Canon EOS 300D User: Tempted By Nikon D50

Discussion in 'Digital Photography' started by Larry R Harrison Jr, Jul 11, 2005.

  1. I know one can easily get tired of these long-winded "Nikon D70s vs EOS
    350D" type of posts, so I hope I'm not adding to the crap-heap. My post is a
    bit different.

    I am an amateur at BEST, only recently the last year or so have I really
    taken any quality types of shots. Regardless, all along, I shot Nikon
    totally until last year when I sold all my film gear--lenses and all--and
    got the Digital Rebel. Got it used for $565 w/lens back last Nov when they
    were typically $675 or so used, and $900 or so new. Quite a deal. At the
    time, I really coveted the D70 but couldn't get it as cheaply--in large part
    because Nikon didn't have the cheap (but pretty good, I'm told) 18-55 lens
    at that time, Canon did--and I shoot way more wide-angle than telephoto.

    Prior to that, the same year, I had purchased a Nikon Coolpix 5700--my 1st
    "serious" digital after a 2MP Nikon CP775--and got much better results than
    I ever had with my Nikon N80. I LOVED the N80 but apparently I was just more
    suitable for digital than film-work; perhaps the instant review let me know
    what I had or hadn't done and/or free film costs (as it were) allowed me a
    chance to really practice. Whatever, I'm much better now--and loving
    digital, that's the reason I sold the Nikon N80 & all its accessories (which
    was only a $50 Sunpak flash and the 28-100 and 70-300 G-lenses anyway).

    That said, my "heart" belongs to Nikon as it were, and I'm tempted to sell
    my EOS 300D and go with the Nikon D50. I only have the 18-55 and 70-300
    Tamron lens, the wired remote, extra generic battery (works better than the
    Canon-one) and a SanDisk Ultra II 512 megabyte card. So I'm not heavily
    "vested."

    But I'm tempted to "come back home to Nikon" via the D50. Someone would take
    all my gear off my hands for $600--my Af-sensors don't illuminate (but they
    AF fine) since I had a local guy fix the mirror box & I think he forgot to
    reconnect those wires or something--and I found the D50 selling for $850
    new. So only $250 away, and I could have the D50.

    Meanwhile, someone is selling the D70 body-only for $650 shipped, about
    5,000 shutter uses.

    It is all tempting, especially the D50. The D70 is tempting and its
    viewfinder grid-lines would help as I do sometimes shoot crooked shots--and
    it will do wireless flash if I ever go that route (not likely to, nice
    capability though it is) and does CF cards instead of SD. And it would be
    cheaper to get initially. But I think the D50 is going to improve on the D70
    in terms of low-noise and such, and when I handled it I really liked it.
    Plus, as the D50 comes with a lens and the D70 deal doesn't, the initial
    savings is apt to be lost once I get whatever lens I get.

    All that said, I have gotten good photos out of the 300D--except for the
    ones that have been crooked--and it does have the advantages of:

    * ISO 100
    * Wired remote instead of wireless (I do take quite a few night-shots from
    behind the camera)
    * Illuminated LCD control panel (D50 doesn't)
    * Mirror lockup (don't use it much though)
    * Easier to go from "all-AF-points" mode to user-chosen AF-point mode (Nikon
    uses menus for that)
    * CF cards, not SD (vs D50)

    And, there would be no more financial investments.

    But I am REALLY enticed by the D50, largely to "come back" to Nikon--but
    ALSO because

    *300D browses too slow in playback mode, big pain in the neck if you're
    trying to delete "duds" to make room for more shots if the card nears
    fill-up
    *D50 is better in "burst" mode
    *Probably better high-ISO performance vs D70 OR EOS 300D
    *Easier to change user-chosen AF-point on-the-fly (Nintendo-pad for that vs
    push-button/turn wheel)
    *Flat-out newer technology overall
    *I also have Nikon CP5700, could do more software integration (then again, I
    have a Canon S50 w/RAW ability)

    At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're getting
    good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My 300D photos
    are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But then I do see
    those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't sell now, next year
    I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should sell now if I do intend
    to "come back" to Nikon.

    Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.

    LRH
     
    Larry R Harrison Jr, Jul 11, 2005
    #1
    1. Advertising

  2. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Mark² Guest

    "Larry R Harrison Jr" <> wrote in message
    news:3XiAe.70870$go.68436@fed1read05...

    <Snip of amazingly bizzare train of thought...>

    > At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're
    > getting good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My
    > 300D photos are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But then
    > I do see those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't sell now,
    > next year I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should sell now if I
    > do intend to "come back" to Nikon.
    >
    > Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.


    Re-read the first sentence of the above paragraph.
    It's the only part of your thinking that makes much sense.
    :)
    If you were basing it on your desire for a higher-end transition for more
    serious work...or some other specific need...sure.
    But you're talking about trading in your low end Canon for a low end Nikon.
    Your biggest gripe is that you can't take a shot that's not crooked.
    Wow.

    Nikon is great.
    Canon is great.
    But come now.
    You're thinking of getting rid of your nicely-producing gear...JUST for the
    name on the front???
    Again...Wow.

    Last thing:
    Never buy digital cameras for their re-sale value.
     
    Mark², Jul 11, 2005
    #2
    1. Advertising

  3. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Bill Hilton Guest

    > Any tips?

    Sounds like this is eating you up ... it's just a camera, so ease your
    mind and sell the Canon and return to Nikon. From your post that seems
    to be where your heart is :)

    Bill
    (Canon user)
     
    Bill Hilton, Jul 11, 2005
    #3
  4. Maybe you're right. Sometimes it takes someone saying something like that to
    shake you straight.

    Then again...

    ....I do know that the D50 does do SOME things I want & later on if I do
    "move up" to a fancier model (like a junior version of the Nikon D2x) I'm
    apt to want to do so in the Nikon camp then, so why not transition over now?

    Both points make sense I guess. Decisions, decisions.

    LRH
     
    Larry R Harrison Jr, Jul 11, 2005
    #4
  5. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Mark² Guest

    "Larry R Harrison Jr" <> wrote in message
    news:c%lAe.70912$go.4309@fed1read05...
    > Maybe you're right. Sometimes it takes someone saying something like that
    > to shake you straight.
    >
    > Then again...
    >
    > ...I do know that the D50 does do SOME things I want & later on if I do
    > "move up" to a fancier model (like a junior version of the Nikon D2x) I'm
    > apt to want to do so in the Nikon camp then, so why not transition over
    > now?
    >
    > Both points make sense I guess. Decisions, decisions.
    >
    > LRH


    At this point, you don' have THAT much invested.
    So...to contradict myself...if you're going to switch, now's better than
    later.

    I really think you might do well to take a serious look at the whole lens
    system, and over-all feel for handling, etc., because regarless of which
    body you end up with, the lenses from that system will stay with you far
    longer than any body likely will.
    Next, think seriously about your future intentions regarding investment of
    big $$. If you pland to spend big $$ in the future, then the fact that
    you're not all that invested at this poing means you stand to lose ONLY if
    you make a hasty decision. I used to be the king of the returned item.
    Now, I'm a very good shopper, and rarely take things back--because I'm VERY
    careful before the purchase. Not slow...just selective and thoghtfully
    careful.

    BTW--There is no "jr. version of the D2x," and it's pretty iffy strategy to
    bank on what you hope might exist in the future.
    Look at the two lines now. Who has what you need? What will you want to
    spend? What sort of lenses will you want and at what level of performance?
    Is Image stabilization important to you? If so, both offer them, but only
    Canon gives you both low and high-level options for IS. Do you want spot
    metering? Canon has it at the high end, but not low.

    The fastest drop-off in what your camera will sell for has already happened
    (the minute you opened the box). You'd be amazed at what you can get for
    two-generation-old cameras on e-bay. Think of it in terms of how much value
    you'll lose from here going forward...BUT...also how much value there is in
    **waiting until you're sure you make the right decision.** While you might
    get an extra $50-100 by selling it right away...you might regret the switch,
    and end up with a much greater loss later...either monetary or simply in
    dissatisfaction. I say...when in doubt...wait a bit. A week or two (or 10)
    isn't going to see your value drop that much.

    Whatever you do, get over the name on the front of your camera.
    I'm a Canon user because I like what Canon offers me for my needs.
    Until you can clearly identify yours (NOT just what the differences
    are...but which system meets YOUR needs), you're shooting blind. Many
    people here (myself included) can rattle of advantages on BOTH sides, but
    few or non of those might be important to YOU.

    Rambling over...
    -Mark
     
    Mark², Jul 11, 2005
    #5
  6. I think too many times we get caught up in brand/technology envy. I
    thought about upgrading our 300D to a newer model but when I really
    thought about it is seemed a waste. Instead I just decided to improve
    MY ability to be more creative and to recognize great shooting
    opportunities. I can do far more to improve the quality of the pictures
    I produce by increasing my skill than by having the latest wiz-bang
    equipment.

    When it comes to photographers and their equipment, I equate it to
    taking two golfers, one a tour professional and the other a mediocre
    weekend hacker, and having them compete head to head. Do you think the
    outcome of the match would change if the professional used a $300 set of
    clubs and the hacker used a $10,000 set? To a large extent the same
    logic applies to photographers, IMHO.

    My advice is to not put so much emphasis on equipment and just enjoy
    honing your skills and capturing images that have great content. Just
    last night I was taking pictures of our neighbor's boy having fun
    lighting left over fireworks from the Fourth. I managed to take a shot
    with the 300D that many would find technically flawed but the look of
    excitement on the boy's face in one shot was priceless. I gave his
    mother a large print of it today and she loved it. Now, to me anyway,
    capturing this type of picture is what makes photography rewarding. To
    her it didn't matter what equipment I used. She was impressed by the
    content, which IMO, is as it should be.


    Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:
    > I know one can easily get tired of these long-winded "Nikon D70s vs EOS
    > 350D" type of posts, so I hope I'm not adding to the crap-heap. My post is a
    > bit different.
    >
    > I am an amateur at BEST, only recently the last year or so have I really
    > taken any quality types of shots. Regardless, all along, I shot Nikon
    > totally until last year when I sold all my film gear--lenses and all--and
    > got the Digital Rebel. Got it used for $565 w/lens back last Nov when they
    > were typically $675 or so used, and $900 or so new. Quite a deal. At the
    > time, I really coveted the D70 but couldn't get it as cheaply--in large part
    > because Nikon didn't have the cheap (but pretty good, I'm told) 18-55 lens
    > at that time, Canon did--and I shoot way more wide-angle than telephoto.
    >
    > Prior to that, the same year, I had purchased a Nikon Coolpix 5700--my 1st
    > "serious" digital after a 2MP Nikon CP775--and got much better results than
    > I ever had with my Nikon N80. I LOVED the N80 but apparently I was just more
    > suitable for digital than film-work; perhaps the instant review let me know
    > what I had or hadn't done and/or free film costs (as it were) allowed me a
    > chance to really practice. Whatever, I'm much better now--and loving
    > digital, that's the reason I sold the Nikon N80 & all its accessories (which
    > was only a $50 Sunpak flash and the 28-100 and 70-300 G-lenses anyway).
    >
    > That said, my "heart" belongs to Nikon as it were, and I'm tempted to sell
    > my EOS 300D and go with the Nikon D50. I only have the 18-55 and 70-300
    > Tamron lens, the wired remote, extra generic battery (works better than the
    > Canon-one) and a SanDisk Ultra II 512 megabyte card. So I'm not heavily
    > "vested."
    >
    > But I'm tempted to "come back home to Nikon" via the D50. Someone would take
    > all my gear off my hands for $600--my Af-sensors don't illuminate (but they
    > AF fine) since I had a local guy fix the mirror box & I think he forgot to
    > reconnect those wires or something--and I found the D50 selling for $850
    > new. So only $250 away, and I could have the D50.
    >
    > Meanwhile, someone is selling the D70 body-only for $650 shipped, about
    > 5,000 shutter uses.
    >
    > It is all tempting, especially the D50. The D70 is tempting and its
    > viewfinder grid-lines would help as I do sometimes shoot crooked shots--and
    > it will do wireless flash if I ever go that route (not likely to, nice
    > capability though it is) and does CF cards instead of SD. And it would be
    > cheaper to get initially. But I think the D50 is going to improve on the D70
    > in terms of low-noise and such, and when I handled it I really liked it.
    > Plus, as the D50 comes with a lens and the D70 deal doesn't, the initial
    > savings is apt to be lost once I get whatever lens I get.
    >
    > All that said, I have gotten good photos out of the 300D--except for the
    > ones that have been crooked--and it does have the advantages of:
    >
    > * ISO 100
    > * Wired remote instead of wireless (I do take quite a few night-shots from
    > behind the camera)
    > * Illuminated LCD control panel (D50 doesn't)
    > * Mirror lockup (don't use it much though)
    > * Easier to go from "all-AF-points" mode to user-chosen AF-point mode (Nikon
    > uses menus for that)
    > * CF cards, not SD (vs D50)
    >
    > And, there would be no more financial investments.
    >
    > But I am REALLY enticed by the D50, largely to "come back" to Nikon--but
    > ALSO because
    >
    > *300D browses too slow in playback mode, big pain in the neck if you're
    > trying to delete "duds" to make room for more shots if the card nears
    > fill-up
    > *D50 is better in "burst" mode
    > *Probably better high-ISO performance vs D70 OR EOS 300D
    > *Easier to change user-chosen AF-point on-the-fly (Nintendo-pad for that vs
    > push-button/turn wheel)
    > *Flat-out newer technology overall
    > *I also have Nikon CP5700, could do more software integration (then again, I
    > have a Canon S50 w/RAW ability)
    >
    > At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're getting
    > good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My 300D photos
    > are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But then I do see
    > those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't sell now, next year
    > I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should sell now if I do intend
    > to "come back" to Nikon.
    >
    > Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.
    >
    > LRH
    >
    >
     
    Michael Johnson, PE, Jul 11, 2005
    #6
  7. Thanks for your creative reply. It is food for thought.

    LRH


    "Michael Johnson, PE" <> wrote in message
    news:p...
    >I think too many times we get caught up in brand/technology envy. I
    >thought about upgrading our 300D to a newer model but when I really thought
    >about it is seemed a waste. Instead I just decided to improve MY ability
    >to be more creative and to recognize great shooting opportunities. I can
    >do far more to improve the quality of the pictures I produce by increasing
    >my skill than by having the latest wiz-bang equipment.
    >
    > When it comes to photographers and their equipment, I equate it to taking
    > two golfers, one a tour professional and the other a mediocre weekend
    > hacker, and having them compete head to head. Do you think the outcome of
    > the match would change if the professional used a $300 set of clubs and
    > the hacker used a $10,000 set? To a large extent the same logic applies
    > to photographers, IMHO.
    >
    > My advice is to not put so much emphasis on equipment and just enjoy
    > honing your skills and capturing images that have great content. Just
    > last night I was taking pictures of our neighbor's boy having fun lighting
    > left over fireworks from the Fourth. I managed to take a shot with the
    > 300D that many would find technically flawed but the look of excitement on
    > the boy's face in one shot was priceless. I gave his mother a large print
    > of it today and she loved it. Now, to me anyway, capturing this type of
    > picture is what makes photography rewarding. To her it didn't matter what
    > equipment I used. She was impressed by the content, which IMO, is as it
    > should be.
    >
    >
    > Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:
    >> I know one can easily get tired of these long-winded "Nikon D70s vs EOS
    >> 350D" type of posts, so I hope I'm not adding to the crap-heap. My post
    >> is a bit different.
    >>
    >> I am an amateur at BEST, only recently the last year or so have I really
    >> taken any quality types of shots. Regardless, all along, I shot Nikon
    >> totally until last year when I sold all my film gear--lenses and all--and
    >> got the Digital Rebel. Got it used for $565 w/lens back last Nov when
    >> they were typically $675 or so used, and $900 or so new. Quite a deal. At
    >> the time, I really coveted the D70 but couldn't get it as cheaply--in
    >> large part because Nikon didn't have the cheap (but pretty good, I'm
    >> told) 18-55 lens at that time, Canon did--and I shoot way more wide-angle
    >> than telephoto.
    >>
    >> Prior to that, the same year, I had purchased a Nikon Coolpix 5700--my
    >> 1st "serious" digital after a 2MP Nikon CP775--and got much better
    >> results than I ever had with my Nikon N80. I LOVED the N80 but apparently
    >> I was just more suitable for digital than film-work; perhaps the instant
    >> review let me know what I had or hadn't done and/or free film costs (as
    >> it were) allowed me a chance to really practice. Whatever, I'm much
    >> better now--and loving digital, that's the reason I sold the Nikon N80 &
    >> all its accessories (which was only a $50 Sunpak flash and the 28-100 and
    >> 70-300 G-lenses anyway).
    >>
    >> That said, my "heart" belongs to Nikon as it were, and I'm tempted to
    >> sell my EOS 300D and go with the Nikon D50. I only have the 18-55 and
    >> 70-300 Tamron lens, the wired remote, extra generic battery (works better
    >> than the Canon-one) and a SanDisk Ultra II 512 megabyte card. So I'm not
    >> heavily "vested."
    >>
    >> But I'm tempted to "come back home to Nikon" via the D50. Someone would
    >> take all my gear off my hands for $600--my Af-sensors don't illuminate
    >> (but they AF fine) since I had a local guy fix the mirror box & I think
    >> he forgot to reconnect those wires or something--and I found the D50
    >> selling for $850 new. So only $250 away, and I could have the D50.
    >>
    >> Meanwhile, someone is selling the D70 body-only for $650 shipped, about
    >> 5,000 shutter uses.
    >>
    >> It is all tempting, especially the D50. The D70 is tempting and its
    >> viewfinder grid-lines would help as I do sometimes shoot crooked
    >> shots--and it will do wireless flash if I ever go that route (not likely
    >> to, nice capability though it is) and does CF cards instead of SD. And it
    >> would be cheaper to get initially. But I think the D50 is going to
    >> improve on the D70 in terms of low-noise and such, and when I handled it
    >> I really liked it. Plus, as the D50 comes with a lens and the D70 deal
    >> doesn't, the initial savings is apt to be lost once I get whatever lens I
    >> get.
    >>
    >> All that said, I have gotten good photos out of the 300D--except for the
    >> ones that have been crooked--and it does have the advantages of:
    >>
    >> * ISO 100
    >> * Wired remote instead of wireless (I do take quite a few night-shots
    >> from behind the camera)
    >> * Illuminated LCD control panel (D50 doesn't)
    >> * Mirror lockup (don't use it much though)
    >> * Easier to go from "all-AF-points" mode to user-chosen AF-point mode
    >> (Nikon uses menus for that)
    >> * CF cards, not SD (vs D50)
    >>
    >> And, there would be no more financial investments.
    >>
    >> But I am REALLY enticed by the D50, largely to "come back" to Nikon--but
    >> ALSO because
    >>
    >> *300D browses too slow in playback mode, big pain in the neck if you're
    >> trying to delete "duds" to make room for more shots if the card nears
    >> fill-up
    >> *D50 is better in "burst" mode
    >> *Probably better high-ISO performance vs D70 OR EOS 300D
    >> *Easier to change user-chosen AF-point on-the-fly (Nintendo-pad for that
    >> vs push-button/turn wheel)
    >> *Flat-out newer technology overall
    >> *I also have Nikon CP5700, could do more software integration (then
    >> again, I have a Canon S50 w/RAW ability)
    >>
    >> At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're
    >> getting good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My
    >> 300D photos are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But
    >> then I do see those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't
    >> sell now, next year I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should
    >> sell now if I do intend to "come back" to Nikon.
    >>
    >> Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.
    >>
    >> LRH
     
    Larry R Harrison Jr, Jul 11, 2005
    #7
  8. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Pete D Guest

    Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the manufacturers
    are so close in results that it does not matter which one you have. The most
    important thing is to get the one that handles best for you. If you prefer
    the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for you, if you like the
    E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature like mirror lockup then
    make sure that is included. There is a couple of features I find important,
    mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have both or I will not look, what is
    important to you???

    "Larry R Harrison Jr" <> wrote in message
    news:3XiAe.70870$go.68436@fed1read05...
    >I know one can easily get tired of these long-winded "Nikon D70s vs EOS
    >350D" type of posts, so I hope I'm not adding to the crap-heap. My post is
    >a bit different.
    >
    > I am an amateur at BEST, only recently the last year or so have I really
    > taken any quality types of shots. Regardless, all along, I shot Nikon
    > totally until last year when I sold all my film gear--lenses and all--and
    > got the Digital Rebel. Got it used for $565 w/lens back last Nov when they
    > were typically $675 or so used, and $900 or so new. Quite a deal. At the
    > time, I really coveted the D70 but couldn't get it as cheaply--in large
    > part because Nikon didn't have the cheap (but pretty good, I'm told) 18-55
    > lens at that time, Canon did--and I shoot way more wide-angle than
    > telephoto.
    >
    > Prior to that, the same year, I had purchased a Nikon Coolpix 5700--my 1st
    > "serious" digital after a 2MP Nikon CP775--and got much better results
    > than I ever had with my Nikon N80. I LOVED the N80 but apparently I was
    > just more suitable for digital than film-work; perhaps the instant review
    > let me know what I had or hadn't done and/or free film costs (as it were)
    > allowed me a chance to really practice. Whatever, I'm much better now--and
    > loving digital, that's the reason I sold the Nikon N80 & all its
    > accessories (which was only a $50 Sunpak flash and the 28-100 and 70-300
    > G-lenses anyway).
    >
    > That said, my "heart" belongs to Nikon as it were, and I'm tempted to sell
    > my EOS 300D and go with the Nikon D50. I only have the 18-55 and 70-300
    > Tamron lens, the wired remote, extra generic battery (works better than
    > the Canon-one) and a SanDisk Ultra II 512 megabyte card. So I'm not
    > heavily "vested."
    >
    > But I'm tempted to "come back home to Nikon" via the D50. Someone would
    > take all my gear off my hands for $600--my Af-sensors don't illuminate
    > (but they AF fine) since I had a local guy fix the mirror box & I think he
    > forgot to reconnect those wires or something--and I found the D50 selling
    > for $850 new. So only $250 away, and I could have the D50.
    >
    > Meanwhile, someone is selling the D70 body-only for $650 shipped, about
    > 5,000 shutter uses.
    >
    > It is all tempting, especially the D50. The D70 is tempting and its
    > viewfinder grid-lines would help as I do sometimes shoot crooked
    > shots--and it will do wireless flash if I ever go that route (not likely
    > to, nice capability though it is) and does CF cards instead of SD. And it
    > would be cheaper to get initially. But I think the D50 is going to improve
    > on the D70 in terms of low-noise and such, and when I handled it I really
    > liked it. Plus, as the D50 comes with a lens and the D70 deal doesn't, the
    > initial savings is apt to be lost once I get whatever lens I get.
    >
    > All that said, I have gotten good photos out of the 300D--except for the
    > ones that have been crooked--and it does have the advantages of:
    >
    > * ISO 100
    > * Wired remote instead of wireless (I do take quite a few night-shots from
    > behind the camera)
    > * Illuminated LCD control panel (D50 doesn't)
    > * Mirror lockup (don't use it much though)
    > * Easier to go from "all-AF-points" mode to user-chosen AF-point mode
    > (Nikon uses menus for that)
    > * CF cards, not SD (vs D50)
    >
    > And, there would be no more financial investments.
    >
    > But I am REALLY enticed by the D50, largely to "come back" to Nikon--but
    > ALSO because
    >
    > *300D browses too slow in playback mode, big pain in the neck if you're
    > trying to delete "duds" to make room for more shots if the card nears
    > fill-up
    > *D50 is better in "burst" mode
    > *Probably better high-ISO performance vs D70 OR EOS 300D
    > *Easier to change user-chosen AF-point on-the-fly (Nintendo-pad for that
    > vs push-button/turn wheel)
    > *Flat-out newer technology overall
    > *I also have Nikon CP5700, could do more software integration (then again,
    > I have a Canon S50 w/RAW ability)
    >
    > At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're
    > getting good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My
    > 300D photos are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But then
    > I do see those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't sell now,
    > next year I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should sell now if I
    > do intend to "come back" to Nikon.
    >
    > Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.
    >
    > LRH
    >
     
    Pete D, Jul 11, 2005
    #8
  9. Pete,
    Going with the theory that the stupid question is the one not asked,
    I'll have to show my ignorance and ask why do you need mirror lockup?
    How is it a benefit?
    Paul


    Pete D wrote:
    > Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the manufacturers
    > are so close in results that it does not matter which one you have. The most
    > important thing is to get the one that handles best for you. If you prefer
    > the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for you, if you like the
    > E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature like mirror lockup then
    > make sure that is included. There is a couple of features I find important,
    > mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have both or I will not look, what is
    > important to you???
     
    Paul Schilter, Jul 11, 2005
    #9
  10. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Celcius Guest

    Paul,
    So that when you shoot a scene with a long shutter interval, the mirror will
    not jitter and perhaps "move" the camera...
    My 2 cents,
    Marcel


    "Paul Schilter" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > Pete,
    > Going with the theory that the stupid question is the one not asked,
    > I'll have to show my ignorance and ask why do you need mirror lockup?
    > How is it a benefit?
    > Paul
    >
    >
    > Pete D wrote:
    > > Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the

    manufacturers
    > > are so close in results that it does not matter which one you have. The

    most
    > > important thing is to get the one that handles best for you. If you

    prefer
    > > the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for you, if you like

    the
    > > E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature like mirror lockup

    then
    > > make sure that is included. There is a couple of features I find

    important,
    > > mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have both or I will not look,

    what is
    > > important to you???
     
    Celcius, Jul 11, 2005
    #10
  11. Marcel,
    Okay, that makes sense. Time exposure shots. Thanks.
    Paul



    Celcius wrote:
    > Paul,
    > So that when you shoot a scene with a long shutter interval, the mirror will
    > not jitter and perhaps "move" the camera...
    > My 2 cents,
    > Marcel
    >
    >
    > "Paul Schilter" <> wrote in message
    > news:...
    >
    >>Pete,
    >>Going with the theory that the stupid question is the one not asked,
    >>I'll have to show my ignorance and ask why do you need mirror lockup?
    >>How is it a benefit?
    >>Paul
    >>
    >>
    >>Pete D wrote:
    >>
    >>>Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the

    >
    > manufacturers
    >
    >>>are so close in results that it does not matter which one you have. The

    >
    > most
    >
    >>>important thing is to get the one that handles best for you. If you

    >
    > prefer
    >
    >>>the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for you, if you like

    >
    > the
    >
    >>>E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature like mirror lockup

    >
    > then
    >
    >>>make sure that is included. There is a couple of features I find

    >
    > important,
    >
    >>>mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have both or I will not look,

    >
    > what is
    >
    >>>important to you???

    >
    >
    >
     
    Paul Schilter, Jul 11, 2005
    #11
  12. Larry R Harrison Jr

    measekite Guest

    Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:

    >Maybe you're right. Sometimes it takes someone saying something like that to
    >shake you straight.
    >
    >Then again...
    >
    >...I do know that the D50 does do SOME things I want & later on if I do
    >"move up" to a fancier model (like a junior version of the Nikon D2x) I'm
    >apt to want to do so in the Nikon camp then, so why not transition over now?
    >
    >Both points make sense I guess. Decisions, decisions.
    >
    >LRH
    >
    >


    I too shoot Nikon Film Camera. When going to a DSLR I am planning
    (unless someone talks me out of it) to Canon. The great majority of
    people claim that Canon is way ahead of Nikon in the digital world. It
    is not like when Nikon built it's prestige and reputation in the Era of
    the Nikon F vs the latter introduced Canon F1.

    Yeh I think I know how you feel. For many years you felt the Nikon
    mistique and now that Canon is a head you are waiting for that next
    Nikon shoe to drop. And it does seem that Nikon lenses are slightly
    heavier duty in construction except for those very expensive L series
    lenses.

    But I think I know and feel what you are going through.

    >
    >
    >
     
    measekite, Jul 11, 2005
    #12
  13. Larry R Harrison Jr

    hyperoglyphe Guest

    "measekite" <> wrote in message
    news:KwCAe.1097$...
    >
    >
    > Larry R Harrison Jr wrote:
    >
    >>Maybe you're right. Sometimes it takes someone saying something like that
    >>to shake you straight.
    >>
    >>Then again...
    >>
    >>...I do know that the D50 does do SOME things I want & later on if I do
    >>"move up" to a fancier model (like a junior version of the Nikon D2x) I'm
    >>apt to want to do so in the Nikon camp then, so why not transition over
    >>now?
    >>
    >>Both points make sense I guess. Decisions, decisions.
    >>
    >>LRH

    >
    > I too shoot Nikon Film Camera. When going to a DSLR I am planning (unless
    > someone talks me out of it) to Canon. The great majority of people claim
    > that Canon is way ahead of Nikon in the digital world. It is not like
    > when Nikon built it's prestige and reputation in the Era of the Nikon F vs
    > the latter introduced Canon F1.
    >
    > Yeh I think I know how you feel. For many years you felt the Nikon
    > mistique and now that Canon is a head you are waiting for that next Nikon
    > shoe to drop. And it does seem that Nikon lenses are slightly heavier
    > duty in construction except for those very expensive L series lenses.
    >
    > But I think I know and feel what you are going through.


    My favourite picture was taken last year of a light aircraft landing on a
    local park and was taken with a D70. I have a 20D. The Canon might be
    pretty good relatively speaking but surely the difference between the two
    brands is tiny compared to the similarities.

    The critical difference is the skill of the operator. If you have a
    significant lens investment surely that would influence a decision to
    change.

    Dave
     
    hyperoglyphe, Jul 12, 2005
    #13
  14. Canon "way ahead?" I don't know about that. Maybe Nikon doesn't introduce a
    steady stream of new D-SLRs as frequently as Canon, they wait longer and
    then introduce big-time whoppers that just about squash everything. Just ask
    the D70 owners, read what most review sites said about the D70 vs the EOS
    300D Digital Rebel (granted, I have the DR, but the hacks make up for much
    of the difference that otherwise would be dramatic vs the D70).

    If you're talking about the 20D vs anything Nikon pretends to have in the
    mid-line around the $1500 mark, Canon totally has that won out at the
    moment. Previously, the EOS-1D Mark II vs the D2h, yes.

    But now Nikon has the D2x--yes, it took them a while, but again they don't
    seem to introduce as many frequently, and the D2x is a killer. Further, as
    great as the 20D is, it was necessary because the D70 was good enough to
    compete quite well against its precedessor, the 10D.

    The D70 was supposed to compete against the 300D, but it ended up smoking it
    big-time (although I have the 300D and the hacked firmware mitigates
    much--but not all--of the D70's advantage). The D2x can compete quite well
    against the EOS-1Ds Mark II and probably out-do the EOS-1D Mark II.
    Admitedly, the D2h and D2hs are relatively inferior and in need of an
    upgrade. And the D100 is way outdated.

    The D50? As far as I am concerned, better than the Digital Rebel XT. The XT
    is too menu-dependent--granted, the D50 has its menu items itself, but not
    as many--its 8 vs 6 megapixel difference is very small and not significant,
    the D50 is way easier to get a grip on and has a better feel to it. And it
    competes well price-wise.

    I think Nikon is hanging in quite well. All they need really is a 20D
    killer, a Nikon D200 or the like.

    LRH
     
    Larry R Harrison Jr, Jul 12, 2005
    #14
  15. Larry R Harrison Jr

    Bill Hilton Guest

    > Larry R Harrison Jr wrote
    >
    >But now Nikon has the D2x--yes, it took them a while, but again they
    >don't seem to introduce as many frequently, and the D2x is a killer.


    What Canon model do you think was "killed" by the D2x? The 1Ds M II
    has more megapixels (16.7 vs 12) and full frame sensor for those
    wishing to use existing wide angle lenses and it's so popular despite
    the high price that it's been in short supply until recently, almost 10
    months after intro. I doubt anyone would claim it's been "killed" by
    Nikon since Canon can hardly keep up with demand. And the 1D M II has
    more megapixels than the D2x in the fast mode (8.2 vs 6.8) and the
    advantage of a nice full viewfinder compared to the complaints one
    hears about having to use just a center section of the D2x viewfinder
    when in high speed mode. I see more 1D Mark II's being used by
    photographers than any other model in the wildlife photo areas I hang
    out at, it's a very popular camera, given the price and weight.

    Don't get me wrong, the D2x is a wonderful camera (if I had Nikon
    lenses it's what I'd be using) and a nice compromise between the two
    Canon Pro models currently out, but the idea that it "kills" Canon
    doesn't hold up very well if you look at the facts.

    Bill
     
    Bill Hilton, Jul 12, 2005
    #15

  16. > "Larry R Harrison Jr" <> wrote in message
    > news:3XiAe.70870$go.68436@fed1read05...
    >>I know one can easily get tired of these long-winded "Nikon D70s vs EOS
    >>350D" type of posts, so I hope I'm not adding to the crap-heap. My post is
    >>a bit different.
    >>
    >> I am an amateur at BEST, only recently the last year or so have I really
    >> taken any quality types of shots. Regardless, all along, I shot Nikon
    >> totally until last year when I sold all my film gear--lenses and all--and
    >> got the Digital Rebel. Got it used for $565 w/lens back last Nov when
    >> they were typically $675 or so used, and $900 or so new. Quite a deal. At
    >> the time, I really coveted the D70 but couldn't get it as cheaply--in
    >> large part because Nikon didn't have the cheap (but pretty good, I'm
    >> told) 18-55 lens at that time, Canon did--and I shoot way more wide-angle
    >> than telephoto.
    >>
    >> Prior to that, the same year, I had purchased a Nikon Coolpix 5700--my
    >> 1st "serious" digital after a 2MP Nikon CP775--and got much better
    >> results than I ever had with my Nikon N80. I LOVED the N80 but apparently
    >> I was just more suitable for digital than film-work; perhaps the instant
    >> review let me know what I had or hadn't done and/or free film costs (as
    >> it were) allowed me a chance to really practice. Whatever, I'm much
    >> better now--and loving digital, that's the reason I sold the Nikon N80 &
    >> all its accessories (which was only a $50 Sunpak flash and the 28-100 and
    >> 70-300 G-lenses anyway).
    >>
    >> That said, my "heart" belongs to Nikon as it were, and I'm tempted to
    >> sell my EOS 300D and go with the Nikon D50. I only have the 18-55 and
    >> 70-300 Tamron lens, the wired remote, extra generic battery (works better
    >> than the Canon-one) and a SanDisk Ultra II 512 megabyte card. So I'm not
    >> heavily "vested."
    >>
    >> But I'm tempted to "come back home to Nikon" via the D50. Someone would
    >> take all my gear off my hands for $600--my Af-sensors don't illuminate
    >> (but they AF fine) since I had a local guy fix the mirror box & I think
    >> he forgot to reconnect those wires or something--and I found the D50
    >> selling for $850 new. So only $250 away, and I could have the D50.
    >>
    >> Meanwhile, someone is selling the D70 body-only for $650 shipped, about
    >> 5,000 shutter uses.
    >>
    >> It is all tempting, especially the D50. The D70 is tempting and its
    >> viewfinder grid-lines would help as I do sometimes shoot crooked
    >> shots--and it will do wireless flash if I ever go that route (not likely
    >> to, nice capability though it is) and does CF cards instead of SD. And it
    >> would be cheaper to get initially. But I think the D50 is going to
    >> improve on the D70 in terms of low-noise and such, and when I handled it
    >> I really liked it. Plus, as the D50 comes with a lens and the D70 deal
    >> doesn't, the initial savings is apt to be lost once I get whatever lens I
    >> get.
    >>
    >> All that said, I have gotten good photos out of the 300D--except for the
    >> ones that have been crooked--and it does have the advantages of:
    >>
    >> * ISO 100
    >> * Wired remote instead of wireless (I do take quite a few night-shots
    >> from behind the camera)
    >> * Illuminated LCD control panel (D50 doesn't)
    >> * Mirror lockup (don't use it much though)
    >> * Easier to go from "all-AF-points" mode to user-chosen AF-point mode
    >> (Nikon uses menus for that)
    >> * CF cards, not SD (vs D50)
    >>
    >> And, there would be no more financial investments.
    >>
    >> But I am REALLY enticed by the D50, largely to "come back" to Nikon--but
    >> ALSO because
    >>
    >> *300D browses too slow in playback mode, big pain in the neck if you're
    >> trying to delete "duds" to make room for more shots if the card nears
    >> fill-up
    >> *D50 is better in "burst" mode
    >> *Probably better high-ISO performance vs D70 OR EOS 300D
    >> *Easier to change user-chosen AF-point on-the-fly (Nintendo-pad for that
    >> vs push-button/turn wheel)
    >> *Flat-out newer technology overall
    >> *I also have Nikon CP5700, could do more software integration (then
    >> again, I have a Canon S50 w/RAW ability)
    >>
    >> At some point, I am telling myself--stay with what you have, you're
    >> getting good photos with it, why change just because you like Nikon? (My
    >> 300D photos are at http://www.pbase.com/larrytucaz/canon_eos300d) But
    >> then I do see those other advantages, and it occurs to me--if I don't
    >> sell now, next year I won't get diddly-squat with my 300D, so I should
    >> sell now if I do intend to "come back" to Nikon.
    >>
    >> Any tips? Sorry if the post was long.
    >>
    >> LRH
    >>

    >
    >


    top posting corrected


    "Pete D" <> wrote in message
    news:GbpAe.37345$...
    > Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the
    > manufacturers are so close in results that it does not matter which one
    > you have. The most important thing is to get the one that handles best for
    > you. If you prefer the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for
    > you, if you like the E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature
    > like mirror lockup then make sure that is included. There is a couple of
    > features I find important, mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have
    > both or I will not look, what is important to you???
    >


    I agree, but with xSLR you should look at the whole system you might need,
    lenses, flash etc and what the performance cost trade is.

    Lester
     
    Lester Wareham, Jul 17, 2005
    #16
  17. Lester Wareham wrote:

    > top posting corrected


    Correction noted, but the real correction is in judicious pruning of the
    quote.
    >
    > "Pete D" <> wrote in message
    > news:GbpAe.37345$...
    >
    >>Personally I think all the consumer price cameras from all the
    >>manufacturers are so close in results that it does not matter which one
    >>you have. The most important thing is to get the one that handles best for
    >>you. If you prefer the D70 over the 20D then that is the right choice for
    >>you, if you like the E300 then get it, if you need a particular feature
    >>like mirror lockup then make sure that is included. There is a couple of
    >>features I find important, mirror lockup and cable release, gotta have
    >>both or I will not look, what is important to you???
    >>

    >
    >
    > I agree, but with xSLR you should look at the whole system you might need,
    > lenses, flash etc and what the performance cost trade is.
    >

    Bingo.

    And then refrain from telling others that if they reach any different
    conclusion, they are dead wrong. (not an accusation here.)

    And putting a dash dash space above a signature is a nice touch.

    --
    John McWilliams
     
    John McWilliams, Jul 17, 2005
    #17
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