attuned to astronomy, the moon and the
    > stars move almost at the same rate in the night sky, so you'd not likely see
    > them cross paths in a photo <g>.


    No shit, Sagan.
    I'm attuned enough to know that if you took photo #1 with the moon and
    the star in their respective positions, and then later took photo #2
    after both of them have moved, there is a chance that the moon in the
    second photo will occupy the same spot as the star in the first. So
    doing a double-exposure will show the two moons, the second of which
    has a star inside it.
    Compositing the photos digitally gives a better result since you would
    avoid the "ghosting" that occurs with traditional multiple-exposures.

    >
    > But the photo of the pitcher made me wonder, with a multiple exposure like
    > that, there would seem to be issues with lighting. I mean, the pitcher himself
    > in each exposure reflects the light for a single exposure; but the anything
    > static in the image (background, pitcher's mound) would have four exposure's
    > worth of light built up. Not apparent in that image though. And how do you
    > know that Bret is using a 20D and that that image is a multiple exposure? I
    > couldn't find anything on the site.



    It was a joke. Obviously, that photo was a digital composite.
    Otherwise, you'd have a ghost pitcher (or a ghost pitcher picture)
    which you could see right through.
     
    Annika1980, Apr 6, 2007
    #10
  11. Re: Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller + 5D - take multiple exposureson a single frame?

    paro wrote:
    > Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used with a
    > 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame?


    No, it doesn't provide that functionality.

    --
    Derek Fountain on the web at http://www.derekfountain.org/
     
    Derek Fountain, Apr 7, 2007
    #11
  12. Re: Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller + 5D - take multiple exposureson a single frame?

    Derek Fountain wrote:
    > paro wrote:
    >> Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used with a
    >> 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame?

    >
    > No, it doesn't provide that functionality.
    >


    The question is then, how does one add exposures? To get the
    effect of exposing on one frame, one should add the raw files,
    before gamma correction, that is, with a gamma of one.
    This is easy to do using the Canon-supplied RAW -> TIF convertor
    and Photoshop. Convert to TIF using the Canon-supplied
    Digital Photo Professional, set to "linear". Then make
    each exposure a new layer in Photoshop, adjusting the
    opacity to make them add up right. Flatten the image, and
    finally use Curves to correct the appearance. You will need
    a curve with at least three correction points other than the
    two at the ends. It should rise steeply from zero, and the
    slowly flatten out.

    This actually works perfectly. This might be a good case for
    buying CS3, with its "active layers". Has anybody tried it
    in CS3?

    Doug McDonald
     
    Doug McDonald, Apr 7, 2007
    #12
  13. Re: Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller + 5D - take multiple exposureson a single frame?

    Doug McDonald wrote:

    >
    > The question is then, how does one add exposures? To get the
    > effect of exposing on one frame, one should add the raw files,
    > before gamma correction, that is, with a gamma of one.
    > This is easy to do using the Canon-supplied RAW -> TIF convertor
    > and Photoshop. Convert to TIF using the Canon-supplied
    > Digital Photo Professional, set to "linear". Then make
    > each exposure a new layer in Photoshop, adjusting the
    > opacity to make them add up right. Flatten the image, and
    > finally use Curves to correct the appearance.


    I should have added that you really need to do this with 16 bit
    files. Without the original correction using gamma correction,
    8 bit files result in banding.

    A good place to start with Curves is with three intermediate
    points at 16, 93 and 45,166 and 120,222, with the ends
    at the usual 0,0 and 255,255. Small changes from these will
    result in a pleasing result.

    Doug McDonald
     
    Doug McDonald, Apr 7, 2007
    #13
  14. paro

    paro Guest

    On 05/04/2007 "Annika1980" <> wrote:
    >On Apr 5, 9:54 am, "paro" <paro> wrote:
    >> >Not a problem with the 20D:
    >> >http://www.pbase.com/bret/image/64251969

    >
    >> It might be that you are not that well attuned to astronomy, the moon and the
    >> stars move almost at the same rate in the night sky, so you'd not likely see
    >> them cross paths in a photo <g>.

    >
    >No shit, Sagan.
    >I'm attuned enough to know that if you took photo #1 with the moon and
    >the star in their respective positions, and then later took photo #2
    >after both of them have moved, there is a chance that the moon in the
    >second photo will occupy the same spot as the star in the first. So
    >doing a double-exposure will show the two moons, the second of which
    >has a star inside it.
    >Compositing the photos digitally gives a better result since you would
    >avoid the "ghosting" that occurs with traditional multiple-exposures.
    >
    >>
    >> But the photo of the pitcher made me wonder, with a multiple exposure like
    >> that, there would seem to be issues with lighting. I mean, the pitcher

    himself
    >> in each exposure reflects the light for a single exposure; but the anything
    >> static in the image (background, pitcher's mound) would have four exposure's
    >> worth of light built up. Not apparent in that image though. And how do you
    >> know that Bret is using a 20D and that that image is a multiple exposure? I
    >> couldn't find anything on the site.

    >
    >
    >It was a joke. Obviously, that photo was a digital composite.
    >Otherwise, you'd have a ghost pitcher (or a ghost pitcher picture)
    >which you could see right through.
    >


    I've zero exposure to digital composites or multiple exposures on a single
    frame, either one, so I took the statement at face value, though it didn't
    seem to match what you'd said before.
     
    paro, Apr 8, 2007
    #14
  15. paro

    paro Guest

    On 07/04/2007 Derek Fountain <> wrote:
    >paro wrote:
    >> Does anyone know if the Canon TC-80N3 Timer Remote Controller when used

    with a
    >> 5D would allow one to take multiple exposures on a single frame?

    >
    >No, it doesn't provide that functionality.
    >


    Thanks, that's the info I was looking for.
     
    paro, Apr 8, 2007
    #15
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