Can you believe some people?

Discussion in 'NZ Computing' started by GraB, Aug 6, 2005.

  1. GraB

    GraB Guest

    I found this in another newsgroup:

    "I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    gone."


    He's got to be kidding, right?
     
    GraB, Aug 6, 2005
    #1
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  2. In article <>,
    GraB <> wrote:

    >I found this in another newsgroup:
    >
    >"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >gone."
    >
    >He's got to be kidding, right?


    I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...
     
    Lawrence D'Oliveiro, Aug 6, 2005
    #2
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  3. GraB

    Richard Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:

    >>He's got to be kidding, right?

    >
    >
    > I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    > Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...


    I rarely have to defrag on windows, only if I do things like audio file tag
    updates when there is only about 50 megs left or something equally stupid.

    In my experiance, if you delete the tempoary files windows will soon put the
    files in order with normal use of it, its only a major when you thrash the drive
    and theres no free space on it.
     
    Richard, Aug 6, 2005
    #3
  4. GraB

    Robert Cooze Guest

    Richard wrote:
    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >>> He's got to be kidding, right?

    >>
    >>
    >>
    >> I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    >> Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...

    >
    >
    > I rarely have to defrag on windows, only if I do things like audio file
    > tag updates when there is only about 50 megs left or something equally
    > stupid.
    >
    > In my experiance, if you delete the tempoary files windows will soon put
    > the files in order with normal use of it, its only a major when you
    > thrash the drive and theres no free space on it.



    From

    http://slackworld.berlios.de/01/wisdom.html

    In a multi-user, multi-tasking, multi-threaded OS, many files are being
    accessed at any time, and, if left unregulated, the disk read-write
    heads would jump all over the place all the time. Even with
    'defragmented' files, there would be as much seek-time delay as there
    would be with a single-user single-tasking OS and fragmented files.

    Fortunately, multi-user, multi-tasking, multi-threaded OSs are usually
    built smarter than that. Since file access is multiplexed from the point
    of view of the device (multiple file accesses from multiple, unrelated
    processes, with no order imposed on the sequence of blocks requested),
    the device driver incorporates logic to accomodate the performance hits,
    like reordering the requests into something sensible for the device (i.e
    an "elevator" algorithm or the like).

    In other words, fragmentation is a concern when one (and only one)
    process access data from one (and only one) file. When more than one
    file is involved, the disk addresses being requested are 'fragmented'
    with respect to the sequence that the driver has to service them, and
    thus it doesn't matter to the device driver whether or not a file was
    fragmented.


    I would guess that Win Xp falls into this catogray as I never seem to
    have any preformance hit from badly fragmented files. MP3 creation is a
    killer step 1 put down about 45~60 Meg of file then compress and deleat
    the big file at the same time put another big wav file down. end result
    is files with big spaces inbetween them.



    --
    http://cooze.co.nz home of the RecyclerMan aka Robert Cooze

    / __/ / / / / /__ / / ___/ / __/ / / / |/ / /__ /
    / / / /_/ / / /_/ / _-' / __/ / / / /_/ / / /| / _-'
    ___\ ____/ ____/ /___/ /____/ /_/ ___\ ____/ /_/ /_/ |_/ /___/
     
    Robert Cooze, Aug 6, 2005
    #4
  5. GraB

    Gordy Guest

    On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 22:43:54 +1200, GraB <> wrote:

    >I found this in another newsgroup:
    >
    >"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >gone."
    >
    >
    >He's got to be kidding, right?


    That is so funny. It has to be a troll...

    Where has his Windows gone... Out the window :)

    What is the newgroup or link...

    I would love to see the follow up on this one..

    Gordy
     
    Gordy, Aug 6, 2005
    #5
  6. GraB

    akiwi Guest

    On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 22:43:54 +1200, GraB <> wrote:

    >I found this in another newsgroup:
    >
    >"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >gone."
    >
    >
    >He's got to be kidding, right?


    I'd say so coz he'd lose all his files so why would he choose not to
    defrag if he knows so little about computers - someone so
    unknowledgeable and weird would just do the defrag instead of dragging
    the PC off to a repair shop - they wouldn't know how to install a hard
    drive right? And if they took it to a repair shop they'd get sent
    home. I don't think Windows says you need to defrag anyway.

    akiwi
     
    akiwi, Aug 7, 2005
    #6
  7. Steve Marshall, Aug 7, 2005
    #7
  8. GraB

    Enkidu Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > GraB <> wrote:
    >
    >
    >>I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>
    >>"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >>just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >>another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >>new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >>over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >>gone."
    >>
    >>He's got to be kidding, right?

    >
    > I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    > Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...
    >

    I've not defragged a Windows box since NT4, about SP2 or SP3...

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    Barzoomian the Martian - http://barzoomian.blogspot.com
     
    Enkidu, Aug 7, 2005
    #8
  9. GraB

    ~misfit~ Guest

    Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    > In article <>,
    > GraB <> wrote:
    >
    >> I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>
    >> "I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >> just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >> another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >> new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing
    >> it over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >> gone."
    >>
    >> He's got to be kidding, right?

    >
    > I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    > Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...


    And yet again one of the brainwashed drones turns a perfectly innocent
    thread into what he believes is a plug for non-Microsoft operating systems.
    In fact all this evangelicalism has the opposite effect on most people.
    Who'd want to end up as sad and pathetic as these drones who only live for
    pushing their OS of choice? The risk just isn't worth it. There are
    obviously undocumented side-effects of using OSS that turn you into a
    'pusher'.

    Sad.
    --
    ~misfit~
     
    ~misfit~, Aug 7, 2005
    #9
  10. GraB

    Enkidu Guest

    ~misfit~ wrote:
    > Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >
    >>In article <>,
    >>GraB <> wrote:
    >>
    >>
    >>>I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>>
    >>>"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >>>just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >>>another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >>>new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing
    >>>it over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >>>gone."
    >>>
    >>>He's got to be kidding, right?

    >>
    >>I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    >>Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...

    >
    >
    > And yet again one of the brainwashed drones turns a perfectly innocent
    > thread into what he believes is a plug for non-Microsoft operating systems.
    > In fact all this evangelicalism has the opposite effect on most people.
    > Who'd want to end up as sad and pathetic as these drones who only live for
    > pushing their OS of choice? The risk just isn't worth it. There are
    > obviously undocumented side-effects of using OSS that turn you into a
    > 'pusher'.
    >

    Some. I run both and I'm quite happy with both. Linux does
    things that MS doesn't and MS does things that Linux
    doesn't. Horses for courses.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    Barzoomian the Martian - http://barzoomian.blogspot.com
     
    Enkidu, Aug 7, 2005
    #10
  11. In article <42f5524c$>,
    Enkidu <> wrote:

    >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> In article <>,
    >> GraB <> wrote:
    >>
    >>>I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>>
    >>>"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >>>just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >>>another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >>>new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >>>over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >>>gone."
    >>>
    >>>He's got to be kidding, right?

    >>
    >> I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    >> Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...
    > >

    >I've not defragged a Windows box since NT4, about SP2 or SP3...


    My brother, who has to deal with Windows systems on a far more intimate
    basis than I do, tells me that he has to defrag his machines quite
    frequently to maintain performance, like more than once a month.
     
    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro, Aug 7, 2005
    #11
  12. In article <42f55743$>,
    "~misfit~" <> wrote:

    >Lawrence D'Oliveiro wrote:
    >> In article <>,
    >> GraB <> wrote:
    >>
    >>> I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>>
    >>> "I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >>> just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >>> another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >>> new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing
    >>> it over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >>> gone."
    >>>
    >>> He's got to be kidding, right?

    >>
    >> I've never had to defrag a hard disk with either MacOS (pre-OS-X) or
    >> Linux. Or Tru64 UNIX, for that matter...

    >
    >And yet again one of the brainwashed drones turns a perfectly innocent
    >thread into what he believes is a plug for non-Microsoft operating systems.


    You just can't handle it, can you, when a problem that you assumed would
    afflict everybody turns out to be Dimdows-specific?

    You're just like a child who's discovered that somebody else has got a
    bigger and brighter toy than he's got. If you want to throw a tanty,
    fine, just don't expect anybody here to clean up after you.
     
    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro, Aug 7, 2005
    #12
  13. GraB

    Gordon Guest

    On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 12:31:40 +1200, ~misfit~ wrote:

    > And yet again one of the brainwashed drones turns a perfectly innocent
    > thread into what he believes is a plug for non-Microsoft operating systems.
    > In fact all this evangelicalism has the opposite effect on most people.
    > Who'd want to end up as sad and pathetic as these drones who only live for
    > pushing their OS of choice? The risk just isn't worth it. There are
    > obviously undocumented side-effects of using OSS that turn you into a
    > 'pusher'.
    >
    > Sad.


    And your posting ...
     
    Gordon, Aug 7, 2005
    #13
  14. GraB

    Gordon Guest

    On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 14:03:21 +1200, Enkidu wrote:

    > Some. I run both and I'm quite happy with both. Linux does
    > things that MS doesn't and MS does things that Linux
    > doesn't. Horses for courses.


    Good to have personal choice eh?
     
    Gordon, Aug 7, 2005
    #14
  15. GraB

    GraB Guest

    On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 10:30:50 +1200, Gordy <> wrote:

    >On Sat, 06 Aug 2005 22:43:54 +1200, GraB <> wrote:
    >
    >>I found this in another newsgroup:
    >>
    >>"I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    >>just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    >>another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    >>new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    >>over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    >>gone."
    >>
    >>
    >>He's got to be kidding, right?

    >
    >That is so funny. It has to be a troll...
    >
    >Where has his Windows gone... Out the window :)
    >
    >What is the newgroup or link...
    >
    >I would love to see the follow up on this one..
    >
    >Gordy
    >


    alt.video.dvd.tech

    Re: Defrag of hard disk

    No-one seems to have taken up on this one.
     
    GraB, Aug 7, 2005
    #15
  16. GraB

    PAM. Guest

    "Gordon" <> wrote in message
    > On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 14:03:21 +1200, Enkidu wrote:
    >
    > > Some. I run both and I'm quite happy with both. Linux does
    > > things that MS doesn't and MS does things that Linux
    > > doesn't. Horses for courses.

    >
    > Good to have personal choice eh?
    >

    Choice. That's what it's all about.

    PAM.
     
    PAM., Aug 7, 2005
    #16
  17. GraB

    PAM. Guest

    "GraB" <> wrote in message
    news:...
    > I found this in another newsgroup:
    >
    > "I never defrag my hard disk. When it says it needs to be defraged I
    > just toss the hard disk and buy a new one. That way it's good for
    > another half year or so. The only bad thing is that whenever I get a
    > new hard disk my computer loses windows so I got to keep installing it
    > over and over. I cant figure out where windows goes but its just
    > gone."
    >
    >
    > He's got to be kidding, right?


    Of course. If they know how to change a HDD then they more than likely know
    where windows is stored.

    PAM.
     
    PAM., Aug 7, 2005
    #17
  18. GraB

    Enkidu Guest

    Lawrence D¹Oliveiro wrote:
    >>
    >>I've not defragged a Windows box since NT4, about SP2 or SP3...

    >
    > My brother, who has to deal with Windows systems on a
    > far more intimate basis than I do, tells me that he
    > has to defrag his machines quite frequently to maintain
    > performance, like more than once a month.
    >

    Tell your brother that is bollocks.

    Unless he is doing something unusal, like editting video
    files, the difference in speed will be unnoticeable.

    In fact, defragging a disk can make performance worse. If
    you have a lot of little files that are accessed frequently
    and randomly, then they will tend to migrate to the usual
    resting place of the heads (or vice versa, the heads will
    mainly stay near the frequently used files). Defragging will
    spoil that and increase seek time to the small files.

    In any case, with modern disks, speed and caching means that
    *any* effect of defragging is not noticeable and barely
    measureable.

    Cheers,

    Cliff

    --

    Barzoomian the Martian - http://barzoomian.blogspot.com
     
    Enkidu, Aug 7, 2005
    #18
  19. GraB

    Rob J Guest

    On Mon, 08 Aug 2005 09:44:47 +1200, Enkidu <>
    wrote:

    >Lawrence D¹Oliveiro wrote:
    >>>
    >>>I've not defragged a Windows box since NT4, about SP2 or SP3...

    >>
    >> My brother, who has to deal with Windows systems on a
    > > far more intimate basis than I do, tells me that he
    > > has to defrag his machines quite frequently to maintain
    > > performance, like more than once a month.
    > >

    >Tell your brother that is bollocks.
    >
    >Unless he is doing something unusal, like editting video
    >files, the difference in speed will be unnoticeable.
    >
    >In fact, defragging a disk can make performance worse. If
    >you have a lot of little files that are accessed frequently
    >and randomly, then they will tend to migrate to the usual
    >resting place of the heads (or vice versa, the heads will
    >mainly stay near the frequently used files). Defragging will
    >spoil that and increase seek time to the small files.
    >
    >In any case, with modern disks, speed and caching means that
    >*any* effect of defragging is not noticeable and barely
    >measureable.


    We have PCs that are shipped with Executive Software Diskeeper Lite

    It will pop up messages every so often saying the disk needs
    defragging. Does it really? (Windows XP)
     
    Rob J, Aug 7, 2005
    #19
  20. GraB

    AD. Guest

    On Sun, 07 Aug 2005 15:31:20 +1200, Lawrence D¹Oliveiro wrote:

    > My brother, who has to deal with Windows systems on a far more intimate
    > basis than I do, tells me that he has to defrag his machines quite
    > frequently to maintain performance, like more than once a month.


    NTFS will quite happily not need defragging as long as you keep plenty of
    free space on the disk.

    It can get a bit nasty with full disks over a long period of time though.

    --
    Cheers
    Anton
     
    AD., Aug 7, 2005
    #20
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