Canon G7 announced

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Daniel Silevitch, Sep 14, 2006.

  1. There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    answer is "yes".

    http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp

    The overview:
    "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7 features a
    new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD and a 6x
    (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens. The G7 also sports a hot
    shoe, face detection software and ISO settings up to 1600.
    Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which appears to
    have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact models -
    presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital SLRs."

    -dms
     
    Daniel Silevitch, Sep 14, 2006
    #1
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  2. On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:15:53 GMT, Daniel Silevitch <> wrote:
    > There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    > continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    > answer is "yes".
    >
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp
    >
    > The overview:
    > "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    > replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7 features a
    > new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD and a 6x
    > (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens. The G7 also sports a hot
    > shoe, face detection software and ISO settings up to 1600.
    > Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which appears to
    > have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact models -
    > presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital SLRs."


    Following up to myself, I have to giggle slightly at this product shot:
    http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/canon2/PowerShot-G7-w-580EX.jpg

    The camera looks like an accessory hanging off of the flash, rather than
    the more normal other way around.

    -dms
     
    Daniel Silevitch, Sep 14, 2006
    #2
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  3. Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    > On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:15:53 GMT, Daniel Silevitch
    > <> wrote:
    >> There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    >> continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review,
    >> the answer is "yes".
    >>
    >> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp
    >>
    >> The overview:
    >> "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    >> replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7
    >> features a new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD
    >> and a 6x (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens. The G7 also
    >> sports a hot shoe, face detection software and ISO settings up to
    >> 1600. Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which
    >> appears to have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact
    >> models - presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital
    >> SLRs."

    >
    > Following up to myself, I have to giggle slightly at this product
    > shot:
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/canon2/PowerShot-G7-w-580EX.jpg
    >
    > The camera looks like an accessory hanging off of the flash, rather
    > than
    > the more normal other way around.
    >
    > -dms


    Yes, quite!

    Do you think this means there will be no S4 IS? The G7 zoom is a little
    limited at 210mm (equivalent) .... but otherwise there is quite a lot of
    overlap. No EVF either.

    David
     
    David J Taylor, Sep 14, 2006
    #3
  4. On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:50:40 GMT, David J Taylor <-this-bit.nor-this-part.uk> wrote:
    >
    > Do you think this means there will be no S4 IS? The G7 zoom is a little
    > limited at 210mm (equivalent) .... but otherwise there is quite a lot of
    > overlap. No EVF either.


    Different target audience, I would guess. Note that at a suggested list
    price of somewhat above $500, it's quite a bit pricier than the $400 S3.
    Bigger sensor, more pixels, flash hot shoe, the dedicated ISO dial,
    etc., separate this from the S series.

    Looking at the pictures, it has an optical finder, rather than an EVF.

    -dms
     
    Daniel Silevitch, Sep 14, 2006
    #4
  5. Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    > On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:50:40 GMT, David J Taylor
    > <-this-bit.nor-this-part.uk> wrote:
    >>
    >> Do you think this means there will be no S4 IS? The G7 zoom is a
    >> little limited at 210mm (equivalent) .... but otherwise there is
    >> quite a lot of overlap. No EVF either.

    >
    > Different target audience, I would guess. Note that at a suggested
    > list
    > price of somewhat above $500, it's quite a bit pricier than the $400
    > S3.
    > Bigger sensor, more pixels, flash hot shoe, the dedicated ISO dial,
    > etc., separate this from the S series.
    >
    > Looking at the pictures, it has an optical finder, rather than an EVF.
    >
    > -dms


    Yes, I agree. Surprising that Canon choose to make their S3/S4 IS cameras
    a middle-of-the-road model rather than a flagship model.

    David
     
    David J Taylor, Sep 14, 2006
    #5
  6. Daniel Silevitch

    Philippe Guest

    David J Taylor wrote:
    > Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    >
    >>On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 14:50:40 GMT, David J Taylor
    >><-this-bit.nor-this-part.uk> wrote:
    >>
    >>>Do you think this means there will be no S4 IS? The G7 zoom is a
    >>>little limited at 210mm (equivalent) .... but otherwise there is
    >>>quite a lot of overlap. No EVF either.

    >>
    >>Different target audience, I would guess. Note that at a suggested
    >>list
    >>price of somewhat above $500, it's quite a bit pricier than the $400
    >>S3.
    >>Bigger sensor, more pixels, flash hot shoe, the dedicated ISO dial,
    >>etc., separate this from the S series.
    >>
    >>Looking at the pictures, it has an optical finder, rather than an EVF.
    >>
    >>-dms

    >
    >
    > Yes, I agree. Surprising that Canon choose to make their S3/S4 IS cameras
    > a middle-of-the-road model rather than a flagship model.
    >
    > David
    >
    >

    you and me both.. I'm hooked on the G series right now, but the G7 is
    making me think fairly seriously about either stopping and looking at
    the S2 or just saving up and hitting DSLR a little earlier than I
    planned..

    :(
    P.

    --
    I do *NOT* have a short attention sp...(Oooh!! shiny!!)
     
    Philippe, Sep 14, 2006
    #6
  7. Daniel Silevitch

    bugbear Guest

    Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    > Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which appears to
    > have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact models -
    > presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital SLRs."


    Hmm - it must be, since in software terms,
    raw output is the easiest, and is pretty much a
    zero-cost feature.

    BugBear
     
    bugbear, Sep 14, 2006
    #7
  8. Daniel Silevitch

    SMS Guest

    Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    > There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    > continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    > answer is "yes".
    >
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp


    <snip>

    They also dropped the tilt, twist and swivel LCD, which was a very
    useful feature on the G series.

    Still, the G7 is probably going to end up being the best
    image-stabilized compact camera in terms of lens quality, noise, and
    features (other than the lack of RAW).
     
    SMS, Sep 14, 2006
    #8
  9. Daniel Silevitch

    Kinon O'Cann Guest

    No RAW??!!

    Canon dropped RAW support on this one? What an amazingly stupid move!

    WTF?????

    "Daniel Silevitch" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    > continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    > answer is "yes".
    >
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp
    >
    > The overview:
    > "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    > replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7 features a
    > new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD and a 6x
    > (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens. The G7 also sports a hot
    > shoe, face detection software and ISO settings up to 1600.
    > Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which appears to
    > have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact models -
    > presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital SLRs."
    >
    > -dms
     
    Kinon O'Cann, Sep 14, 2006
    #9
  10. Daniel Silevitch

    Keith Guest

    Daniel Silevitch <> wrote:

    > There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    > continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    > answer is "yes".
    >
    > http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp
    >
    > The overview:
    > "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    > replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7 features a
    > new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD and a 6x
    > (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens. The G7 also sports a hot
    > shoe, face detection software and ISO settings up to 1600.
    > Disappointingly what it doesn't have is a raw mode, which appears to
    > have been completely dropped by Canon for its compact models -
    > presumably to protect the sales of entry-level digital SLRs."
    >
    > -dms


    No RAW though... what were they thinking....!
     
    Keith, Sep 14, 2006
    #10
  11. Daniel Silevitch

    Guest

    SMS wrote:

    > They also dropped the tilt, twist and swivel LCD, which was a very
    > useful feature on the G series.


    And it's hard for me to envision spending that kind of money on a
    camera whose widest focal length is 35 mm equivalent.

    Bill
     
    , Sep 14, 2006
    #11
  12. On Thu, 14 Sep 2006 09:55:43 -0700, SMS <> wrote:
    > Daniel Silevitch wrote:
    >> There was some speculation here recently about whether Canon would
    >> continue their G series. According to a press release on DP Review, the
    >> answer is "yes".
    >>
    >> http://www.dpreview.com/news/0609/06091405_canon_g7.asp

    >
    ><snip>
    >
    > They also dropped the tilt, twist and swivel LCD, which was a very
    > useful feature on the G series.
    >
    > Still, the G7 is probably going to end up being the best
    > image-stabilized compact camera in terms of lens quality, noise, and
    > features (other than the lack of RAW).


    From all reports, the Panasonic LX series has a very good lens, though
    of course it has the notoriously noisy sensor. It does have RAW support,
    which helps somewhat. That's one vaguely equivalent model; there are
    probably a few others across different makers' lines.

    -dms
     
    Daniel Silevitch, Sep 14, 2006
    #12
  13. Daniel Silevitch

    ASAAR Guest

    On 14 Sep 2006 12:43:24 -0700, wrote:

    >> They also dropped the tilt, twist and swivel LCD, which was a very
    >> useful feature on the G series.

    >
    > And it's hard for me to envision spending that kind of money on a
    > camera whose widest focal length is 35 mm equivalent.


    The lens IIRC is smaller than before and the distinctive G series
    shape is gone. Assuming that its lens is still of high quality, the
    camera is stealthily trying to hide its heritage, resembling just
    another humdrum P&S with a traditional camera silhouette.
     
    ASAAR, Sep 14, 2006
    #13
  14. "Daniel Silevitch" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    [ . . . ]
    > "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact to
    > replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7 features a
    > new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD


    Heh. Pixel cramming.


    > and a 6x
    > (35-200mm equiv.) image stabilized zoom lens.


    Which (inevitably, I suppose) loses the earlier G series' nice f/2.0 at the
    short end.

    Neil
     
    Neil Harrington, Sep 15, 2006
    #14
  15. Daniel Silevitch

    Petri Lopia Guest

    Re: No RAW??!!

    On 2006-09-14, Kinon O'Cann <> wrote:
    > Canon dropped RAW support on this one? What an amazingly stupid move!


    Looks like it =( I really liked my G5 and really weird if Canon has dropped
    RAW on G7... RAW would make G7 pretty nice camera.

    --
    Petri Lopia :: lid
    StormChasing/Myrskynbongaus etc. Lightnings/Salamoita yms.
    http://www.petrilopia.net/
    http://www.pbase.com/whig/
     
    Petri Lopia, Sep 15, 2006
    #15
  16. "Neil Harrington" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    >
    > "Daniel Silevitch" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    > [ . . . ]
    >> "Canon has finally announced the long-awaited new G series compact
    >> to replace the G6 (launched August 2004). The $550 PowerShot G7
    >> features a new Digic III processor, 10 megapixel (1/1.8-inch) CCD.

    >
    > Heh. Pixel cramming.


    Yes, that equates to slightly less than 2 micron pixel pitch.
    It will be interesting to see what the noise reduction quality of the
    Digic III will be able to do, as it would indicate what can be
    expected from newer Digic III based dSLRs.

    Too bad it will also inevitably hurt Dynamic Range, unless the user
    has an option to apply binning/averaging.

    --
    Bart
     
    Bart van der Wolf, Sep 15, 2006
    #16
  17. Daniel Silevitch

    Alfred Molon Guest

    In article <450aea49$0$4519$4all.nl>, Bart van der Wolf
    says...

    > Too bad it will also inevitably hurt Dynamic Range, unless the user
    > has an option to apply binning/averaging.


    If they offered double exposure (a very short exposure followed by a
    longer exposure) they could solve the dynamic range issue.
    --

    Alfred Molon
    ------------------------------
    Olympus 50X0, 7070, 8080, E300, E330 and E500 forum at
    http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
    Olympus E330 resource - http://myolympus.org/E330/
     
    Alfred Molon, Sep 16, 2006
    #17
  18. On Sat, 16 Sep 2006 10:01:48 +0200, Alfred Molon <> wrote:
    > In article <450aea49$0$4519$4all.nl>, Bart van der Wolf
    > says...
    >
    >> Too bad it will also inevitably hurt Dynamic Range, unless the user
    >> has an option to apply binning/averaging.

    >
    > If they offered double exposure (a very short exposure followed by a
    > longer exposure) they could solve the dynamic range issue.


    I'm sure that it will support exposure bracketing, which would amount to
    the same thing. Better use a tripod if you are planning on merging
    multiple shots, though.

    -dms
     
    Daniel Silevitch, Sep 16, 2006
    #18
  19. Daniel Silevitch

    Alfred Molon Guest

    In article <>, Daniel Silevitch
    says...

    > >> Too bad it will also inevitably hurt Dynamic Range, unless the user
    > >> has an option to apply binning/averaging.

    > >
    > > If they offered double exposure (a very short exposure followed by a
    > > longer exposure) they could solve the dynamic range issue.

    >
    > I'm sure that it will support exposure bracketing, which would amount to
    > the same thing. Better use a tripod if you are planning on merging
    > multiple shots, though.


    Yes, but it's messy and time consuming assembling two bracketed images
    after the fact. If you took two measurements for each pixel, one under-
    and one overexposed and integrated these in the camera, you would
    effectively increase the dynamic range.

    For instance, if one pixel was overexposed with the long exposure time,
    it would most likely not be so with the short exposure time. So you
    would not use the overexposed measurement and instead use the
    underexposed measurement, which would then be multiplied by a constant
    factor to account for the shorter exposure time.
    --

    Alfred Molon
    ------------------------------
    Olympus 50X0, 7070, 8080, E300, E330 and E500 forum at
    http://tech.groups.yahoo.com/group/MyOlympus/
    Olympus E330 resource - http://myolympus.org/E330/
     
    Alfred Molon, Sep 16, 2006
    #19
  20. "Alfred Molon" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > In article <450aea49$0$4519$4all.nl>, Bart van der
    > Wolf
    > says...
    >
    >> Too bad it will also inevitably hurt Dynamic Range, unless the user
    >> has an option to apply binning/averaging.

    >
    > If they offered double exposure (a very short exposure followed by a
    > longer exposure) they could solve the dynamic range issue.


    Not really, because the image will be swamped by photon noise relative
    to the well depth. Even if we were to very liberally assume a 2x2
    micron area per sensel, and say 1000 electrons per square micron, that
    would result in a well depth of 4000 electrons maximum. The dynamic
    range would then be something like 4000:63 (assuming a read noise
    significantly below photon noise of 63), or almost 6 stops, at best
    (!). Binning a 4x4 array of sensels would add another stop of DR.

    That is even the case if you tonemap the image by a non-linear
    operation on silicon. Combining multiple seperately recorded exposures
    like in HDR imaging is always possible, but not too useful for moving
    subjects like e.g. children, or cars passing by, etc., without a lot
    of postprocessing not available in current cameras.

    --
    Bart
     
    Bart van der Wolf, Sep 17, 2006
    #20
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